Elizabeth Collins Stoddard (1991)

[LeticiaFaye]

I have been watching my 1991 videos...cause I am so excited about the new show. I was wondering though..I know Jean Simmons is English...but why was her accent used as ECS. Wasnt Elizabeth after all raised in Collinwood in the states?

Just curious?

THanks guys.

[Michael Evenden]

Well, I've *****ed about this before, but it seems to me that Jean Simmons was hired and then was given nothing whatsoever to do; there was virtually no thought given to individualizing her character, and that included no one asking her to change her accent. She had been a great fan of the OS, but the '91 series, based at first on HODS, left her as a supporting player at best, her primary job being standing about with a concerned look, registering confusion: "But no one gets diphtheria anymore!" They got her name value, her presence, and some gentle, cultivated line readings. But she was wasted, wasted wasted.

[jtfolden]

Re: Elizabeth Collins Stoddard (1991)

Originally posted by LeticiaFaye
I have been watching my 1991 videos...cause I am so excited about the new show. I was wondering though..I know Jean Simmons is English...but why was her accent used as ECS. Wasnt Elizabeth after all raised in Collinwood in the states?

We really don't know.... perhaps she had a VERY English tutor as a child. :-)

[Carol04]

I agree with you Michael, Jean Simmons' talent was wasted in the remake Dark Shadows 1991. She had very little to do accept to be Elizabeth from the House of Dark Shadows. She needed a storyline about her character.

[Michael Evenden]

I've groused plenty on this board about my problems with the under-characterized characters in 1991, and my concerns that the new series could be based entirely on 1991 and on the unproduced screenplay that came shortly after its cancellation, which means that those of us with fond memories of stories and characters strictly from the OS have no good reason to hope for their inclusion now. All that said, I take it as a good sign that the spoilers for the new pilot say that Carolyn is determined not to become like her mother--which would suggest that they've got to characterize Elizabeth SOMEHOW, no? I'd hate to see Blair Brown wasted, too. So here's hopin'.

[Witches of Morva]

ORDDU: Jim Pierson once told my sisters and I that, had the 1991 series been allowed to continue, it was intended that a love interest for Elizabeht Stoddard would have been written into the story. Jean Simmons was, indeed, a fine choice for Elizabeth. Such a shame she didn't get the chance to show us all just HOW fine she could be. (sigh...)

[jtfolden]

I can't really call it either way... let's face it. In the majority of modern series you see on TV many characters are neglected until they're needed sooooo Blair Brown may go quite underused until a specific plot focuses on her. I mean the characterization of Carolyn not really wanting to be at Collinwood was summed up in a single line in DS91.

Although, a thought just popped into my head... probably completely removed from reality but the idea that Carolyn doesn't want to be like her mother and given the looks of the actress (at least what I've seen of her)... you don't suppose this new Carolyn is going to be shaped after Claire on Six Feet Under, do you? lol

[k. caorli]

I liked Jean Simmons as Elizabeth though I agree she was woefully under utilized.Hopefully, Blaire Brown will get more to do after the pilot which has to focus on introducing Barnabas and elements connected to him like Angelique.If it was still serialized they could have waited a few episodes before bringing Angelique [or Julia, for example] in but since it's not they can't.The only slight advantage to the bottle episode format is that they can periodicly take one to focus on the subsidiary characters and I'm afraid that's what Liz basicly is.Whether she aught to be is a seperate if related issue.Most of the time she is liable to be mainly in the background with a line of dialogue here and there but probably few prominent scenes.That's why I hope the restore the plots about Vicki being either her illegitimate duaghter or her missing husbands and they need to explain who he was eventually and what happenned to him.I'de say to avoid the Leviathans but with today's special effects and more carefull plotting some similar story might work at least down the road a bit.A love interest is a nice idea too. Probably a short term one might be done that doesn't work out but I'de like to see at least one core cast member manage a successfull romance where the love interest is not a hidden villain or doomed to die or leave town in an episode or two.

[Michael Evenden]

Congratualations, k caorli, you have just said the first positive thing about the "bottle" episode format--that it may create spaces in which lesser characters can be developed and excellent actors in supporting roles can strut their stuff. I choose to find this VERY encouraging!

[michael cahalane]

why so much gloom and doom about liz?i've never seen d.s.91,but i gather the actress was underused.maybe dan curtis will learn from that mistake and return liz to the prominence joan bennett had on o.s. the mystery of liz's husband and her reason for hiring victoria(which eventually got dropped from o.s.)could be worked into the new show.but perhaps in a once a week formula that will likely be barnabas centered that's not possible.

[Michael Evenden]

I complain about the under-characterization of both Jean Simmons' characters in DS91 because a) it's symptomatic of the writing problems that I think (and at least some of the critics in the press at the time agreed) fatally hurt the show--although there were things to praise in the writing as well, and b) because, as obvious a course of action as it seems to us fans, I see no indication that the new WB series is consulting the OS at all as a way of filling these characters out. My conjecture is that they'll be working from the '91 series (which was expressly based, for the contemporary scenes, more on the film House of Dark Shadows than on the OS) and possibly from the unproduced screenplay Dan Curtis and Barbara Steele concocted following the series' cancellation, all of which leaves the things we loved from the OS far behind. I have no way of being sure, but this is my reasoned speculation, and if I'm right, we OS fans should shape our expectations accordingly. So the griping about Liz is a way of getting at larger concerns in the ongoing adaptation process that is Dark Shadows.

[k. caorli]

One thing that can sometimes be forgotten about the original series is the extent to which all the human characters were reduced to victims after Barnabas was introduced though each still had better moments.Most of their stories played out before Barnabas was introduced, though there was overlap with Jason's blackmail plot.More to the point is that the pre
Barnabas episodes were never syndicated in 1975-1990 and only released much later on video. At least once the Sci-fi channel also began with Barnabas release. Admittedly, between the several SCI-FI runs 1992-1997 and 1999-2003 and the videos the prebarnabas episodes are more familiar than since 1966.But they remain obscure compared to april 1967-april 1971.Characters like Liz, Roger, Sam Evans and so on essentially 'coasted' especially after the flashback, though I love some of the later stories or at least episodes.The new show, like HODS and 1991 did not have the luxury of almost ten months, over 200 episodes, to allow the audience to get to know the main characters so that they remained an important 'presence' even later when they weren't doing much [ except being victimized by the supernatural characters].Any deeper characterizations in the new show will have to be very carefully written and performed because the time for it is liable to be quite breif.It sounds as though the series will be more plot than character driven,though that doesn't mean characterization needs to be ignored.

[michael cahalane]

k.caorli, what you say is unfortunately true.as someone who has viewed d.s. on video from ep.1, i really "got to know" liz,roger,sam,etc. before the barnabas character was introduced.even during b's first several months on the show the origional cast remained focal.the 1795 story was it's own thing.when the story returns to the present the problems start.it's sad the producers felt they needed to keep "upping the ante" by introducing one disposable monster after another at the expense of the human characters.what made the early barnabas story so engaging was the suspense, but also b's fondness for vicki and julia's jealousy and manipulations.when it essentially becomes a show about monsters it loses alot of it's magic.