View Poll Results: Rate this Episode.

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  • 10 - Up Up and Away

    8 21.05%
  • 9

    7 18.42%
  • 8

    6 15.79%
  • 7

    4 10.53%
  • 6

    6 15.79%
  • 5

    0 0%
  • 4

    0 0%
  • 3

    5 13.16%
  • 2

    0 0%
  • 1 - Let Rahs stick a sword into this episode.

    2 5.26%
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  1. #16
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    Good:
    1 - The Diggle and Oliver moments. It was bringing back a part of season 1 which I loved at the time and I have missed. It also showed the mindset that all soldier's have in common that no one else can truly understand, which has almost been an underlining theme for a chunk of this season.
    2 - Roy opening up to Thea. It's good to see that they aren't just forgetting about what Roy did and they are showing that it does haunt him.

    Bad:
    1 - Laurel being so stupid she thought for a moment she could take on Malcolm. If she wanted him done she should have shot him from a distance as the moment it was up close Malcolm would have been able to disarm her easy enough.
    2 - Ray's suit. From everything I can recall from the comic's ATOM can't fly, at least not when he is at his regular size and that annoyed me. And also the fact that how he flew made him look exactly like Iron Man it just seemed cheap to me.
    3 - Ra's telling Oliver he wanted him to be the next leader. That was predictable as all hell and was not a "twist" in any sense of the word.

    While I found myself enjoying chunk's of this episode I think overall it was rather boring and there is essentially no big bad for this season now as it's been shown that Ra's is better then Oliver and the league can easily take down Malcolm if they want.

  2. #17
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    Was a good episode but it definitely didn't deserve the hype it received. The action scenes were all great. Laurel, Thea and Nyssa are all awesome but there were some parts I really didn't like.

    For starters, it seems like Oliver can beat Nyssa with ease, as well as kill lots of League of Assassins members (I think he was killing them, he definitely killed the one he burnt), but Malcolm can't even beat one? Yet Malcolm is training Oliver? What's that about? And Diggle can also kill them with ease? I thought these assassins were meant to be the best in the world? Yet every time we see them they get beaten.

    So Diggle felt guilty when Oliver went to fight Ra's the first time. Did he not feel at all guilty when Oliver was away and everyone was trying to take down Brick? Seemed strange to me but it did provide some good (and much needed) Diggle screentime.

    Oliver wanting to get Malcolm back really makes no sense to me. I really really hope Oliver's recent decisions regarding Malcolm, Thea and The League can all be explained by whatever the hell Tatsu did to him.

    And then there was that "twist". They really should have changed the word "twist" to "obvious". I was really expecting something a lot better. Like Nyssa killing Thea. But I don't expect that to happen now.

    And so I guess the rest of the season will be over Oliver mulling over what to say to Ra's. That doesn't sound particularly entertaining. I guess Oliver could make his decision next episode, say yes, and then the rest of the season will be trying to get Oliver back to normal.
    Last edited by Quark; 02-26-2015 at 02:25 AM.

  3. #18
    It's the mileage... costas22's Avatar
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    Aaaand the good run of episode is over. Man, this one was all over the place so much, it's embarrassing.

    The bad:

    - As someone said, they really don't seem to have a clue where they want to take their season. Guggenheim says "the season will only get crazier". Which I'm starting to think is another phrase for "We're throwing random stuff on the wall each week and we're waiting to see what sticks".

    - The characterizations, with a few exceptions, have become ridiculously convoluted: Oliver's lame plan and motive, Thea (in a league of her own this week), Laurel, Lyla, Ra's... The only ones that came across as themselves were Merlyn and Nyssa.

    - By the way, is Oliver a killer again or not? I've lost count with him. And is he ever going to bring Malcolm to justice for Sara's death?

    - Ra's is looking for a successor, hey? Can't say I blame him. He couldn't even kill a helpless Oliver and he can't even pronounce his name. Maybe the show will eventually reveal him as "Henry Ra's Al Ghul". Smallville fans will get that one.

    - Felicity and Ray having sex. Normally, I'd place this in the win column, but I won't. Because I seriously doubt we've seen the last of Olicity. This feels like another bump on the road in what has been an exchausting and badly written love triangle.

    - While it was great to finally see Ray in his Atom suit, the show hasn't done this character justice. For example why does he have to share every scene he's in with Felicity? The pattern of Felicity inspiring Ray (apparently even through sex) has reached ludicrous levels.

    The not so bad:

    - Katrina Law. The woman can make any scene she's in infinitely hotter. Hope she sticks around for a few episodes.

    - Nyssa and Laurel's scene. A nice and touching little scene.

    - Roy's redemption story. I'm glad they addressed that.

    - Oliver and Diggle's bromance. Always a fan of those two guys' friendship and it was great to see them get a few scenes together.

    - For all the mediocre material he's given, Brandon Routh has done a tremendous job as Ray Palmer.

    5/10. Mainly for Diggle.
    Last edited by costas22; 02-26-2015 at 02:50 AM.

  4. #19
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    I saw raas asking oliver to replace him coming a mile away.

    Extremely overhyped episode. Total letdown

  5. #20
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    People are questioning Oliver's motives for saving Malcolm and/or trying to work with him to bring down Ra's. It was actually explained, at least to me, during the Oliver/Diggle scene. Oliver was PISSED that Ra's beat him (the fall) and he does not want to lose again. What stunned Oliver was that Ra's had/has no intention of killing him, was testing him, and now wants a successor. Stephen played that "huh what?" moment perfectly.

    I think Oliver taking Maseo's son will have big significance coming up.

    I really liked this episode. Getting to be a fan of Routh's Ray. It was very Iron-Mannish, but great scenes, but I sense a triangle

    Even though Oliver was using Malcolm (and actually using Thea's "soul" excuse) to finish what he started with Ra's, I'm not at all clear what's up with Malcolm. Is he a good guy or a bad guy? Just still very muddy for me. I love the character, but his whining to Ra's at the end seemed way OOC.....

    Loved the episode. Hate the hellatus....

  6. #21
    Forum Regular Arrowaddict22's Avatar
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    Okay, i must be one of the few who enjoyed the episode. I have always viewed Oliver as little bit naive, especially when it comes to Family. Diggle has often said that Oliver is blind when it comes to Family and Laurel. everything Oliver does is to protect family, and now that is Thea. His motive is always there, but very often he ends up putting everybody he is trying to protect at risk. He is blind to the consequence of saving malcolm, simply because he wants to save Thea's soul.

    Was general Shrieve and Amanda playing good-cop-bad-cop? Also, why did he have a patch of a horse on his upper arm, and not a flag for the US?

    felicity and ray - was that rebound sex from felicity? She is angry with Oliver, there is a spark between her and Ray, and now she is transferring all the emotion to Ray. felicity is portrayed as a naive girl, and there is little sophistication to her. the atom suit was AWESOME

    laurel just cannot keep a secret. She is so emotional and cannot think clearly. The speed with which she reacts is confounding given her age. i would definitely say she is immature. no wonder Oliver did not trust her with his secrets. The only mature, level headed woman in this series was Moira.

  7. #22
    Pirate King Backward Galaxy's Avatar
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    Not bad. I enjoyed a lot of the League stuff. Matt Nable is crushing it. Boy was I dead wrong about him. He's excellent.

    The one thing I don't care for is Thea handing over the sword to Nyssa. I understand feeling guilty, but she has to assume Nyssa is going to chop her head off at that point. My main problem with Arrow continues to be how it gets so darn melodramatic sometimes. You don't have to jump from feeling guilty immediately to suicidal. There are in-between steps.

  8. #23
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    Haven't heard anyone mention this:

    Episode 13, Arrow returns to Starling City and states, "I will never leave again."

    Episode 14, Arrow leaves to spend more time on the island.

    Episode 15, Arrow leaves to spend time to Nanda Parbat(sp?) in the Hindu Kush! Not sure how much further away from Starling he could get...

  9. #24
    Pirate King Backward Galaxy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRF View Post
    Haven't heard anyone mention this:

    Episode 13, Arrow returns to Starling City and states, "I will never leave again."

    Episode 14, Arrow leaves to spend more time on the island.

    Episode 15, Arrow leaves to spend time to Nanda Parbat(sp?) in the Hindu Kush! Not sure how much further away from Starling he could get...
    Reminds me of Superman's "I'm always around" line in Superman Returns... the events of which take place after he had just been gone for 5 years.

  10. #25
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    Is anyone else tired of Oliver being a selfish jerk? He gives no regard to the thoughts, feelings, or opinions of others around him. Instead, he just keeps making stupid and inconsiderate decisions. It's clear from this season that he never cared for Sara and isn't grieving her death. It's clear that he just wants Felicity miserable-he doesn't want to be with her, but doesn't want anyone else to have her either. And the level of disregard he's shown Laurel is unsurprising, but disappointing. In no way was rescuing Malcolm with a halfarsed plan the moral high ground or a smart decision.

    I did enjoy the interactions with Diggle and Ollie this episode. Dig is a great friend, even if Oliver doesn't deserve that level of loyalty. The Thea/Roy and Nyssa and Laurel moments were also well done.

    As for the twist... R'as has how many assassins in his league? Not a single one would make a good successor?

  11. #26
    Black Canary dreamsofnever's Avatar
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    Oh, and I seem to be one of only a few who actually likes Ray. Even if I wish his suit was closer to the comics. I also enjoy the Raylicity interactions, so it's unfortunate that Felicity will end up stomping all over his heart.

  12. #27
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    Routh is doing a terrific job

  13. #28
    Black Canary dreamsofnever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strike101 View Post
    Routh is doing a terrific job
    Agreed! It helps when I pretend that Ray is just Ted Kord with the wrong name too, because originally the plan was for him to be Ted until DC said no.

  14. #29
    Pirate King Backward Galaxy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dreamsofnever View Post
    Is anyone else tired of Oliver being a selfish jerk? He gives no regard to the thoughts, feelings, or opinions of others around him. Instead, he just keeps making stupid and inconsiderate decisions. It's clear from this season that he never cared for Sara and isn't grieving her death. It's clear that he just wants Felicity miserable-he doesn't want to be with her, but doesn't want anyone else to have her either. And the level of disregard he's shown Laurel is unsurprising, but disappointing. In no way was rescuing Malcolm with a halfarsed plan the moral high ground or a smart decision.
    I don't look at Oliver as being a selfish jerk. I just look at him as being unwilling to trust others to make the right decisions and know what's best for themselves, like he does. I take issue with that particular character flaw on a case by case basis. For example, he was apparently right with respect to Thea. She feels so guilty about what she's done, she all but committed suicide by handing over the sword to Nyssa. No one else predicted that might happen. Oliver KNEW it would, and it did. Can we now turn around and call him a jerk about it?

    On the other hand, he has been dismissive of dissenting points of view from people who probably have earned more respect; like Diggle.

  15. #30
    Black Canary dreamsofnever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backward Galaxy View Post
    I don't look at Oliver as being a selfish jerk. I just look at him as being unwilling to trust others to make the right decisions and know what's best for themselves, like he does. I take issue with that particular character flaw on a case by case basis. For example, he was apparently right with respect to Thea. She feels so guilty about what she's done, she all but committed suicide by handing over the sword to Nyssa. No one else predicted that might happen. Oliver KNEW it would, and it did. Can we now turn around and call him a jerk about it?

    On the other hand, he has been dismissive of dissenting points of view from people who probably have earned more respect; like Diggle.
    I got the feeling that Thea's guilt was over what she'd done to Sara, not so much turning Malcolm in. So I will say that I can somewhat understand him keeping the secret from Thea about her role in Sara's death, but him going to rescue Malcolm was not nearly about Thea but about himself. And in doing so, he put Diggle in danger and risked Thea having his death on her conscience.

    And selfish may not be the right word, but he disregards the feelings of others all too often. Like asking Thea to put her feelings aside and work with Malcolm, or failing to see that Laurel deserved to know what happened to Sara and failing to show even an ounce of sympathy or empathy when she did find out. So I do stand by calling him a jerk as much because of his refusal to even consider dissenting points of views as for his refusal to regard or even recognize the feelings of those around him. I get that this season is about the journey of him deciding if he can be Oliver Queen or The Arrow, and he's leaning more towards being a cold, unfeeling vigilante, but I'm just finding it hard to like and root for him in the way he's behaving towards everyone who has risked their life multiple times for both him and his cause.

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