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We seem to have the opposite problem nowadays: too much relationship drama, and not enough superhero stuff. I remember Levine saying in a commentary that she wouldn't have had Clark and Lois start dating until season 5. I wonder if that changed because of the studio or the new showrunners. It would be interesting if the studio pushed for more Superman and a fast-tracked relationship. If Levine had stayed, the show probably would have been better in the long run. At the very least, we likely would have averted the frog-eating Lois clone ordeal.
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Well, I certainly wouldn't want mopey Clark. To be fair, that could have been her intention going into the show rather than after completing the season.
I can't confirm this quote, but it sounds reasonable. Things probably did change over the course of that first year.Asked the inevitable question as to whether Lois and Clark will ever, uh, get together, LeVine is surprisingly candid. "Yes, definitely. Clark will reveal to Lois that he loves her, she'll fall in love with him, he'll tell her that he's Superman, and hopefully, they'll get married. My plan is not to do it for several more seasons, but if I see dark at the end of the tunnel this season, I'll make it happen very quickly."Comment
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Yeah, part of the problem is: these new writers stink at writing romance. We're getting teen angst romance and drama, with characters in their 20's and 30's. I do think these kinds of shows need more than just "superhero stuff". Especially now, that we have so many (we have four on the CW alone). Otherwise, they become generic. And it's bad enough that the four CW shows are largely the same show, repackaged four times (OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE!!). You need more of a plot, than simply a person in a suit, fighting bad guys. However, it doesn't have to be romance.
Decided to listen to the Pilot commentary. She says she didn't want them to get together, until at least the fifth season, as she felt the show would take a turn for the worse, when they did get together. You know, she created L&C as a romantic comedy. And, in romantic comedies, they get together and the story is done. It's no surprise that, after Lois & Clark said "I Do", the ratings went down and the show was canceled. However, five years would've been too long, for them to even start dating. People would've grown tired of the relationship never going anywhere.Comment
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Seeing the basic discussion on this page just a day after arguing with a friend as to why I think Frasier was better than Cheers (maybe I'm in a minority here!) has brought to mind the point when I think Frasier started to go downhill. Much of the enjoyment of the show came from years of Niles secretly pining after Daphne and her being totally oblivious to it. When they eventually got together, it seemed as though the writers didn't really know what to do with them after that. That's the risk with the romantic angle on TV shows because the thrill of the chase is far more satisfying for the writers and viewers than the aftermath of a successful catch.Comment
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Yeah that happens way to often. In this regard the writers are basically like The Joker from The Dark Knight:
Do I really look like a guy with a plan, Harvey? I don't have a plan...The mob has plans, the cops have plans. You know what I am, Harvey? I'm a dog chasing cars... I wouldn't know what to do with one if I caught it.Comment
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Most of the writers now, do seem to suck at writing romance. The one thing that seems to happen, is they are bad at the slow burn. It goes from nothing, to full blown supernova, at the flip of a switch. When you watch Lois and Clark, they really didn't date that long. Clark proposed at the end of the second season, after less than a full season of them dating. It was incredibly fast. I get the "but they're starcrossed soulmates" bit that they threw in the show, but it was too much. The show basically built itself on the premise of exploring the relationship between the two of them, but then skipped over the majority of the relationship.
However, while that is a valid criticism of the show, I still feel Lois and Clark had the far better charaterization than what we've been given anywhere else thus far. I actually cared for both of them, and totally see why Lois Lane would fall for Clark Kent, and why Clark Kent would fall for Lois Lane. They even had depth to the characters. Clark's occasional reveals that he was far more wordly, experienced, and knowledgable than Lois would expect from the "Hack from Nowheresville". Lois revealing to Clark her attitude and rules for herself stem from life experience, and aren't arbitrary to the story. She trusted and got burned. Clark promising not to do that, inadvertantly sort of doing it anyway, but being a real person about it, and confronting the problem head on, and not trying to run from his feelings, or the consequences of his actions. They had some truly great relationship moments, even over the short time they were dating/engaged.
Thinking about it now, I would have loved to see one of my favorite comics seens played out on Lois and Clark, though it would have been a bit dark. Manchester Black, and telepath/telekinetic, decides to test Superman, because Black believes there is no such thing as a real hero. That even Superman is just a selfish jerk deep down, and will gave to his most basic impulses when sufficient pressure is placed on him. In a horrific moment, Superman comes home to find Lois has been savagely murdered, and Manchester Black claims responsibility for it, basically telling him what he did in detail. Clark is holding a broken and lifeless Lois, and Black is just taunting him over it. Superman has a brief moment where he imagines just vaporizing Manchester Black with his heat vision, but turns to him and just tells Black that he's taking him in for murder. Manchester Black just stares at him, basically gives a giant WTF, and tries to talk Superman into murdering him. Clark then essentially lays out that he can't, he won't, and he never could, because Lois would never forgive him for that. He refuses to dishonor his wife and her memory, and everything he was raised to be, over another person's hatred, malice, and BS. Black then reveals Lois is alive, and Superman has been trapped in a psychic illusion. Manchester Black was testing Superman, and hoping to commit suicide essentially, because he lost all belief in their really being "light" in the world. He didn't believe a real hero could exist. It blows his mind that Superman really is what he claims to be. He tells him, "you're the real deal".
I don't know why I thought of that, but as soon as it popped into my head, I can't imagine any of the other Superman and Lois pairs from stage or screen, playing that scene out. It's always Dean and Teri, because out of all the Superman pairings on screen, I actually believed them.Comment
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Yeah, I could see the Dean Cain's Superman and Teri Hatcher's Lois in that scene you just described, Hal.
Too bad that never happened on the TV show. That would had shown both the writers and the viewers that things doesn't have to be dull just because the two got married. That they could still have tons of interesting things happen despite the fact that they were married.
As much as I love Tom Welling, I don't think Clark from Smallville would be able to pull off that scene realistically, considering how impulsive and hot-headed he could be at times. we have to admit that the smallville version's biggest weakness is that he often jumps the gun a lot... without thinking things though. And knowing the writers and directors-- they would probably find a way to make it be about Lana instead of Lois somehow. They often made it seem like Lois was the second choice instead of Lana, because of how Lana-obsessed they were.
On the flip side of Superman TV shows--I think they could do that in an animated series, in the vein of the JLA/JLU cartoon series. They had some pretty dark moments, without going too grimdark. And I think they'd be able to adapt that story-line very well. Young Justice could pull that off with Superman too, I think.Comment
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Not gonna happen. Why? Politics. Mr. Cain seems to be on the conservative side of things and if you're not Adam Baldwin playing some kind of military personnel, that simply doesn't fly anymore, especially since it is public knowledge. Cain made several podcasts with Steven Crowder. That alone would have him blacklisted by the liberals.Comment
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I doubt that. I know several liberals who were a big fan of Dean Cain's acting career even if they didn't agree with most of his real life political views. I also know many liberal superman fans who were a fan of Dean Cain's superman, even if his superman came off as conservative at times.
You see, unless he was a murderer, child molester or a serial rapist, many are able to separate the actor's political views from his work. I personally hate the fact that he's such a homophobic bastard in real life, but that didn't stop me from enjoying his portrayal of the character.
But thinking about it, I think they might have a problem if it's only Teri Hatcher and Dean Cain coming back to reprise their roles. What really made the series, was the fact that they also focused on the supporting cast's lives too. Made the daily planet feel more real, once we got to know the people working there.
If I recall, the man who played Perry White died. I think the actors who played Superman's parents retired from acting. The lady who plays Martha is currently an author now. Not so sure about the Jonathan guy.
It would be a real downer if they stated that all three of them died or something. And it wouldn't feel right if they replaced Clark Kent's parents with some other actors in the L&C universe. I can see Justin Whalin (Jimmy) coming back though.
Maybe they could just do a comic series like they did with Batman '66? Teri Hatcher and Dean Cain gets to write and direct some stories for the comic series, and have their likeness be on it. This way we could also get past the problem with Perry White's actor being dead, etc.Comment
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Looking at IMDB, both Eddie Jones (Jonathan) and K Callan (Martha) are stil acting. As for Perry, it would be 20 years after the events of the series. Certain things are bound to change, over two decades. Perry wouldn't even have to be dead. Were Lane Smith still alive today, he would've been 81 years old. So, Perry would've retired years ago. And Clark would've taken over as editor-in-chief of the DP (like in the old Earth-Two continuity).
L&C Season 5 would be L&C 20 years later. It shouldn't ride the nostalgia train (like some other rivials), but reflect the reality of how these characters lives would've changed over these two decades. If we take the Batman '66 Meets Wonder Woman '77 series, as an example, the last two issues take place in the late 70's. Bruce is retired as Batman, Alfred's dead, Robin's become Nightwing and Barbara Gordon (now Batwoman) has become the new commisioner. You get a sense that their lives have evolved over the past decade.
What would be a real downer is, if we see these characters, after 20 years... and absolutely nothing's changed. Everyone is exactly where we left them, 20 years ago. No one's career has advanced in 20 years. Life hasn't changed for anyone.
The show also ended on a cliffhanger, with a Kryptonian baby (who'd be about 20 now). So, top priority would be to resolve said cliffhanger.Comment
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I agree, some things definitely should change. I was just pointing out that it would've sucked if it was only Teri Hatcher and Dean Cain who came back. The other surviving actors definitely need to come back, even if it's just for a short cameo in one scene. If Lane Smith (Perry white) was still alive, I would've had wanted a short cameo from him too. Even if it was just to show him enjoying his retirement.
That would really help sell the idea that this is the L&C universe, 20 years later.
And they do have a good story to start off with, like you said. The Kryptonian baby--I always thought that he was from the future where genetic engineering a Kryptonian/human hybrid was possible. I always assumed that the note was from a time traveller as a kid for some reason. You have to admit it'd make a lot of sense.
The other possibility-- That group of Kryptonians who tried to have Clark/Kal-El come with them once. Although it would be weird for them to have kept an eye on Lois and Clark, and help them out like that. The production notes from the final ep indicated that the Kryptonian baby was royalty, and were supposed to age up rapidly and eventually leave the couple who raised him. But to be honest I don't like that at all.
The L&C movie could follow Conner Johnathan Kent, Son of Clark Kent and Lois Lane. Clark and Lois would feature very heavily in this movie, of course.
Story idea/suggestion:
It's his 20th birthday and Conner Kent is still figuring out what he wants to do in life. He just graduated from college, now he has no idea what to do.
There's the one thing He's already happy doing... playing the role of Superman when Clark himself couldn't come for some reason. To the world, his alter ego is known as Kon-El, or Superman jr. But, being a superhero doesn't pay the bills AND his parents want him to have a second job that would ground him among all the human beings.
Clark Kent is kind of pressuring him into getting a job at the daily planet, but Connor wants to do his own thing. It also doesn't help that Clark Kent is the editor-in-chief of the daily planet, so getting a job there would had been seen as favoritism. It's something they argue over. Connor also gets advice from his mother Lois, and his grandparents about this particular issue. He also talks to Jimmy Olsen about it, because he always saw Jimmy as a "fun uncle", despite them not being related at all. Jimmy often babysat him in the past, and he also eventually found out that Clark Kent was Superman. (this takes care of all the cameos!)
During this time he also discovers that he was "adopted", which confuses him. He clearly has kryptonian blood, and Clark is the only Kryptonian on earth. So obviously they have to be related by blood... right?
During this time the villain Tempus appears, and actually brought back Lex Luthor with him from a earlier time period! Naturally this leads to a lot of trouble for both Clark and Conner, who has to suit up together as Supermen to take on the troublesome pair. HG Wells would show up as well, and then eventually reveal Conner's real origins as a test tube baby from the future... and the fact that he was the one who brought Conner back to this time period so that Lois and Clark would have a chance at having a biological child that was truly theirs.
Lois and Clark was going to see Conner as their son no matter what, but they're still highly touched to find out that Conner was genetically their son after all. Conner is just relived that he wasn't an adopted child from off planet.
The movie ends with the two of them flying though the sky as Superman and superman jr together.
What do you think? I dunno, I would really like to see a L&C take on Conner Kent aka Kon-El.
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