Lex = Oliver Clone?

[hopeless]

Oliver is Lex?

Besides the conceptual reasons I think Ollie could be Lex, look at the lighting in that cut to him. There's more there than just a sad Oliver. The light cuts away a lot of his face, downturned, looking slightly sinister.

This is why at first I thought oh, Oliver crossed a line and now he's becoming like Lex. Well what if that's because he actually is Lex?

Did they explain How Oliver even knew there was a bomb because there didn't seem anything to warn him BUT if he was actually Lex, he knew becuase he arranged it himself and ducked into cover knowing he would be the only survivor...

Video evidence would show he did try to warn the boardmembers and could epxlain the blast left him unable to remember what alerted him...

So can you explain this?

[xrayvision]

Sorry but his theory come off as pure rubbish to me! Oliver has been in a bad mood ever sinse he found out lex killed his parent (or who ever the relations were). He has been wanting revenge ever sinse then...

There is no way lex can throw a needle like that! I dont think lex was in that truck, just some lab grown body parts made form his dna. we all know lex will be back, unless you missed superman! lol.

As for the person who said we havent seen the green arrow this season, what about when he met lana whilst trying to kill lex?

Your last statement about him trying to kill Lex as the Green Arrow is what makes me think it wasn't Oliver. In that scene in Bride, Lana told him that he's better than that. And I think she got through to him because he went back to Smallville with her to attend the wedding rather than continuing to pursue Lex.

Also, it's possible that Lex found a way to create a clone that has Oliver's aim/archery skills. You could be right that a lab-grown clone or body parts could have been in the truck, but I'm hoping I'm right, because it would make for an awesome story and a great reveal, even better than Bizarro's reveal in Gemini.

----- Added 12 Minutes later -----

Did they explain How Oliver even knew there was a bomb because there didn't seem anything to warn him BUT if he was actually Lex, he knew becuase he arranged it himself and ducked into cover knowing he would be the only survivor...

Video evidence would show he did try to warn the boardmembers and could epxlain the blast left him unable to remember what alerted him...

So can you explain this?

Well, they said that the Toyman worked for Oliver. So Oliver seeing those balls start going on their own could have expected them to fit the MO of the Toyman.

But that's what gets me. If it was really Ollie, would his first suspicion be that of the Toyman? Maybe, but I'm not entirely sure.

Now if we instead assume that the Oliver that we see from the hospital scene through the rest of the episode is really a clone with Lex's brain inside, then it would have to be explained that Lex sent them on Toyman's trail. Lex would also have a strong feeling that Chloe would tell Clark was he (Lex-in-Oliver clone) was up to after blackmailing her to keep quiet. Which means that this was all Lex's intricate plan to 1) do away with his old body to eliminate the trail of those out to get him and to 2) contaminate Lana with kryptonite so that he could never be double teamed by her & Clark at the same time (plus to get his own revenge for her stealing the suit).

[highdro_pharmer]

I like this Lex-o-Lollie theory... kind of reminds me of Harvey Dent in the Dark Knight if you sort of view Ollie/Green Arrow as Metropolis' own white knight.

Lex would love nothing more than to slowly burn and poison everything that Ollie stands for, his second chance at toying with Clark's morals, with Clark trying to act as Ollie's personal saviour as he descends into darkness.

Clark (aka Mr. 'Red-Blue Blur') is reluctant to take up the hero mantle, much like Batman. Heck, I was waiting for Mr. Toyman, with his love of dynamite and general hijinx, to ask Ollie "why so serious?" and then proceed to "put a smile on that face..."

[xrayvision]

I like this Lex-o-Lollie theory... kind of reminds me of Harvey Dent in the Dark Knight if you sort of view Ollie/Green Arrow as Metropolis' own white knight.

Lex would love nothing more than to slowly burn and poison everything that Ollie stands for, his second chance at toying with Clark's morals, with Clark trying to act as Ollie's personal saviour as he descends into darkness.

Clark (aka Mr. 'Red-Blue Blur') is reluctant to take up the hero mantle, much like Batman. Heck, I was waiting for Mr. Toyman, with his love of dynamite and general hijinx, to ask Ollie "why so serious?" and then proceed to "put a smile on that face..."

It would also allow Lex to get revenge on his 2nd or 3rd most hated nemesis--Oliver. That would mean that he got Clark & Lana (his top 2 enemies) and now Ollie is next. It would be damn cool if it turns out to be true.

[xrayvision]

I'm rewatching the episode now and am taking notes:

1. The Toyman, who was working for Lex, blows up the Luthorcorp boardroom after Oliver shows up and stops the board from executing a no-confidence vote. Why would Toyman blow up Lex's company if he's working for Lex, just to kill Oliver? There has to be a much bigger motive here. By killing the boardroom members, taking an incapacitated Ollie hostage, and then replacing him by becoming an Oliver clone, Lex would commandeer both Luthorcorp & Queen Industries without Clark or anyone else suspecting. I also think Ollie would have been in critical condition after that blast, with bits of kryptonite possibly embedded in his skin.

It is also possible that a Lex-as-Oliver clone was the Oliver who walked into that meeting and that Ollie had already been abducted beforehand, because I find it too convenient that Tess was not present in such an important meeting. Therefore if Lex is in an Oliver Queen clone, he could have ordered a fake meeting unknown to Tess and had the board killed after replacing Oliver with himself so that when Tess returns, she wouldn't suspect anything.

2. "Oliver's" line to Lana about "if Lex would go after anyone, it would be her due to her theft of the suit" sounded very much like one of Lionel's lines from Transference when he was in Clark's body. Specifically, it sounded like Lionel-in-Clark as he mentioned everything that Lex owned (from the Scotch to the very cufflinks in his shirt)---as if Ollie knew too much info than he should have (just like in Lex's POV, Clark, before Lex found out it was really Lionel, knew more than he should have about the Scotch, cufflinks, and ultimately the bank account). I definitely sense a strong whiff of the hospital bed Oliver being Lex with that conversation.

3. We see Toyman talking to Lex as he talks to that ventriloquist doll. But is the injured Lex they show the real Lex? Also, notice how they don't specifically show a screen in front of the injured Lex. It could be that Lex as Oliver was getting that feed. It may even be possible that Lex is actually inside the real Oliver while the real Oliver is inside Lex, forced to inhabit Lex's injured body while Lex parades around as him and steals everything he can while making Oliver notorious and blackmailing Clark's friends and ruining everyone's lives. If this is true, then the Lex DNA that was found by the truck remains could have been planted by Lex's men.

4. Skeptics to this theory would ask what the purpose was to the scene in the hospital room where Toyman tried to kill Oliver with the toy monkey. The explanation is that it was a show because there were most likely cameras in the room and Lex wanted to make it look as convincing as possible. Heck, we saw Chloe watching footage of "Oliver" leaving the room with the toy monkey. More evidence of this are the balloons that Toyman brought with him. If Oliver was supposed to die in an explosion after being handcuffed, then why did Toyman bring the balloons with the knockout gas? Because it was his way to get out of the room in case he encountered resistance. Notice also how Oliver didn't write a message to the doctor to have Toyman arrested, or didn't call the cops at a pay phone/with a cellphone after escaping the hospital. Not very Oliver Queen-like to let a very dangerous criminal go free like that.

5. The scene with the explosion showed a short shot of "Lex's" face with an explosion flaring in front of it. I'm guessing that "Lex" was in front of a screen showing the truck explode and the flare we saw was a reflection from the screen and not the actual explosion. Therefore, if Ollie is really in Lex, he would have survived and is locked away somewhere.

6. The next thing I will mention is that scene where Ollie & Chloe talk. What motive would the real Oliver Queen of all people have to look through hospital surveillance videos so he could find the murder of Sebastian Kane to blackmail Chloe with? If Oliver found out that Chloe, while being inhabited by Brainiac, killed Sebastian, he would have told Clark since his main argument back then was for Clark to do something to rid Chloe of her Brainiac powers. Something that big would have made him go straight to Clark to prove his point and force Clark to act. The real Oliver would never do that. He doesn't have time to view all those videos. But guess who does have the time to view all sorts of footage, and who has been doing pretty much nothing but watching everyone since the start of the season, and who had a reason to keep tabs on Chloe? You guessed it---Lex. His "Now that Lex is gone, you can't tell me you're not relieved" quote is something that Lex would definitely say if he was in Oliver's body. Lionel said something very similar to this line to Chloe in Transference in that scene where they were both at the Torch.

7. The final scene I will mention is the one where "Oliver" looks at the shattered photo of Lex and has the kryptonite ring in his hand. It literally looks like Lex-in-Oliver is looking at his temporarily former life (until he reclaims it in the near future) and reflecting his upcoming plans. Oliver's face is showing a faint sign of a sinister grin, very similar to the one Lex had at the very end of Onyx after Lionel left. The most telling sign of all was the kryptonite ring, which he obviously plans to use against Clark, especially if Chloe tells him. My biggest question here is, how the hell would Oliver know where, out of all places, Lex keeps his kryptonite ring with the embedded Luthor family crest? Tess obviously didn't know where Lex kept it because she knew nothing about kryptonite being the weakness of Kryptonians. So she couldn't have told Oliver. There was only 1 person who knew where to find that ring, and it was Lex himself.

Based on the above analysis, the possibility that Lex is inside either Oliver himself or a living breathing Oliver clone is very high. I would say it's more than likely that he is Oliver now. At least I'm convinced he is.

[bor-el]

the clone idea is played out. it was bad enought grant, lana, clark and now perhaps lex were all cloned at one point.

stupid.

[xrayvision]

the clone idea is played out. it was bad enought grant, lana, clark and now perhaps lex were all cloned at one point.

stupid.

It's not stupid at all. It was done very nicely in the comics, though it was Lex who was cloned. What's cool is that the theory has multiple paths, one that doesn't even involve a clone where Lex just switched bodies/brains with Oliver and planted DNA in the truck to throw everyone off.

[Kevin24]

Why wouldn't he just kill Oliver ? Why kidnap and keep him alive?

[xrayvision]

Why wouldn't he just kill Oliver ? Why kidnap and keep him alive?

Knowing Lex, he'd want to destroy Oliver's reputation and then return to being Lex Luthor and give Oliver his own life back after ruining it.

[zHeN_zHeN]

Wow, that would be a crazy-ass twist!

[tj_powers]

nah not a fan of this one. that would only mean that justin was only put on the cast to replace lex and not pursue as his own character. So i really do hope they dont do it as you think. It does sound interesting but that only leaves us since when has he REALLY been him and with Brainiac being chloe already this season... it would be too much.

[Kschreck]

I got a crazy theory that Lex had his doctors clone Ollie just like he made Julian/Grant Gabriel. Ollie was very un-Ollie like in this episode. That ring at the end of the episode just seemed to tell the real story that Lex is an Oliver clone.

For this to be possible, he had to have performed some sort of transference, or moved his brain into the Oliver Queen clone body. It happened in the comics when Lex had cancer and had to save himself.

So I think Lex created a living Ollie clone, transferred brains (or perhaps bodies using the same type of Kryptonian technology as seen in the stones) and set up/brainwashed the Ollie clone to act as Lex so that he could kill him with the bomb and eliminate the chance of anyone else coming after him until he's back to being the real Lex.

So I think Lex will parade around as Oliver for a while and eventually clone his own body and have his brain/soul transferred into it.

I don't think it was a coincidence that Ollie happened to acquire Luthorcorp and kill all the board members. I think that was Lex's doing and that when he returns he will rename it Lexcorp, if Luthorcorp even exists anymore.

I don't think the producers would do such a plot. I think it would be to hard to follow. On top of that, we see Green Arrow in scenes from future episodes as well as Chloe as the Watchtower and there just isn't any indication of Oliver really being Lex. Not to mention that Oliver gives Clark something to help him combat Doomsday. Lex would never help Clark out today.

[XLex]

No i dont think that's the case here..but your theory is really good!I am pretty sure it was a clone and the question everybody is asking is "Where the hell is Lex if he is alive"
Well my theory is that Lex wants the world to belive that he's dead!He killed Lionel,Lana hates him and has powers now,Green Arow want's to kill him and took control of Luthorcorp..it's obvios that Lex wants revenge..on Crark especely for betraying him(Lex thinks he was betrayed by Clark and not the other way around).
Now everybody thinks that Lex lost everything that he had,the money,Luthorcorp,his mantion everything!Not true.Remember when Lionel was in prison and Lex took control over Luthorcorp and left Lionel without even a place to live,Lionel stayed at mantion under excuse that he is broke...season 5 we see the old Lionel back living in his penthouse ofice in Luthorcorp and being the old good(bad)rich Lionel.So if Lionel was able to manipulate Lex to think he is poor just so that he could keep an eye on Lex,than why wouldn't Lex be able to do the same thing(similar at least)Even if they knew he was alive they would all think "Hey Lex doesnt's have all that bilions and power now he's not a threat enymore".And im pretty sure that in season 10 we'r goona see Lex back in Metropolis as the CEO and founder of LEXCORP!
Now i dont know what the producers have in mind for Lex but im sure that if Tess survives she will join Lex and things are going to get really enteresting!

[xrayvision]

It's a shame that Oliver's behavior in this episode and all the things that were seriously off about him were never explained. I mean I can see Oliver going to a dark point of his life as a result of finding out Lionel killed his family, but what he did in this episode was way above & beyond what a heroic Green Arrow should have done if he were to go to a dark point in his life. It really crossed the line and his behavior was very Lex-like.

I would've loved to see this theory implemented along with my theory about Lex using the cloaking his company developed and used on Wes Keenan so that Lex would resort to using an Oliver clone to get around while his original body had to be periodically healed (kind of like in Crusade after Lionel poisoned him in Covenant) and ruin Oliver's life and when not healing use his own body while cloaked (with invisibility technology) to get around as himself as I originally suspected he did in Echo when we saw his reflection flinch in the glass door/window that Oliver threw his drink at.

For the above, I would spin this theory slightly and explain that the real Lex created an Oliver clone who was being mind controlled by Lex himself using technology that his company and perhaps with the help of the Toyman developed. We saw something like that in Upgrade in season 9 with John Corben.