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Loved It? Hated It? What did you think of "Pilot, Part 2?"

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Lipzo

    @Carmine Given that Connor Hawke is supposed to be introduced in Legends sometime this season I could see him being someone they could bring in if they felt the need for an Archer and Colton didn't want to do 10 episodes as Roy.
    I don't see Stein leaving to get back to his wife, remember that Rip said they would return to the moment they left so while he may miss her she isn't going to realise he's gone so he would be able to see all of time then come home to her easy enough which is something he clearly really enjoys.
    Canary will be a permanent character as long as Caity wants to play the role I feel, she's loved by all the fans pretty much and her character is the only one on the show that has a true backstory behind it.
    Good point about Connor, I forgot he was coming on the show. Agree Caity will be permanent team member, possibly Atom too. If they want to continue with villains on the team, maybe Huntress, or Cupid instead of Roy/Connor.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by JDBentz
      Another very enjoyable episode. A few notes:

      I just really hope the success it has doesn't give them a moronic idea like expanding it to a 23 episode series next season. One reason the storytelling so concise is because its not a 23-episode season requiring a bunch of filler.
      Yea I can see them increasing the episode number. Of course maybe if they grow brains the Arrow and Flash writers might see how this is working of having a shorter season and apply it to their shows. I doubt it will happen though.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Haggard01
        Yea I can see them increasing the episode number. Of course maybe if they grow brains the Arrow and Flash writers might see how this is working of having a shorter season and apply it to their shows. I doubt it will happen though.
        Gotham just ran an 11 episode early arc, went on hiatus for 3 months and will return in the end of February with another separate 11 episode arc. This might be the way to go.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Carmine-Infantino
          Gotham just ran an 11 episode early arc, went on hiatus for 3 months and will return in the end of February with another separate 11 episode arc. This might be the way to go.
          If Flash and Arrow actually took some cues from Gotham like that, we'd probably have a lot less to complain about because the storytelling would have to be tighter and they wouldn't be allowed to draw out their overly-complicated romantic BS as much without it affecting the story worse. Great, now I'm wishing they DO take cues from Gotham. Sadly, it appears that the Berlanti series' all have some very common themes; the most common being they all get a voice over intro by Oliver/Barry/Kara/Rip.

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          • #20
            Still incredibly camp. I do like Sara though.

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            • #21
              The episode was a great follow-up to Pt 1, and the humor can really carry this show for 10 seasons easily. However, I'm not sure what reason they will provide for having to assemble a new team once Savage is killed. I'm guessing the only way to make that work would be to allow for some unfortunate events to happen in order to kill Savage and then take different teams to undo those events, without undoing the circumstances that led to Savage's death. Since the same team cannot go back in time and tinker with what they've done, it would have to be a different team. It would be complicated for sure. That said, if they do go that route I wouldn't mind seeing them add Deathstroke and Aqualad (Young Justice version) to the team.
              Last edited by Arrow_47; 01-30-2016, 08:56 PM.

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              • #22
                I wonder if Oliver and Barry will visit the team to pay their respects to the fallen, Hawkman....

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by TheSecretVampire
                  I wonder if Oliver and Barry will visit the team to pay their respects to the fallen, Hawkman....
                  Since it was 2016 Hawkman that died, I'm not sure they will even know about it. The 1975 Hawkman could eventually join up with the team, as long as Rip picked him up post-Kendra meeting. Though I'm not sure the writers are going that route.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Arrow_47
                    Since it was 2016 Hawkman that died, I'm not sure they will even know about it. The 1975 Hawkman could eventually join up with the team, as long as Rip picked him up post-Kendra meeting. Though I'm not sure the writers are going that route.
                    Not really plausible as then that version of Hawkman would know that they failed to kill Savage in 2015 which in turn would alter the timeline.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Lipzo
                      Not really plausible as then that version of Hawkman would know that they failed to kill Savage in 2015 which in turn would alter the timeline.
                      The 1975 Hawkman has to eventually meet Kendra (in current timeline that was aired) and convince her that she is Hawkgirl. They have to go against Savage with Barry and Oliver's help. All that stuff has to happen, because it already happened. If Rip picks him up after the time he assembled the team, the timeline would continue unaltered (with the exception of the part of time they are trying to alter).

                      ETA: Again, I don't believe he was ever intended to be a regular on the show so he will most likely remain dead, but my point was they could bring him back if they wanted to.
                      Last edited by Arrow_47; 02-01-2016, 08:18 PM.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Arrow_47
                        The 1975 Hawkman has to eventually meet Kendra (in current timeline that was aired) and convince her that she is Hawkgirl. They have to go against Savage with Barry and Oliver's help. All that stuff has to happen, because it already happened. If Rip picks him up after the time he assembled the team, the timeline would continue unaltered (with the exception of the part of time they are trying to alter).
                        Rip can't pick him up after the moment they assembled the team as by taking him on board and having him die in the past means that any future he has in Rip's original timeline has now ceased to exist. That was the point of Rip picking these people, if they did die during the mission then the future timeline wouldn't be badly damaged with them not being around.
                        It's not like the RF who was able to come back because he was coming from an earlier part in his timeline in which all the events of S1 of the Flash hadn't occurred yet.

                        The only possible way I could see around it to bring him into the team again would be to recruit the next reincarnation of him to the team as that wouldn't damage any timeline as far as I can think.

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                        • #27
                          The tricky thing to my way of thinking with re: to how they handle interactions of post-2016 Hawkmans and pre-what? (the current, albeit recently deceased, Hawkman was about how old? 30? 35 max? so his birth year would be about what? 1981- 1986 crude guesstimate .....) --- anyway let's say post-2016 Hawkmans and pre-1981 adult Hawkmans with our circa 2016 Kendra/Hawkgirl --- would be that those earlier and later versions are destined to be with different versions/reincarnations of Kendra/Chayera/Hawkgirl than we have now. So, if one of them comes aboard, then I don't see how a "replacement" Hawkman could become romantically involved with the current Kendra/Hawkgirl we have without screwing something up (which I certainly would not be complaining about; ...)

                          If they encounter a 1975 adult Hawkman -- so let's say to meet my abitrary definition of adult he has to be at least 20 years old -- then he had to have been born at the latest ~ 1955 (possibly much earlier depending on the age of the 1975 adult Hawkman we would encounter) and that 1975 Hawkman should have been/will be busy during his own lifetime tracking down and reminding his own Hawkgirl of who she is (2016 Hawkgirl should be the subsequent reincarnation of that precursor Hawkgirl) Or does Hawkman sometimes reincarnate into a lifetime in which Hawkgirl does not? (ie he ALWAYS reincarnates and she sometimes skips being reincarnated into his lifetime?)

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Shelby Kent
                            If they encounter a 1975 adult Hawkman -- so let's say to meet my abitrary definition of adult he has to be at least 20 years old -- then he had to have been born at the latest ~ 1955 (possibly much earlier depending on the age of the 1975 adult Hawkman we would encounter) and that 1975 Hawkman should have been/will be busy during his own lifetime tracking down and reminding his own Hawkgirl of who she is (2016 Hawkgirl should be the subsequent reincarnation of that precursor Hawkgirl) Or does Hawkman sometimes reincarnate into a lifetime in which Hawkgirl does not? (ie he ALWAYS reincarnates and she sometimes skips being reincarnated into his lifetime?)
                            Typically speaking they are both reincarnated into the same life, they aren't reincarnated until both of them dead. They also have a long history of only finally finding each other and remembering everything right before one of them dies which is all apart of their curse. Though given how much they have already changed with their back story it's not possible to know exactly how it will be.

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                            • #29
                              Really disliked the whole bit about the younger Stein smoking pot. It felt like a tired cliché and the writers just checking 70's stuff off a list. People took drugs in the 70's (something that totally never happened in the decades before or after the 70's), thus they have to run into someone who smokes pot. Another thing they also checked off the list was protests against the Vietnam War (when the characters shows up at Stein's university, there's a booth in the parking lot, urging people not the send troops back to Vietnam). They establish this as taking place in October, 1975. The war had already ended in April of that year.

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                              • #30
                                I liked it very much. So far both of those episodes were very enjoyable. The story flows smoothly, the interactions between characters are interesting (like with Ray and Captain Cold) and all cliche moments/events are still utilized very well. Didn't see coming that they will get rid of Hawkman so soon. So I guess those two graves from the trailer are burial places of Hawkman and Hawks' son from a different timeline.

                                Every scene when Rip tries to talk some sense into heroes he gathered and they don't listen to him cracks me up. He is going to have hard time with them, and for this earns additional sympathy points from me. I would watch this show solely for him, but so far I enjoy all of the characters' portrayal (for example Atom is much more interesting, when he is not used only to be a fifth or even sixth wheel in Olicity ship). The showrunners (for the time being) seem to remember that they don't need to cram the screen with all of them, and divide them in smaller teams. It's a very good sign, works very well, and I wish other CW shows, namely "Arrow" would do the same.

                                The ego battle of two version of Steins was indeed epic.

                                Originally posted by Carmine-Infantino
                                Good point about Connor, I forgot he was coming on the show. Agree Caity will be permanent team member, possibly Atom too. If they want to continue with villains on the team, maybe Huntress, or Cupid instead of Roy/Connor.
                                Like the idea of Cupid joining the team in future, but guess it's not going happen. Huntress would be an interesting addition too!

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