Lionel's Knowledge

[kostaki00]

I think that Lionel has known since Transferrence.

BUT, if that is NOT the case, then i think it's Jor-El using his body, just like he said he would do anytime he needed to in "Hidden"

[xrayvision]

I say Lionel knew from Transference or at least since around the time he shot Jason.

I have 2 theories:

1) He is really a good guy & the "blackmail" was just a scheme to get Martha to trust him. He paid that guy off simply to better his reputation with Martha. I'm leaning towards this one.

2) He is still the same old bad-ass. He remembers the knowledge & info the stone downloaded him with in Commencement and knows all about Clark/Kal-El, the cave, and the FOS. He knew that Clark would come back to life in Hidden as long as was brought back to the FOS, so he did this. His speech to Clark (when he was revived) about someone having to die to balance the universe and how Jor-El was using his body as a vessel was total BS. He used a crystal and heard Jor-El in the past & imitated his voice to convince Clark. He looked into Jonathan's medical records & knew that his health was detiorating. When the chance came, he showed up and caused the heart attack so he can get rid of JK and force his way into the Kent family and do whatever he is planning to do (blackmail Clark to use his powers to make himself more powerful and get back Luthorcorp).

As I said, I am leaning toward #1. Him shooting Jason makes me think he's a good guy. The only reason he may have done this if he's a bad guy is that he knows Clark's power is the only thing that can get him Luthorcorp back. If #2 does turn out to be the case, then he has to be the most clever, evil, patient, vindictive, SOB of all time.

[Kadence]

Your 2nd theory is awesome I think there's no chance whatsoever of it being true, but the idea that Lion-El was a ruse by Lionel is utterly bad-ass

[xrayvision]

That's what I thought. It would make his blind ruse (for those few weeks that he was no longer blind but didn't tell anyone) back in S2 look insignificant.

[LuthorRequiem2]

Great theories, xrayvision. I really liked your second one, even though I doubt it would happen like that, it's very clever.

My theories are:

1.) He's a good guy in a twisted way, but not the same good, charity-loving philanthropist we saw from the end of "Transference" up until "Onyx". No, he's still dark in many ways, but he thinks he's using his darkness for a greater purpose-to keep anyone from knowing Kal-Al's secret and to train him as Superman. But he uses his scheming, MB ways to do so (killing Griff, blackmailing Martha and saving her to gain her trust, blackmailing Lex for the stone, etc.) He knew Clark's secret after "Transference" maybe, but didn't tell anyone. He somehow knew the stones were meant for Clark, but once he was downloaded with Kryptonian knowledge, he now knows EVERYTHING. He knows ALL of Clark's powers, his birth name, what exactly happened to the doomed planet of Krypton, who General Zod is and Professor Fine, etc. In a way, he's like Ras Al Ghul in "Batman Begins" (trying to do the right thing to better mankind but ultimately killing and destroying anyone in his way).

2.) He's still just as bad as before, and right now is only keeping Clark's secret to ultimately gain his trust. Then he'll unveil his true colors, and blackmail Clark, tell him he wants to rule the world with him (Reminiscent of Lex in the comics and what he said to Clark in "Onyx", "Your powers, my brains, together we could walk as gods among men"). Once Clark says no, Lionel will start to become the ultimate villain, until Lex kills him to get the answers out of him. Lionel refuses to tell Lex because it gives him the ultimate power over Lex, and he also deep down doesn't want Lex to become like him, and he knows if he tells Lex the secret, he will.

3.) It is Jor-El all along, and he's been doing what he's doing to help Clark and his family. The only times he wasn't Jor-El was when it just involved Lex (like "Lexmas"). Other times though he was out to help the Kents.

4.) Jor-El uses Lionel's body as a vessel but only when needed (example: giving Chloe info on Proff. Fine to tell to Clark). Other times, he's still Lionel all the way.

[xrayvision]

Originally posted by xrayvision
I say Lionel knew from Transference or at least since around the time he shot Jason.

I have 2 theories:

1) He is really a good guy & the "blackmail" was just a scheme to get Martha to trust him. He paid that guy off simply to better his reputation with Martha. I'm leaning towards this one.

2) He is still the same old bad-ass. He remembers the knowledge & info the stone downloaded him with in Commencement and knows all about Clark/Kal-El, the cave, and the FOS. He knew that Clark would come back to life in Hidden as long as was brought back to the FOS, so he did this. His speech to Clark (when he was revived) about someone having to die to balance the universe and how Jor-El was using his body as a vessel was total BS. He used a crystal and heard Jor-El in the past & imitated his voice to convince Clark. He looked into Jonathan's medical records & knew that his health was detiorating. When the chance came, he showed up and caused the heart attack so he can get rid of JK and force his way into the Kent family and do whatever he is planning to do (blackmail Clark to use his powers to make himself more powerful and get back Luthorcorp).

As I said, I am leaning toward #1. Him shooting Jason makes me think he's a good guy. The only reason he may have done this if he's a bad guy is that he knows Clark's power is the only thing that can get him Luthorcorp back. If #2 does turn out to be the case, then he has to be the most clever, evil, patient, vindictive, SOB of all time.

I think if they make Lionel evil this season, they should go with something like #2. I hope they keep him good after all he's been through, but theory #2 happens, it would really be something. Since he is good now, maybe something could happen that after Jor-El leaves him, he still remembers what happens and uses it to get Clark to do what he wants for power. But like I said, I would like Lex to be the main villian from now on.