View Poll Results: What did you think?

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  1. #31
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrow_47 View Post
    The only obvious downside for me was that hussy kissing Oliver right in front of his wife. Has she no shame?
    8/10.
    Does Al Sahhim not recall the sacred vows he made before the Head of the Demon himself two years ago? Can't say I'd blame him if he didn't -- with all the hallucinogenic incense flying around that chamber. Maybe he thought he was marrying McKenna or even Helena.

    (It's wedding night. Olicity's on fire!)

    "Oliver: Ohh ... McKenna.

    Felicity: WTF?!

    Oliver: Whoa. Wait. My bad. Before you throw that half-eaten cupcake at me, let me explain ... I have PTSD, Ra's juiced me with god-knows-what drugs, Chase beat me senseless and messed with my head ...

    Felicity: I mean, it was bad enough Quentin's wedding gift said: 'To Oliver + Laurel' He tried to pass it off as a typo. I mean, really? But now, as we are about to consummate our marriage ... you bring up one of your paramours? And did Nyssa really have to show up in full League widow regalia? The cape on that thing was longer than our limo! 'I am mourning the besmirching of my honour by your immoral union', she was saying the whole time.

    Oliver: Baby, it's not that bad. She bought us a trip to Tahiti as a gift. Tahiti!

    Felicity: She wore a black veil to the reception. A veil! It took six ninjas to carry her train.

    Oliver: If you will just give me ... a moment ... to process a suitable explanation. I mean, McKenna was one of my better relationships. So by comparing her to you -- it shows how much I care ... right?! *steamed, Felicity goes to bathroom and slams door*

    *His phone buzzes, it's a text from Rene: Yo, dog!!! Me 'n hoss are in Vegas, baby. Hitting the casino now. Hey, whatever you do -- don't say another girl's name, lol. Peace out.*

    Oliver: I cannot catch a break! *mumbles* Stupid League wedding. I got Ra's-blocked."

  2. #32
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDBentz View Post
    @costas22: Flashbacks for 1x15. Oliver retrieves the herbs from Yao Fei's cave to treat Slade's wound. There's that one guy who works for Fyers trying to earn Oliver's trust there, using a story similar to his own.
    Ah, that short memory I was talking about. Thanks for reminding me. So I guess Oliver has had the herbs at his possession since then.

  3. #33
    Chlark Addict BkWurm1's Avatar
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    Wonder how the shippers feel about baby mama, now that she ships Olicity? #TeamSammie?
    See I couldn't help take her comment about how from the looks of that kiss, things weren't complicated as her kinda throwing shade at Felicity for ever breaking up with him and thus absolving Samantha of anything she might have done to contribute to the break up.

    I suspect that wasn't the intention of the scene but everything about their exchange was weird. First off, ok, so you are now walking through the woods toward a plane that you have no intention on getting on. What was the plan? Accompany them to the plane and then wave goodbye and hopefully track down Oliver with her kid? If she was so adamant about not "abandoning" William, why didn't she suggest she go with Oliver to look for him?

    We know it's because they wanted to do a fight scene but Samantha's plan to stay on the island when Oliver wouldn't have even known he'd have to swing by and pick her up just proves that William being dumb enough that he never learned to NOT talk to strangers (even after being kidnapped and having to go into hiding and change his name) can't be all blamed on Oliver's genetics.

    And I hated that the subtext of her her line about not abandoning William was her ripping into Oliver about HIM abandoning William when he sent them away (as proven by Felicity mentioning she'd been against the idea) as if Samantha hadn't done everything in her power to encourage Oliver to think he shouldn't be in the kid's life. Yes, Chase going after William is technically Oliver's fault, but be mad about that then, not that he sent the kid out of supposed harm's way.

    Then she notices Felicity not wearing her ring and asks if Felicity disagreeing over the kid being sent away was the reason why they'd broke up. How about the part where you convinced Oliver that he had to lie to Felicity or never see his son again? How can she so easily assume she had no part of their problems? Then she has the nerve when Felicity very graciously sidesteps the answer with an "it's complicated" by suggesting that Felicity is they only one that is making it complicated!!

    Plus she was SUPER helpful when Thea was on the land mine. After all she yelled at everybody that somebody had to do something!

    And then later when Malcolm was dead, why was she so worried about who was going to fly it? She wasn't even planning on getting on it.

    So no, Samanatha hasn't won me over at all. But I do wish her a long healthy life.

    About that. There is spec that they will let her be in a coma at the start of the season so they could show Oliver trying to be a father for a few episodes and show how that influences his decisions as the GA. (If he'd even go out if he had to look after William). Then after a couple episodes they could wake Samantha up and send her and MYSON! to live somewhere close enough that Oliver could occasionally see him, (hopefully offscreen) but far enough so that he's not around each week.

    MG has said they want to put Oliver in situations in season 6 that he hasn't been in before.

  4. #34
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    I loved this episode. This season finale was everything I had hoped for. 10/10

    Slade is back! Really back! Not some miracuru-influenced insane shadow of himself. And hey, coming out of nowhere and killing from behind seems to be like riding a bike - once learned one never forgets . Loved the interaction between Oliver and Slade. I think it is fitting that Slade is the one to point out to Oliver his survivor's guilt because he is the one who had known Oliver then. I also enjoyed their plan to have Slade seemingly switch sides again and again. I hope we will have some episodes Oliver helping Slade find Joe.

    And Slade pointing out that Oliver married Nyssa instead of Felicity - Oliver's reaction was just so on spot
    I hope we will see some more of Oliver and his chaotic situation regarding women in season six. What exactly does Nyssa expect from her marriage? Maybe to be closer to Felicity - I recall her reaction when the two met first time? A child? A family she trusts?

    Nyssa and Talia interaction was great. There seems to be lot's of stuff for season six to solve. They seemed to have been close before Talia left. BTW does Talia know that Nyssa and Oliver are married. Nyssa just said she would fight on the side of her friends, no "husband" here.

    I wonder if Malcom I-was-Ras-al-Ghul Merlin is really dead or if he talked them into joining him or had some healing water or something. The scenes with Thea were great, Thea still not knowing what to think of him.

    Guess the only ones who lost here were Talia's red shirt faceless zombie minions. First they had to place Chase's bombs all around the island and then they are cannon fodder for the heroes. Chase's plan was great - he even told Oliver they will meet on the boat before getting into the helicopter last episode: should have been a hint to Oliver to look for William on a boat.

    I won't forgive Chase destroying the island even more - it was just so beautiful. We will see what is left.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    It doesn't look like the monastery. Whatever it is, we didn't see Oliver live in it during the flashbacks, unless it's the crushed plane that he,Slade and Shado lived in for a while (at least the set is the same).
    I think the monastery was new. It never was mentioned before. I liked it though.

    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    Another question is where Oliver found the healing herbs that he kept using in season 1. Don't remember if that was addressed in the flashbacks.
    Oliver got them from Yao Fei. But we never learned where he got them from. It could well have been the monastery garden.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freawaru View Post
    I think the monastery was new. It never was mentioned before. I liked it though.



    Oliver got them from Yao Fei. But we never learned where he got them from. It could well have been the monastery garden.

    Way back in Season 2, Oliver and Slade climbed up on top of the hill to get a look at the freighter, just before it was bombed by Ivo. When the camera panned, there was a building visible- my theory is that it was the monastery.

    http://imgur.com/xtDqRFq

  7. #37
    Forum Regular Arrow_47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freawaru View Post
    I wonder if Malcom I-was-Ras-al-Ghul Merlin is really dead or if he talked them into joining him or had some healing water or something.
    Since they didn't show him actually die, they have a number of outs. He could have flipped Captain Boomerang on top of the mine and suffered some injuries while Boomerang took the brunt and died. Or, that could have been the moment in time when Reverse Flash grabbed him for the LOT season 2 storyline (less the haircut of course).

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrow_47 View Post
    Since they didn't show him actually die, they have a number of outs. He could have flipped Captain Boomerang on top of the mine and suffered some injuries while Boomerang took the brunt and died. Or, that could have been the moment in time when Reverse Flash grabbed him for the LOT season 2 storyline (less the haircut of course).
    Except they SHOWED when Reverse Flash grabbed him. He was grabbed the same night Darhk died in Season 4 of Arrow.

  9. #39
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    JB is a talented actor, let's get this out of the way first.

    My view that Malcolm's death should stick is not a reflection on JB, but in the declining relevance of the Malcolm character on Arrow specifically. I feel Malcolm's tenure as a character has run out of gas after five years. There is no more story to tell with Malcolm as far as I'm concerned. The show's struggle to generate in Thea what seems to be a manufactured familial corncern for a man who a) did not raise her and b) has the blood of at minimum of Tommy and Sara on his conscience (her being now alive is beside the point), never mind the deaths of innocent civilians -- only appears to be grasping at straws to extend his alleged relevance to the series.

    S3 was the year he should have paid the piper, and this could credibly happen with Ra's or Nyssa doing the deed. Oliver would keep his hands clean and Thea wouldn't have a reason to resent Oliver for doing it. Even in S4 Nyssa would have plenty of justification during the LOA civil war.

    Had he been better handled as a major or even series-long villain, Malcolm could likely have been written as the schemer who orchestrated the blindside arc instead of Chase. Imagine if this had been a hypothetical Merlyn endgame. Instead, they turned him into a frenemy, muddled his development and entangled him in melodrama and meh subplots, which only accelerated his slide into irrelevance on this show. Even in the LoD, he was the junior partner, while Thawne was the obvious aand more compelling alpha in the group.

    JB is great, but this greatness does not extend to keeping Malcolm on life support as a character without good reason to justify it storywise on Arrow.

    Having said that, they have totally kept the door open by not showing his death/producing a body. I am fine with a death and glory ending for Malcolm, killing off Digger and goons to save his daughter. No need to rehash angst we've seen in previous seasons.

    If they come up with fresh ideas for him (multiverse Malcolm from alternate Earth?) I'd have to see it -- but they're already had two seasons beyond S3 to do it ... and they've come up with little imaginative.

    I think they've run out of ideas (and time!) for him after five seasons and a death and glory exit on Lian Yu is a mercy.

  10. #40
    Forum Regular Arrow_47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDBentz View Post
    Except they SHOWED when Reverse Flash grabbed him. He was grabbed the same night Darhk died in Season 4 of Arrow.
    I missed when RF grabbed him. I only remember him showing up in 1927 Chicago (S2/E8). What was MM up to when RF grabbed him?

  11. #41
    Forum Regular Arrow_47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    JB is a talented actor, let's get this out of the way first.

    My view that Malcolm's death should stick is not a reflection on JB, but in the declining relevance of the Malcolm character on Arrow specifically.
    Agree 100% on how the showrunners handled him. I'm not advocating for his return, but merely mentioning some ways they could bring him back.

    I remember one of my earliest posts (either on this site or another) saying the problem with Malcolm's character is that JB is just too likeable, and the fans were rooting for him despite him being a heel. So TPTB tried to give him a redemption arc, but he plays a better villain than hero. I met him at a Con and in the brief conversation we had I got the sense that he is the real deal and all around great guy. Sorry to see him go.

  12. #42
    Nate nate-dog1701d's Avatar
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    Not a bad finale, but I couldn't get out of my head the fact that I had seen better episodes this season. Also, the parallel flashback fight felt too reminiscent of season 2. In both cases, he killed in the flashbacks and didn't in the present. Okay, so, Oliver is at the same place he was in season 2. This is a flaw of the season as a whole. Maybe it would have been better if Oliver hadn't explicitly put killing back on the table in the first episode. Then, Prometheus could come along, try to expose him as a fraud, and try to show him he really is a killer. As it stands, Oliver's back-and-forth on the issue has drowned out its impact.

    Other than that, I didn't care for the awkward scenes between Oliver and Felicity, Felicity and Samantha, and Thea and Malcolm. They felt like forced drama in an episode that warranted more focus on the high stakes at hand. How many times do we need to see the same conversation between Thea and Malcolm? The good news is that even if he is still alive, he probably won't be popping in to force his fatherliness on his daughter anytime soon.

    The ensemble fight scenes were boring in season 4, and they're still boring. Oh, how I wish Green Arrow could be in the field alone with only occasional assistance. It's insulting that Rene, Dinah, and Diggle can all tangle with Talia's followers. At least Curtis wasn't there.

    Why Captain Boomerang was an Arrow villain, I'll never know.

    I guess we're pretending Slade still had Mirakuru in his system all the way into season 3, making him crazy. I...guess...I'm...okay with that. It certainly doesn't make up for season 2's giant blunder, but he was at least enjoyable in this episode.

    It was especially nice to see Moira, and I join others in being in favor of more Nyssa/Talia scenes in the future.

    Chase really was a crazy one to set all of this up and practically guarantee his own death. I knew he was a little out there when he laid out the crime scene of his father's death with precision, but talk about a guy who couldn't get past his father's death. His speech about fathers and boats was interesting. It made me wonder what his true goal was. For a brief moment, I thought he had a glimmer of an altruistic motive in bringing Oliver and his son together. But really, this was just about making Oliver suffer, just like Ivo and Slade did in making him choose between Shado/Sara and Moira/Thea.

    I liked the moment when Oliver found out killing Chase would detonate the bombs. You could see that Chase knew things had shifted, and it was time to go to the boat.

    If any of Chase's crew, particularly Talia, knew about those bombs, why were any of them still there when Chase was trying to get Oliver to kill him? I imagine most didn't know his death meant kablooey, but you'd think Talia would be on top of things.

    I hope season 6 starts five years later and shows us what happened in the intervening time in flashbacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arrow_47 View Post
    I missed when RF grabbed him. I only remember him showing up in 1927 Chicago (S2/E8). What was MM up to when RF grabbed him?
    He was in an apartment watching news coverage of Green Arrow killing Damien Darhk. As I recall, Thawne even showed up with Darhk. This occurred in a later episode than when he just appeared in Chicago.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrow_47 View Post
    I missed when RF grabbed him. I only remember him showing up in 1927 Chicago (S2/E8). What was MM up to when RF grabbed him?
    He was drinking away his sorrows while watching Darhk get stabbed on the news. It was in Legends 2x10, where we focused more on the Legion than the Legends. It was the opening scene.

  14. #44
    Forum Regular Arrow_47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDBentz View Post
    He was drinking away his sorrows while watching Darhk get stabbed on the news. It was in Legends 2x10, where we focused more on the Legion than the Legends. It was the opening scene.
    Ah...I vaguely remember that, but not clearly. I casually watch LoT and like its' campiness, but don't pay as much attention to the details. Did RF or the Legends bring him back to his timeline so that he could be in S5 of Arrow, or was that a plot hole?

    ETA: Just rewatched ep10 and finale of LoT. They never grabbed him in the ep, just made him an offer. If they wanted to, they could easily explain he turned them down. Then, when his life was in jeopardy (finale of Arrow S5) Thawne could have taken him at that time. Not saying it is good writing, but it does live up to the standard of writing for them.
    Last edited by Arrow_47; 05-29-2017 at 10:15 AM.

  15. #45
    Chlark Addict BkWurm1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eowin View Post
    Way back in Season 2, Oliver and Slade climbed up on top of the hill to get a look at the freighter, just before it was bombed by Ivo. When the camera panned, there was a building visible- my theory is that it was the monastery.

    http://imgur.com/xtDqRFq
    Yeah, it looks like a temple or a the Monastery. And Oliver said in this episode he'd only seen the temple once from afar so it all fits. Which is kind of a surprise, lol.

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