An analysis of the mess that was this episode

[xrayvision]

I'm going to try & explain various things that did not make sense in Quest in this thread bit by bit as I come up with plausible explanations.

Here's what I got so far:

1. Genevieve & Jason did not die for Clark. Edward Teague was delusional as seen by his insanity. See the following lines from Jason in Commencement:

Jason: Well, let's see. When I ran into your son in Shanghai, I decided to do a little homework on my own. And the more I dug, the more Clark Kent's name just kept popping up. Sit down! Was it coincidence that the symbols were burned into your field?

Jason: What about Clark's connection with Bridgette Crosby?

Jason: She had one of the artifacts! I suppose that was just a coincidence, too.

Jason: You know, when my mother came to Smallville, she thought the Luthors would lead her to the stones. But she was wrong. It was a farm boy. The one who has no record of ever been born. He's more connected to those stones than any of us.

These lines clearly show that Jason knew nothing about Clark being the Traveler or any intentions of helping Clark. At best, Jason knew about the Traveler and wanted to gather the stones for him, but did not know his identity. But this explanation presents other problems as seen below.

2. Lionel did not kill Dr. Swann---instead Edward Teague killed him. Proof: Look at all the information Teague knew about Krypton & Jor-El, etc. It took Lionel years and bizzare circumstances to get that information. There's no way he would have gotten that information otherwise & Swann would certainly not give that information to him. After all, his son and/or wife killed Bridgette Crosby later on and she had been on the run from them and Swann probably knew it. Lionel had a long time to kill Swann and would have done it years ago. I'm positive it was Edward Teague who killed Swann just as Jason/Genevieve killed Crosby.

I will add more explanations as I come up with them. Feel free to add them as well.

[warriorrenegade]

Well Lex didn't know of any Traveler either, it took him getting shot in the head to remember that lost memory. I'm sure Jason had that memory repressed aswell. It's understandable really they were all small childern. We have no evidence about the stories Genevieve told Jason to convince him to help her in her quest to find the stones. Though it sounded like in that exchange between Jason and the Kents he was getting closer to the truth maybe he was just realizing his mother was lying to him all along. But we know he was a momma's boy and he really wanted to impress her and finding the stones would put him in her good graces.

As for who killed Swann. I don't care really It's a safe bet to assume Lionel killed him. It's been said enough times by credible people that it's a safe asssumption. The reason I gathered about how Ed knew all that info about the traveler and whatnot, was because he was closer to Swann seeing as the other member's were killed off and he'd gone into hiding. Swann knew to place the clock in that church because he knew Ed was hiding there. So it's plausible Swann was in close contact with Ed.

[xrayvision]

I don't think Swann & Ed were close. Why would Genevieve kill Bridgette Crosby? She was in Swann's foundation and on the side of the Traveler with Swann. The guy looked and acted like a maniac, just like his wife. I think he killed Swann and found out all the secrets and then hid out in that church. It was ludicrous when he said that Genevieve was out serving the Traveler. There's no way that was true. Genevieve and the Swann Foundation were at odds. And since Genevieve was Ed's wife, I wouldn't think he would be too different. I really don't think Swann would have trusted other Veritas members with Clark's secret. Crosby knew, but she wasn't a Veritas member.

[Kevin24]

Edward Teague took lessons from Dr. Swann about Krypton. He mentions it in the episode. I don't even know if Dr. Swann got murdered he could have just died because of health issues.

[xrayvision]

But why would Swann help someone whose family had an evil agenda that ultimately resulted in the death of Swann's assistant (after Swann's own death)? I just don't believe it or anything else that came out of Edward's mouth. He is delusional.

[Kevin24]

I don't think Swann & Ed were close. Why would Genevieve kill Bridgette Crosby? She was in Swann's foundation and on the side of the Traveler with Swann. The guy looked and acted like a maniac, just like his wife. I think he killed Swann and found out all the secrets and then hid out in that church. It was ludicrous when he said that Genevieve was out serving the Traveler. There's no way that was true. Genevieve and the Swann Foundation were at odds. And since Genevieve was Ed's wife, I wouldn't think he would be too different. I really don't think Swann would have trusted other Veritas members with Clark's secret. Crosby knew, but she wasn't a Veritas member.

She killed her because Bridgette had a stone of knowledge and she was going to sell it to the Luthors. In a way if you look back on season 4 you can see that they were perhaps trying to help the traveler all along.

When it comes to morals you can see that Ed Teague thinks that killing for the greater good justifies killing. So them killing Crosby doesn't seem out of character for them at all since they were doing it for the greater good by keeping it out of the hands of the Luthors.

[Theshadow129x]

I think everyone had their own agenda when it came to the traveler to be honest. Some wanted the knowledge, some wanted him to be a savior, and others wanted him for power/control. With that said, I think Edward teague wanted the traveler to be their savior seeing as he was following after Swan's footsteps, but his wife and Jason wanted the knowledge for power over the world. Not everyone's in Veritas was noble, we know that from lionel who's quest was to , at first, control the traveler then he went to protect him and have him be the worlds savior.

----- Added 51 Seconds later -----

i think that needs to be cleared up

[Joelito]

People people! At this point you all must know that Veritas plot was made from the TPTB sleeves, so..don't expect "continuity" from the past...when Swann and Lionel first met, was clear that they didn't know each other.
So, why bother...

[Poweranimals]

when Swann and Lionel first met, was clear that they didn't know each other.
So, why bother...

How so? They apparently knew who each other were. While you could assume they didn't know each other, there's nothing that proves they didn't. They probably just didn't have that close of a relationship. As far as Edward Teague, he was Swan's disciple. He obviously trusted him. In fact, he had good intentions, they were simply misguided.

And Jason and Geneveve did die because of Clark's secret since the stones were all connected to him. Geneveve seemed to have her own motives for looking for the stones. She didn't seem too focused on the actual Traveler, but in the end it's all connected.

[Joelito]

How so? They apparently knew who each other were. While you could assume they didn't know each other, there's nothing that proves they didn't. They probably just didn't have that close of a relationship. As far as Edward Teague, he was Swan's disciple. He obviously trusted him. In fact, he had good intentions, they were simply misguided.

And Jason and Geneveve did die because of Clark's secret since the stones were all connected to him. Geneveve seemed to have her own motives for looking for the stones. She didn't seem too focused on the actual Traveler, but in the end it's all connected.
for a people that have much in common, with a tons of reunions in the name of Veritas....yeah! they did a good job assuming that? :rolleyes:
And what killed the teague family, Jason and Genevive, was the greed of power, nothing else.

[xrayvision]

How so? They apparently knew who each other were. While you could assume they didn't know each other, there's nothing that proves they didn't. They probably just didn't have that close of a relationship. As far as Edward Teague, he was Swan's disciple. He obviously trusted him. In fact, he had good intentions, they were simply misguided.

Their meeting in Legacy did not have the feeling like they were in a secret society together in the past. They obviously knew who each other was, but from watching Legacy before ever watching any of the Veritas episodes, everyone here thought that the first in-person meeting between the 2 was in Legacy. And one thing that made us think that was how Swann said it took Lionel long enough to walk through his door. He didn't say we meet again or something to that nature. And who says he trusted him? If that was the case and he was Swann's follower, then why didn't he tell Swann about Lionel's Veritas mutiny in trying to open the envelope as seen in that scene in Veritas? Why did Swann take such a nonchalant attitude towards Lionel in their meeting in Legacy when Lionel should have been considered a threat? Why was Lionel able to kill Swann when he would have been warned by his "great friend" Edward? It doesn't make sense. There's no way Swann told Edward anything about Clark.


And Jason and Geneveve did die because of Clark's secret since the stones were all connected to him. Geneveve seemed to have her own motives for looking for the stones. She didn't seem too focused on the actual Traveler, but in the end it's all connected.

Something else that I didn't mention doesn't make sense. If Genevieve & Jason were serving the Traveler, then why the hell did they bring Lana to the crypt to get Isobel to possess her? Why would they bring another competitor for the stones into the picture, especially knowing how she wanted revenge against the Teagues? Did anyone have the notion prior to watching Quest that Genevieve & Jason were looking out for Clark in season 4? That is just illogical given their behavior and how they brought Isobel back. If they wanted him to be a savior, why not come out and tell him back then rather than hiding it all? This bugs me now just like it did with the plot where Lionel forced Lana to marry Lex to get info on the phantom that Clark could have easily gotten had Lionel come out in the open & told Clark to use his superspeed to spy on Lex and get the information.

My guess is that Edward Teague wasn't waiting there only for Clark. I think he was waiting for Lex too. He seemed to know about Sageeth and how he and Clark would be bitter enemies. He probably knew that whoever Sageeth was would one day show up after opening the Zurich box so he could place the kryptograph in the clock.

I say that Edward was waiting for Clark to show up because his plan all along was to get him on that table. He also waited for Lex to show up so he could kill him and steal the diamond that was hidden in the clock and would soon thereafter look for the globe that was hidden in the Luthor mansion. So basically he was waiting in the church so he could control the Traveler and make him do his bidding.

[SpiritedDiva]

This bugs me now just like it did with the plot where Lionel forced Lana to marry Lex to get info on the phantom that Clark could have easily gotten had Lionel come out in the open & told Clark to use his superspeed to spy on Lex and get the information.


I say that Edward was waiting for Clark to show up because his plan all along was to get him on that table. He also waited for Lex to show up so he could kill him and steal the diamond that was hidden in the clock and would soon thereafter look for the globe that was hidden in the Luthor mansion. So basically he was waiting in the church so he could control the Traveler and make him do his bidding.

I was under the impression that Lionel forced Lana to marry Lex for more than just info on the Phantom. I thought it was to keep an insider's leak on all his son's doings involving Clark to protect him, which I think Lionel mentioned to Clark in one of the epis.
Of course I can't remember which one at the moment.

I thought that Edward was just a nutcase, who though he was saving the world from an all powerful dictator. I'd say he didn't plan on doing what he did to Clark, but felt threatened by Clark's comment regarding his knowledge of what Lex was.

Anyway, I am curious. Who do you think was in the car that picked up Lionel from the prison in season four? Prob the one who assisted in his release. I think it may have been Bridgette Crosby. Though, I have been wrong before.

[All about Clark]

I think that Teague had very viable concerns and if Clark wasn't taking his life seriously as the savior, it makes sense that that would cause Teague to lose it so to speak. And Clark didn't voice his own concerns about Lex, I mean, really they were on the same page except for the execution of stopping Lex and in that sense, Teague was dead on that Lex needed to be stopped one way or another.

And xrayvision, you have no idea how much this Veritas plot bugs me with what we know from seasons 1-3.

[xrayvision]

I think that Teague had very viable concerns and if Clark wasn't taking his life seriously as the savior, it makes sense that that would cause Teague to lose it so to speak. And Clark didn't voice his own concerns about Lex, I mean, really they were on the same page except for the execution of stopping Lex and in that sense, Teague was dead on that Lex needed to be stopped one way or another.

And xrayvision, you have no idea how much this Veritas plot bugs me with what we know from seasons 1-3.

The best thing they could have done is to have found space to keep the Kawatche cave set and to do everything through the caves rather than this Veritas plot. Lex should have found out about the orb and the diamond piece from new areas or glyphs found in the cave. That was the vehicle through which the mythos had been guided and should have remained so.

This season was great until Veritas and time travel ruined it.

[smallvillelogan]

First, I don't think just because Genevieve and Jason died doesn't mean they died protecting Clark's secret. They just died while involved in Clark's secret, or the stones that lead to his destiny, which would uncover his secret.

Secondly, obviously the writers didn't have Veritas in mind until Season 4 at the earliest (probably more like Season 6), so the Lionel-Swann meeting in Legacy seems odd. But it could still be interpreted as a meeting between two people who haven't seen each other in 15, perhaps 20 years.

Thirdly, Edward Teague wasn't going to "sacrifice" Clark for his own gain. He was going to do so only when he found that Clark hasn't done a whole lot to fulfill his destiny, and also hadn't killed the enemy who can stop him (Lex). I'm afraid you're wrong on his agenda.

[Poweranimals]

Their meeting in Legacy did not have the feeling like they were in a secret society together in the past. They obviously knew who each other was, but from watching Legacy before ever watching any of the Veritas episodes, everyone here thought that the first in-person meeting between the 2 was in Legacy. And one thing that made us think that was how Swann said it took Lionel long enough to walk through his door. He didn't say we meet again or something to that nature. See that's the thing. Why would Swann even be expecting Lionel to walk through his door at all? Unless he knew that he'd be pounding on his door eventually seeking information on the traveller. Just because we didn't get a "We meet again." comment doesn't mean they haven't met. And I'm sure it wasn't the writer's original intention for them to have known each other when Legacy was produced, but nothing contradicts it. If anything Swann expecting him does support the Veritas storyline.


And who says he trusted him? If that was the case and he was Swann's follower, then why didn't he tell Swann about Lionel's Veritas mutiny in trying to open the envelope as seen in that scene in Veritas? Who says that he didn't tell Swann? I'm sure that he did actually.


Why did Swann take such a nonchalant attitude towards Lionel in their meeting in Legacy when Lionel should have been considered a threat? Why was Lionel able to kill Swann when he would have been warned by his "great friend" Edward? It doesn't make sense. Swann did know that Lionel wasn't to be trusted and said that his meetings with him were in Clark's best interest. Clearly Swann knew how to handle Lionel or thought he did anyway. The whole Veritas mutiny happened quite some time before Swann was killed. Obviously, a person can only take so many precautions throughout their lifetime. And we know Lionel's resourceful.


There's no way Swann told Edward anything about Clark. Clearly, he didn't. Edward didn't know who the traveller was until this episode. But he obviously did trust him with other information.



Something else that I didn't mention doesn't make sense. If Genevieve & Jason were serving the Traveler, then why the hell did they bring Lana to the crypt to get Isobel to possess her? Why would they bring another competitor for the stones into the picture, especially knowing how she wanted revenge against the Teagues? The truth is that no one said that they were serving the Traveller. Except maybe Edward, but as mentioned by Genevieve in Season 4, Jason took after his father, implying that he wasn't too bright. Genevieve had negative intentions with the stones. The same way that Lionel did.


Did anyone have the notion prior to watching Quest that Genevieve & Jason were looking out for Clark in season 4? That is just illogical given their behavior and how they brought Isobel back. If they wanted him to be a savior, why not come out and tell him back then rather than hiding it all? They didn't even know Clark was the traveller and as I mentioned before, Genevieve's motives were her own. Jason probably didn't even know anything about the travller.


This bugs me now just like it did with the plot where Lionel forced Lana to marry Lex to get info on the phantom that Clark could have easily gotten had Lionel come out in the open & told Clark to use his superspeed to spy on Lex and get the information. Well Lionel's always been an "ends justify the means" type of player. Even when he was protecting Clark, he would do anything to get the job done and played by his own rules.


My guess is that Edward Teague wasn't waiting there only for Clark. I think he was waiting for Lex too. He seemed to know about Sageeth and how he and Clark would be bitter enemies. He probably knew that whoever Sageeth was would one day show up after opening the Zurich box so he could place the kryptograph in the clock.

I say that Edward was waiting for Clark to show up because his plan all along was to get him on that table. He also waited for Lex to show up so he could kill him and steal the diamond that was hidden in the clock and would soon thereafter look for the globe that was hidden in the Luthor mansion. So basically he was waiting in the church so he could control the Traveler and make him do his bidding. Edward Teague was trying to serve the Traveler. He only turned against him after he felt that he wasn't living up to his destiny and tried to kill him in order to prevent him from being controlled by Lex.

[dwgebler]

Actually what I thought was a major flaw was that Edward Teague described what he was doing to Clark as an "ancient" Kryptonian ritual from before the time they were a scientific people. This involved some sort of liquid kryptonite on an altar. Am I wrong in thinking that Kryptonite was only a threat towards the last days of Krypton? I mean, surely it wasn't poisonous to them when they were living on a planet full of the stuff?


P.S. Was Edward Teague played by the guy who was the doctor in star trek voyager or am I imagining things?

[Poweranimals]

Actually what I thought was a major flaw was that Edward Teague described what he was doing to Clark as an "ancient" Kryptonian ritual from before the time they were a scientific people. This involved some sort of liquid kryptonite on an altar. Am I wrong in thinking that Kryptonite was only a threat towards the last days of Krypton? I mean, surely it wasn't poisonous to them when they were living on a planet full of the stuff?


P.S. Was Edward Teague played by the guy who was the doctor in star trek voyager or am I imagining things? They didn't need Kryptonite to perform the ritual on Krypton, but it was needed on Earth.

[xrayvision]

See that's the thing. Why would Swann even be expecting Lionel to walk through his door at all? Unless he knew that he'd be pounding on his door eventually seeking information on the traveller. Just because we didn't get a "We meet again." comment doesn't mean they haven't met. And I'm sure it wasn't the writer's original intention for them to have known each other when Legacy was produced, but nothing contradicts it. If anything Swann expecting him does support the Veritas storyline.

Swann expected Lionel to walk through his door because as he revealed in Legacy, he knew that Lionel had been spying on his (Swann's) emails to Clark & it was just a matter of time until Lionel came to meet Swann.


Clearly, he didn't. Edward didn't know who the traveller was until this episode. But he obviously did trust him with other information.

It makes no sense why Swann would trust Teague with information about Krypton. Heck, it doesn't even make sense how Swann got that information. How did he find out about old Kryptonian rituals from that one message Jor-El sent him about delivering Kal-El from evil?


The truth is that no one said that they were serving the Traveller. Except maybe Edward, but as mentioned by Genevieve in Season 4, Jason took after his father, implying that he wasn't too bright. Genevieve had negative intentions with the stones. The same way that Lionel did.

Edward did say they (Genevieve & Jason) died serving him. I would think that there would be some alignment in the Teague family with their objectives. That statement by Genevieve about Jason taking after his father was implied as part of the ploy that the Teagues were playing on Lex, Lana, Clark, and anyone else who didn't know what their true agenda was. At least that's how I took it. I'm not convinced Lionel after Transference had negative intentions with the stone. He did shoot Jason in Forever to protect Clark's secret and was trying to use his ruthless means to get the Air stone away from Lex by blackmailing Lana. I think given the way he protected Clark's identity, he would have given them to him.


They didn't even know Clark was the traveller and as I mentioned before, Genevieve's motives were her own. Jason probably didn't even know anything about the travller.

Like I said above, I would expect there to have been some alignment amongst the Teagues. Or else, they would have broken up instead of staying together as a family.


Well Lionel's always been an "ends justify the means" type of player. Even when he was protecting Clark, he would do anything to get the job done and played by his own rules.

I just don't think the way they wrote this was too convincing that Edward was a good guy waiting to help the Traveler. It's one of those things that a viewer has to accept if it is true.


Edward Teague was trying to serve the Traveler. He only turned against him after he felt that he wasn't living up to his destiny and tried to kill him in order to prevent him from being controlled by Lex.

There's something else that I didn't realize until now. Lex in season 4 asked Jason why he didn't join his father in his law profession. This means that Lex checked and knew that Edward Teague had at that time been practicing law--something he couldn't have done if he had been at the church 24/7. Lex was very suspicious of the Teagues and wouldn't have let this go unchecked. He did an entire background check on Jason for Lana. He also did not trust Genevieve at all. Surely he checked into her and Edward.

So it's still outstanding as to why Jason & Genevieve would have devoted much of their lives to studying Isobel and even worse why they would knowlingly set the events that led to her resurrection if they were out to serve the Traveler. Edward would have known that Jason was raised as a child around artifacts of Isobel. He would not approve of his wife and son doing all that they did, especially their roles in her resurrection. Being as crazy as he was, he would have killed them himself knowing that they were creating competition for the stones for the Traveler, even if they didn't know who he was.

Also, towards the end when Jason started putting the pieces together, he would have known Clark was the Traveler. Here is a very revealing line of his from Commencement:

Jason: You know, when my mother came to Smallville, she thought the Luthors would lead her to the stones. But she was wrong. It was a farm boy. The one who has no record of ever been born. He's more connected to those stones than any of us.

He would have to be a total idiot not to know that Clark was the Traveler after uttering the above line. And this means that he would have stopped his rampage against the Kents because he knew they supported Clark aka the Traveler.

And it makes no sense why Lionel would kill Swann in season 4. He had all the time to do it. He knew that Swann posed no danger to Clark. I would have expected him to kill Swann at the end of Legacy if he did.

[cygnusx1]

i am in agreement with xray, it is probable that teague killed swann. how did they find the symbols in the church and more importantly, who put them there?