My questions about this episode

[ForzaItalia]

1. How could Moira have powers? She’s never been to Smallville, so she never touched a meteor rock / kryptonite?

2. How was Moria able to control Chloe with that hand washing example in the past she mentioned? That was before Chloe moved to Smallville, so Chloe could not have been meteor-infected back then. Isn't Moria only able to control meteor infected people??

3. If Moira had this power for so long, why did she never control Chloe before?

4. Why was Moira’s hair blonde in Tomb, but black this episode?

[blaze88]

You've just illustrated many of the dumb plot holes in this story lol. This whole Chloe meteor freak storyline is just some dumb thing they came up wtih so don't expect it to match up with their sad attempts at continuity. Its mostly question 1/2 that are the main weird things here since hair color isn't a big deal and ppl dye it maybe? Also my guess is she never controlled Chloe before because she left after that hand ink incident and went catatonic i think?

[ForzaItalia]

Originally posted by blaze88
Also my guess is she never controlled Chloe before because she left after that hand ink incident and went catatonic i think?

If she was catatonic all this time, why was she just fine in Tomb?

[Kii]

Originally posted by ForzaItalia

4. Why was Moira’s hair blonde in Tomb, but black this episode?

In an interview, Lynda Carter said she brought a blonde wig with her but TPTB said she didn't need it.

[brainiacisfine]

I was kind of wondering why, when Moira left Chloe, she took her bracelet or whatever it was. If she was so afraid of hurting Chloe, why would she take one of her personal belongings. Did she know at that time that she needs to hold something of theirs in order for her powers to work? That is how it works, right? She has to hold something that belongs to the person in order for her to control them? I may have misunderstood that part. :confused:

[last man of krypton]

Originally posted by Kii
In an interview, Lynda Carter said she brought a blonde wig with her but TPTB said she didn't need it.

Gough: You can start whenever you're... wait, are you wearing a wig?
Lynda: Yeah. I'm naturally a brunette. When I watched the only Smallville episode that shows anything of Moira, it's shown she's blonde. Which makes sense, given that Chloe's blonde as well.
Gough: Oh, you're one of those kind of actors. We don't care about what happened in previous episodes. Lose the wig.
Lynda: But -
Gough: Now.

[ForzaItalia]

I don’t know how the show could have a continuity flaw like that…… Are these episodes written by people who haven’t seen a single Smallville episode before? Where are are Al & Miles finding these writers? Perhaps they should give some of us fans a try to write episodes…..
Hire me!!! I took 2 screenwriting courses in college, and I've seen every episode of Smallville! Al & Miles, if you’re reading this, PM me and let me send you a treatment for an episode!

[hassenmorad]

Originally posted by last man of krypton
Gough: You can start whenever you're... wait, are you wearing a wig?
Lynda: Yeah. I'm naturally a brunette. When I watched the only Smallville episode that shows anything of Moira, it's shown she's blonde. Which makes sense, given that Chloe's blonde as well.
Gough: Oh, you're one of those kind of actors. We don't care about what happened in previous episodes. Lose the wig.
Lynda: But -
Gough: Now.
:rotfl: That's hilarious!

[MidgardDragon]

Originally posted by ForzaItalia
1. How could Moira have powers? She’s never been to Smallville, so she never touched a meteor rock / kryptonite?

2. How was Moria able to control Chloe with that hand washing example in the past she mentioned? That was before Chloe moved to Smallville, so Chloe could not have been meteor-infected back then. Isn't Moria only able to control meteor infected people??

3. If Moira had this power for so long, why did she never control Chloe before?

4. Why was Moira’s hair blonde in Tomb, but black this episode?

1. The episode shows that she had been to Smallville and/or touched a meteor rock at some point before she went to the institution. It does not show us when that was but I'm sure she had plenty of opportunities to drive through and/or stay there.

2. The episode shows that Chloe had been to Smallville at some point back then, wether it was a drive-through/visit or they had already moved and this is the new official continuity (them living in Smallville longer than we knew) we don't know. The point is she officially had been to Smallville after the meteor shower but before moving there as this episode illustrates her having been infected.

3. She was catatonic due to either the power, the mental illness that actually runs in the family, or both. She just recently came out of her catatonic state via Lex's drug. In Tomb she was likely not completely catatonic but at least completely withdrawn into herself retaining motor functions but little-to-no control over her mind.

4. It's HAIR and can be dyed FFS! If people are really insisting on having a timeline for something as unnecessary and boring as hair-color then here you go:

Moira goes to mental institution with brown hair.

Moira before going catatonic has the nurses help her dye her hair.

Chloe visits Moira in Tomb when she has blonde hair.

Option 1) Moira comes out of catatonic state via Lex's drug and dyes her hair brown again.

Option 2) The dye washes out during routine washing and the nurses cannot ask her if she wants it dyed back so it remains brown.

[skully]

Originally posted by MidgardDragon
1. The episode shows that she had been to Smallville and/or touched a meteor rock at some point before she went to the institution. It does not show us when that was but I'm sure she had plenty of opportunities to drive through and/or stay there.

2. The episode shows that Chloe had been to Smallville at some point back then, wether it was a drive-through/visit or they had already moved and this is the new official continuity (them living in Smallville longer than we knew) we don't know. The point is she officially had been to Smallville after the meteor shower but before moving there as this episode illustrates her having been infected.

3. She was catatonic due to either the power, the mental illness that actually runs in the family, or both. She just recently came out of her catatonic state via Lex's drug. In Tomb she was likely not completely catatonic but at least completely withdrawn into herself retaining motor functions but little-to-no control over her mind.

4. It's HAIR and can be dyed FFS! If people are really insisting on having a timeline for something as unnecessary and boring as hair-color then here you go:

Moira goes to mental institution with brown hair.

Moira before going catatonic has the nurses help her dye her hair.

Chloe visits Moira in Tomb when she has blonde hair.

Option 1) Moira comes out of catatonic state via Lex's drug and dyes her hair brown again.

Option 2) The dye washes out during routine washing and the nurses cannot ask her if she wants it dyed back so it remains brown. Kudos. A quite neat and tidy clean up of the plotholes MD. Still, it's a pity the writers had to retcon Chloe's early years due to slackness on their part in the past.

[xrayvision]

Originally posted by MidgardDragon
2. The episode shows that Chloe had been to Smallville at some point back then, wether it was a drive-through/visit or they had already moved and this is the new official continuity (them living in Smallville longer than we knew) we don't know. The point is she officially had been to Smallville after the meteor shower but before moving there as this episode illustrates her having been infected.

I just wish that for someone as important as Chloe, they would have showed how it happened. Did they not show it because they have still not stuck to the idea that she is a freak, even after pointing out that her mother can control only freaks and controlled her? Or perhaps they thought it wasn't important?


Originally posted by MidgardDragon
3. She was catatonic due to either the power, the mental illness that actually runs in the family, or both. She just recently came out of her catatonic state via Lex's drug. In Tomb she was likely not completely catatonic but at least completely withdrawn into herself retaining motor functions but little-to-no control over her mind.

I would say because of the mental illness. Chloe did say that her family has a mental illness history, so she must know that someone other than her mother in her family was also catatonic. That's just probable speculation based on the facts offered. But with these 2 characters, past facts offered tend to be overrided.


Originally posted by MidgardDragon
4. It's HAIR and can be dyed FFS! If people are really insisting on having a timeline for something as unnecessary and boring as hair-color then here you go:

Moira goes to mental institution with brown hair.

Moira before going catatonic has the nurses help her dye her hair.

Chloe visits Moira in Tomb when she has blonde hair.

Option 1) Moira comes out of catatonic state via Lex's drug and dyes her hair brown again.

Option 2) The dye washes out during routine washing and the nurses cannot ask her if she wants it dyed back so it remains brown.

It just seems weird that someone would have their hair dyed in a catatonic state. I think that's when it was done since the picture on Chloe's computer had her with brown hair, and she seemed like she was crazy in that photo.

A big question that was never answered was why 12 years later she still doesn't show signs of powers. Everyone else has shown powers well before 12 years (in which she was exposed to 2 meteor showers, including the original according to spoilers that I was told of). It's stupid how they consider her a freak but not Lana who wore a piece of kryptonite around her neck for years.

[MidgardDragon]

xray - it was never stated that she immediately went into a catatonic state upon arrival at the institute was it? If so she easily could have dyed her hair before going into the state (and that's exactly what I said in my timeline).

The options for the hair being dyed back are both equally as logical, either the dye washed out during routine cleanings while in her catatonic state (they have to clean those people, too, yknow?) or she washed it out/dyed it back after Lex brought her out of the state.

Of course you do make a point that it likely would've washed out long before Tomb, but we see her retaining some major motor-functions in Tomb so it's likely that she had periods of awareness that easily could have allowed her to re-dye. But again, it's hair, not an immutable constant.

[Atomic girl]

Weren't there spoilers that talked about how Chloe and her mom were meteor-infected? I'm assuming that part of the episode was cut and I hope it will be a deleted scene on the DVDs.

[MidgardDragon]

Originally posted by Atomic girl
Weren't there spoilers that talked about how Chloe and her mom were meteor-infected? I'm assuming that part of the episode was cut and I hope it will be a deleted scene on the DVDs.

Umm, the episode itself shows us that they are, indeed, meteor-infected.

1) Moira has powers to control meteor-freaks, obviously had to have been gained from meteor exposure.

2) Chloe can be controlled by her mother and we already learned she is a freak in a previous episode, obviously had to have been gained from meteor exposure.

And the episode even lets us in on the fact that it had to have been during or just after the first shower, since they've had powers for so long.

It didn't show it but it did tell us they were meteor infected. Spoilers saying, "they're infected" don't mean they're going to show us the exact origin of the infection. Besides that, it could be a great scene for a later episode relating to this arc, and Progeny was already full-up with great scenes.

[faz]

Originally posted by ForzaItalia
1. How could Moira have powers? She’s never been to Smallville, so she never touched a meteor rock / kryptonite?

2. How was Moria able to control Chloe with that hand washing example in the past she mentioned? That was before Chloe moved to Smallville, so Chloe could not have been meteor-infected back then. Isn't Moria only able to control meteor infected people??

3. If Moira had this power for so long, why did she never control Chloe before?

4. Why was Moira’s hair blonde in Tomb, but black this episode?

Most of these can be explained, albeit very clumsily. I've learned to make certain concessions when dealing with SV continuity errors since I know that if I don't I'll end up getting really annoyed by many of the ridiculous oversights that come out of every episode. Let's face it, TPTB have never really committed themselves to ensuring the absence of basic plot holes and other such continuity errors.

[Jlvsclrk]

Yes, I don't understand the obsession with continuity on minor points like these. To me, it reflects a comic book attitude to the past, which is forget about it unless it helps your story. If you have a great story idea like the For Tomorrow run in the comics, go for it even if it can't possibly be reconciled with everything else that's supposed to be happening at the same time in the DCU.

Where the lack of continuity kills Smallville is where it affects the core characters, particularly Lana and her forgetfulness of all the things that have occurred between her and Clark. I understand that she could be bitter and say some of the truly hurtful things she has said to him: I'd love if they developed that she has a genuine greivance, Clark knows it and that's why he cuts her so much slack. But then they turn around and turn her into saint Lana, patron saint of victimization and it makes me want to scream. Oh for some consistency on THAT front.

[faz]

wait, do you mean that TPTB hit a lightswitch on Lana's memory? As if she actually KNEW Clark was keeping secrets from her?

In all seriousness, its not just that they constantly reverse the moral value of Lana's character, but it happens literally from episode to episode. I mean, how many times in the beginning of this season did we see Lana go from the committed and supportive girlfriend to Lex to undermining his plans to tinker with his Kryptonian toy? Or her sudden reversal after telling Lex that it would be ok if he experimented on meteor freaks? Or how she went from not knowing how she ever could have loved Clark, then out of nowhere she says she's still in love with him? This list could go on for quite a while. Flaws like that are so ridiculously obvious that I do sometimes wonder if the ingenious minds behind SV actually read their scripts before they start filming or if they're pulling a Vincent Chase.

[SlickBlonde]

Just to add some clarity. Moira tries to blame her ramblings about being able to control chloe on a deluded mind. But then lext counters "delusions don't put you in a catatonic state, you can thank your incredible power for that". Also before he says this he says something along the lines of "...we wouldn't want your ability to throw you back into a catatonic state". So apparently it was her abilty that put her in a catatonic state, however when is a mystery.

There seems to be little evidence in this episode that Moira did in fact have a psychological disorder at all. She admits to chloe that she committed herself to protect chloe, not be cause she was psychologically disordered. My guess is, with seemingy deluded ramblings about being able to control her daughter and eventual catatosis, doctors diagnosed her with something and the rest is history

[faz]

I'm a bit on the fence about the mental conditions of the Sullivan family. It's been previously mentioned on the show that Chloe has a history of mental illness in her family, but then again SV has been known to change the circumstances of a particular story arc midway through. I believe they originally planned to make Moira actually insane and leave it at that but htey saw an opportunity to create a solid, though extremely short, atory arc for Chloe's mother. I think what it will come down to is the final word from TPTB on whether or not Moira actually belonged in an institution.

[MidgardDragon]

Originally posted by SlickBlonde
Just to add some clarity. Moira tries to blame her ramblings about being able to control chloe on a deluded mind. But then lext counters "delusions don't put you in a catatonic state, you can thank your incredible power for that". Also before he says this he says something along the lines of "...we wouldn't want your ability to throw you back into a catatonic state". So apparently it was her abilty that put her in a catatonic state, however when is a mystery.

There seems to be little evidence in this episode that Moira did in fact have a psychological disorder at all. She admits to chloe that she committed herself to protect chloe, not be cause she was psychologically disordered. My guess is, with seemingy deluded ramblings about being able to control her daughter and eventual catatosis, doctors diagnosed her with something and the rest is history

I think considering Chloe has discovered mental illness in her family before, that her mental illness threw her into the catatonic state but her power acted as a catalyst which made it happen suddenly and sooner than it likely would have.