View Poll Results: What did you think?

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  • 10 - A breath of fresh [Rogue] air

    9 42.86%
  • 9

    5 23.81%
  • 8

    6 28.57%
  • 7

    1 4.76%
  • 6

    0 0%
  • 5

    0 0%
  • 4

    0 0%
  • 3

    0 0%
  • 2

    0 0%
  • 1 - Not Cool

    0 0%
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  1. #31
    Complete SV Nerd skully's Avatar
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    Fair ep. I was annoyed at S.T.A.R. Labs unlocked revolving entry door that seemingly anyone can walk through, and the fact that they had knock out gas to get the supervillains into Cisco's power-sapping electric field in the truck (which failed, allowing their escape). Er, why not just keep them under with a little more gas??

  2. #32
    Wu needs to know!!!!!! jpfort1957's Avatar
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    I still hate seeing a Reverse-Flash that can run circles around Barry!!!

  3. #33
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora Moon View Post
    Hmmm. when I made this list, I just realized that many people in both The flash and the Arrow could fit the description of a few things on this list. Yikes.
    It's a bit unnerving that a couple of them on both shows share, if not all the things on the list, then a handful of them. In the Arrow finale, Felicity inexplicably mastering ATOM's suit tech and -naturally- saving Ollie in the nick of time comes to mind and must count as evidence here. Also, her knack for offering sage advice that Ollie accepts, even when he declines the same advice another character offers -- sometimes in the same ep.

    But with Cisco and Felicity, they're like kids dipping their feet into a pool that's too cold or too hot. Sometimes they back away from the danger, sometimes they flinch but still wade in, or even dive in regardless of the risk. (The risk being: doing Mary Sue/Gary Stu things). An extreme example would be SV's Lana -- she essentially became a mermaid and lived in this pool for 8 seasons.

    Cisco may still have the benefit/excuse of freshman season glitches. I'm tempted to level the j'accuse label at Felicity, but we all know she's a fan favourite and somehow such behaviour can and will be explained away. Even if some fans claim she hasn't dived headfirst into the Mary Sue pool, she has certainly wiggled her toes and dipped her feet in the shallow end of this pool.

    Another item on the list could be: even when character A commits a Mary Sue offense, the fandom will likely explain it away as understandable, rational or even justified. This would be more applicable to fan faves who do it and are given a wide berth when they do.

    (Back away from the pool, Cisco, it's not too late!)

  4. #34
    Posting Pro Aurora Moon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    Another item on the list could be: even when character A commits a Mary Sue offense, the fandom will likely explain it away as understandable, rational or even justified. This would be more applicable to fan faves who do it and are given a wide berth when they do.

    (Back away from the pool, Cisco, it's not too late!)
    Heh. The sad thing is, sometimes the fans are actually correct on that one. Sometimes the story couldn't had been able to move along without a little bit of stuish or sueish action going on. So certain things you just have to accept and move on, even though in the back of the head you know that none of this even makes sense at all.

    But yeah I think I would accept that into the list if it turned out to be a particularly horrible thing that the stu/sue did. For instance, in the real world this thing they did would had been highly illegal and completely wrong no matter what the justification. In-universe it's only seen as being "morally questionable" instead of flat-out wrong, but the narrative frames it as being a necessary thing they needed to do even if it was sketchy. The fans on other hand, thinks the stu/sue doing it is such a perfect angel that they can do no wrong... that nothing they do could ever be wrong at all as long as it's their perfect angel doing it.

    Example: Oliver Queen from Smallville. Looking back at it I realize that almost everything he did as Green Arrow was highly illegal in real life. It doesn't help that Smallville Oliver Queen seemed to be unnaturally obsessed with the Luthors, espeically Lex (even though Lionel was the one who killed off Oliver's parents, and that Lex had only been 7 to 8 years old when it happened). So it was like Oliver was like some kind of heroic stalker with a grudge. He never targeted any other evil companies out there, etc... he only targeted Lexcorp and Luthorcorp. I know this was proably for the sake of it being set in the Smallville universe, so it needed to stay connected to one of the Smallville characters... but still it was a little bit disorienting when you realize that SV's Ollie had motives that made him look like yet other one of Lex's deranged stalkers/attackers.
    Yet, if you browse any smallville forums or browse the SV fanfiction sections, there's plenty of Ollie fans who insist that he's totally perfect and is never wrong.

  5. #35
    Nate nate-dog1701d's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora Moon View Post
    Hmmm. when I made this list, I just realized that many people in both The flash and the Arrow could fit the description of a few things on this list. Yikes.
    Yeah, that's what I was thinking while reading it.

    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    I'm tempted to level the j'accuse label at Felicity, but we all know she's a fan favourite and somehow such behaviour can and will be explained away. Even if some fans claim she hasn't dived headfirst into the Mary Sue pool, she has certainly wiggled her toes and dipped her feet in the shallow end of this pool.
    Nah, she's at least waist-deep.

  6. #36
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    Didn't notice this until I stumbled across it. Golden Glider is the same actress that played Lucy Lane in Smallville.
    So does that mean Lois Lane and Cpt Cold are related?

  7. #37
    Board Master Dagenspear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora Moon View Post
    Heh. The sad thing is, sometimes the fans are actually correct on that one. Sometimes the story couldn't had been able to move along without a little bit of stuish or sueish action going on. So certain things you just have to accept and move on, even though in the back of the head you know that none of this even makes sense at all.

    But yeah I think I would accept that into the list if it turned out to be a particularly horrible thing that the stu/sue did. For instance, in the real world this thing they did would had been highly illegal and completely wrong no matter what the justification. In-universe it's only seen as being "morally questionable" instead of flat-out wrong, but the narrative frames it as being a necessary thing they needed to do even if it was sketchy. The fans on other hand, thinks the stu/sue doing it is such a perfect angel that they can do no wrong... that nothing they do could ever be wrong at all as long as it's their perfect angel doing it.

    Example: Oliver Queen from Smallville. Looking back at it I realize that almost everything he did as Green Arrow was highly illegal in real life. It doesn't help that Smallville Oliver Queen seemed to be unnaturally obsessed with the Luthors, espeically Lex (even though Lionel was the one who killed off Oliver's parents, and that Lex had only been 7 to 8 years old when it happened). So it was like Oliver was like some kind of heroic stalker with a grudge. He never targeted any other evil companies out there, etc... he only targeted Lexcorp and Luthorcorp. I know this was proably for the sake of it being set in the Smallville universe, so it needed to stay connected to one of the Smallville characters... but still it was a little bit disorienting when you realize that SV's Ollie had motives that made him look like yet other one of Lex's deranged stalkers/attackers.
    Yet, if you browse any smallville forums or browse the SV fanfiction sections, there's plenty of Ollie fans who insist that he's totally perfect and is never wrong.
    Oliver actually didn't know that Lionel had his parents killed until s8. He was after Lex because of the Duncan debacle and the Zod thing.

  8. #38
    Posting Pro Aurora Moon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dagenspear View Post
    Oliver actually didn't know that Lionel had his parents killed until s8. He was after Lex because of the Duncan debacle and the Zod thing.
    Actually Ollie had a mad-on for Lex ever since they were kids at boarding schools. It's strongly implied that this went on for a long time before Lex even met Duncan. in Ollie's first appearance, Lionel even comments on Ollie's fixation on Lex and how he used to pick on Lex when they were both kids. So Ollie's Lex obsession goes a LOOONG WAY back.
    Last edited by Aurora Moon; 05-19-2015 at 05:56 AM.

  9. #39
    Board Master Dagenspear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora Moon View Post
    Actually Ollie had a mad-on for Lex ever since they were kids at boarding schools. It's strongly implied that this went on for a long time before Lex even met Duncan. in Ollie's first appearance, Lionel even comments on Ollie's fixation on Lex and how he used to pick on Lex when they were both kids. So Ollie's Lex obsession goes a LOOONG WAY back.
    I was just talking about his fixation when he was an adult.

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