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  1. #1
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    Veronica & Buffy - Discuss

    The two shows have been compared since the very beginning. Joss wrote that Veronica was the best show ever, was interviewed saying that this was the first show he was honored to have compared to Buffy, and even appeared on the show this season. The press is always a buzz with comparisons of the show.

    Today, TV Squad wrote an article entitled "The Five Ways Veronica Mirrors Buffy"
    1. Hot Chick, Kicking Ass + Baggage -- This is the most obvious parallel for the two shows. We've got a cute, high school aged girl who's had her share of a troubled past, but she takes little crap from anyone. Sure, one kicks ass with fists, feet and weaponry, while the other does so with a knack for sleuthing, but their motive remains true: take down the bad guys, stay trendy in the process.

    2. The Scooby Gang -- Buffy had Xander and Willow in the beginning, and they all met at the library to discuss their plans. Veronica has Wallace and Mac, and Veronica's library parallel turns to the girl's restroom at school. Mac's similarities to Willow are almost too obvious. Wallace is still that guy who helps Veronica with her investigations, though he has no real unique skills to offer (just as Xander had no real powers to offer). Each show even referenced themselves as the "Scooby Gang" at some point.

    3. The Good, Single Parent -- Buffy had single-mom, Joyce. Veronica has single-dad, Keith. Both parents had rotten relationships with their spouses for whatever reason, and their daughters love and support them almost solely. The similarities with the parents pretty much ends there, though, as Keith plays a much more active role in the series than Joyce ever did.

    4. The Big Bad -- Both shows had/have one great recipe that I've come to love of these kinds of shows. Each series has episodes that easily stand on their own, one way or another. They also have one "big bad" or primary evil of the season to be defeated. Throughout the season, we get some advancement to that final episode where everything comes to a head, and it keeps you anxiously awaiting each new episode with bated breath.

    5. High School Angst -- Both shows start out in a beautiful, California high school. The principal's got something out for Veronica/Buffy, and she knows how to make his life just a little more difficult with every meeting. While Buffy had Giles, Veronica's had exchanges with a few different teachers who'd been there to help. I sometimes wonder if Sydney Tamiia Poitier was originally cast to play the Giles-like character on Veronica Mars, since she was featured prominently in the credits in season one, then suddenly she disappeared from the show (on the show, they blame a sudden case of getting pregnant as reason for her leaving school -- anyone know the real reason she left the show?)
    http://www.tvsquad.com/2005/11/29/th...mirrors-buffy/

    Not to mention all the other comparisons... here I go...

    6) Unique Witty Dialogue & Banter - both shows use a quick-paced dialogue pattern that is filled with wit, banter and unique terminology. Both heroines consistantly provide quippy one liners when confronting their respective bad guys. And the "Scooby Gang" creates their own banter, which outsiders don't always get.

    7) Bad Ass Truth Telling Love Interest - both girls have a bad both with a golden heart love interest, Spike on Buffy and Logan on Veronica. The boys are villanized repeatedly, but with the next breath they are suddenly romantic and sweet. Both have a nack for telling the other characters the truth, which is exactly what they don't want to hear, and doing it in a witty and slightly cruel way. And both Logan & Spike seem to get the quippiest, wittiest and funniest dialogue.

    8) Obsession with the First Love - Veronica & Buffy both have an obsession with their slightly dopey and dull first boyfriend. The first love is changed remarkably by their first sexual encounter... Angel loses his soul and goes evil, Duncan sleeps with her thinking she's his sister and then spends a year hurting her & ignoring her.

  2. #2
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    I think that you forgot the obvious - they are both blonde! Hello! LOL

    I think another one is the feeling of isolation and alone-ness. They both started off popular and somewhat vapid, a change to vampire slayer (or in VM's case a series of changes and occurances) alter their perception and standing in the world.

    Yes they both are hip, but I think VM dresses more purpose and weather apppropriate

    To be honest I don't really feel like they're that alike, if that were true all VM fans would have loved Buffy and that's not true. VM is someways is more relateable as a teenager, she has no special powers, her life sucks and the guy she's in love with (Duncan, or so she thinks) will never live up to her ideal.

  3. #3
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    Yes, of course, the most important comparison... they are both blond. LOL!!!

    Agreed, they are both the popular girl turned bad-ass outsider.

    As for clothes, VM tends to dress more in line with her outsider status, where somewhat grungy clothes or odd combinations. I'm not always a fan of some of her clothing choices, but that seems to be her point. Plus, the RT team is trying to hard to make her look very different from the Veronica pre-Lilly's death.

    The big thing that differentiates the shows is the method of coming to terms with things, the genre of the show and the actual main character herself.

    Buffy was forced to face the consequences of her actions and situation on a magical & fantastical way. Everything on Buffy had elements of horror and fantasy. Also, Buffy was far more up beat and light a character, even though she had gone through a lot. Buffy had to deal with her character traits of "holier than though" and being "cold".

    On the other hand, Veronica Mars takes place in a gritty & dark world filled with mysteries & human horrors. There is nothing other worldly about VM, all the evils and battles take place as a result of human frailty and cruelty. Veronica is forced to deal with the consequences of her actions because of the confrontations she undergoes via the people in her life and the various results of her desperate truth seeking attempts. Veronica must consistantly face her desire for revenge, her difficulty & poor choices in trust, and her jealousy issues.

    As for the first love never living up to an ideal, well Angel fits that bill as well. Angel could never give her a normal life, he could never marry her and have kids, he could never walk into the sunlight with her.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    Ohh Yellowqueen I think you are my thread-mate, wanna be my unrealistic, never-meet-my-ideal, first thread love?

  5. #5
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    Wow... I think that is the very best proposition I've ever gotten on a thread. How can I resist an offer like that???? LOL!!!!

  6. #6
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    I am hoping, of course, that you don't end up boring as all hell and dreaming of me dressed in a domanatriz outfit but what the hell, let's have a go at thread love

    Now I am sounding just like my imaginations of Duncan the psycho, where's the car I can beat to a pulp? Looking both directions. Oh well let's end it before it begins, i cannot stand the disappointment or having to take medication.

    Yellowqueen - I am a fan LOL

    Now I am sounding just like my imaginations of Duncan the psycho, where's the car I can beat to a pulp? Looking both directions. Oh well let's end it before it begins, i cannot stand the disappointment or having to take medication.

    Yellowqueen - I am a fan LOL
    Last edited by BlueJay; 11-29-2005 at 03:53 PM.

  7. #7
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    I love having another fan. And although I may have been called psycho before, I've never ever been called boring. If you want to peg me as a character on TV, I'm usually pegged as Buffy (BTVS), Mal (Firefly), or Veronica (VM)... if that helps you get my unboring personality.

  8. #8
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    Seriously - getting back to the comparison.

    The Xander/Wallace correlation I just don't buy. The are both minorities in a way. Xander's the token loser, boy in the Scoobies and Wallace (at the moment) is the token black friend. Wallace and Xander have both been the best characters that listen to their protagonists e.g VM telling the 'whole'' sotry and Xander and Buffy's close, confidante relatinship specifically in S7.


    Apologies for all the typos, teachers can spell just not type

    You're not Duncan, you're the queen bee, the glint in my eye. the serious qualitity to this thread.

    If anything i just took that metaphor way, way, too FARRRR

  9. #9
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    I love it!!!! Although, since I'm the only other person writing on this thread it is hard not to be.

    The comparison between the scoobies and the outsiders (my name for now since they keep making references to the book/movie outsiders) is the biggest stretch, since they really arent' that similar. And Veronica really doesn't rely on them as much as Buffy did. The whole point of Buffy was that she couldn't stand alone, that her greatest strength was her friends & family. Whereas, Veronica is often forced to stand alone, be tough and strive because of it.

  10. #10
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    Just had a thought

    Buffy had two bland boyf's
    Angel and Riley

    Veronica's only had one bland boyf, but on two occasions. Leo doesn' count as Leo was laidback so I wouldn't call him bland rather...yummy.

    Riley was Whiny, I wish Duncan was whiny

  11. #11
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    The comparison between the scoobies and the outsiders (my name for now since they keep making references to the book/movie outsiders) is the biggest stretch, since they really arent' that similar. And Veronica really doesn't rely on them as much as Buffy did. The whole point of Buffy was that she couldn't stand alone, that her greatest strength was her friends & family. Whereas, Veronica is often forced to stand alone, be tough and strive because of it.
    Have you even watched Buffy? Especially the last few seasons, she was relagated to handling things away from her friends, while drawn to them in times of stress. Same deal with Veronica.

    Scoobies/"Outsiders" nothing alike? I can't agree with that;

    Xander/Wallace -- Funny best-friend, but totally devoid of any meaningful talent.

    Willow/Meg -- Timid, and sometimes *****y girlfriend that was sometimes short-changed in there role on the show.

    Giles/Keith -- The "Father figure" (well, in VM case, Father) who's both a mentor and collegue.

    Spike/Logan -- Quick witted, popular and with a seriously wicked dark-side.

    Angel/Duncan -- Love of there lives, and somewhat bland, although both have a wild-card in there decks. Angel had Angelus, Duncan has.... well.... we'll just call them demons.

  12. #12
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    Originally posted by VMBTVSFAN.
    Have you even watched Buffy?
    Ouch!!! Yes, I've watched Buffy... obviously. And the comparisons you've made are similar to the ones I've made several time on this very board.

    When speaking scoobies I was meaning specifically Xander/Willow vs. Wallace/Mac. Even as low as Buffy got or distancey... they were still a huge part of her life and her closest friends. Veroncia never lets Wallace or Mac in, although they are the closest thing she has to friends, it is still very clear that she is a loner & outsider. In the end she is always on her own. In Buffy, the message went the other way. Every time Buffy pushed her scooby pals away, she suffered the consequences. What made her strong was the scoobies. That aspect is very different between the two shows.

    Additionally, Mac & Willow really aren't anything alike in personality. Sure they are both computer geeks... but that is about it. And Veronica's relationship to Mac isn't anywhere near the relationship between Buffy & Willow. The comparison between Wallace and Xander is even more stretched IMO. They really aren't alike. Wallace isn't in love with Veronica. He's popular and decent with the ladies. He doesn't really take s**t from Veronica and he has his own life aside from her. But I do see the comparisons in the basic structure of two friends, one female & one male, that help her solve mysteries & fight the big bad.

  13. #13
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    Yes there are similarities ... and there are differences. Veronica's friends have had identities that aren't Veronica-dependant. Buffy friends only got to that point in the latter seasons. Veronica's friends, I don''t really know if Meg was really one without selfish motivations, are the basketball jock, the tech nerd and the biker. When you look at the most basic stereotypical manifestations of their characters of course they are going to be alike.

    The quick repartee that is characteristic of the show is Buffy-like but then so is Gilmore Girls and other shows of the same era. Have you heard that copyrighting someone's butt is the most sincerist form of flattery.

    I am a buffy fan, really!

    I attended the Melbourne Buffy Convention and met ASH and JM, called my GeekGirl!!

  14. #14
    KryptonSite Moderator yellowqueen22's Avatar
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    The GG pop culture references and quick witted repetoire is direclty influenced by Buffy.

    I forgot to add #9... pop culture references.

    9) Pop Culture Repetoire - both shows go all pop culture referency. In every episode you can find quite a huge variety of pop culture references, from modern movies, classic films, comic books, literature, music, and current news. Think "spidey sense", Clark Kent identity references, Ferris Bueller parade jokes, Gone with the Wind & Casablanca references... and on it goes....

  15. #15
    Forum Regular BlueJay's Avatar
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    How about

    #10 Friends with names of animals and plant life?

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