Allison Mack, Second-in-Command of a Sex Cult

[Martin le Magicien]

She didn't seem enthusiastic while he was describing those horrific things, so that's a good point for her: she was just saying "Okay" a lot in a robotic voice. However, she was clearly disappointed and jealous when he told her that he wanted other people opinions on the branding ritual. She seemed like a person madly in love, some kind of Harley Quinn actually.

However, I just read about what is probably the most horrific thing Raniere said: that it was okay to have sex with children, that in some case they were even craving it. If that is not enough to snap you out of it, are you even a good person deep down? When do we say that brainwashing isn't a good excuse anymore?

[Doranwen]

People who are locked into belief in their idol (which was what Raniere was, in a way) hard enough turn off all rational thinking, and I'm pretty sure that's where she was. By the time she'd have heard that from him, I'm betting even cognitive dissonance (between that and what she should've known was the truth) couldn't shake her out of it. The only thing that I suspect has had a real impact is him being locked up in jail and her having to sit at her parents' home for months on end (broken up with brief court appearances), and I would imagine she needs serious therapy at this point. The damage that does to one's mind to turn off thinking like that, it's not a process that one can just snap out of and go back to normal. She's going to have to retrain her brain and thinking skills, and my understanding is that that requires professional help.

That aside, I don't think it's a matter of whether brainwashing is an excuse or not. Someone can be a victim AND a victimizer, and while I doubt Allison ever went to that level of depravity (unfounded speculation aside), some of the things she did were clearly wrong, and she still has to atone for those, whether she was in her right mind or not. It doesn't mean that one can't pity or feel some sympathy for her, because I don't believe she would ever have sank to those levels if Raniere hadn't entered her life. It's possible to be sympathetic to someone's experiences (as a victim) while still not excusing their actions (in victimizing others).

[Bally]

Raniere has been found guilty of all charges by the jury and now awaits sentencing.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48699099

[Doranwen]

*fistpump* Justice at last. Now I just want to see Clare Bronfman arrested for some of her other crimes - it sounded like she would: https://artvoice.com/2019/06/17/sour...tional-crimes/

I'm also very curious to hear how much time Allison will be sentenced with.

[moviefan2k4]

This article says Raniere was convicted of all charges against him, and faces life in prison. Allison's sentencing is later this year, but she could face up to 20 years.

https://metro.co.uk/2019/06/19/smallvilles-allison-mack-testifies-keith-raniere-found-guilty-running-sex-cult-10015934/

[Amar J]

Throw away the keys for the lot of them. All of them are monsters

[skizzo]

https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/nxivm-trial-allison-mack-sex-slave-nicole-abuse-keith-raniere-845830/

So disgusting to read this. Allison did these slaves so wrong

[Doranwen]

(The thread notification email went into junk mail for some reason, just now saw it.)

So disgusting to read this. Allison did these slaves so wrong

And Raniere did her major wrong as well - she couldn't possibly even think straight on a starvation diet, sleep-deprived, and having been told wrong was right (so to speak) for so long. See here: https://frankreport.com/2019/07/26/a...-had-over-her/

It doesn't excuse her behavior - she still has to be held accountable (and I think jail for a few years should do it, as reports are that she is still mentally very fragile, had a near-breakdown, and is terrified of prison) - but it's mitigating circumstances. She's neither all victim nor all perpetrator, and I still pity her because who sets out to be where she is? No one. When she began her role as Chloe, I don't think this future for her would have ever been in her mind as a possibility, not in a million years. The one who holds the most guilt for where she is today is rotting at MDC and will be in jail for life, basically. So rather than denouncing her as a terrible person, I'd rather look at her as someone who's messed up - spectacularly, in front of the public eye, and in a way that has hurt others greatly in addition to herself - but someone who is nonetheless as much of a human being as anyone else, and who is not unredeemable. Only Raniere and Clare Bronfman and perhaps a handful of others have committed themselves to what they were doing with relish and appear to be unwilling to truly admit that they were wrong. (And I still hope Clare and the others are brought to true justice eventually.) Allison is not at all in the same boat as them.

I'm interested in seeing when they actually sentence her, since that's been postponed: https://frankreport.com/2019/07/15/a...ing-postponed/

[harryandginnyfanatic]

Sara Fletcher is apparently playing her in the NXVIM movie.

Don’t they need her permission for that?

[MrT]

Looks like Zod got mixed up in this sex scandal too.

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/smallville-actor-callum-blue-opens-up-about-joining-nxivm-on-true-hollywood-story

[Martin le Magicien]

So, today is the day Allison will be sentenced. Never in a million years would I have ever imagined being here today for that. Crazy world.


EDIT : 3 years in prison. Not a lot.

[Doranwen]

It is crazy indeed.

For anyone who wants some background on her sentencing, these articles on the Frank Report are very interesting:

https://frankreport.com/2021/06/22/shocking-development-allison-macks-sentencing-guidelines-recommend-14-17-years-in-prison-government-asks-judge-for-leniency-since-actress-provided-substantial-assistance-against-raniere/

https://frankreport.com/2021/06/26/allison-macks-complete-presentencing-letter-to-the-judge-and-to-all-those-who-have-been-harmed-by-my-actions/

https://frankreport.com/2021/06/28/mindy-mack-pleads-for-leniency-for-her-daughter-allison-in-heartfelt-letter/

https://frankreport.com/2021/06/29/will-the-punishment-fit-the-crime-in-the-allison-mack-sentencing/

https://frankreport.com/2021/06/29/the-case-for-forgiveness-let-the-healing-begin/

And of course the currently-being-updated post on the sentencing: https://frankreport.com/2021/06/30/u...-june-30-2021/


EDIT: Yeah, I'm kind of glad he went with 3 years. Less than that would've been an insult to those who were harmed by her actions, but significantly more than that (such as the amount Clare Bronfman was sentenced to, or higher) would've ignored the fact that she's not a hardened and depraved criminal. A criminal she may be, yes, but one that most likely didn't have a clue she was heading down this path, who was easily manipulated, and who has tried to redeem herself as best she can (and who, unlike Clare, has actually repudiated Raniere). I don't think she's in any danger of harming others in the future, which makes a severe sentence (as a deterrent / preventative) unnecessary.

[~*Lois & Clark Fan*~]

Uhm she is depraved for what she did to those women, 3 years is a slap in the face to the victims

https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/allison-mack-nxivm-sentenced-keith-raniere-memo-1235008997/

[Doranwen]

Uhm she is depraved for what she did to those women, 3 years is a slap in the face to the victims

https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/all...mo-1235008997/

Not at all. Quoting from the very article that you linked (it's long but important):

There are also important mitigating factors, three of which I want to emphasize. First, your lawyers make a persuasive case that you, like the victims of your conduct, were ensnared in Mr. Raniere’s coercive and manipulative web. Like your victims, you turned over collateral in connection with your involvement in DOS. Like your victims, you were subject to abusive and unreasonable demands that were designed to destabilize you and deprive you of your agency. I don’t doubt that you were also manipulated and that you also felt captive, even as you were inflicting those very consequences on other women. In the language of DOS, you were a slave as well as a master, and the harms that you inflicted as a master were, to some extent, demanded of you in your capacity as Mr. Raniere’s slave. Even the letters from your victims reflect a kind of ambivalence: many of them see you both as their abuser and as a fellow victim. That is something that weighs on me. It is hard to determine an appropriate sentence for a perpetrator who is also her co-conspirator’s victim.

Second, you have expressed remorse and contrition and made significant progress towards rehabilitating yourself. And I see no reason to doubt that your efforts and your progress are sincere. In contrast to other individuals who have remained deferential to Mr. Raniere even as the artifice of his virtues crumbled, you have begun the hard work of unraveling the lies and grappling with your culpability and the consequences of your behavior. I don’t doubt that it has been difficult and painful to dispel some of the illusions under which you were operating and to attempt to see yourself and your behavior with a new kind of clarity. I commend you for having the courage to engage in that work.

Your contrition and ownership of your actions cannot repair the damage that you inflicted, but it is an important and encouraging step towards your own rehabilitation. I urge you to continue that work, during and after your sentence, so that you may better understand for yourself what happened, why it happened, what effects it had, and how you can ensure that it does not happen again.

Third, you have assisted the Government with its investigation and prosecution. As the Government described in its sentencing submission, you began to cooperate with their investigation approximately one month prior to Mr. Raniere’s trial. You provided key details about Mr. Raniere’s role in DOS, including his solicitation of nude photographs and sexual encounters. You turned over evidence, including emails, documents, and an audio recording that became a crucial piece of evidence at trial, in which Mr. Raniere devises the DOS branding ritual. According to the Government, you were willing to testify at trial, though you were not called upon to do so. The Government takes the position that while you could have been even more helpful if you had begun to cooperate sooner, you deserve a sentence below the Guidelines range in recognition of the assistance that you provided.

CONCLUSION

Taking all of this into consideration, my task today is to balance the need for a sentence that adequately punishes your serious conduct with the need for a sentence that supports rather than disrupts your efforts towards rehabilitation. There will be more chapters to your life after your sentence concludes, and it is the court’s hope that you will be ready and able to make the most of those chapters, and that the family and community that have supported you through the last three years will aid you in continuing your work of rehabilitation as you move through your sentence, and as you eventually move beyond it.

Note that after the judge points out all of the criminal and harmful things she's done, he tells her, "I don't doubt that you were also manipulated and that you also felt captive, even as you were inflicting those very consequences on other women". This is a major mitigating factor! "It is hard to determine an appropriate sentence for a perpetrator who is also her co-conspirator's victim." I'm glad that he recognized that, something few people seem to take into account.

I find a lot of people want to swing one way or the other on this, with a very few wanting her to not serve time and the vast majority wanting her to be locked up for well over a decade (in what would then be maximum security prison). It's easy to look at her crimes and go, "Throw the book at her!" "Make it a long sentence!" etc. People feel self-righteous doing so, because she is so obviously guilty of her crimes (which sound terrible), and by supporting harsh punishment, we feel like that's the best thing.

But criminal consequences balance several factors: protection for society from the individual doing further harm (something it's highly unlikely she would be capable of doing in the future, for a variety of reasons), any non-incarceration consequences (paying fines, doing other things to set things right), (in a multi-defendant case such as this one) whether the criminal has provided valuable help to the government in prosecuting a bigger fish (so to speak) - which she has, whether the criminal can be redeemed and contribute positively to society in the future (something she has been working towards with the support of family and friends who have been able to "have her back" after NXIVM had her mind captive for years), and a sense of justice for the victims. You're looking only at the last factor and ignoring the rest.

The judge, on the other hand, has clearly looked at all of it, and the memo, published in that article, articulates the complexity of his decision quite well. Her crimes are bad, yes, but she was also a victim as much as a perpetrator (some leniency MUST be considered in that light, otherwise you are denigrating every victim's experience), she is repentant and trying to move on, she provided help to convict Raniere, and society is in no danger from her in the future. Three years is, I think, a reasonable balance between all of that.

And other than giving some of the victims a sense of "ha! she got what's coming to her" or "she can't hurt me or anyone else now!" - an emotional sense of satisfaction - how will putting her in prison for well over a decade (as compared to three years) help them? She is in no more danger of hurting anyone should she be released in three years than thirteen (she's not following after Raniere - nor is she likely to get sucked in anywhere now, with the support and therapy she's got), and the sense of satisfaction in seeing one's abuser be punished, while valid (particularly in cases where said abuser is not repentant), will not assist those victims much in moving on with their lives. It does nothing to deal with the effects of whatever abuse they experienced, and if they focus and hold onto that delight in her punishment, it may sour and poison their attitudes towards life. (One of the blog posts pointed out the benefits of forgiveness for the one doing the forgiving, and a saying I grew up with suggested that holding hate or resentment against someone "is like drinking poison and hoping the other person will die".) And in Allison Mack's case, she's written letters of apology and (I believe) is truly regretful for her actions. They may never want to deal with her again (and it might be well that they don't), but it does not benefit them to rejoice gleefully in harsh punishment (that brings out the worst in people), nor does it benefit society as a whole, compared to allowing her a reasonable measure of punishment (three years locked up will probably feel like a lifetime enough) and then giving her the chance to rebuild a life that can contribute to the world rather than harm it.


EDIT: The Variety article cut the memo just a bit short. Frank Parlato's post on his blog has a bit more of it: https://frankreport.com/2021/06/30/j...-allison-mack/

What I found interesting was the three conditions for when she is paroled:

1) She can't contact anyone involved with NXIVM (specifically, who is on a prohibited list). I presume that means she's forbidden from contacting Nicki Clyne or any others who are still supporters of Raniere. Whether that list also includes her former victims or not, I do not know.

2) She will be required to undergo a mental health evaluation (which she has to pay for) and if necessary, undergo any outpatient treatment. (Also, one of the final lines of the memo was this: "The court recommends that the defendant be designated to a Bureau of Prisons facility that provides mental health counseling so that she may continue the course of rehabilitative treatment that she has pursued while on release.")

3) She will be required to do 1,000 hours of community service.

#1 is logical; I would have expected that one. I particularly like the inclusion of #2 - that will benefit society far more than another five years in prison. (Just the financial aspect alone - but also the fact that proper treatment might help her to avoid hurting others in the future…) And #3 might show her more beneficial ways to "help people" than self-help cults. Had she gotten sucked into a particular type of charity years ago and thrown herself into that sort of work, she might never have gotten into NXIVM in the first place.

[costas22]

She should count her blessings.