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Is this Bobby-Rufus thing foreshadowing of Sam & Dean?

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  • Is this Bobby-Rufus thing foreshadowing of Sam & Dean?

    Something tells me Lisa will be killed & Sam will be at fault & Dean will be faced with the same situation that Rufus was in regarding forgiving Sam.

  • #2
    Hopefully the whole Braeden storyline is done; for good.

    I don't think Dean is undeserving of happiness outside of his brother (+ Bobby), but let's face it... either Dean gives up hunting [somehow] or they join him in 'the life'; nothing besides those two extremes will work for a lasting relationship between the two parties.

    The boys have enough already-existing angst in their lives to drive them and this production, please Show, end this {Dean/Braedens} before it has the possibility of driving yet another 'lack of trust wedge' between the Winchesters.


    Of course, I guess if Lisa's death were to occur, and it was Sam's fault; it would continue the 'crappiest luck in the universe' & 'destiny!? more like never-ending nightmare!' life he's been dealt ever since he turned 6 months old.

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    • #3
      I can't see this as a foreshadow, especially after Dean's speech at Rufus' burial site.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Anno_Domini
        I can't see this as a foreshadow, especially after Dean's speech at Rufus' burial site.
        That speech actually solidified it for me. It set up a situation where Dean said what he said in this episode, but once Lisa dies, living up to those words would be something that he wouldn't be able to do. At least not easily. In other words, I think it's setting up a scenario where it was easy for Dean to say what he did now, but once he's confronted with the same situation, what he said to Sam here & what he'll do are 2 different things.

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        • #5
          Saying that speech, then something happening like that with Sam being at fault with Lisa's death, AND if there is something that happens between those two, Dean will become a hypocrite and make him become the jerk for the next season, which, I don't think will happen. Why would Dean say this and then make himself turn out to be the one that will be the "bad brother"(for being a hypocrite now)?

          For anything, I think Bobby mentioned that just because it's a parallel of more like the Bobby/Rufus situation(Bobby was saved from his wife by Rufus but Bobby is the reason for Rufus' wife's death).

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          • #6
            I don't think it would make him the hypocrite. I think it would show that it's easy to say that now when he hasn't had a personal loss like that. But once it happens it's a totally different thing.

            I actually don't want this to happen because I don't think this show needs that kind of drama, but I have a feeling that's where they may be going after that ending scene. We know that Lisa is still around and the monsters & demons know about her, setting up the potential for it to happen. If they're going to kill her & Ben off, then I wouldn't be surprised if Sam takes some of the blame, though I do think Dean will ultimately forgive Sam. If it happens, Lisa & Ben's deaths may even come down to a decision or a risk that Sam won't be willing to take that soulless Sam would have taken, which would put the whole thing on back on Dean since he wanted Sam to have his soul back.

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            • #7
              I still think the parallel of Bobby and Rufus is enough and doesn't need to foreshadow anything in regards to Sam and Dean. Plus, yes, it would still make Dean a hypocrite, saying "it doens't matter, that he should've still forgave you" means that Dean wants them to start over with a clean slate, and would be a hypocrite if something were to happen with Lisa and Dean doesn't forgive Sam, plus, it'll just feel like the beginning of season five all over again, imo. Less dramatic angst between the brothers is a good thing, and so far, that's what the writers seem to be doing. It's enough that we might be showing what will happen once Sam's wall is cracked that we don't need to see any kind of dilemma with Lisa.

              And speaking of Lisa, I couldn't see her being brought up anyways, imo. "M3:TR" felt like an ending for Lisa and Ben.

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              • #8
                I hope you're right, because like I said, I don't want this show to have such unneeded drama. And I also hope you're right about Lisa & Ben being done after M3: TR.

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                • #9
                  IF Lisa and Ben do return, then it's just a spat on the face to the fans, imo. That "goodbye Lisa montage" looked like a sign of the end to their storylines, and it would just be a hit to the fans to bring her back once more. She's done and Ben's done, which, Ben's not even Dean's son(which Dean should not take it to heart what Ben said to him last).

                  Plus, what Bobby did say about him and Rufus should only soldify the point that Sam and Dean will become stronger as brothers and hunting partners from now on to get them more back into what they were in the first two seasons.

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                  • #10
                    I hope you're right. But there are still sources of possible angst between them. Even though Sam was grateful for having his soul back, he could still blame Dean once the wall breaks down and he faces whatever torment he will face. But I'd rather have that than Lisa & Ben returning.

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                    • #11
                      In a way, Dean has already lost Lisa because of Sam. That's not something they need to go back to.

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                      • #12
                        I didn't see it as a foreshadow but I do think that Bobby and Rufus were supposed to be a paralell for the boys (Bobby=Sam, good at research and quick to figure things out. Dean-Rufus, better at the shooting things part and ready to charge in and kiss butt.).

                        But Sam and Dean have what Rufus and Bobby never had (despite Rufus being "family")--their connection as brothers. It's seen them through everything (including Ruby, which I wasn't sure that Dean would ever get over).

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by xrayvision
                          I hope you're right. But there are still sources of possible angst between them. Even though Sam was grateful for having his soul back, he could still blame Dean once the wall breaks down and he faces whatever torment he will face. But I'd rather have that than Lisa & Ben returning.
                          I don't think Sam will be able to blame Dean once the wall cracks/breaks. By then he may turn full-on demon and just go on a killing spree.

                          I say Lisa and Ben are done. There doesn't need to be some kind of Bobby/Rufus parallel going on just because Bobby/Rufus had a parallel on their own. If anything, though, I could see Lisa dying and Sam having to save Dean, which would be a direct parallel to how Dean saved Sam from Jess.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Anno_Domini
                            I don't think Sam will be able to blame Dean once the wall cracks/breaks. By then he may turn full-on demon and just go on a killing spree.

                            I say Lisa and Ben are done. There doesn't need to be some kind of Bobby/Rufus parallel going on just because Bobby/Rufus had a parallel on their own. If anything, though, I could see Lisa dying and Sam having to save Dean, which would be a direct parallel to how Dean saved Sam from Jess.
                            I'd like seeing Sam saving Dean with a parallel to what happened with Jess.

                            Although I really hope he doesn't go psychotic or demon when the wall finally comes down. That's been something I was worried about when thinking of all the possible reactions.... I guess I'm tired of the mistrust between the brothers and tired of Sam being a bad guy. I feel like they've done that story line. Let's try something else.

                            It's been nice to see trust being built back up between the two. I'd be really disappointed to see that trashed again.

                            I think there's a lot they can do with this Mother of All story line and maybe they can get back to some of the fun of earlier season one or season two hunts.

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                            • #15
                              Well, I don't think there will be a "mistrust" issue if the wall breaks inside Sam's mind, just more of the lines of Dean trying to fix Sam. Someone mentioned that they would like season seven to focus on Dean trying to fix Sam once more, but I think the arc will end in the sixth season finale; my idea is that the wall cracks, Sam becomes a maniac for a little while, but gets healed by Eve(there's an idea circulating with the possibility of "only a mother can heal a soul"), and I think Eve will end up healing Sam, but it'll probably be part of the deal Castiel makes. Misha said Castiel will get himself into trouble, and I believe Cas will make a deal with Mother.

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