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  • 10 - Uprising indeed.

    9 24.32%
  • 9

    10 27.03%
  • 8

    7 18.92%
  • 7

    5 13.51%
  • 6

    3 8.11%
  • 5

    2 5.41%
  • 4

    0 0%
  • 3

    0 0%
  • 2

    0 0%
  • 1 - More like a Downfall.

    1 2.70%
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  1. #46
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    Overall, it was a decent enough ep. -- a sort-of mini-finale to the Brick story arc. I'd hate to say it, but the reactions I had issues with were from: Ollie and Felicity. I think the need to cater/service Olicity made Ollie and Felicity exhibit some skewered behaviour they would otherwise not do. It's hard for me to reconcile Felicity at first wanting Ollie to kill Ra's at the duel to end his threat once and for all ... and now changing her mind. Now that Ollie is opting to do just that (I'm not passing judgment on the "right"-ness of his choice yet), it's a deal-breaker now? He is deciding to embrace the killing-is-necessary code. Is it the Malcolm connection that is offensive to her, the killing itself, or the whole thing?

    As for Ollie, he left for the duel clinging to his restored humanity (and likely knowing that it would be the death of him if he obeyed his new no-kill rule). Felicity was right in suggesting that coming back from the dead might have given him a new perspective, maybe an appreciation for how he had rebuilt his humanity (and, yeah, clarified his feelings for her). His decision -- after all of this -- is to go back to his "Hood" code where the end justifies the means? If not for the need to fan their 'ship, I'd like to believe that they would be on the same page that the Team ultimately chose, which is that compromising one's values to achieve an end is the Malcolm way, not the Arrow way. We don't actually know who voted for what, I can only assume Roy wanted to back Malcolm's idea and the others out-voted him. This part of the ep was muddled and it's the fog of Olicity that muddled it.

    They did a credible job explaining Merlyn's motivations -- I didn't even expect we'd get more insight into his past and what drove him to go to the League. I'd have to give Merlyn credit for convincingly getting into everyone's head. (And in pro wrestling terms, this could be the point we could say is the start of Merlyn's turn from "heel" to "face", if he is indeed becoming reformed due to Thea. It's more likely a false "face" turn.) If it's merely a ruse and he's playing them -- completely in his game-book -- then Ollie's decision to go along with him will look much more foolish.

    The street fight battle was pretty cool and heavily borrowed from the Dark Knight Rises scene. Where did Diggle and friends find their Glades army? Maybe a post-fight pizza/dance party at the Verdant persuaded the locals to join in.

    It looks like for both Quentin and Thea, secrets and lies are on the verge of coming out. If Quentin can figure out Arsenal is Roy, then he'd have to be able to do the same with the Arrow and Ollie. I am really hoping Quentin finds out about Sara's death sooner rather than later, as this particular secret is long past needing to be revealed to him.

    It was a 7/10 from me, due to the Olicity plot/character muddling and the increasingly stale (and sudsy) secrets 'n lies.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    The street fight battle was pretty cool and heavily borrowed from the Dark Knight Rises scene. Where did Diggle and friends find their Glades army? Maybe a post-fight pizza/dance party at the Verdant persuaded the locals to join in.
    We know Roy has street connections and therefore you would presume Sin would have as well. When people aren't happy with a situation they will rally together, especially if they have a single main target. Add on top of that Laurel going to Ted, who has looked after a lot of street kids it makes sense how the word gets around.

    Also it is the Glades afterall and that area in general is much more prone to violence/self regulation rather then accepting the law no matter who's it is.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carmine-Infantino View Post
    I don't believe anything we've been told so far. I think everything we've seen in season 3 is a big set up for a massive plot twist that will finally make sense out of this mess. We're supposed to believe Malcolm comes up with a stupid scheme to kill Sara to get off the hook with Ra's. Malcolm is not that stupid. We're supposed to believe Malcolm would take a foolish risk with Thea's life? No, none of this sounds like Malcolm. You know who it sounds like, Ra's. Ra's is a masterminded and tactician, how hard would it be for Ra's to arrange for Malcolm to use Thea to kill Sara. Why would he want Sara dead? Ra's has always wanted an heir, with Sara around he was never going to get an heir. By using Malcolm to remove Sara, Ra's can remain blameless to nissa. By using Thea, Ra's insurers Oliver will fight him thus giving him a chance to judge a possible suitor for his daughter. Not only does this sound like Ra's, it's almost exactly like the storyline of "Birth of the Demon" the first story to feature Ra's.
    EXACTLY! this is what i have been thinking, and i bet ras offered Malcolm to be clear of his blood debt if he did it, because your right why would maseo save ollie then send the league to starling immediately after that..this whole thing seems like a mess, and based on season 2 and how amazing it was i dont see the writers just nose diving it this season... because a great plot twist at the end can redeem everything this season

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carmine-Infantino View Post
    I don't believe anything we've been told so far. I think everything we've seen in season 3 is a big set up for a massive plot twist that will finally make sense out of this mess. We're supposed to believe Malcolm comes up with a stupid scheme to kill Sara to get off the hook with Ra's. Malcolm is not that stupid. We're supposed to believe Malcolm would take a foolish risk with Thea's life? No, none of this sounds like Malcolm. You know who it sounds like, Ra's. Ra's is a masterminded and tactician, how hard would it be for Ra's to arrange for Malcolm to use Thea to kill Sara. Why would he want Sara dead? Ra's has always wanted an heir, with Sara around he was never going to get an heir. By using Malcolm to remove Sara, Ra's can remain blameless to nissa. By using Thea, Ra's insurers Oliver will fight him thus giving him a chance to judge a possible suitor for his daughter. Not only does this sound like Ra's, it's almost exactly like the storyline of "Birth of the Demon" the first story to feature Ra's.
    well EP Marc said in an interview that a plot twist will shock the audience so maybe your theory is correct. I mean it likely Merly and ra's been working together that is scary being the Devil and Demon!

  5. #50
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    While I didn't like it as much as Midnight City, Uprising was still a decent episode. I could complain about the Olicity stuff, EBR's loud/angry delivery of most of her lines, and several other things but I won't. Most of it's already been covered anyway. Instead, I'll bring up a couple things I wondered about.

    Both Lance & Thea have now established that they know Roy is Arsenal because of his red hoodie. So perhaps if Oliver ran around in a green hoodie, they might know he's the Arrow. Or in Lance's case, he already knows and is maintaining plausible deniability. It doesn't make sense that he wouldn't do the same with Roy, though.

    The other thing was the battle in the Glades. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the majority of Brick's men have guns? I know Diggle did. Instead of using them though, everyone decides to charge at each other. One more thing: Did anyone else see Laurel being carried over someone's shoulder during the charge? I must have missed it.
    Last edited by Red_Arrow; 02-06-2015 at 06:25 AM.

  6. #51
    Hopeless Forum Addict Halberdier17's Avatar
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    My problem with fight in the Glades was they should've used Malcolm's help because it would've been safer for the civilians instead of having them fight Brick's gang and potentially get killed.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halberdier17 View Post
    My problem with fight in the Glades was they should've used Malcolm's help because it would've been safer for the civilians instead of having them fight Brick's gang and potentially get killed.
    That's the difference between a Team led by Oliver and a Team led by popular vote. Oliver would have accepted Malcolm's help, albeit grudgingly, in order to keep the civilians safe. Roy, Oliver's apprentice and partner, was his voice, and Laurel also voiced that one. But since she's not officially part of the team, Dig and Felicity got to outvote Roy.

  8. #53
    Super Moderator savingpeoplething's Avatar
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    Loved it! 9.

  9. #54
    Site Groupie SteelyGal's Avatar
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    Enjoyed this episode. My minor criticism is the vicious beating Wild Cat received from Brick. I felt Laurel's trainer should be able to fight better than that.

    I wasn't sure why they showed only Laurel hanging back to watch Oliver's speech but the way they cut that scene showing just her watching Oliver reminded me of Lois in Smallive hiding while watching Clark heal himself in the Lazarus episode.

    It will be interesting next week to see how Oliver handles how the team has evolved without him.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by SVfan26 View Post
    Was the exact timeline ever established on that, previously? I thought I remembered Malcolm saying he was so angry at himself for ignoring her calls because he was busy, but then the cops informed him of what happened, and then is when he tortured himself by repeatedly listening to those voicemails as she called for help and lay dying.

    Could just be my imagination and giving the writers/tptb the benefit of the doubt that they got it right - would have helped if they could squeezed in a few seconds in the flashbacks of him listening to those voicemails post-cop condolences and pre-murdering the supposed shooter.
    You may be right. I will try and go back and find where they talked about that in a previous season.

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Arrow View Post
    While I didn't like it as much as Midnight City, Uprising was still a decent episode. I could complain about the Olicity stuff, EBR's loud/angry delivery of most of her lines, and several other things but I won't. Most of it's already been covered anyway. Instead, I'll bring up a couple things I wondered about.

    Both Lance & Thea have now established that they know Roy is Arsenal because of his red hoodie. So perhaps if Oliver ran around in a green hoodie, they might know he's the Arrow. Or in Lance's case, he already knows and is maintaining plausible deniability. It doesn't make sense that he wouldn't do the same with Roy, though.

    The other thing was the battle in the Glades. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the majority of Brick's men have guns? I know Diggle did. Instead of using them though, everyone decides to charge at each other. One more thing: Did anyone else see Laurel being carried over someone's shoulder during the charge? I must have missed it.
    The Laurel over somebodies shoulder ... I think i saw that too but pretended i didn't. Havent rewatched yet, but will keep an eye out.

    As for the guns, apparently Bricks mob is unruly and unorganized. Maybe if they started shooting, they might have feared friendly fire? Like Brick cares, he is apparently bullet proof.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelyGal View Post
    Enjoyed this episode. My minor criticism is the vicious beating Wild Cat received from Brick. I felt Laurel's trainer should be able to fight better than that.
    Yeah I agree. And what is funny, I recall Laurel throwing some vicious hooks in a couple of the earlier brawls, that she HAD to have learned from Ted. But I thought TG would have done better. At first he was taking it to Brick, so maybe I need to rewatch. I felt better about Olivers fight with Ras after rewatching it a couple times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelyGal View Post
    It will be interesting next week to see how Oliver handles how the team has evolved without him.
    100% agree. Oliver is the head of this team. It formed around him. Everyones opinion is important, but it can't be done by a vote every time. Ollie has to be the place where the buck stops. Maybe they should sit down, and come up with a mission statement or something they can all abide by. But in the case of Ollie, I feel that when his massive survival instinct kicks in, he will do anything it takes to accomplish his goal.

    I'm also really worried about Felicity. She is almost becoming irrational. Others have covered it, so I won't go into it much. But she is becoming more of a hinderance to the team, than an asset. Oliver has apparently been killed, or close to it, and finally makes his way back to get chewed out by Felicity, who is contradicting herself? She doesn't like Malcolm, which is fine. But I would think she would at least give a few minutes to be glad Ollie is back. Maybe her working with Ray is making it harder for her to work with Arrow. Arrow is a lot of times by the seat of the pants decisions, and working with Ray is probably more like long and thought out plans. I just hope they will please settle Felicity back down to the way she used to be.

  13. #58
    Posting Pro SVfan26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightHawk777 View Post
    100% agree. Oliver is the head of this team. It formed around him. Everyones opinion is important, but it can't be done by a vote every time. Ollie has to be the place where the buck stops. Maybe they should sit down, and come up with a mission statement or something they can all abide by. But in the case of Ollie, I feel that when his massive survival instinct kicks in, he will do anything it takes to accomplish his goal.

    I'm also really worried about Felicity. She is almost becoming irrational. Others have covered it, so I won't go into it much. But she is becoming more of a hinderance to the team, than an asset. Oliver has apparently been killed, or close to it, and finally makes his way back to get chewed out by Felicity, who is contradicting herself? She doesn't like Malcolm, which is fine. But I would think she would at least give a few minutes to be glad Ollie is back. Maybe her working with Ray is making it harder for her to work with Arrow. Arrow is a lot of times by the seat of the pants decisions, and working with Ray is probably more like long and thought out plans. I just hope they will please settle Felicity back down to the way she used to be.
    There should be a system set up for when Oliver can't be, or isn't, around. Like he is the leader of the team, but when he's away, one of them is the defacto leader in his stead, and then another person if first person can't for some reason, etc.


    I know it won't happen, because of the need to pander to a portion of the fanbase, but Oliver should be telling Felicity - albeit politely - that he's let it go up to a point, but she needs to make a choice on her priorities; the Arrow team or Ray Palmer. "Us or Him", basically. She hasn't told the team (Oliver) that Palmer is working on his A.T.O.M suit, right? I wonder if the TPTB will decide to have that somehow blow up in her face by not confiding in Oliver/Team Arrow. Of course, this season's myth-arc 'spine' seems to be about all the harmful secrets kept from people they care about, so it fits right in.

  14. #59
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    I'll need to rewatch the episode but I thought Laurel was much more open-minded to the idea of Malcolm helping them before the vote than Felicity who stonewalled even though she was the one throwing out the idea of sicking Malcolm on Brick when she discovered Brick killed Malcolm's wife. My question is who has more of a right to hate Malcolm? Malcolm plotted to have the Queen's Gambit sunk during a storm and hoped Robert Queen would die but he didn't. If Oliver wouldn't have unexpectedly joined the cruise Robert may have well reached the island Oliver landed on so Malcolm isn't directly responsible for Robert's death (moral twisting that doesn't actually remove blame for Robert's death from Malcolm but it's something often tried). Then we have Tommy, also not something we can blame Malcolm directly for but someone important to both Oliver and Laurel, no major connections to anybody else on the team. We have Sara's death, while she was a close friend to everyone on the team she was Oliver's lover and Laurel's sister. Yet in this vote that we didn't get to see it's very obvious that Felicity, whose only "personal" grudge is Walter's kidnapping, is there claiming to know what Oliver would do and brow-beats Roy while Laurel stands quietly listening. If anyone then it should've been Laurel with her panties in a wad denouncing Malcolm and not some supposed socially ackward IT genius who supposedly has no love life and is always light-hearted and cheery. This is absolutely NOTHING like the Felicity we were introduced to and who's short appearance convinced the show runners to make her a show regular. Go ahead and claim she's emotionally to close and therefore is having this outburst but I'm not buying it. Others closer than her are showing a much more open mind than she is.

    EDIT: After rewatching, it was Diggle that suggested sicking Malcolm after Brick and Felicity didn't fully support the idea but was more open minded than when Malcolm showed up and offered to help. In Diggle's defense I will state his flip-flop was shown without any major emotional outburst demonstrating a more rational reasoning behind his change in opinion. Laurel also questioned Diggle's suggestion of sicking Malcolm on Brick so that one can assume she stuck to her opinion as did Felicity but again without any emotional outburst to make it seem hysterical. Felicity made a solid argument against asking Malcolm for help when Diggle suggested it, it's her emotional outburst that riled my feathers so badly that it negated the more rational arguments she made from my memory.
    Last edited by DoubleDevil; 02-08-2015 at 06:03 AM.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by SVfan26 View Post
    There should be a system set up for when Oliver can't be, or isn't, around. Like he is the leader of the team, but when he's away, one of them is the defacto leader in his stead, and then another person if first person can't for some reason, etc.


    I know it won't happen, because of the need to pander to a portion of the fanbase, but Oliver should be telling Felicity - albeit politely - that he's let it go up to a point, but she needs to make a choice on her priorities; the Arrow team or Ray Palmer. "Us or Him", basically. She hasn't told the team (Oliver) that Palmer is working on his A.T.O.M suit, right? I wonder if the TPTB will decide to have that somehow blow up in her face by not confiding in Oliver/Team Arrow. Of course, this season's myth-arc 'spine' seems to be about all the harmful secrets kept from people they care about, so it fits right in.
    Good points here. I agree that he should politely (for him) tell Felicity she needs to make a choice. And not just between Team Arrow/Ray Palmer, but between whether she wants to continue as part of the vigilante group or if she needs to step away for a while.

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