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  1. #271
    Flying around :D CKent/KalEl's Avatar
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    Ha, so when you watch a movie that you are on the fence about a few more times, chances are that suddenly liking it after the third time is a mere exposure effect.

  2. #272
    Forum Regular AsteroidMike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CKent/KalEl View Post


    Ha, so when you watch a movie that you are on the fence about a few more times, chances are that suddenly liking it after the third time is a mere exposure effect.
    Funnily enough I was watching that same video earlier today, and after some thought I've realized that we as SW fans are the most unpleasable people in the world.

  3. #273
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    I must admit that it's very amusing to sit back and watch the mainstream media scramble for desperate excuses as to why The Last Jedi has been so heavily criticised by so many people. Trying to shame people about hating a Disney movie is a new low and I thought I'd seen it all after the over the top backlash for BvS. And like the video points out, we've reached the point where the detractors are either labeled as sexist racists or angry fanboys whose theories were wrong (because that never happens before any popular franchise movie ). I guess that also applies to the vast majority of Chinese moviegoers that turned their backs on this movie (TLJ's gross in China was 1/4 of TFA's)?

    While we are at it, a close relative of mine, whose only contact with the SW universe is watching the OT once every decade or so, watched TLJ recently. He didn't like it. When I asked him why, he specifically pointed out Luke's borderline character assassination (Luke was his favorite character in the OT), the questions from TFA that remained unanswered, the Canto Bight subplot, the force projection and floating Leia. Nothing to do with the protagonists being women and people of colour or with any theories of his being proven wrong. As a matter of fact, he didn't even bother predicting anything before watching the movie because he didn't care enough to do so.

    Point being, you will find plenty of casual fans who simply disliked it for being an average movie in general or a bad movie as far as the SW canon is concerned. And the latter has nothing to do with fanboys being angry either. It's one thing to be upset because Snoke didn't prove out to be Darth Plagueis and it's another to be upset because a movie tells you that what happened in the 2 movies that preceded it means nothing.

  4. #274
    Forum Regular AsteroidMike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    While we are at it, a close relative of mine, whose only contact with the SW universe is watching the OT once every decade or so, watched TLJ recently. He didn't like it. When I asked him why, he specifically pointed out Luke's borderline character assassination (Luke was his favorite character in the OT), the questions from TFA that remained unanswered, the Canto Bight subplot, the force projection and floating Leia. Nothing to do with the protagonists being women and people of colour or with any theories of his being proven wrong. As a matter of fact, he didn't even bother predicting anything before watching the movie because he didn't care enough to do so.
    Character assassination of Luke? Huh? How is that borderline character assassination, does anyone really honestly believe Luke is going to be the exact same person he was 30+ years ago, especially with something traumatic as losing the Jedi Order again on his mind? Making Luke flawed makes him more interesting as a character, and even if he briefly contemplated killing Ben, remember that the last time there was a gifted Force user who was being tempted by the dark side in the middle of everything, it was Anakin and he ended up bringing down the Jedi, the Republic and being the Emperor's right hand man. Furthermore, let's not forget that Luke briefly tried to kill his dad during the end part of their duel in ROTJ where he's just wailing on him until he cuts his hand off.

    Questions from TFA left unanswered could still be answered in Episode 9, which I should remind everyone has yet to come out. Everyone seems to have forgotten that this is a trilogy and not every single question is answered all at one time, though I would like to know how Maz found Luke's old lightsaber at the bottom of Bespin.

    Floating in space Leia. Okay, I'll admit that was a bit weird looking. And I've already said the Canto Bight stuff was a weak storyline yet I'm more forgiving of it as time goes on and it doesn't really annoy me that much.

    Also, force projection is perfectly in-tune with Star Wars lore because every single movie introduces a new use of the Force than before it. For example, ESB was the first time we saw Force users actually pull objects toward them, something not shown in the previous movie. Then ROTJ showed the Emperor blasting Luke with lightning. Then TFA showed Kylo Ren stopping laser bolts in mid-air and freezing people. But force projection (something shown by Yoda in Star Wars Rebels) is crossing line?

    I guess my feelings on this are that I think fans are mad because everything isn't done perfectly to their liking, theories aside, and they want everything right here and right now. People criticized TFA for being too similar to A New Hope, but now TLJ gets criticized for being too different.

  5. #275
    Ming-the Merciless Glove's Avatar
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    I read an article on another movie site the other day that stated Lucasfilm upperbrass and a particular person involved with Disney's Star Wars ignored many years of the Expanded Universe and turned it into Legends (not canon) was because "they killed Chewbacca over the coarse of time" in the Expanded Universe...."that they couldn't have done this trilogy without such a beloved character in it." This was such a ridiculous story that they couldn't move on from their "Childhood rose-colored glasses".

    Rian Johnson couldn't completely ignore the Original Trilogy in that the Force-Ghost Yoda pretty much said the exact same things he said in The Empire Strikes Back. You're telling me that Luke Skywalker and Yoda and/or Obi-Wan never carried on a conversation in 30 years and it took Rey to bring Yoda out of hiding so that he could repeat what he said in the fan's most popular movie? Yoda couldn't have shown up after Luke's failure with Ben to give him a few pointers? It was easy to make Luke look like a careless coward and die quite easy....after he finally finds his courage. It was easy to make Leia look like Superman and fly through space. JJ Abrams basically remade A New Hope. Episode 9 will most likely be a remake of Return of the Jedi. Who cares about the questions brought up in The Force Awakens? At this point, what's the point? They're never really going to move on anyways...
    Last edited by Glove; 01-22-2018 at 08:36 AM.

  6. #276
    What? McFly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by costas22 View Post
    I must admit that it's very amusing to sit back and watch the mainstream media scramble for desperate excuses as to why The Last Jedi has been so heavily criticised by so many people. Trying to shame people about hating a Disney movie is a new low and I thought I'd seen it all after the over the top backlash for BvS. And like the video points out, we've reached the point where the detractors are either labeled as sexist racists or angry fanboys whose theories were wrong (because that never happens before any popular franchise movie ). I guess that also applies to the vast majority of Chinese moviegoers that turned their backs on this movie (TLJ's gross in China was 1/4 of TFA's)?

    While we are at it, a close relative of mine, whose only contact with the SW universe is watching the OT once every decade or so, watched TLJ recently. He didn't like it. When I asked him why, he specifically pointed out Luke's borderline character assassination (Luke was his favorite character in the OT), the questions from TFA that remained unanswered, the Canto Bight subplot, the force projection and floating Leia. Nothing to do with the protagonists being women and people of colour or with any theories of his being proven wrong. As a matter of fact, he didn't even bother predicting anything before watching the movie because he didn't care enough to do so.

    Point being, you will find plenty of casual fans who simply disliked it for being an average movie in general or a bad movie as far as the SW canon is concerned. And the latter has nothing to do with fanboys being angry either. It's one thing to be upset because Snoke didn't prove out to be Darth Plagueis and it's another to be upset because a movie tells you that what happened in the 2 movies that preceded it means nothing.
    Exactly!!! The movie is flawed in ways that simple dialog could have helped..

  7. #277
    Incurable Postaholic DA_Champion's Avatar
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    They had to kill off the EU as it had an internally inconsistent continuity. Furthermore it would be too much of a burden for the new filmmakers to catch up on hundreds (thousands?) of stories.

  8. #278
    Forum Regular AsteroidMike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DA_Champion View Post
    They had to kill off the EU as it had an internally inconsistent continuity. Furthermore it would be too much of a burden for the new filmmakers to catch up on hundreds (thousands?) of stories.
    Some of those EU stories weren't that good either, in addition to that.

  9. #279
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    The new trilogy's issues never had anything to do with ignoring the EU, I feel. A lot of Star Wars fans only follow the movies anyway. The EU is no Bible and neither were George Lucas' original ideas for the sequel trilogy. But, if you are willing to overlook both, it means you have an already structured plan of your own. And there was no such thing. Only things they had their minds set on was that the protagonist would be a woman and that the cast would be diverse. And both are great developments, but they are not enough to bring a trilogy to life.

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