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  • #46
    Just a reminder, for the 60th time this weekend, talking about other fans or the forum itself is not cool.

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    • #47
      ....Yes. The only person I see doing that at this point is Oliver because she's actually letting him in.
      The better question would be, why is Oliver the only person she is letting in?

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by umm
        The better question would be, why is Oliver the only person she is letting in?
        Read my second post. I state there that Chloe's distancing herself away from Clark because of an irrational reaction (IMO) to what Clark refused to do for her in Savior which was compounded with Clark having his own crisis last season where he detached himself from humanity.

        She doesn't trust Clark anymore and now she's the one who is detaching herself.

        If Clark knew what was going on with Chloe emotionally, he would help her, but he doesn't know. He cannot read minds or hearts and Chloe is keeping him and everyone else in the dark about her emotional state.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Hopefulsuicide
          This episode has opened my eyes a bit.

          I've been so wrapped up in how much I love the idea of Chlollie that I have been ignoring my own feelings about Chloe's character in general. But this episode really brought it home for me just how much Chloe's mental state is deteriorating.

          And why?

          Mainly because of Clark.

          Chloe, for day one, was set up as the girl with the unrequited love. It's always been about Chloe's pain and yearning.

          Then when she learned his secret, it became about her loyalty. Her trustworthyness. She was always there for Clark, always the one he could call on.

          And when she got a Superpower, she really felt that she could always save him. It was insanely dangerous (probably causing some damage to the brain every time), but she knew that no matter what happened shed never be powerless to stop it.

          After a while, Clark began taking Chloe for granted. His own personal Google. We all got annoyed. But then we got this shining ray of hope in the idea of 'Watchtower'. Chloe not just being Clark's lapdog, but actually being the eyes and ears of Superheros in general. Using everything she has learned to help people who might actually appreciate it.

          But it stalled. The writers didn't focus on the JL. They focused on Veritas instead. And Chloe's character became almost pointless. The only thing I remember her doing in season 7 was getting attacked by Brainiac.

          And look at what that did to her. She got a Brainiac brain upgrade. Was granted an intelligence not meant for humans. That's got to have warped her way of thinking a bit. Of course, removing it and erasing her memory also altered things.

          Then comes Davis, a lovely guy that she is very confused about, who she tries desperately to save. She cleaned up blood and body parts for him because she thought that his life was worth saving, and because she wanted to protect Clark from having to deal with it in a way that would jepordise his moral code. Everyone turned against her because she did this.

          And after all that, can no one else understand why loosing Jimmy would have pushed her over the edge?

          The one person who DID appreciate her. The one person who loved her, so simply, just because she was Chloe. No matter what she did, no matter whether she felt the same or not, he loved her. And as annoying as I found their relationship at the time, when I look back at the scene where he gives her watchtower, I really start to understand how broken she must have been by his death.

          And who was there to comfort her? No one.

          Not Lois, obviously because she was in the future. Not Olly, or any of the JL because they disbanded after Jimmy died, blaming themselves for his death. Not Clark... because Clark decided to become a solitary hero.

          She dealt with all that grief for her husband, the one simple sweet thing in her life, and not one person helped her with that. Not one of her friends even stopped by.

          So why the hell are people calling her a villain?

          She was so scared to sleep at night, she bought a gun. To keep herself from going insane, she spent all her time looking for her cousin, as well as calling Olly hoping he would pick up.

          She had to harden. When she got everyone back, she found a way to make sure she was never left to helpless and alone again. She started spying on them. Keeping them close to her in the only secure way she could.

          When Lois, Clark, Olly and the JL all came back together, she didn't once express how lonely she must have been. How hurt she must have been that not one of them was there for her. She just took it on the chin, pushed it all way day, and gets on with it because saving the world is, in some ways, easier than dealing with that kind of pain.

          Chloe has a store of kryptonite weapons. And we're surprised by this why?


          So, anyway, everyone else feel free to vent if you have anything to add
          I agree with you Idk why everyone is hating on Chloe, she has done nothing wrong THANKS SO MUCH I hope others can see your perspective I just want others to see and justify what and why Chloe is doing things

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Hopefulsuicide
            This episode has opened my eyes a bit.

            I've been so wrapped up in how much I love the idea of Chlollie that I have been ignoring my own feelings about Chloe's character in general. But this episode really brought it home for me just how much Chloe's mental state is deteriorating.

            And why?

            Mainly because of Clark.

            Chloe, for day one, was set up as the girl with the unrequited love. It's always been about Chloe's pain and yearning.

            Then when she learned his secret, it became about her loyalty. Her trustworthyness. She was always there for Clark, always the one he could call on.

            And when she got a Superpower, she really felt that she could always save him. It was insanely dangerous (probably causing some damage to the brain every time), but she knew that no matter what happened shed never be powerless to stop it.

            After a while, Clark began taking Chloe for granted. His own personal Google. We all got annoyed. But then we got this shining ray of hope in the idea of 'Watchtower'. Chloe not just being Clark's lapdog, but actually being the eyes and ears of Superheros in general. Using everything she has learned to help people who might actually appreciate it.

            But it stalled. The writers didn't focus on the JL. They focused on Veritas instead. And Chloe's character became almost pointless. The only thing I remember her doing in season 7 was getting attacked by Brainiac.

            And look at what that did to her. She got a Brainiac brain upgrade. Was granted an intelligence not meant for humans. That's got to have warped her way of thinking a bit. Of course, removing it and erasing her memory also altered things.

            Then comes Davis, a lovely guy that she is very confused about, who she tries desperately to save. She cleaned up blood and body parts for him because she thought that his life was worth saving, and because she wanted to protect Clark from having to deal with it in a way that would jepordise his moral code. Everyone turned against her because she did this.

            And after all that, can no one else understand why loosing Jimmy would have pushed her over the edge?

            The one person who DID appreciate her. The one person who loved her, so simply, just because she was Chloe. No matter what she did, no matter whether she felt the same or not, he loved her. And as annoying as I found their relationship at the time, when I look back at the scene where he gives her watchtower, I really start to understand how broken she must have been by his death.

            And who was there to comfort her? No one.

            Not Lois, obviously because she was in the future. Not Olly, or any of the JL because they disbanded after Jimmy died, blaming themselves for his death. Not Clark... because Clark decided to become a solitary hero.

            She dealt with all that grief for her husband, the one simple sweet thing in her life, and not one person helped her with that. Not one of her friends even stopped by.

            So why the hell are people calling her a villain?

            She was so scared to sleep at night, she bought a gun. To keep herself from going insane, she spent all her time looking for her cousin, as well as calling Olly hoping he would pick up.

            She had to harden. When she got everyone back, she found a way to make sure she was never left to helpless and alone again. She started spying on them. Keeping them close to her in the only secure way she could.

            When Lois, Clark, Olly and the JL all came back together, she didn't once express how lonely she must have been. How hurt she must have been that not one of them was there for her. She just took it on the chin, pushed it all way day, and gets on with it because saving the world is, in some ways, easier than dealing with that kind of pain.

            Chloe has a store of kryptonite weapons. And we're surprised by this why?


            So, anyway, everyone else feel free to vent if you have anything to add
            I COMPLETELY COMPLETELY COMPLETELY AGREE ABOUT TIME WE HAD THE TRUTH ABOUT CHLOE when i read this everything you said totally agreed upon im so glad you brung this up about chloe thank you! hopefully everyone sees our perspective on chloe and sees why she does things the way she does

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by kneel4justice
              I agree with you Idk why everyone is hating on Chloe, she has done nothing wrong
              Chloe HAS done plenty of things wrong. However, there are some people who can UNDERSTAND where she is coming from and why she's doing the things she can. Some can even excuse her yet others cannot.

              Comment


              • #52
                RE: I am angry on Chloe's behalf because...

                [QUOTE=Hopefulsuicide;6087808]Just re watched Savior... think I just realised something.

                >> The moment he refused to save Jimmy, is the moment the Chlark friendship ended, and she started treating him as just another part of her superhero help obsession. She doesn't spend any time with him socially anymore, the only time they even speak is if he needs something, or wants to know something.

                Agreed. I think this was the turning point for the Chlark relationship as well, although it was very sad to see given the 8-plus years they've going through together .

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Ella
                  Read my second post. I state there that Chloe's distancing herself away from Clark because of an irrational reaction (IMO) to what Clark refused to do for her in Savior which was compounded with Clark having his own crisis last season where he detached himself from humanity.

                  She doesn't trust Clark anymore and now she's the one who is detaching herself.

                  If Clark knew what was going on with Chloe emotionally, he would help her, but he doesn't know. He cannot read minds or hearts and Chloe is keeping him and everyone else in the dark about her emotional state.
                  I'd simply add that I believe Chloe views Clark differently since he left. Just as Clark lost faith in humanity, once he returned, Chloe lost faith in Clark. What I don't think Chloe, with all her smarts, realizes is that Clark refused to reverse Jimmy's death out of fear that Lois, Oliver, Chloe or anyone else would die in his place. The fact that Jimmy died was because Clark allowed the future to be altered by not letting Chloe die when she was infected by Brainiac and instead had the Legion "cure" her. Had she died, Davis would never have been jealous of Jimmy because the Chlavis relationship would not have gotten as strong as it did after Legion.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Read my second post. I state there that Chloe's distancing herself away from Clark because of an irrational reaction (IMO) to what Clark refused to do for her in Savior which was compounded with Clark having his own crisis last season where he detached himself from humanity.
                    She doesn't trust Clark anymore and now she's the one who is detaching herself.
                    If Clark knew what was going on with Chloe emotionally, he would help her, but he doesn't know. He cannot read minds or hearts and Chloe is keeping him and everyone else in the dark about her emotional state.
                    True, no one can read minds! That is why we take the time to talk to our friends! We take them out to dinner, see a movie at their place, or simply have them over for a visit at the house where we can chat about the day slowly leading up to a more serious conversation about ones troubles, problems and issues!
                    Has Clark done that? He knows full well, that one thing will remain the same about Chloe, no matter how old she may get, she will never tell you her troubles unless you ask her point blanck or pressure her out of fear of burdening you, especially if that said person is a hero, who already has enough on their plate!
                    It was always up to Clark to ask her, and hey it shouldn't be too much to ask after all those years worth of help she provided him! Not just with saving the day, but also with his Lana woes! Yet this year he has decided that it wouldbe best to cut her out of his life, fine it's his perogative, but then how can he even come up with the notion of telling her to 'have his back'!
                    It's true that Chloe is disatncing herself, but that's because he has hurt her emotionally time and time again! Especially this year, treating her as a search engin, not as a human being, so of course it's easier to keep him at an distance!
                    Last edited by umm; 02-27-2010, 11:00 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      I completely agree with the orignal poster. I'm glad you posted all that. Chloe needs a break.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Sorry, but I have a hard time liking Chloe anymore. I think it happened last season when she turned from Jimmy and went towards Davis. That first hug in the hospital when Jimmy was watching through the blinds. She definately was attracted to Davis and it wasn't all for Clark that she went off with Davis. When Jimmy was killed she all of a sudden did a turn around and she was in love with Jimmy and Davis was just a means to an end and now she is in the state she is in because of Jimmy's death. I just can't buy it. I wish I could but it wasn't believable for me. I can't find the sympathy for her as she made her own bed and now is blaming everyone else for her actions. Unless Chloe does a turn around and starts acting like a team member instead of a babysitter, I can't go along with her actions in the name of Watchtower.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by umm
                          True, no one can read minds! That is why we take the time to talk to our friends!
                          THAT is the problem. Chloe has NOT talked to Clark or even intimated that she is going through some emotional/mental problem.


                          Has Clark done that?
                          We saw Clark at the end of Metallo talking to Chloe about what he had gone through. SHE could have in turn told him how she was feeling but she didn't do that. So the opportunity to communicate for Chloe was there in at least that one moment, but Chloe didn't take the opportunity.

                          But one doesn't need a formal meeting with a friend to let them know that something is wrong. Any time is the right time to let someone know that you are going through a rough situation that you are afraid may be taking you to a dangerous place.

                          The responsibility of dealing with her emotiona/mental problems falls on CHLOE and Chloe only. Clark may be her friend but he's not responsible for her and he cannot help Chloe if she doesn't open up or let him know what's going on.



                          He knows full well, that one thing will remain the same about Chloe, no matter how old she may get, she will never tell you her troubles unless you ask her point blanck or pressure her out of fear of burdening you, especially if that said person is a hero, who already has enough on their plate!
                          How does he know that? Chloe didn't have a problem gonig to Clark and BURDENING him by asking him to reverse time to save Jimmy. How is that less burdensome then Chloe simply asking Clark to hear her out as she explains her emotional situation?



                          It was always up to Clark to ask her,
                          How does that make any sense, though? Chloe is an adult and you're saying that she cannot take responsibility for her own emotional well being and instead must wait for Clark to approach her? Why?

                          Chloe has closed herself off and is not showing herself to be in need and has not open herself up to Clark in terms of what is bothering her right now. Clark cannot be expected to "fix" a problem that he has no idea exists!


                          and hey it shouldn't be too much to ask after all those years worth of help she provided him!
                          Read the above. Clark cannot fix a problem he's unaware above.

                          However, I'd also add that the flip side of what you have stated is that Clark has been there for Chloe every single time she needed him in the past with the exception of the Doomsday episode (which is when he was going through his OWN crisis).

                          So why can't Chloe go to Clark and rationalize that just because Clark let her down (in her mind) *one* time that it does not erase the countless time he has NOT let her down and has been there for him?


                          Yet this year he has decided that it wouldbe best to cut her out of his life,
                          He cut her off AND the entire world for a few weeks. That's it. He's not cutting Chloe out of his life right now.


                          but then how can he even come up with the notion of telling her to 'have his back'!
                          For the same reason that Clark will always have Chloe's back. Because that's what friends do and Clark still views Chloe as a friend.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by devilneedsaride
                            You know, I would actually really love to see Chloe break down. A scene where Clark confronts her about all her kinda-iffy behavior, and says something insightful (it could happen!) about Jimmy that pokes her in just the right place, and she screams at him for refusing to save him and collapses into sobs and apologies before starting the dealing process and eventually becoming more dimensional again. Because she does feel very shut off, and I would definitely buy the "can't deal with Jimmy's passing" angle as a reason for, well, season 9 Chloe.
                            Me too. I think it'd be a brilliant emotional moment.

                            Originally posted by Wicked Lois
                            Well... the towers were a solid investment for the city economy and many people lost their jobs when mister Kent decided to burn down the solar power. So there we go.
                            good point

                            Originally posted by Jack-El49
                            I agree, Nora - totally! I might add that Chloe actually admitting she had a huge part in Jimmy dying wouldn't hurt either. Last night, all I heard from Chloe was that Clark was to blame for Doomsday when she was the one harboring him, cleaning up after him, lying to Clark about him, and interfering in Clark sending Davis to the PZ. Yep, it's all Clark's fault.

                            (I did read your post Becky - I just don't subscribe to the inference that to grieve properly, Chloe needs Clark's shoulder to cry on.)

                            Actually, I'm glad that Oliver took away her kryptonite weapons and will oversee their security.
                            First episode of the season, when Chloe asked Clark to go back and save him, she said 'he did because of what WE did'.

                            I think the whole doomsday situation was so complicated, with basically everyone betraying everyone, that it had a massive effect on how the characters felt about each other and what they now feel they owe each other... which is apparently not a lot.

                            I personally don't think Jimmy's death is Clark's fault. I'm not even sure why he does. But I do think that Chloe's state of mind right now IS his fault, and a result of having no one to help her.

                            No, she didn't need Clark's shoulder to grieve. But when you've just lost your husband, are you honestly saying that being abandonded by everyone else straight after isn't going to push you over the edge?

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              I stopped reading after the line about Chloe's idiocy being Clark's fault

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Dyanara
                                I stopped reading after the line about Chloe's idiocy being Clark's fault
                                funny. If there's an idiot on the show, it wouldn't be Chloe.

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