View Poll Results: What did you think?

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  • 10 - Great

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  • 9

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  • 8

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  • 7

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  • 6

    0 0%
  • 5

    0 0%
  • 4

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  • 3

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  • 2

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  • 1 - No more chances

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  1. #16
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    Should arrow be done just like the comics or just based on the comics storyline.

  2. #17
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    Thankfully the "Tina Boland = Dinah Drake" cat has been out of the bag for a couple of days now, so I was able to watch this episode fully prepared for the garbage that was about to unfold. I don't feel like ranting about this again because I did it countless times. I'll just say that vantheman77 and Backward Galaxy echoed my thoughs perfectly. On a side note, Juliana Harkavy did ok in her debut episode and looked unfazed. That's just about the only positive in this whole mess.

    As for the rest of the episode, I'm glad the Diggle storyline is over. Now he can become an active part of this show again. And maybe Thea and Quentin won't be far behind either. With these 3 characters marginalized, the show has become even more unrecognizable.

    The Felicity stuff has potential to royally suck. However, it will be somewhat tolerable if she has as much screentime as she had in this episode.

    The only bright spot of this episode were the flashbacks. Lexa Doig was terrific as Talia and her appearance is finally setting the wheels of Oliver's return to Starling City in motion.

    P.S. The kill/don't kill dilemma has turned into an utter joke right now. Oliver makes a fuss out of Tina killing, but he's happy to have Wild Dog kill bad guys with his guys. On top of that, in the same episode Oliver blows up a helicopter with a bad guy inside. His hypocrisy was really glaring in this episode.

    3/10. The flashbacks helped this episode avoid joining Who are you? in the stinker category.
    Last edited by costas22; 02-02-2017 at 01:25 AM.

  3. #18
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    This is one of the few episodes where I was far more interested in the flashbacks than I was the present.

    Talia is very cool. Although, I am confused as to how she knows so much about Oliver. Has she just been following him around the last five years? Doesn't really make sense to me. She must have some sort of connection with ARGUS.

    The fact that Yao Fei was trained by her is intriguing.

    The New Black Canary is meh.

  4. #19
    Pirate King Backward Galaxy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    P.S. The kill/don't kill dilemma has turned into an utter joke right now. Oliver makes a fuss out of Tina killing, but he's happy to have Wild Dog kill bad guys with his guys. On top of that, in the same episode Oliver blows up a helicopter with a bad guy inside. His hypocrisy was really glaring in this episode.
    To be fair, the guys Wild Dog killed were trying to kill him. The people in the helicopter were trying to kill Oliver. The guy Tina/Dinah killed had been subdued and was no longer a threat. While I understand your point, and by the "laws of Batman" I even agree with you to an extent, but I also think that the show went out of its way to present the kills as different.

  5. #20
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    When it comes to self defence, both Oliver and Wild Dog can claim justification here. And S5 Oliver does have killing on the table. The circumstances under which he goes there aren't always clear this season, but in this case not doing it would mean Oliver or Wild Dog occupying a body bag.

    Dinah could have brought Sonos to justice; she opted to serve him vengeance. He could see her embracing the mentality of the Hood and this was what he was preventing, knowing its cost from experience. And, man, they are going to milk that particle accelerator as a meta creator like nobody's business. It's this universe's green meteor rocks.

    I can see what they're trying to do with Dinah, dotting the i's and crossing the t's, hoping it means after 5 seasons they got it "right" with BC. For a lot a fans, their BC died in S4 and while Dinah may turn out to be a fine teammate she's unlikely to be seen as an heir/successor. I think Diggle said it best, something along the lines of finding a team replacement ... and finding someone to take on the BC mantle are entirely separate things.

    If Felicity isn't being played by Hacker Girl, then I can see how this may be the route Felicity will have in making a difference beyond Team Arrow, maybe even joining Helix later.

    The flashbacks were great. We're finallly seeing glimpses of the Hood emerging.

  6. #21
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backward Galaxy View Post
    To be fair, the guys Wild Dog killed were trying to kill him. The people in the helicopter were trying to kill Oliver. The guy Tina/Dinah killed had been subdued and was no longer a threat. While I understand your point, and by the "laws of Batman" I even agree with you to an extent, but I also think that the show went out of its way to present the kills as different.
    There have been many times on this show where Oliver defended himself in situations like this by not dropping any bodies. Especially after he decided to honor Tommy's memory. He would aim for the bad guys' legs or some other safe body part. In this episode, both he and Wild Dog went for the kill straight away. And it's not the first time that's happened recently either. He killed Felicity's boyfriend because his first instinct was to shoot Prometheus in the chest. I agree that the circumstances in Tina's case were different, but just like she had a choice to kill or not to kill, so did Oliver and Wild Dog.

  7. #22
    Pirate King Backward Galaxy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    There have been many times on this show where Oliver defended himself in situations like this by not dropping any bodies. Especially after he decided to honor Tommy's memory. He would aim for the bad guys' legs or some other safe body part. In this episode, both he and Wild Dog went for the kill straight away. And it's not the first time that's happened recently either. He killed Felicity's boyfriend because his first instinct was to shoot Prometheus in the chest. I agree that the circumstances in Tina's case were different, but just like she had a choice to kill or not to kill, so did Oliver and Wild Dog.
    Hence the qualifier, "by the laws of Batman". I'm not suggesting we give the show a pass. It's a clear contradiction when juxtaposed with earlier material. I'm just saying that, within the context of this single episode, there's a clear difference between the circumstances.

  8. #23
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    I gave it an 8. Yes, I watched the episode twice before thinking on things. Again, I will say I'm NOT a professional reviewer, so don't hold me to that standard.

    Most of this episode was pretty good. They're keeping with the whole 'not making Felicity SuperHacker, capable of hacking anything in seconds' aspect of this season, which is good. I had worried they would do that. Speaking of Felicity, her attitude in this episode is practically a 180 from last episode, so I am going to assume that her darker arc will be more or less embracing her former identity (Great Fox Goddess?) and joining Helix in order to bring down Prometheus. I can also see the possibility of her becoming a villain moving forward, though it would be very interesting if the show took that route considering their previous kow-towing.

    Did no one else notice the boxing glove arrow in this episode? It was the one Oliver shot to knock down Dinah (sorry, I'm not going to use Tina now that we know her real name).

    Dinah's saucy attitude will be an interesting addition to the show moving forward.

    However, I do have to dock points for things like how Captain Singh is just fine working with Green Arrow, if only giving him information, considering I've always seen Singh as an even harder-nosed cop than Joe, and we all know how Joe feels about the Arrow/Green Arrow. I also need to dock points on the whole 'undercover identity is still a cop'. This is another of the 'idiot writing mistakes'.

    For those interested, the viewing numbers for last night's episode were higher than last week's, despite the revelation 2 days prior to its release that Tina Boland's real name was Dinah Drake.

    FYI: If you intend to quote with the mindset to get into a debate with me over my views of the show... don't bother. I am leaving my reviews here, but that's about it. I refuse to engage in the type of negative commentary that permeates both this site and Reddit. Those who want to engage in normal discussion know how to contact me for that purpose.

  9. #24
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    I wasn't even going to do a review because quite frankly I've gotten sick of the constant negative commentary whether it's Olicty or complaining about how KC/Laurel been treated among the several other things from this site and Reddit. I saw JDBentz's review and decided I would do one of my own.

    I actually enjoyed this episode and for sure more then last week's.

    First just to get this out of the gate, I like Dinah and I think she's going to be a good Black Canary. She's got the metahuman canary cry, her persona is far closer to the actual Dinah from the comics (at least from my knowledge) then I would say Laurel's was. Putting the comic stuff aside, she is a decent character.

    Really I'm fine with Dinah. Sure Laurel died and maybe they were going somewhere with her, but I we'll never really know she is dead. So it's time to move on.

    The action and such was good in this episode.

    Felcity's going dark is well if her darker path is going to be back to the gothic hacker instead of season 4 post break up we saw last episode, then I'll be fine with it in the show. That would actually work better and I hope they go down the route of eventually making Felicity a villain.

    In the flashbacks well they were good and have a purpose for sure. Talia is a enjoyable character and one that is set on helping Oliver. Because yea Oliver needs a kick to get started into his vigilante self, and that happened in this episode.

    Speaking of his vigilante self, I did not see coming Oliver getting his Hood suit at all and my mouth dropped open wide on that one. Because I'd say Oliver's now really starting to come full circle, especially given his brutal killing of Yurievich's men then the man himself by beating the guy to death.

    Oh I'm enjoying Wild Dog and well I wish they more of kept Curtis behind the computers, that's a good place for the guy.

    Captain Sigh being on friendly terms with the Green Arrow? Uh, I'm not buying that one.

    Other then that, it was a good episode.
    Last edited by Haggard01; 02-02-2017 at 04:13 PM.

  10. #25
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    Whether Felicity becomes a villain or simply signs up to join Helix, the hacking could be a way to flesh out her non-melodramatic development more. I know, it's an annual request of mine re: her character, maybe they'll do it this time and actually give her a subplot that doesn't involve checking the Olicity relationship status meter.

    Setting aside the 'Dinah is BC heir or not' debate here, I've said more than my piece on the issue over in the spoiler thread. I'd be just rehashing it again. Tina/Dinah certainly has the sauciness and no doubt she is ballsy, I'll give her that.

    I'll go with the Diggle viewpoint: we'd have to assess her in two ways a) as a new recruit, someone to fill the vacant spot on the roster, and b) as a potential claimant to the BC mantle. I suspect the 'a' part will be answered by season's end or earlier, whether she fits into the team in general. 'B' likely won't get any definitive answer for some time, maybe not even this season if they have any sense. Maybe they could have drawn out the recruitment sales pitch part another episode, it seemed rather fast.

    Loved the flashbacks, loved it. Lexa Doig is going to slay it in the second half, she is awesome. It was pretty gruesome Oliver pistol whipped that dude to death - and we only heard it, not see it -- which made it even more disturbing. Add to that it was a test from Talia, giving him his Hood gear to become "something else" and Oliver is well on his way to attaining his S1 Hood mindset. And we still have Kovar on deck.

    There are some things to look forward to, or at least they have potential to be interesting.

  11. #26
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    I didn't know Lexa Doig was Talia not bad but I still think she is Andromeda.
    Oh and Steve Bacic too.

    I'm glad Yao Fei is mentioned again. I love that guy.

    I don't know about "the true Canary." Good background story but not sure about the actress.


    The real Ghost Fox Goddess can Gothlicity be cooler?
    Last edited by YutG; 02-02-2017 at 10:41 PM.

  12. #27
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    I assumed it was a name she chose for police work. So made sense to me

  13. #28
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    Shocker, people didnt like the episode. What a surprise. I just dont understand sometimes. To me this new Canary did more in one episode to prove shes worthy of the mantle then Laurel ever did. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Laurel, but as Black Canary she left much to be desired. Im excited to see what Dinah can bring in the back half of the season.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by 134sc View Post
    Shocker, people didnt like the episode. What a surprise. I just dont understand sometimes. To me this new Canary did more in one episode to prove shes worthy of the mantle then Laurel ever did. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Laurel, but as Black Canary she left much to be desired. Im excited to see what Dinah can bring in the back half of the season.
    She murdered several people with no real qualms or real reason, wasn't caring or maternal, is a cool female caricature and is the 4th Dinah to exist on this show. If anything that proves she isn't worthy. Something some defenders of this are ignoring, that the BC isn't a title that's worthy of by fighting cool and a canary cry. Have a very great day! God bless you all!

  15. #30
    Settling In Gintoki's Avatar
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    It's a shame people who were pretending to be Katie/Laurel fans, have jumped on Bandwagon on Tina, because she only has a comic name 'Dinah', and backstory. A Black Canary which kills, yeah okay. I guess at the end of the day, people only cared about how accurate it is to comics, not the actress or character itself. Just my 2 cents.

    I do not support this Dinah Drake character at all, wasn't impressed at all. You had all the personality traits of the character in Laurel S1. Not the actress fault, but the writers.

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