So Lionel knew the secret since...

[Xerox]

Transference? He said said he held the crystal in his hand,right?

[vyperman7]

He has known since Commencement. At least that is the way that I took it because Clark said almost a year. If it had been since Transference it would be well over a year. Also, Lionel made mention to the FOS, which also points to Commencement. The FOS was not a factor in Transference. It would have been great if it had been Transference, but I think it was Commencement. Especially with the Kryptonian symbol in his eye. It only makes sense that is when he gained the knowledge.

[xrayvision]

I think he knew about the abilities from before Commencement, but until then, he knew nothing about the Kryptonian language, the name Kal-El, Krypton, the FOS, Zod, or anything else he will be seen to know about in upcoming episodes.

[Watching Smallville]

He said it was since Commencement -- so apparently when he told the doctor he didn't remember what happened in Transference, he was telling the truth. Of course, Lionel has had suspicions abou Clark since Red -- who knows how much he learned along the way.

[Xerox]

oh ok. That's right I forgot about the FOS reference...

[aqua]

I was so happy about this. At least he really didn't have another case of amnesia.

[LastFatherOfKrypton]

Originally posted by Xerox
Transference? He said said he held the crystal in his hand,right?


I think that is just about correct....since the first time he held the stone in his hand...even to get the info on it and its origin to understand what he was searching for.

[GottaLoveHotSuperHeros]

didn't he kind of guess in Season 3? with Morgan Fine and all that Red K stuff

[LastFatherOfKrypton]

Originally posted by GottaLoveHotSuperHeros
didn't he kind of guess in Season 3? with Morgan Fine and all that Red K stuff

You mean Morgan Edge....Metropolis' Crime Boss, who Clark got entangled with about securing Clark's blood properties for Lionel.

Milton Fine is Brainiac, Clark's former professor.;)

[xrayvision]

Originally posted by Watching Smallville
He said it was since Commencement -- so apparently when he told the doctor he didn't remember what happened in Transference, he was telling the truth. Of course, Lionel has had suspicions abou Clark since Red -- who knows how much he learned along the way.

I still think he knew about his abilities before (definitely had suspicions). After seeing Jeremiah doing his feats, he said he knew that there were humans who could do things like that. I also think he shot Jason for a reason, and unless he knew or remembered something from Transference, he would not have shot him.

I think his suspicions of Clark's invulnerabilities from Red were verified in Insurgence after he shot Pine. He was right behind Pine when he shot him, so that bullet must have gone through him and into Clark who was in front of Pine. He probably knew that too since Clark's voice would have given him away.

As far as his knowledge of all things Kryptonian, I agree that he knew since Commencement.

[LastFatherOfKrypton]

Originally posted by xrayvision
I still think he knew about his abilities before (definitely had suspicions). After seeing Jeremiah doing his feats, he said he knew that there were humans who could do things like that. I also think he shot Jason for a reason, and unless he knew or remembered something from Transference, he would not have shot him.

I think his suspicions of Clark's invulnerabilities from Red were verified in Insurgence after he shot Pine. He was right behind Pine when he shot him, so that bullet must have gone through him and into Clark who was in front of Pine. He probably knew that too since Clark's voice would have given him away.

As far as his knowledge of all things Kryptonian, I agree that he knew since Commencement.

But Lionel clearly said since the first moment he held the crystal in his hand.

That must be unless I missed something?:confused:

[xrayvision]

What I'm saying is that Lionel knew 100% of the secret since Commencement. His abilities are not 100% since Chloe knew about them, but had no idea he was an alien, and what planet he was from. The crystal gave him knowledge of all the actual Kryptonian info he has. Clark knew about his own secret but didn't know all of it until he met Dr. Swann & later on Jor-El. Knowing the abilities isn't equal to knowing the whole secret. That's all I'm trying to say.

Saying that Lionel knew nothing prior to that is dismissing all the evidence and times Lionel knew there was something different about Clark and also makes all episodes before Commencement that dealt with Lionel & Clark as well as Lionel's character in those episodes null & void. I'm not sure what he knew, but I think he did know Clark was an alien (not where he came from or what his weakness was). He knew the serum his doctors were experimenting with came from Clark's blood. I would think that a serum that revives the dead would be somewhat of a giveaway that Clark is special. That incident with Jonathan & the key in Legacy must have proved it to him. Shooting Jason in Forever when Jason was already in a compromised position was done for a reason. In Talisman, Lionel said it himself that he always knew there were people of accomplishing such feats (being invulnerable to bullets & running incredibly fast) after seeing Jeremiah do it. It was really since then that Lionel's intentions, for me anyway, have been mysterious.

[Watching Smallville]

Originally posted by xrayvision
I still think he knew about his abilities before (definitely had suspicions). After seeing Jeremiah doing his feats, he said he knew that there were humans who could do things like that. I also think he shot Jason for a reason, and unless he knew or remembered something from Transference, he would not have shot him.

I think his suspicions of Clark's invulnerabilities from Red were verified in Insurgence after he shot Pine. He was right behind Pine when he shot him, so that bullet must have gone through him and into Clark who was in front of Pine. He probably knew that too since Clark's voice would have given him away.

As far as his knowledge of all things Kryptonian, I agree that he knew since Commencement.
Yes, I think this sums up the Lionel learning curve very well.

[LastFatherOfKrypton]

Well xrayvision!

You clarified that well, thanks!

[hotkk]

And know that he knows. it's time for it to have confrontation with Lex about it and, by the end of the series, be killed by his own son :)

[photogirl]

I took it that he knew since Commencement, but that really bothered me because since Clark remembered what happened in Transference wouldn't Lionel remember too? Maybe not, though. It could've affected Clark differently, I guess.

[myankskent]

I thought that it would be revealed that he knew in transference but I guess not. He must have forgotten about what happened to him in that episode but never forgot his time as JorEl.

[Keyser Soze]

Since Lionel has known for so long does this mean that Lionels actions since Commencement have been good?

He talked about the world needing Clark and ever since he has tried to hinder Lex and steer him away from his path. Is Lex's and Clark's future so obvious to Lionel or does he have some ability to prophesize the future like Jor-el did with the coming of Brainiac and the other two Krytonian.