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Something's not right: Oliver jumps into bed after stealing black-k?

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  • #31
    A combat trained green arror person couldn't lift a 5'5 guy above his head? Find better proof.

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    • #32
      The way he lifted him? No way. The way he lifted him was like a rag doll. I've seen people being pressed like that by people with much more muscle than the relatively scrawny Green Arrow, and it took more of an effort than what I saw. The way he lifted him was like a mannequin or dummy, not a 150+ lb guy. They never once showed Green Arrow lifting anyone till Injustice. It took more effort by beings with superhuman strength like Titan & Aldar to lift Clark than it did for GA to lift Parasite.

      ----- Added 8 Minutes later -----

      Then again, when Lois as Stiletto came crashing through the skylight and kicked Ricky in the face, he went flying 15 feet across the room, so I shouldn't believe anything that I see in this show because it's just so damn inconsistent & BS.
      Last edited by xrayvision; 05-10-2009, 05:09 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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      • #33
        I don't believe it.
        First, how can nobody notice...at all.
        Second, like it's said before Lex wouldn't know all the codes and everything that went down with the JL.
        Also, why bother with all the "Green Arrow" stuff, he could just go and steal it, it's his safe and his mansion after all.
        You're thinking too much, and trying to excuse Oliver from his bad judgment in the past episodes.
        Also, you say that Lexoliver it's the one that blow that truck, but if this it's true, why he would go to meet Chloe in the Isis Fundation, how he could know that Chloe was the one the killed Sebastian, and he didn't seem surprised at the mention of Brainiac (something Lex would have been).
        Oliver was nervous of the Lex subject, because he (believe) killed Lex, there is nothing more than that to it.
        In the Bizarro situation you could see the little things, the most important was that "Clark" supposedly return from the fortress but his clothes were different, in a single episode they let you know Clark wasn't himself. There the Bizarro cliffhanger wasn't so crazy.
        Oliver jumped in the bed, for two reason:
        -He was horny/ he isn't serious enough.
        -There wasn't another inmediate solution.

        If we tried to get out like the GA, somebody would try to stop him, and I believe anyone would prefiere the option than deals with less fights. He was naked, because he take off his entire costume, there is also the part when he carried Tess, Oliver style.
        Also when he and Clark discuss the team dealing with murders, and Clark told him a (Super) lecture, he looked somewhat thorn, like he regretted his actions (and after all the "We set an example" speech was epic), if he really would Lex in disguise he would just smile or something else.

        The reason Oliver fight Tess (shot her) in Bloodline it's simple, she caught him in the suit, it isn't like he could undress and she wouldn't have notice. That's why he fought.

        Look, I don't like the Oliver in murder spree either, but we have to accept that that's the way the showrunners are doing things, and they tried to make the evolution from good Oliver to Crazy ass, I'll kill if you even dress like bad guy Oliver, somewhat believable.

        See, I don't want to sound like I'm insulting you or something like that, I only disagree entirely with this theory, but I have to tell you that it's interesting, and if you were the showrunner, and if you would have put more energy in setting this storyline maybe it could have work. It's somewhat really imaginative, if only we could have seen more things than could support this I could agree with you.

        Any how, maybe you should write a fanfic or something with this idea, I would read it no doubt, if you do PM me. I could help if you want.

        P.S: I'm sorry for the bad grammar, english is not my nativ languaje. I'm really sorry for all the wrong spelled words.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by LJ-90
          Also, you say that Lexoliver it's the one that blow that truck, but if this it's true, why he would go to meet Chloe in the Isis Fundation, how he could know that Chloe was the one the killed Sebastian, and he didn't seem surprised at the mention of Brainiac (something Lex would have been).
          Well, I always thought it was weird that Oliver would have nothing else better to do than watch hospital security footage to see Chloe kill Sebastian. Oliver has better things to do and had nothing against Chloe at the time to want to spy on her or get evidence for blackmail. She killed Sebastian before Oliver saw that she was involved in things she shouldn't be---Bloodline (when he mentioned to Clark what Chloe did with the crystal and told him to make her stop). Maybe you're right & he started doing some checking on Chloe after what he saw her do in Bloodline and saw her killing Sebastian in the security video archive.

          But Lex not being surprised about the mention of Brainiac could be due to learning about the name from someone. He did find out about kryptonite even though he supposedly forgot about its effects as he learned in Oracle from Lana. He definitely learned a lot more, and would have learned a great deal if he was posing around as Oliver for a long time.

          Oliver was nervous of the Lex subject, because he (believe) killed Lex, there is nothing more than that to it.
          Given the simplicity of the writers & their inability to actually create an interesting plot like the one suggested, I think that these things will just go unexplained since they really don't care about explaining what they're showing. I just find it very odd for Oliver to go from the personality he had at the end of episodes like Identity & Bloodline where you could see his mind was at the right place to his actions in Requiem. It's not impossible that it was Lex and he got nervous because the subject of the conversation came to the very thing Lex would be trying to conceal. If it was Lex, he could have been nervous that Clark uncoveredand was about to reveal evidence that showed that the real Lex didn't die in the explosion.

          In the Bizarro situation you could see the little things, the most important was that "Clark" supposedly return from the fortress but his clothes were different, in a single episode they let you know Clark wasn't himself. There the Bizarro cliffhanger wasn't so crazy.
          Oliver jumped in the bed, for two reason:
          -He was horny/ he isn't serious enough.
          -There wasn't another inmediate solution.
          I definitely picked up on the things in Gemini that who they were trying to pass off as Clark was really Bizarro because I noticed similar things in Knight Rider's season 4 premiere. If Oliver being horny gets in the way of his "heroics" then I think the Green Arrow is even a sorrier excuse for a hero than I did before. And there certainly was another solution--escaping with the black-k & shooting down everyone in his way like he did in Bloodline.

          If we tried to get out like the GA, somebody would try to stop him, and I believe anyone would prefiere the option than deals with less fights. He was naked, because he take off his entire costume, there is also the part when he carried Tess, Oliver style.
          Also when he and Clark discuss the team dealing with murders, and Clark told him a (Super) lecture, he looked somewhat thorn, like he regretted his actions (and after all the "We set an example" speech was epic), if he really would Lex in disguise he would just smile or something else.
          Like I said, he got in & left in Bloodline without being stopped and the case with the frequency generator was a lot bigger than the case with the black-k. If it's really Lex, he wouldn't want to give things away and put up too much resistance to Clark, but just roll with it.

          The reason Oliver fight Tess (shot her) in Bloodline it's simple, she caught him in the suit, it isn't like he could undress and she wouldn't have notice. That's why he fought.
          Why not do it here again? Why jeopardize the entire operation? What if a mansion staff member found the supposed stashed away Green Arrow costume? I know this will certainly just be a plothole because the writers can't come up with a great storyline tying Lex to Oliver, Tess, Clark, and Zatanna. It would be too cool to come up with a great plot like this that from now can explain Lex's return at the end of the series.

          Look, I don't like the Oliver in murder spree either, but we have to accept that that's the way the showrunners are doing things, and they tried to make the evolution from good Oliver to Crazy ass, I'll kill if you even dress like bad guy Oliver, somewhat believable.
          I agree. The showrunners unfortunately can't come up with great storylines anymore that set up Lex's future return. I'm sure if we see Lex back, it will have a ridiculous & contrived explanation to it like that unnecessarily complicated release of Zod from the Phantom Zone that we got in Vessel.

          See, I don't want to sound like I'm insulting you or something like that, I only disagree entirely with this theory, but I have to tell you that it's interesting, and if you were the showrunner, and if you would have put more energy in setting this storyline maybe it could have work. It's somewhat really imaginative, if only we could have seen more things than could support this I could agree with you.
          No problem. I never thought you were insulting me. My problem is that the creativity & imagination factor of the show is no longer there. Instead they just throw things at the viewers that are completely unexplained. Like that black crystal from Solitude for instance. That crystal was part of Brainiac and contained his programming. We know this because it did the same thing to the Fortress when it was placed in the crystal console in Solitude that the knife from the crystal console did when Clark threw it at Brainiac in Vessel. So it should have disappeared like the rest of Brainiac (Milton Fine & the Black Ship) did in Solitude. Instead, Clark pulled it out of nowhere in Beast. Perhaps it was recreated in Abyss when the Fortress turned all black, but the way Clark spoke about it doesn't make that seem likely. If that crystal was important enough to bring back, why couldn't the showrunners show its return? Instead we saw it out of nowhere after more than 3 years. It doesn't even make sense why Clark would keep something that dangerous around.

          Any how, maybe you should write a fanfic or something with this idea, I would read it no doubt, if you do PM me. I could help if you want.
          Thanks, but I have other fanfics that I have to finish writing that I'm much more interested in finishing after the last one I wrote almost 2 years ago.

          P.S: I'm sorry for the bad grammar, english is not my nativ languaje. I'm really sorry for all the wrong spelled words.
          You did a pretty good job.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by xrayvision
            The way he lifted him? No way. The way he lifted him was like a rag doll. I've seen people being pressed like that by people with much more muscle than the relatively scrawny Green Arrow, and it took more of an effort than what I saw. The way he lifted him was like a mannequin or dummy, not a 150+ lb guy. They never once showed Green Arrow lifting anyone till Injustice. It took more effort by beings with superhuman strength like Titan & Aldar to lift Clark than it did for GA to lift Parasite.
            The average hieght of a 5'5 guy with a small frame is more around 135lbs. Im slightly heavier but around the same hieght myself. If i got a video of one of my mates throwing me in the same way would that prove it to ya?

            GA isnt scrawny. Pretty big biceps by the looks of it.

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            • #36
              The writers would never make a plot like this, I'm sorry OP but I don't think it is going to happen.

              Why would Lex as Oliver be hanging around Oliver's office? What if Oliver came in?

              I just think instead of causing a conflict, he just wanted to get away easily, which is what he did. After all, pissing off Tess as the Green Arrow wouldn't be a great idea, since she would then spend every waking moment trying to hunt him down. The GA doesn't want that sort of attention.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by MetroGirl06
                Heh, the writers aren't that clever.
                I agree with you. It was just poor writing having Oliver waiting in Tess's bedroom after stealing the black kryptonite, & it's too much to hope there is a deeper plot involved. I'm sure Lex isn't really dead, & there is likely to be cloning involved, but I don't think this theory about the Lex/Oliver disguise will hold true.

                ----- Added 3 Minutes later -----

                Originally posted by xrayvision
                Another thing I found to be off is Oliver picking up Parasite above his head. Oliver is not strong enough to do that. Perhaps he is taking some type of strength enhancer, or maybe this is another sign that who they show as Oliver isn't really him 100% of the time and that they could be showing us Oliver & Lex. I wouldn't put it past Lex to use strength enhancers.

                There have just been too many things off. Oliver is typically a pacificist who doesn't kill. A huge part of me still thinks there's more going on than meets the eye.
                Oliver's no Bruce Wayne, but he is stronger than he looks. I think his bow is supposed to have something like a 300 lb pull weight--that's why the arrows can penetrate steel & concrete.
                Last edited by dunkman; 05-11-2009, 07:28 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by 27CDruid
                  The average hieght of a 5'5 guy with a small frame is more around 135lbs. Im slightly heavier but around the same hieght myself. If i got a video of one of my mates throwing me in the same way would that prove it to ya?

                  GA isnt scrawny. Pretty big biceps by the looks of it.
                  I don't consider his biceps big. They're bigger than average, but nothing like some wrestlers I've seen, who have much bigger muscles than his and still can't lift someone with that sort of ease. It's much harder to lift a human than a barbell (dead weight) of the same weight. The lift looked too fake--it was obvious he picked up a dummy and not the actual actor (or at beast the actor was on some sort of harness to lift him up).

                  But like I said, I'm willing to concede this point for the pure fact that we have seen ridiculous scenes like this before, like when Lois kicked Ricky in the face as she fell through the skylight in Stiletto and he flew 20 feet across the room. This scene with Ollie was of the same caliber, but not as fake as that one.

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                  • #39
                    Guys, there isn't 2 Olivers. lol

                    He just didn't want to risk the hallway, when he knew Tess was coming.

                    Also, he's Oliver, and he wanted to get laid.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by sithius
                      The writers would never make a plot like this, I'm sorry OP but I don't think it is going to happen.

                      Why would Lex as Oliver be hanging around Oliver's office? What if Oliver came in?

                      I just think instead of causing a conflict, he just wanted to get away easily, which is what he did. After all, pissing off Tess as the Green Arrow wouldn't be a great idea, since she would then spend every waking moment trying to hunt him down. The GA doesn't want that sort of attention.
                      Well, Tess has a lot bigger things on her mind, though he doesn't know that.

                      Also, Lex could have had a GPS chip embedded in the real Oliver while he was in the hospital in Requiem. Anyway, I'm just entertaining this idea to show that it would be a cool way to keep Lex involved and bring him back realistically instead of having some inexplicable contrived, overly-complicated, non-sensical storyline if/when he returns like they did with so many things. I know that the writers would never be smart enough to actually sow the seeds of Lex's return from now.

                      ----- Added 33 Minutes later -----

                      Originally posted by ZeoVGM
                      Guys, there isn't 2 Olivers. lol

                      He just didn't want to risk the hallway, when he knew Tess was coming.

                      Also, he's Oliver, and he wanted to get laid.
                      I just find that to be piss poor writing and/or reasoning on Oliver's part when he had an entire arsenal & could have probably gotten out a window without being detected. I mean seriously, what kind of hero disrobes & jumps into bed when the going gets tough?
                      Last edited by xrayvision; 05-12-2009, 12:41 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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                      • #41
                        IMO these theories are grasping at straws BIG TIME. I disagree that it was poor writing..simply he didn't have time and he was just being Playboy Oliver. You can "what if" the whole show, but this is how the writers presented it to us and wasn't far-fetched at all...

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                        • #42
                          I just find it funny how he calls himself a hero let alone a superhero after being such a coward. What would a kid who was reading a comic book of the Green Arrow or some other superhero say if they saw him jumping into bed because the heat was on? And there was no pressure on him, at least nothing even close to what we usually see. That had to be one of the most retarded scenes I've ever seen. It ranks up there with that pointless helicopter scene in Gone. Even that scene made more sense.

                          I'm a fan of the comics, and it's an insult to me to see what I saw in that scene. At least I could care less about the Green Arrow. The best thing is if Clark banishes him from Metropolis. In my opinion he already overstayed his welcome back in Sneeze. It angers me how they can bring a non-Metropolis based clown on this show in a costume instead of giving Metropolis' own hero a pre-Superman costume so we can have the real hero get his long deserved spotlight. This is a perfect example of what I call gimmicks to take the spotlight off Clark and to ooh & ahh the fans. Instead, it just pisses off fans of this show who got into it in the early seasons because we believed it to be a show about Clark becoming Superman. That clearly isn't the case anymore. They could have elongated the show without such unneeded distractions. There are so many things we should have seen development-wise that we didn't.
                          Last edited by xrayvision; 05-12-2009, 01:12 AM.

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                          • #43
                            You're entitled to your interpretation, but it isn't far-fetched at all..seeing that he played on Tess in an earlier scene. He isn't just playing GA...he's also playing a playboy billionaire. Also, you can't expect much from SV..these writers aren't DC writers and simply trying their best, and have made a fair representation...not to mention their own interpretation

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                            • #44
                              Yeah, I get what you're saying. These writers probably have to please some sexual initiative the network has forced them to adhere to, especially with Dawn Ostroff's goals. I heard that Al/Miles were forced into doing Thirst in season 5. It's a shame if the network has gained so much control of Smallville. I could easily understand why DC won't allow Batman to ever be on this or any show.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by xrayvision
                                The way he lifted him? No way. The way he lifted him was like a rag doll. I've seen people being pressed like that by people with much more muscle than the relatively scrawny Green Arrow, and it took more of an effort than what I saw. The way he lifted him was like a mannequin or dummy, not a 150+ lb guy.
                                Whiping someone into the air is much less taxing than slowly lifting them in a vertical collection. He may have had the benefit of momentum. Plus its 135lbs.

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