the clex friendship

[Aurora Moon]

Well you have to realize that Both Lex and Lana didn't know that Clark was an alien for sure.

Lana thought that Clark was hiding something and that certain something was standing in the way of their relationship. Lana thought that Clark could be her super-ideal boyfriend and that they would have the most perfect happy life together, and she wanted that to happen so badly. Basically, Lana was obsessed with wanting that perfect life with Clark but that damned secret was in the way of that happening. So naturally she had to find that out so that it would be out of the way instead of blocking her way to happiness.

Lex, it mainly had to do with the need to know everything that goes on. you know how when you tell somebody not to look but they look anyway? Lex's kind of like that. And it gets worse when you consider the fact that Clark isn't very good at covering his tracks... so it's like there's this giant flashing arrow sign pointing straight at Clark. And Clark makes such a HUGE DEAL about the fact that he has a secret, instead of keeping quiet about it.

It's like a little kid wanting everyone to know that he's got this super-cool secret.. so he carries it around in a box, talking about how super-awesome it is but that nobody is ever, ever allowed to look because it's a SECRET. Naturally every other kid in school is going to want to look in that box just because that kid made such a big fuss about it.
Ironically Clark doesn't want anybody to know, ever.... but, he acts exactly like that kid with the box around Lex.

[laurarawlins]

Finally, some Clarity! Thank you

Him not being superman doesn't change anything. This being Clark's show doesn't mean that Clark shouldn't tell someone what kind of threat they're under.Clark was keeping his secret from them before they knew about aliens. It wasn't about that. Clark was afraid of what the reactions of those he loved would be. But it wasn't based on reactions they'd had before about aliens. Clark's secret is important to Lex simply because of skepticism. Lex is someone who doesn't trust people, but he trusts Clark. I'd say what he has early on is what Tess has later on, which is a desire to be trusted and loved by something that's more than you. Lex himself says as much, when he says that Clark inspired him. Of course, Lex and Tess could have both fixed that hole in their lives, their souls, their hearts by turning to God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ. But that didn't seem to happen. The problem being, with Lex anyway, is that Lex made his redemption about how Clark saw him, which for Lex, is a thing for him. His lack of love and acceptance as a child is likely a reason for this. But you can't look to a human as a way to define yourself. Lex did. So when Clark didn't trust him, when he lied to him that left Lex with this sense of betrayal that this person that he looked to as what could save him doesn't trust, in his mind likely refuses to trust, him. Lex looked to Clark for validation. That's why his secret was so important to him. With Lana, it was about simple relationship dynamics. Lana does tend to focus on how others view her, as well, though it's not specifically about Clark like it is for Lex. She does develop feelings for Clark. Clark saves her life. She knows that. But he tells her that he didn't, so now this person that she'd developed feelings for is pulling away and Lana, who has been told one thing about her for most of her life only to discover that that isn't true is being told a similar thing now. The fact is that Lana isn't interested in Clark's secret. She's interested in why he pulls away when they get close and she thinks that if she can get that secret out he won't pull away anymore, that he won't try to tell her that her life is one thing when she knows it isn't anymore. She may want Clark's love, but it isn't like Lex where he feels betrayed because he feels like Clark doesn't have that for him. Instead Lana knows that Clark has that for her, which he does, but it drives her up the wall that he just keeps pulling away from it.

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!

I understand now, thank you for explaining. but there is another thing that I don't get though. Why look to Clark for validation? Why can't Lex look to himself for validation? instead of Clark? apparently the phrase "better to be whole alone, than scattered in a crowd" hasn't ever crossed Lex's mind. Lex never took that phrase into consideration has he? because if he did he wouldn't have this distrust problem with Clark. I mean do you really need to tell everyone everything about yourself just to be validated? to be loved? to be trusted? or to seek acceptance and approval from others? when you can seek your own self acceptance? I mean why look to others when you have yourself to look to for validation? the fact is Lex (like Lionel before him) doesn't love and respect himself and blocked himself from love because if you want to people love and respect you, and accept you and trust you then you have to learn how to love, respect, accept and trust yourself first because if you can't do that then other people won't reciprocate and the more you push, the more you press and the more you expect people to love, respect, accept and trust you when you don't love, respect, accept and trust yourself is how you lose love, trust and respect of others and they will end up pulling away and resent you for not giving enough. That's the thing about relationships. If you want a lot then get used to giving more. Both Lex and Lana are blinded to their role in this dynamic in their relationships with Clark.

If Lex and Lana want to have Clark in their lives to listen to them, make them feel safe, take on all of his problems and try to make him happy and vice versa, then they should really go to see a therapist. Seriously. It's not gonna happen exactly the way they want in their relationships with each other.... People are complex even if they are characters on a TV show.

[Aurora Moon]

Lex had an emotionally abusive father who raised him. So naturally he would had never heard of that phrase about being whole and stuff. Because Parents who abuse their kids tends to cut them off from support groups or anything else that might boost their self-esteem early. Abusers want their victims to think so poorly of themselves, so that the victims would side with the Abusers every time the abuser claim they are in the right.

And then Lionel trained Lex to be such a good actor that everyone thinks that Lex doesn't have a self-esteem problem. In fact everyone thinks that Lex has too much self-esteem due to how arrogant he acts at times. And that's the most damned part... how do you tell if somebody's been emotionally abused, especially since the abuser wasn't the type to leave behind bruises or any physical signs of abuse?

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2014/10/13/21-warning-signs-of-an-emotionally-abusive-relationship/

I think some of the stuff on that list highlights how Lex tends to react to Lionel doesn't it?

[Dagenspear]

I understand now, thank you for explaining. but there is another thing that I don't get though. Why look to Clark for validation? Why can't Lex look to himself for validation? instead of Clark? apparently the phrase "better to be whole alone, than scattered in a crowd" hasn't ever crossed Lex's mind. Lex never took that phrase into consideration has he? because if he did he wouldn't have this distrust problem with Clark. I mean do you really need to tell everyone everything about yourself just to be validated? to be loved? to be trusted? or to seek acceptance and approval from others? when you can seek your own self acceptance? I mean why look to others when you have yourself to look to for validation? the fact is Lex (like Lionel before him) doesn't love and respect himself and blocked himself from love because if you want to people love and respect you, and accept you and trust you then you have to learn how to love, respect, accept and trust yourself first because if you can't do that then other people won't reciprocate and the more you push, the more you press and the more you expect people to love, respect, accept and trust you when you don't love, respect, accept and trust yourself is how you lose love, trust and respect of others and they will end up pulling away and resent you for not giving enough. That's thing about relationships. If you want a lot then get used to giving more. Both Lex and Lana are blinded to their role in this dynamic in their relationships with Clark.

If Lex and Lana want to have Clark in their lives to listen to them, make them feel safe, take on all of his problems and try to make him happy and vice versa, then they should really go to see a therapist. Seriously. It's not gonna happen exactly the way they want in their relationships with each other.... People are complex even if they are characters on a TV show.

It's funny how really similar Clark, Lex and Lana are. They're all secretive, they all demand honesty and they all spend their time worrying about how they're seen or could be seen by others. The fact that they're all caught up in eachother is hilarious, because none of them will ever give what eachother wants from their relationships, so they'll never get it. Clark doesn't trust Lex, so Lex doesn't trust Clark, Clark doesn't trust Lana, so Lana doesn't trust Clark, Lex doesn't trust Clark, so Clark doesn't trust Lex, Lana doesn't trust Clark, so Clark doesn't trust Lana, then Lana trusts Lex because she feels he trusts her, but really Lex just wants her because Clark had her and he's angry at Clark because he didn't trust him, then Lana begins to discover that Lex doesn't trust her, so she distrusts him and it's just this bonkers triangle of everyone distrusting eachother because they're all really just insecure. Lana's trying to discover who she is, but is conflicted about every aspect of her life and is trying to reconcile who she is with who she's viewed as. Clark is afraid of being viewed as a freak and being spurned from society, so he lies to keep people from turning away from him, which ironically turns people away from him. Lex wants something to save him from his father, his mother, himself, thinks he can't be good unless he's viewed as good by Clark, who saves his life, but he refuses to trust Clark because he feels Clark doesn't trust him otherwise he would tell him. Lex wanted Clark's validation because he viewed Clark as more than him. As something whose validation could define, because if, in Lex's mind, someone like Clark would validate him, then that means he could actually be as good as Clark. Of course this all could have been avoided if Lex had just accepted God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ into his heart. But that didn't happen.

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!

[Aurora Moon]

Deaganspear-- I have to say, even religious people can be evil.... especially if they sincerely believe that god would be totally okay with the crimes/sins they commit just as long as they repent for it. Of course, the evil people wouldn't understand that you can't just repent and then keep on committing sins/crimes afterwards. But they do exactly just that. They seem to think repenting is just like washing your hands. that if your hands get dirty every time, you can just wash it all off by repenting.

Examples: Josh Duggar and Kim Davis.
Those are two people who seems to really believe that they're a follower of Jesus, etc. They believe this so strongly, yet their actions say otherwise...

Josh sexually assaulted five girls that was way younger than he was when he was a teenager. and many of them were barely hitting puberty. but he repented publicly, so everyone let him off the hook for being a child molester. And then later on despite being such a public follower of Jesus, etc he was found to be cheating on Anna with random women online, etc. But again he's publicly repenting....

Kim Davis is a serial cheater who cheated constantly on her first husband with her second husband, got pregnant by a third husband while she was still with her first husband. Then she left him for her second. Then left the second one for the third one.
Then she becomes an court clerk that has the audacity to talk about the sanctity of marriage, never mind that she acts like a total cheating scumbag towards all of her husbands so far. But oh, she's a "Born again" Christian, so the fact that she sinned big time and is most likely still sinning is just hunky-dory.

So....is there a way to truly tell if somebody's truly let Jesus and god into their hearts? Because even the most delusional nut-cases seem to truly, really believe that they've already done that.
So what makes you think that Lex Luthor would truly be transformed by being converted to a religion? What if he just becomes one of those delusional nut-cases who thinks that because they have god on their side, that they can do whatever they want... even if it's a horrible sin? Because hey, all he has to do is repent and his hands are clean again!

[Aurora Moon]

And I don't know if you noticed, but the show's gone out of it's way to portray Jor-el as a god-like figure and Clark Kent as a Jesus Christ analog. Which I personally find to be so wrong on many levels considering Jor-El's and Clark Kent's horrible actions on the show itself. But the fact still stands, Al and Miles wants us to view Jor-El as being Godly and Clark as being like Jesus... here to save everyone on earth.

So by this logic, wouldn't that mean that Lex desperately wants to accept Jesus Christ into his heart but Jesus keeps on rejecting him because apparently destiny has other plans in store for Lex?

[Dagenspear]

Deaganspear-- I have to say, even religious people can be evil.... especially if they sincerely believe that god would be totally okay with the crimes/sins they commit just as long as they repent for it. Of course, the evil people wouldn't understand that you can't just repent and then keep on committing sins/crimes afterwards. But they do exactly just that. They seem to think repenting is just like washing your hands. that if your hands get dirty every time, you can just wash it all off by repenting.

Examples: Josh Duggar and Kim Davis.
Those are two people who seems to really believe that they're a follower of Jesus, etc. They believe this so strongly, yet their actions say otherwise...

Josh sexually assaulted five girls that was way younger than he was when he was a teenager. and many of them were barely hitting puberty. but he repented publicly, so everyone let him off the hook for being a child molester. And then later on despite being such a public follower of Jesus, etc he was found to be cheating on Anna with random women online, etc. But again he's publicly repenting....

Kim Davis is a serial cheater who cheated constantly on her first husband with her second husband, got pregnant by a third husband while she was still with her first husband. Then she left him for her second. Then left the second one for the third one.
Then she becomes an court clerk that has the audacity to talk about the sanctity of marriage, never mind that she acts like a total cheating scumbag towards all of her husbands so far. But oh, she's a "Born again" Christian, so the fact that she sinned big time and is most likely still sinning is just hunky-dory.

So....is there a way to truly tell if somebody's truly let Jesus and god into their hearts? Because even the most delusional nut-cases seem to truly, really believe that they've already done that.
So what makes you think that Lex Luthor would truly be transformed by being converted to a religion? What if he just becomes one of those delusional nut-cases who thinks that because they have god on their side, that they can do whatever they want... even if it's a horrible sin? Because hey, all he has to do is repent and his hands are clean again!

That's about certain people. If someone has actually accepted God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ into their heart they will be changed. But, people can and still have trouble. But I was mostly speaking about Lex personal emotional troubles, the emptiness in his life that he had.

And I don't know if you noticed, but the show's gone out of it's way to portray Jor-el as a god-like figure and Clark Kent as a Jesus Christ analog. Which I personally find to be so wrong on many levels considering Jor-El's and Clark Kent's horrible actions on the show itself. But the fact still stands, Al and Miles wants us to view Jor-El as being Godly and Clark as being like Jesus... here to save everyone on earth.

So by this logic, wouldn't that mean that Lex desperately wants to accept Jesus Christ into his heart but Jesus keeps on rejecting him because apparently destiny has other plans in store for Lex?

Jor-El isn't that powered. The show does seem to try to play on the idea for Clark which is problematic, but Clark isn't that. He can't give Lex what God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ can. Clark isn't capable of that.

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!

[Aurora Moon]

I do agree that Clark is no Jesus Christ, not even as Superman. And I think most Supermen across universes would be very uncomfortable at the implications that Al and Miles made about him on the Show Smallville.... that as long as you were on Clark's side you and your soul would be redeemed/saved, etc. No matter how much of an ******* you were or no matter what questionable horrible stuff you did that you never really atoned for.

Tess Mercer kind of ended up like the evil religious people I mentioned up above...She looked to Clark so much that it was almost like she worshiped him. and she felt that her soul was saved just because she ended up on Clark's side. Yet, she kept on doing those horrible things because she justified doing it in the name of "good" and never really truly atoned for it at all. That never really sat well with me... and since she was like a female Lex Luthor 2.0 to me, this indicated to me how things might go on the show if Lex Luthor truly became religious. Or at the least were still on Clark's side.

But yeah it was problematic how the show seemed say that the exact thing that the Luthors kept on doing is only terrible if you're on the opposite side of the hero. If you're on the side of heroes, then it's perfectly okay. I couldn't also get over how much the green arrow kept on breaking laws constantly and yet the police didn't seem to be after him or anything like that. I know he's a vigilante and you tend to make leeway for some stuff they may do, but there have to be a limit on how many laws they can break before the police is after them. It was as if law might never even exist in the smallville universe.

As for Jesus filling a emotional void in Lex's life... I may have been raised as a Christian, but I tend to take the practical viewpoint that prayer cannot solve everything. It irritates me when people think that things like cancer or some other serious mental illnesses can be easily willed away with just prayer, etc.
As a deaf person, I've seriously had people come up to me and tell me that I would be "cured" of my deafness if I would just pray hard enough. and you have no idea how truly offensive that is. It never occurred to them that god could had made me deaf to help my family learn to be more accepting of people's differences, etc. That the real reason why god put all different types of people on earth... to help us learn how to be more tolerant, etc.

You know the saying, "God helps those who helps themselves?"
Religion is good in times when you're sad and need to be comforted, etc. But at the same time be aware that things like medication do exist, and be thankful that things like cancer medical treatments exist. make good use of them, because god placed people on earth who were able to invent it so that you could live.
people can't just use God like a magic wand for all of their problems, life doesn't work like that.

So it's in my opinion that Lex should find a psychiatrist who refuses to be brought off by other rich douche-bags who want info on Lex Luthor... one who can help Lex come to terms with some of his mental and emotional problems. By all means, if joining Christianity would also help Lex on his emotional journey then he can also do that. But he can't just use it as a band-aid for all of his problems.... especially when his problems is like a giant gaping wound that a single band-aid can't cover by itself.

[Dagenspear]

I do agree that Clark is no Jesus Christ, not even as Superman. And I think most Supermen across universes would be very uncomfortable at the implications that Al and Miles made about him on the Show Smallville.... that as long as you were on Clark's side you and your soul would be redeemed/saved, etc. No matter how much of an ******* you were or no matter what questionable horrible stuff you did that you never really atoned for.

Tess Mercer kind of ended up like the evil religious people I mentioned up above...She looked to Clark so much that it was almost like she worshiped him. and she felt that her soul was saved just because she ended up on Clark's side. Yet, she kept on doing those horrible things because she justified doing it in the name of "good" and never really truly atoned for it at all. That never really sat well with me... and since she was like a female Lex Luthor 2.0 to me, this indicated to me how things might go on the show if Lex Luthor truly became religious. Or at the least were still on Clark's side.

But yeah it was problematic how the show seemed say that the exact thing that the Luthors kept on doing is only terrible if you're on the opposite side of the hero. If you're on the side of heroes, then it's perfectly okay. I couldn't also get over how much the green arrow kept on breaking laws constantly and yet the police didn't seem to be after him or anything like that. I know he's a vigilante and you tend to make leeway for some stuff they may do, but there have to be a limit on how many laws they can break before the police is after them. It was as if law might never even exist in the smallville universe.

As for Jesus filling a emotional void in Lex's life... I may have been raised as a Christian, but I tend to take the practical viewpoint that prayer cannot solve everything. It irritates me when people think that things like cancer or some other serious mental illnesses can be easily willed away with just prayer, etc.
As a deaf person, I've seriously had people come up to me and tell me that I would be "cured" of my deafness if I would just pray hard enough. and you have no idea how truly offensive that is. It never occurred to them that god could had made me deaf to help my family learn to be more accepting of people's differences, etc. That the real reason why god put all different types of people on earth... to help us learn how to be more tolerant, etc.

You know the saying, "God helps those who helps themselves?"
Religion is good in times when you're sad and need to be comforted, etc. But at the same time be aware that things like medication do exist, and be thankful that things like cancer medical treatments exist. make good use of them, because god placed people on earth who were able to invent it so that you could live.
people can't just use God like a magic wand for all of their problems, life doesn't work like that.

So it's in my opinion that Lex should find a psychiatrist who refuses to be brought off by other rich douche-bags who want info on Lex Luthor... one who can help Lex come to terms with some of his mental and emotional problems. By all means, if joining Christianity would also help Lex on his emotional journey then he can also do that. But he can't just use it as a band-aid for all of his problems.... especially when his problems is like a giant gaping wound that a single band-aid can't cover by itself.

That's not really the same. You praying and depending on God doesn't equal you not doing anything about something. As I understand it, people who say that God will heal you if you just pray hard enough don't understand how God and Jesus Christ works. God and Jesus Christ can and have healed people. Some people who haven't been healed haven't for many reasons. But I'm not gonna pretend to understand how I or you should do something to get something. But as I understand it, it's not about how hard you pray.

If Lex truly gave himself over to God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ he would be changed, it might not be in an instant, it likely wouldn't be, and he couldn't just sit back and that would be that, he would have to work and nurture his relationship with God and Jesus Christ. I think Lex's main problem is that he's more concerned with answers than faith, than acceptance, than love. His words to Clark in wrath say a lot about his problems. He says, "Obsession outlasts everything. Even love." The fact that he says that like it's acceptable shows that Lex can't let go of searching for answers.

The thing is I don't think Al and Miles really was about that. Their seasons had it in some ways, but I think Kelly and Brian really attached their seasons to it more.

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!

[Aurora Moon]

Al and Miles already had it as a subtle tone to their work... but I can agree that Kelly and Brian took that existing theme and amped it up more.

As for the rest of your post, you're kind of agreeing with my point. That with religion you can't just sit back and wait for god to fix everything.... you have to put in work into that relationship and then God would meet you halfway there. Hence, God helps those who helps themselves.
Those who thinks that they will be magically cleaned of every sin they did in life without even atoning for it, or thinks that God is like a magic wand you can just wave around to fix all the problems in life.. well they're the ones who doesn't understand how life and god works.

[computermaster]

It's funny how really similar Clark, Lex and Lana are. They're all secretive, they all demand honesty and they all spend their time worrying about how they're seen or could be seen by others. The fact that they're all caught up in eachother is hilarious, because none of them will ever give what eachother wants from their relationships, so they'll never get it. Clark doesn't trust Lex, so Lex doesn't trust Clark, Clark doesn't trust Lana, so Lana doesn't trust Clark, Lex doesn't trust Clark, so Clark doesn't trust Lex, Lana doesn't trust Clark, so Clark doesn't trust Lana, then Lana trusts Lex because she feels he trusts her, but really Lex just wants her because Clark had her and he's angry at Clark because he didn't trust him, then Lana begins to discover that Lex doesn't trust her, so she distrusts him and it's just this bonkers triangle of everyone distrusting eachother because they're all really just insecure. Lana's trying to discover who she is, but is conflicted about every aspect of her life and is trying to reconcile who she is with who she's viewed as. Clark is afraid of being viewed as a freak and being spurned from society, so he lies to keep people from turning away from him, which ironically turns people away from him. Lex wants something to save him from his father, his mother, himself, thinks he can't be good unless he's viewed as good by Clark, who saves his life, but he refuses to trust Clark because he feels Clark doesn't trust him otherwise he would tell him. Lex wanted Clark's validation because he viewed Clark as more than him. As something whose validation could define, because if, in Lex's mind, someone like Clark would validate him, then that means he could actually be as good as Clark. Of course this all could have been avoided if Lex had just accepted God and the Lord And Savior Jesus Christ into his heart. But that didn't happen.

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!

And this is what the show was primarily all about imo. Trust, loyalty, betrayal, love, passion and characters that felt like real people amongst all the madness. It was so much more interesting and intriguing to watch than a cartoon like superhero working in a cartoon like place that he had no business being in, fighting cartoon like villains with catchphrases like "kneel before me" or some nonsense like that. I wish Al and Miles had stayed and the show didn't get ruined.

As for the question - there were various other reasons why Clark and Lex's friendship went south, but yeah both of their interest in Lana was definitely one of them.

[Dagenspear]

And this is what the show was primarily all about imo. Trust, loyalty, betrayal, love, passion and characters that felt like real people amongst all the madness. It was so much more interesting and intriguing to watch than a cartoon like superhero working in a cartoon like place that he had no business being in, fighting cartoon like villains with catchphrases like "kneel before me" or some nonsense like that. I wish Al and Miles had stayed and the show didn't get ruined.

As for the question - there were various other reasons why Clark and Lex's friendship went south, but yeah both of their interest in Lana was definitely one of them.

Lex mainly wanted Lana because of Clark. Thank you though!

God bless you! God bless everyone in your life!