Loved it? Hated it? What did you think of Mother?

[superhippie2000]

What did you think?

[Aries83]

I gave it a 9, as I felt it was almost a perfect episode.

I LOVED all the Evil Queen scenes, which were made even better by the unrivaled Barbara Hershey.

I also got a kick out of Emma's need for Rum...

Next week looked REALLY interesting. I wouldn't mind watching an entire season where the roles were reversed between the heroes and villains. I guess we'll have to see if it truly becomes a reality.

[superhippie2000]

I gave it a 9, as I felt it was almost a perfect episode.

I LOVED all the Evil Queen scenes, which were made even better by the unrivaled Barbara Hershey.

I also got a kick out of Emma's need for Rum...

Next week looked REALLY interesting. I wouldn't mind watching an entire season where the roles were reversed between the heroes and villains. I guess we'll have to see if it truly becomes a reality.

Next week is the season finale so maybe it will wind up being that way next season. or atleast half.

[Aries83]

maybe it will wind up being that way next season. or atleast half.

Yep. Maybe this is their way of trying to breathe some new life into the show, which is why The Author seemed so needed.

[SteelyGal]

Throughout the whole episode, I kept saying that is not Cora or Cora has ulterior motives so I was thrown off when neither proved true. Cora was previously written a master manipulator who used Regina for her on ends. It was not until she got her heart back that she showed any true love for Regina so I didn't recognize this Cora.

I also thought that Zelena had ice on her heart and that is why she had to leave Storybrooke and couldn't return. Did Zelena fake what the Snow Queen did to her?

The Evil Queen was truly evil. When I am reminded about it and seeing her kill someone's true love, I feel she should be grateful she is not locked up in chains and some residents of Storybrooke have not only forgiven her but view her as one of the 'good' guys.

Snow and David proved why they are the 'good' guys. They make mistakes and don't let that be an excuse to be bad but a reason to fight harder on doing the right thing. I just wish they would stop dressing Snow like Mary Margaret. Please jazz up her wardrobe.

I really want to know what Rumple has on the author because it made no sense that he would leave the safety of Regina and go back to Rumple. I also thought it was very clever of Regina to get Lilly's blood instead of turning Emma bad to get it. I wonder why Rumple never thought of it.

[Aries83]

Throughout the whole episode, I kept saying that is not Cora or Cora has ulterior motives so I was thrown off when neither proved true.

What do you mean? She orchestrated the charade with Nottingham in order for Regina to have a child so that—after she killed Regina—she would have a claim to the throne, because she didn't want Snow White to come into power. She was going to get rid of Regina and try control the throne through that child—at least that's what I took away from the episode. That seems pretty heartless to me.

All that talk about wanting Regina to have a child so she could have someone that loved her was a bunch of BS. She only said that because she knew the jig was up. I'm sure she's said things like that before so she didn't look like she was trying to manipulate any given situation (when it didn't go her way). I thought it was typical Cora.

As for whether she had her heart, I don't know. Did she get it back when she was in Wonderland? (I didn't watch that).

I also thought that Zelena had ice on her heart and that is why she had to leave Storybrooke and couldn't return. Did Zelena fake what the Snow Queen did to her?

I don't think they've explained that explicitly, but I hope they have a good answer... Maybe all of it appeared real to everyone else, but posed no threat to Zelena because it was a glamour? I don't know.

I really want to know what Rumple has on the author because it made no sense that he would leave the safety of Regina and go back to Rumple.

If I remember right, he overheard Hook telling Rumple he was powerless (because performing any dark deeds would kill him). I think he was playing dumb when he asked Rumple what was wrong with his heart. Later on, he told Regina that the only reason he was with Rumple was because he thought he could protect him, but that was after he saw that Rumple was weakened (after Regina snatched the quill from him).

So, when he whisked himself back to Gold's shop, he knew Rumple didn't pose a threat. He also had the ink, so he had the power to control any character, so he wasn't in danger. As for Regina, I think he was just using her to get the ink charged so he could write. Also, Gold said that if Rumplestiltskin died, only the Dark One would remain, which would put everyone in danger. Maybe The Author started there with him so that didn't happen?

[SteelyGal]

What do you mean? She orchestrated the charade with Nottingham in order for Regina to have a child so that—after she killed Regina—she would have a claim to the throne, because she didn't want Snow White to come into power. She was going to get rid of Regina and try control the throne through that child—at least that's what I took away from the episode. That seems pretty heartless to me.

All that talk about wanting Regina to have a child so she could have someone that loved her was a bunch of BS. She only said that because she knew the jig was up. I'm sure she's said things like that before so she didn't look like she was trying to manipulate any given situation (when it didn't go her way). I thought it was typical Cora.

As for whether she had her heart, I don't know. Did she get it back when she was in Wonderland? (I didn't watch that).

Cora was not lying when she told Regina that she was wrong about love being a weakness and wanted Regina to have a baby to be happy. She told Regina that if she wanted to take her power, she would be more direct than getting her pregnant and killing her to raise the child. Then she told Regina she love her. All things the other Cora who came to Storybrooke was unable to say until Snow tricked Regina into putting Cora's heart back in her chest.

[Aries83]

Cora was not lying when she told Regina that she was wrong about love being a weakness and wanted Regina to have a baby to be happy. She told Regina that if she wanted to take her power, she would be more direct than getting her pregnant and killing her to raise the child. Then she told Regina she love her.

The way I see it is...If ANY of that stuff were true, any of it, Cora would NOT have schemed with the Sheriff of Nottingham at all, she would've found/brought Robin Hood to Regina, not him. I don't believe Cora had any good intentions for her daughter. She just wanted another bid to get power any way she could.

[SteelyGal]

The way I see it is...If ANY of that stuff were true, any of it, Cora would NOT have schemed with the Sheriff of Nottingham at all, she would've found/brought Robin Hood to Regina, not him. I don't believe Cora had any good intentions for her daughter. She just wanted another bid to get power any way she could.

The only reason she did not bring Robin was she found out he was already married. And from what she said to Regina, she really thought the Sheriff was a good match for Regina. For me, I interpret the scene between Regina and Cora as Cora truly wanting to help Regina which I thought was totally out of character. And to drive home the tragedy for Regina, her mother was not there to use her so there was no need to make herself sterile to get back at her mother.

[Aries83]

Cora has done so many rotten things during her time on the show that I just don't/never will see her as a sympathetic character. What Regina did to herself was rather sad, though.

[Exedore]

Throughout the whole episode, I kept saying that is not Cora or Cora has ulterior motives so I was thrown off when neither proved true. Cora was previously written a master manipulator who used Regina for her on ends. It was not until she got her heart back that she showed any true love for Regina so I didn't recognize this Cora.

Maybe the Author was bored that day and decided to write Cora OOC just for s*&ts and giggles

I also thought that Zelena had ice on her heart and that is why she had to leave Storybrooke and couldn't return. Did Zelena fake what the Snow Queen did to her?

Sssshhh! You weren't supposed to notice that stuff

[Leonatus]

I think this is the first time that Aries and I have ever differed in such a polar opposite way.

I did like this episode, however I considered it to be one of the weakest in the season, and all of it had to do with Lily.

The way Lily was introduced was pretty great, and then they started to build her up to be Emma's opposite, her complete rival in every way was even better. I thought if anything, Emma needed an adversary that was so very much like her and yet so completely different. The fact that Lily just happened to contain all of Emma's potential for darkness was even better, and I thought they were building up to a clash between potential pure light (Emma) and potential pure darkness (Lily).

However, this episode exploited a few problems.

The first being the author: Since when was he completely on board the Rumple train? I knew he was a scumbag, but the last thing I would have seen him do was to be like "lol screw you guys" and go help Rumple to let the bad guys win. It just seemed like a cop-out thing for them to initiate an amazing season finale. Not to mention, what was even the point of Rumple going on and on about not being Rumple anymore if his heart went black, if the writers decided "You know what, we're going to save him!" ? It seemed like they were building up to this amazing idea of having a completely evil Dark one with Rumple's personality, only to throw that out the window because Rumple for some reason deserved to keep his "Rumple" side.

Lily again was a big one. She had all of this darkness inside of her, and even stated that she felt like she could only destroy. Are they planning on capitalizing on that a bit more, or is she going to go the Regina route despite the fact that, unlike Regina, her heart is supposed to essentially be complete darkness?

The means to the Ink was the third one. For all of this half of the season, it was about turning Emma dark so that they could get her blood to power the ink. They fail, and once again (thank you season 2 for showing the power of these sudden miracle answers!), there's a sudden second option of taking the blood from Lily since Lily holds Emma's darkness. Wait...seriously? That's almost as bad as the fairies just magically having memory potions when it suddenly became convenient. What was even the point of the Emma-to-darkness trial if all it took was bringing back Maleficent's child to get it from her?

Outside of that, that's really it. I liked Cora in this as I always do, and was really glad to see Barbara Hershey back once more. I haven't watched the season finale yet, but I'm hoping it's a bit better than this was.