View Poll Results: Rate This Episode

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  • 10 - Climbed to the top of the greatest episodes ever.

    29 56.86%
  • 9

    13 25.49%
  • 8

    4 7.84%
  • 7

    2 3.92%
  • 6

    1 1.96%
  • 5

    0 0%
  • 4

    1 1.96%
  • 3

    0 0%
  • 2

    0 0%
  • 1 - Well Arrow is dead in more ways than one.

    1 1.96%
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  1. #61
    Taylor Swift Caught_In_The_Sun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post

    Ray has got to stop taking relationship advice from the seemingly mild-mannered reporter from Metropolis who "stalked" his high school sweetheart Lana more times than he'd care to admit, to the point where only a Lex-induced kryptonized allergy kept them apart. Ray: excited for your ATOM subplot -- your workplace harassment of Lana, I mean, Felicity, not so much. Mr. Palmer, I believe that's HR on line 2.

    (And, no, I don't think Felicity is like Lana. The evolution of Ralicity so far? -- the DNA of Clana is all over it).
    *Cough* Superman Returns *Cough*

    I actually love Ray as he is a positive character and Brandon is awesome.

    ETA: Brandon to me is a "hero" actor. The ship sailed with Superman but if they could do some awesome stuff with The ATOM. I am all for it!
    Last edited by Caught_In_The_Sun; 12-12-2014 at 10:30 AM.

  2. #62
    Forum Whiz TheSecretVampire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dandabeast View Post
    based on the animated movie of son of batman slade wilson aka deathstroke is also able to hold his own against ras al ghul

    Well, that was a much more experienced Deathstroke against what looked like the end of line Ras.


    In this Arrowverse at the moment, I would say Slade and Ras would have a much better fight vs Ras/Oliver, but I still see Ras winning. On the other hand, Slade with the mirkuru, then that tip the scales in Slade's favor. Ras is on a different level than both Oliver and Slade, it's really amazing.

  3. #63
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    all im saying comic and movie wise the only two people to be in ras level are bruce wayne and slade wilson but in arrowverse slade vs ras couldve been a better fight slade has the strength but ras has the speed plus slade is an expert when it comes to wielding a sword since the fight did start as a sword fight it couldve been harder for ras to take the sword away from him than it was with oliver. one of my favorite scenes from season 2 was when slade slams oliver on the floor and punches him them tells him "dont forget who taught you how to fight kid"

  4. #64
    Forum Regular Arrowaddict22's Avatar
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    I think Ollie knew he had to die, and do so at the hand of Ra's to clear the blood debt. If Ollie had killed Ra's, Nyssa would have wanted to revenge her father's death, and still gone after Thea. Ollie told Thea and Felicity that there was nothing he would not do to protect his sister. Ido not think it is any more complicated than that.
    so coming back in January, both Ollie and the Arrow will have been missing. Will Quentin the. Finally admit to knowing that Ollie is the Arrow?

    Or will Diggle suit up as Arrow?

  5. #65
    New In Town Superboy1991's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrowaddict22 View Post
    Or will Diggle suit up as Arrow?
    Two words, Connor Hawke 😊

    I really enjoyed the finale, and I also really like the direction of where Ollie is going. I think Ras killed Ollie for the death of Sara, ( I don't think Malcolm is off the hook here, therefore I think he genuinely wanted Ollie to win) but realise Ras, in his own way, care for the league as a family and his first kill was to protect and revenge his family. I think Ras will take Ollie to the pit himself, since Ollie was also fighting and sacrifice himself for his family, and train him in hand to hand combat ( I honestly think he still won't be able to take on Malcolm 1 on 1)

    And there was some saying Lazarus pit goes against the realism of the show, I remember the producers said the show grounded by reality, not that everything in it is realistic.

  6. #66
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    Two words, Connor Hawke
    One problem he's not old enough.

  7. #67
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    Finally, I feel like some of the characters are getting back to being the bad ***es they were in earlier episodes. I've never been a huge fan of the Lances, but Dinah's comments in the cemetery, I think I yelled at the screen, "Yeah! Finally some vengeance back in this joint!" I'd love to see Laurel go all Ollie-season-1 on some bad guys.

    There were a couple scenes that made me go Ugh, though. When Ra's said it's been 47 years since someone challenged him: are we supposed to believe someone pushing 80 has abs and a hairline like that? The man lives underground, off the grid. That gotta take a toll on your looks. If he's that old, he's been living in a Hollywood spa for the past 47 years. Also, when Ray began talking about his finance, I kind of went, "oh, here we go again." Star City must have a murder rate higher than Honduras if even the richest of the rich all have their own horror stories. I mean if the Queens, Merlyns, and Palmers are getting offed left and right, what's the murder rate like in the bad neighborhoods?

    I'm really starting to dig Felicity's look. There's something very mid-century-comic book about the a-line skirts and beehive hairdos that gives her a kind of secret identity when she's outside the Batcave.

  8. #68
    Posting Pro PHOENIXZERO's Avatar
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    67 years, not 47. I take it you're not familiar with Ra's history? They're clearly taking the comic book route with Ra's, at least to an extent.

    Quote Originally Posted by dandabeast View Post
    all im saying comic and movie wise the only two people to be in ras level are bruce wayne and slade wilson but in arrowverse slade vs ras couldve been a better fight slade has the strength but ras has the speed plus slade is an expert when it comes to wielding a sword since the fight did start as a sword fight it couldve been harder for ras to take the sword away from him than it was with oliver. one of my favorite scenes from season 2 was when slade slams oliver on the floor and punches him them tells him "dont forget who taught you how to fight kid"
    There are multiple characters in the comics that are on Ra's level or even better when it comes to fighting. Slade no longer has Mirakuru enhancements and his lack of those showed (and possibly their withdrawing from him) let Ollie pretty much kicking his ass with little issue in contrast to the beat down Slade was giving him in the flashback but like I already said, some of that could be chalked up to the side effects of the cure with the withdraw. Slade on the show is no where near the level of show Ra's, hell without Mirakuru show Slade isn't on the level of Malcolm, Nyssa or maybe even Sara.

    Quote Originally Posted by Haggard01 View Post
    One problem he's not old enough.
    Connor is a meta-human in the show who coincidentally ages 15 years instantly but keeps up intellectually along with gaining all the perks he had in the comics due now to his "meta-humanness".

    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post

    If there were suspension of disbelief moments, they all involved Thea. How she defeated Sara is something I will need to digest. We have to presume that seeing Thea on the rooftop was such a surprise that it caught her off-guard? This is hard to buy into. The other moment is the use of mind control on her to do Malcolm's bidding. I'd have to agree with some reviews I've read that it's a convenient get-out-of-responsibility (or jail time?) card: once used with Roy re: mirakuru-induced killing of a cop, and now Thea with Sara's death. I'm presuming that in both instances, these "passes" were issued for Ollie's benefit. Since they were under the influence, they are technically still in the realm of redemption, so Ollie has a reason to fight for them. If they killed consciously knowing it was wrong, Ollie could wash his hands of them, cast them aside and let the authorities deal with them. It might have been dramatically more satisfying to see them wrestle with what they've done -- and they may yet still do that, but with the under the influence defence they will get a pass on the real consequences.
    I can buy Sara being caught off guard and surprised, Sara would not have been prepared for that at all from Thea. I still think they should make Thea a naturally better archer than Oliver, especially since they hinted in the first season that was already talented in that regard. As dumb as the whole thing is, I totally forgot that someone a while back took that "hello Sara" bit of altered dialog and played with it and it sounded like Willa, but I didn't actually think they'd go through with it. I would rather have Thea know what she did and meant to do it without this lame drug induced mind control junk. I'd rather Thea did it without knowing it was Sara than this... I also don't care for how Roy got over killing that cop so quickly.

    Thea's encounter with a suited Oliver was hilarious for all the wrong reasons.

    At this point, for Quentin not knowing the Arrow's identity I've retconned that he's pulling a Jim Gordon -- he knows it but chooses not to openly admit it for the greater good, etc. As for not knowing Sara is dead, I'd have to agree again with other reviews that suggest Dinah is a better detective than he is. I've never been a fan of the secrets-and-lies subplots these shows trot out each season, it's all for melodrama. And worse, it makes Quentin or whoever is being kept in the dark look clueless or even idiotic.
    You don't need to, he said as much last season, he really is pulling a Gordon on this front. And umm "mother's intuition" but the drama around it is dumb and they need to resolve it, hopefully the next three episodes do that. The cheap drama and the shoddy writing that comes with it is the worst aspect of this show.

    As for Ollie being on a dramatic hiatus, I think out of necessity they need to reinforce the development of the other cast members, whether this is Laurel, Roy, Diggle, Thea and so on. If this means Ollie steps back and goes through a personal "rebirth" however it may pan out, I'm all for it. Felicity also needs some further development, in the world-outside-the Arrowcave-and-work sense, and not in the shipper sense as she's holding down three jobs on this front (Barry, anyone?).
    Agreed.
    Ray has got to stop taking relationship advice from the seemingly mild-mannered reporter from Metropolis who "stalked" his high school sweetheart Lana more times than he'd care to admit, to the point where only a Lex-induced kryptonized allergy kept them apart. Ray: excited for your ATOM subplot -- your workplace harassment of Lana, I mean, Felicity, not so much. Mr. Palmer, I believe that's HR on line 2.

    (And, no, I don't think Felicity is like Lana. The evolution of Ralicity so far? -- the DNA of Clana is all over it).
    So true.


    I think "Olicity" is awful and the pandering the people in charge have been doing since late last season has kind of hurt the show as has the way Felicity has been handled.
    Last edited by PHOENIXZERO; 12-13-2014 at 05:23 PM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by dandabeast View Post
    all im saying comic and movie wise the only two people to be in ras level are bruce wayne and slade wilson but in arrowverse slade vs ras couldve been a better fight slade has the strength but ras has the speed plus slade is an expert when it comes to wielding a sword since the fight did start as a sword fight it couldve been harder for ras to take the sword away from him than it was with oliver. one of my favorite scenes from season 2 was when slade slams oliver on the floor and punches him them tells him "dont forget who taught you how to fight kid"
    Bronze Tiger is better than both.Oliver is not even the top ten and has never been in the dc universe.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    I've never been a fan of the secrets-and-lies subplots these shows trot out each season, it's all for melodrama. And worse, it makes Quentin or whoever is being kept in the dark look clueless or even idiotic.
    This times a million. You could make a drinking game out of the line "no one can know about this." I swear, some of the secrets seem about three layers deep.

    "There are things about me that I can't tell you. But no one can know that you know that I have secrets that I can't tell you. It's our secret, okay?"

    How did these people make it this far in life - running billion dollar corporations and global crime families - all behaving with the collective intellect of an eighth grade cafeteria?

  11. #71
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    I knew I wasn't going mad when I thought that one of the actors said that Malcolm would be on the mountain. I just made a mistake with what episode it would be.

    http://www.greenarrowtv.com/did-john...t-notice/20740

  12. #72
    Site Groupie President_Luthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHOENIXZERO View Post
    Thea's encounter with a suited Oliver was hilarious for all the wrong reasons.
    Yeah, there was definitely a level of absurdity in that whole scene. It was a perfect storm of 'what the heck did I just see happen here?' The intent was to show Ollie's surprise that Thea had combat skills, that she was lying about being in contact with Malcolm and (allegedly) can hold her own against the Arrow. Facts digested -- but my gut reaction by the end of it was Her leaping off the balcony to make her escape, jacketless in December, with her "leave me and my father alone!" bleating sealed the deal on that.

    Ollie can save his city ... but apparently not his own sister from going out into the night without so much as a windbreaker.

  13. #73
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    If Thea doesn't flinch when boiling hot coffee is spilled on her hand, why would a little cold weather bother her? She is now impervious to heat and cold. That is why she only wears midriff shirts now, no matter what the temperature.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by President_Luthor View Post
    Yeah, there was definitely a level of absurdity in that whole scene. It was a perfect storm of 'what the heck did I just see happen here?' The intent was to show Ollie's surprise that Thea had combat skills, that she was lying about being in contact with Malcolm and (allegedly) can hold her own against the Arrow. Facts digested -- but my gut reaction by the end of it was Her leaping off the balcony to make her escape, jacketless in December, with her "leave me and my father alone!" bleating sealed the deal on that.

    Ollie can save his city ... but apparently not his own sister from going out into the night without so much as a windbreaker.
    It's really funny. Somehow, in a 4-6 month period, Thea has become more awesome than Spider Man! In fact, she's like Super Girl!

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRF View Post
    If Thea doesn't flinch when boiling hot coffee is spilled on her hand, why would a little cold weather bother her? She is now impervious to heat and cold. That is why she only wears midriff shirts now, no matter what the temperature.
    She's also impervious to family Christmas brawls, which is actually a handy super power.

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