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  • Shaw: understated or badly acted?

    Do you think Brandon Routh is playing Shaw as a hard nosed, emotionless, understated agent. Or is he just a bad actor?

  • #2
    Originally posted by closetclana
    Do you think Brandon Routh is playing Shaw as a hard nosed, emotionless, understated agent. Or is he just a bad actor?
    I think it's the writing more than anything else.

    The first couple of episodes he was great, including when Sarah found out about him and his ring and his wife that died. He was good and in control up to the plane to Paris episode.

    But as soon as they took him to the romantic route, it's like the character suddenly lost focus. It's not doing great in romance, because they write him some horrible romance stuff. He is fumbling in spy stuff. His trust in Chuck is gone. He makes bad decisions in spy work. The character is just utterly destroyed.

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    • #3
      I have only seen Brandon Routh in this and Superman Returns, and I thought his acting in a romantic capacity in both leaves something to be desired. Then again, he was written as a super-stalker in SR and his lines about his dessert being contained within Sarah's aren't exactly Shakespearean.

      Is it just me, or is this question a huge mindf**kr? I've been asking it to myself since 3.07. It's starting to intrigue me in an odd way. I think finding out more about Shaw's intentions will let us know how the performance actually was
      Last edited by smeyer44; 03-09-2010, 11:29 AM. Reason: removing my own hyperbole

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      • #4
        This is the line that made me think it was just bad acting:

        It's at 32:18 on Hulu. "Sorry Sarah, but you can't think of Chuck. You have to think like a spy."

        When he said that line was the first time I thought to myself that this guy was a horrible actor. But now that I'm rewatching it, maybe it was bad writing - or a combination of the two.

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        • #5
          I must admit that I liked BR as Superman, and I thought he was a good actor. But here on Chuck... I don't know, maybe it's because I hate his character, but I don't really see any acting skills here. I mean, it looks like he has just one facial expression!

          Anyway, I vote for badly acted.

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          • #6
            I love Brandon's work in the show. He's a fine actor. I've seen him in other things (Superman Returns, Zach and Miri Make a Porno, Table For Three) and he's good/great in them. He can emote emotion really well, has a great voice and great presence (I mean, he IS Superman).

            I like the way he plays Shaw in Chuck; he's cocky, commanding, mysterious, morally ambiguous and all business. And yes, understated. He is the strong and silent type of spy. He's been hurt deeply and that's why he's usually on guard and distant.. well, not always, he is somewhat weak with Sarah. awww. haha. He also shows emotion with his face, but it's very subtle most of the time, which fits the character. If people expect him to do goofy faces a la Chuck, well, there are totally missing the point. Besides, Shaw has shown far more humanity than Casey so far, but people only criticize Shaw. Dumb and very biased, again.

            I know some people say Shaw's creepy and that makes me laugh so hard because I just don't see that at all, and neither does my sister who doesn't read internet message boards, btw. I guess people just want to see what they want to see. I also think many hardcore C/S shippers HATE him so much because of his romantic connection with Sarah. They just can't take it, so they make up all kind of silly and absurd stuff about Shaw.

            I like the Shaw/Sarah relationship. I totally get why they'd be attracted to one another, and I like their scenes together very much.

            However, he's been written somewhat poorly and inconsistently lately. He's not shown as a very competent super spy like he is supposed to be, and that upsets me greatly. They are just not giving the actor enough material to work with, but when they do, he delivers like in the first two eps. The character shone the best in those. In general I've like Brandon's work in all his eps. I thought his acting was very strong in Fake Name during the name reveal and in the fight with Chuck and on. He showed lots of emotion in it. Now, I just really want to see Shaw kicking some serious Ring ass. It's about time. My guess is that since they extended his arc from 4 to 8 eps, they had to somewhat drag his storyline. Well, it's lacking. But I heard that the climax to his arc is really something. So I guess I better be patient... sigh
            Last edited by blueyes; 03-09-2010, 09:32 PM.

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            • #7
              blueyes, no one expect Shaw to make goofy faces. i for one just want him to be in character, but it is hard to do when the writers don't seem sure what the character really is.

              i agree with you that Shaw's core should be "cocky, commanding, mysterious, morally ambiguous and all business." That is how Shaw is like in the first couple of episodes. And he was GREAT.

              But after the plane episode, Shaw started the romancing Sarah plot line, i didn't see any cocky, commanding not to mention definitely not all business. So what happened to the character?

              I am with you that Shaw's inconsistent character is the result of bad writing. because the writers' flipflop, it probably caused Brandon some confusion in how to approach this change in his character. After all, being a mysterious character probably means being mysterious to Brandon as well.

              But it's on screen and it's canon. I can only hope the future episodes will not repeat this error.

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              • #8
                The thing that bugs me is that I really liked him in the first couple episodes, now I'm not a very big fan of Shaw. If his arc ends really well, then I'll conclude that it was because his arc was stretched an extra 4 episodes.

                The reason he came off creepy to me was the neck kissing in "vs. the Mask." And though the relationship with Sarah makes sense to me, I just feel like it was poorly executed and it took away from his spy badassedness. He started off by shooting himself to deceive The Ring, now he's talking about desserts being contained within desserts.

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                • #9
                  Shaw and Sarah are attracted because their hot people. Sarah doesn't love Shaw. She's being her usual self, a hot guy comes along and she pounces. Thanks to the writing from CF and JS.

                  Its not romantic.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Kryptonian250
                    She's being her usual self, a hot guy comes along and she pounces.
                    huh? i haven't gotten that vibe at all....

                    i guess it's true that Sarah made out with some pretty good looking people.... but i blame that on the casting director :P

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Kryptonian250
                      Shaw and Sarah are attracted because their hot people. Sarah doesn't love Shaw. She's being her usual self, a hot guy comes along and she pounces. Thanks to the writing from CF and JS.

                      Its not romantic.
                      It's a TV show, they're obviously going to cast attractive love interests for their main characters. I would agree she doesn't love Shaw, but I'd say there's a little more to it than "we're both attractive, let's do it"

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by hansioux
                        blueyes, no one expect Shaw to make goofy faces. i for one just want him to be in character, but it is hard to do when the writers don't seem sure what the character really is.

                        i agree with you that Shaw's core should be "cocky, commanding, mysterious, morally ambiguous and all business." That is how Shaw is like in the first couple of episodes. And he was GREAT.

                        But after the plane episode, Shaw started the romancing Sarah plot line, i didn't see any cocky, commanding not to mention definitely not all business. So what happened to the character?

                        I am with you that Shaw's inconsistent character is the result of bad writing. because the writers' flipflop, it probably caused Brandon some confusion in how to approach this change in his character. After all, being a mysterious character probably means being mysterious to Brandon as well.

                        But it's on screen and it's canon. I can only hope the future episodes will not repeat this error.
                        I don't see how him romancing a beautiful woman is so out of character. This is still a SPY COMEDY, remember? It's not supposed to be taken so seriuously. And they say that spys are not supposed to fall in love, BUT they always do, starting with Sarah falling for Chuck. Now that was bad because she was his handler and he the asset, she was supposed to protect him. At least Shaw and Sarah are equals. Can you see the double standard in your reasoning? Unless you never had a problem with Sarah falling for Chuck, not sure.

                        Oh and he was definitely cocky and commanding, especially on The Mask, imo. Even Casey respects him now. Shaw is just the strong and quiet type of spy, I think. I like him. He's a more serious and subtle character. He's still an enigma. And I agree that it's about time we learned his true agenda. Hope the writers deliver...

                        My problem is that they don't write Shaw as a very competent spy like he is supposed to be. Him falling for Sarah, I have no problem with, it fits the universe they've created. They loooove angst. And yes, he's mostly all business, you're right. haha


                        [QUOTE=smeyer44;6123872]
                        The thing that bugs me is that I really liked him in the first couple episodes, now I'm not a very big fan of Shaw.
                        Maybe we're not supposed to like him much?


                        If his arc ends really well, then I'll conclude that it was because his arc was stretched an extra 4 episodes.
                        Maybe. As a fan of The Mask and Fake Name, I've had no big problems with his characterization or Brandons' work; the only thing that annoys me is that he isn't shown as badass as they want us to believe he is.


                        The reason he came off creepy to me was the neck kissing in "vs. the Mask." And though the relationship with Sarah makes sense to me, I just feel like it was poorly executed and it took away from his spy badassedness.
                        Man, I just don't get you people. It's like we're watching a different show sometimes. To me the neck kissage was/is HELLA SEXY. And she soo liked it. To each their own.


                        He started off by shooting himself to deceive The Ring, now he's talking about desserts being contained within desserts.
                        People do/say silly, cheesy things when they're in love or like someone. It's nothing new. I thought it was a cute thing for him to say. It showed that he wasn't that cold a spy. *shrugs*


                        Originally posted by closetclana
                        This is the line that made me think it was just bad acting:

                        It's at 32:18 on Hulu. "Sorry Sarah, but you can't think of Chuck. You have to think like a spy."

                        When he said that line was the first time I thought to myself that this guy was a horrible actor. But now that I'm rewatching it, maybe it was bad writing - or a combination of the two.
                        Even the best of actors deliver lines in a poor way sometimes. That doesn't mean they're horrible actors. It's just that they're imperfect? Now, if they did it ALL the time then I guess they're horrible actors, lol.

                        That said, I''ve watched the ep several times and have no problem with his delivery in that scene. In fact, I think Brandon did a very good job actingwise in this ep, as he usually does to my tastes.
                        Last edited by blueyes; 03-15-2010, 12:59 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by blueyes
                          I don't see how him romancing a beautiful woman is so out of character. This is still a SPY COMEDY, remember? It's not supposed to be taken so seriuously. And they say that spys are not supposed to fall in love, BUT they always do, starting with Sarah falling for Chuck. Now that was bad because she was his handler and he the asset, she was supposed to protect him. At least Shaw and Sarah are equals. Can you see the double standard in your reasoning? Unless you never had a problem with Sarah falling for Chuck, not sure.
                          the difference is Sarah began to feel more for Chuck as she got to know him. Especially when she learns how Chuck cares for his family and friends. Chuck liked Sarah because she is hot, playful and charming and she came on to him, which isn't rocket science that Chuck would like her.

                          With the kind of trust Chuck and Sarah built up, it still took them a long time for Sarah to even tell her middle name to Chuck.

                          In Shaw and Sarah's case, like you said, Shaw is still a enigma, we don't know anything about his character except that his wife died. And suddenly Sarah is making out, telling her identity to Shaw? Why? because he brought her coffee and massaged her neck?

                          I am not saying this can't happen. But when it happens the way it's written and played on the screen, it damages Sarah's established character. And frankly doesn't do anything for Shaw's character, since he seems like a pompous yet some what incompetent spy.

                          As for Shaw being the quiet silent stern kind of spy, we already have Casey....

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by blueyes
                            I like the way he plays Shaw in Chuck; he's cocky, commanding, mysterious, morally ambiguous and all business. And yes, understated. He is the strong and silent type of spy. He's been hurt deeply and that's why he's usually on guard and distant.. well, not always, he is somewhat weak with Sarah. awww. haha. He also shows emotion with his face, but it's very subtle most of the time, which fits the character. If people expect him to do goofy faces a la Chuck, well, there are totally missing the point. Besides, Shaw has shown far more humanity than Casey so far, but people only criticize Shaw. Dumb and very biased, again.

                            I know some people say Shaw's creepy and that makes me laugh so hard because I just don't see that at all, and neither does my sister who doesn't read internet message boards, btw. I guess people just want to see what they want to see. I also think many hardcore C/S shippers HATE him so much because of his romantic connection with Sarah. They just can't take it, so they make up all kind of silly and absurd stuff about Shaw.

                            I like the Shaw/Sarah relationship. I totally get why they'd be attracted to one another, and I like their scenes together very much.

                            However, he's been written somewhat poorly and inconsistently lately. He's not shown as a very competent super spy like he is supposed to be, and that upsets me greatly. They are just not giving the actor enough material to work with, but when they do, he delivers like in the first two eps. The character shone the best in those. In general I've like Brandon's work in all his eps. I thought his acting was very strong in Fake Name during the name reveal and in the fight with Chuck and on. He showed lots of emotion in it. Now, I just really want to see Shaw kicking some serious Ring ass. It's about time. My guess is that since they extended his arc from 4 to 8 eps, they had to somewhat drag his storyline. Well, it's lacking. But I heard that the climax to his arc is really something. So I guess I better be patient... sigh
                            This bothers me a little... Obviously no one expects him to be like Chuck and Casey's emotionlessness is deliberate and completely in character... on Shaw... i think it's partly also cause we're not entirely sure what his character's supposed to be as well as the inconsistancy which i don't think is to do with the romance arc specifically but rather to do with the writing... I think it's as hansioux said, being a 'mysterious' character, the character is probably kinda mysterious to Brandon as well (cause sometimes they really don't tell the actors everything before hand) and that would effect his acting.

                            And I for one can barely stand the Sarah/Shaw ship, and it has nothing to do with Charah because since around mid s2-s3, I can barely stand the Charah ship too ... but i think Sarah is still hung up on Chuck but that's really not a reason to not like the ship for me most of the time... it just comes down to me, not feeling it. It's that simple... i think people forget that sometimes when they argue over ships and who likes what and why something is awesome or terrible, sometimes it's just a matter of not feeling it.

                            Generally i'm ok with Shaw but i do think his first two episodes were his strongest ones... i do however am a bit annoyed by the ring storyarc etc. being overshadowed by the romance, but this isn't just a problem with Shaw but kinda what's been happening with this show all the time... like for example the Cole/Sarah, happening during the Orion storyarc... Cole, now there's a character i really really can't stand.

                            Anyway, I'm all for a little less romance angst and a little more Shaw a$$kicking... in fact i would really really like to see Chuck and Shaw kicking a$$ together. That would be so awesome!

                            ----- Added 16 Minutes later -----

                            Originally posted by blueyes
                            Man, I just don't get you people. It's like we're watching a different show sometimes. To me the neck kissage was/is HELLA SEXY. And she soo liked it. To each their own.
                            I didn't think the neck thing was creepy... a little forward maybe but definitely not creepy. I am however not that into the way Shaw flirts, which adds to me not being that into Sarah/Shaw but i think that's a personal preference thing cause i just prefer guys like Chuck and that slightly tentative but cute/sweet and witty way he is when he flirts.

                            ----- Added 36 Minutes later -----

                            Originally posted by hansioux
                            In Shaw and Sarah's case, like you said, Shaw is still a enigma, we don't know anything about his character except that his wife died. And suddenly Sarah is making out, telling her identity to Shaw? Why? because he brought her coffee and massaged her neck?

                            I am not saying this can't happen. But when it happens the way it's written and played on the screen, it damages Sarah's established character. And frankly doesn't do anything for Shaw's character, since he seems like a pompous yet some what incompetent spy.

                            As for Shaw being the quiet silent stern kind of spy, we already have Casey....
                            Well i think the reason why Sarah openned up to Shaw is fairly clear, since she really did feel like she was losing Chuck at the time and he does seem like a good sturdy shoulder to cry on (well, he does to me anyway, even if he is still enigmatic) even if she didn't feel for him deeply yet. For me it was more a moment of weakness for Sarah than anything else, and definitely not because of the coffee or massage but Shaw is kinda at least shown to be trying to be there for her even a little bit in a moment where she really can't open up to Chuck because a lot of her anguish is about him... and she certainly can't talk to Casey.

                            It made sense for me what Sarah did, and the moment of weakness i think just made her more human... and really, apart from Chuck she's always been the most sentimental character on the show (even if she tries not to be).

                            On the 'incompetant' part i think that might not be intentional on the writer's part. Like i said above, i'm really hoping to see Shaw and Chuck kick a$$ together at some point.

                            It'd almost make up for them not letting Kristin Kreuk kick any a$$ on the show even though I really really love KK's fight scenes... and if KK gets a role in that sitcom, looks like i might not be seeing her fight in that... unless she and whoever's playing her character's husband is a making a more, shall we say unconventional couple than I thought.

                            Also, i don't think Shaw could be compared to Casey. I think they're very different types. Casey's 'quiet silent stern' is meant to be played for laughs against Chuck, he's all about gruffness and deadpan humour. I think Shaw is supposed to be more James Bond like.
                            Last edited by Daddylion; 03-17-2010, 03:56 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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