Has Smallville Jumped the Shark? [Archive] - Page 2 - KSiteTV Television & Movie Forums

Nospam

09-26-2006, 12:05 PM

Originally posted by Damali
Having "name" guest stars is nothing new for Smallville:

Christopher Reeve
Margot Kidder
Terrance Stamp (voice)
Jane Seymour
Carrie Fisher
Tom Wapot
James Masters
Michael Mckean.....AoT husband
Ian Somerhalder
Jesse Metcalfe
Alan Ritchson.....American Idol turned Aquabro'
Denise Quinones.... She won Miss Universe or something
Lee Thompson Young....I use to watch The Famous Jett Jackson
and others...

I don't think named guest stars hurt Smallville, it's something the show has been doing for a while. IMO, TPTB are tring to bring in new viewers, across different demos. But when you look at the characters the guest stars are playing this season, I don't see a problem.

The Wrestler guy is from the Phathom Zone, Tori Spelling is playing a gossip columist at the DP and Bow Wow may or may not be linked to Lex and Ollie (?). I rather wait-and-see the actual episodes.

I agree you with that stunt casting on Smallville is not new, just that the choices that were made bear little to no resemblance to the mythos, Superman or the comics. If you look through the list of guest stars almost all of them are directly connected to Smallville through the Superman movies or as co-stars from other TV series. Some of the actors came aboard as guest stars for multi episode arcs, but on the whole the choices did not shout gimmick. The same cannot be said of Batista, Bow Wow and Tori Spelling. It's like the CW executives just pulled names out of a hat and told AlMiles, "Here are your special guest stars for this season".

To the credit of AlMiles, in a recent interview they mentioned that the CW was pushing some stunt casting on them and they balked with the explanation that if you wanted to stunt cast on Smallville it would make more sense to add DC comics characters rather than some random star.

Fly by guy

09-26-2006, 01:19 PM

I stated in another thread that they have saddled that shark and are riding off into the sunset with their leather jacket and 2 thumbs up, ayyyyyy.
Guests stars for Flash, Aqua, and Cyborg gave them numbers based on the characters not the stars. Does anyone really think Justin, Bow Wow, Tori, or Batista is going to do Aquaman type numbers? The days of Rosetta type hype is gone. If they were doing the show for the numbers they would have left Clana alone, forgotten Lexana, and not kill Jonathon Kent. Oops, left out the forgettable Lexod. Sorry. I just wish TPTB were.

nipvillesmlltuk

09-26-2006, 01:21 PM

Ok, then. I just had a horrific thought, though. I couldn't help but think that maybe they're trying to rush everything that happens in Clark's life, hence the series finale happening this season(I am NOT saying it actually is the season finale). I don't know how many seasons it's out for. It just seems to me that all the stunt casting stuff might be linked to Clark finally fulfilling his destiny: Lois working as a reporter, Lana possibly pregnant, the Justice League happening, etc...:confused: :(

sirconical

09-26-2006, 01:23 PM

Originally posted by Migu-El
Seriously some of you guys are already saying that this season is horrible before it even starts. Atleast wait and see what happens after September 28 then u can talk about how bad the season will be.:o Yeah that happened with season 5. I only started coming on here during season 4, so I really don't know if it happened with the others. It probably did though. Hell, probably had people bashing it before season 1 had begun!

Timester

09-26-2006, 01:42 PM

Originally posted by Migu-El
Seriously some of you guys are already saying that this season is horrible before it even starts. Atleast wait and see what happens after September 28 then u can talk about how bad the season will be.:o

Perhaps because this season 6 and we know how the things work? Remember "Spell"? We already knew 2 months before about it? Remember "Thrist" and "Reckoning"?

Damali

09-26-2006, 01:55 PM

Originally posted by Nospam
.... the choices that were made bear little to no resemblance to the mythos, Superman or the comics.

I disagree with this point. Batista, is playing a character escaping from the Phathom Zone and the PZ is part of Superman Mythos. Tori Spelling is playing gossip columnist at the DP, her character might be very Cat Grant-like. As for Bow Wow, he could be playing a DC character or have a shared history with Lex and Ollie. Its seems stunt casting or not, these guest aren't playing themselves and are being worked in to the story arcs.

.. If you look through the list of guest stars almost all of them are directly connected to Smallville through the Superman movies or as co-stars from other TV series. Some of the actors came aboard as guest stars for multi episode arcs, but on the whole the choices did not shout gimmick. The same cannot be said of Batista, Bow Wow and Tori Spelling. It's like the CW executives just pulled names out of a hat and told AlMiles, "Here are your special guest stars for this season".

True, the list I posted contains guest stars connected to Smallvile in various ways, but lets be fair, using Tom Wapot and having him and JS ride around Smallville in a fast car, was a little gimmicky. Same thing with James Marsters using 'spikes' to kill people.

The newest celebs may be more obvious, and the CW may be forcing this, but spoilers so far aren't that bad IMO.

I think the real problem might be, the type of celeb that is guest starring. Wrestling is considered lowbrow to some. Tori is more famous because of her family and Bow Wow is teenage rapper. But then again my sister likes the All-American Rejects, I don't, and I don't want too, but no one is really complaining about them and their guest spot.

I chalk this up to The CW doing whatever they have to do, to increase ratings, but as of now it just doesn't bother me.

myankskent

09-26-2006, 02:08 PM

Originally posted by bluehybrid69
How is it that a show can be so good at times, and at others be so dissapointing. WHY do we have to start getting 'name' actors and that is a long shot - by that I mean why are they getting Tori Spelling and Bow Wow??? No offense, but that is going to hurt the image of the show in a negative way. Am I the only one who feels that the new guest stars are going to hurt the show?

The guest stars are to pump up the ratings after a disasterous finish to season 5. The writers want this show to go at least 7 seasons so they need to get the ratings up with these guest stars. I have no problem with guest stars, but if they end up being the main attraction while we watch the main characters on this show spin their wheels, then yes, the guest stars will hurt the show. The main priority should be Clark and Lex, everyone else should be second to them and I'm not getting the feeling that this is the case in season 6.

gj430

09-26-2006, 02:29 PM

but what I don't understand is how is it suppose to be to boost ratings if people are obviously having problems with them. Casual viewers don't have a clue about these people being on the show, so why would they think putting these people in would boost ratings if the people finding out about it for the most part aren't liking it. Or is it that they are donig thinking we will like it and then it has the opposite effect. I don't know but I think maybe they are just putting some people on the show knowing full well some will like it and some won't. I don't something about about C list stars doesn't scream ratings to me. Maybe they are just putting them in there because they feel like it.

Pal-El

09-26-2006, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by gj430
but what I don't understand is how is it suppose to be to boost ratings if people are obviously having problems with them. Casual viewers don't have a clue about these people being on the show, so why would they think putting these people in would boost ratings if the people finding out about it for the most part aren't liking it. Or is it that they are donig thinking we will like it and then it has the opposite effect. I don't know but I think maybe they are just putting some people on the show knowing full well some will like it and some won't. I don't something about about C list stars doesn't scream ratings to me. Maybe they are just putting them in there because they feel like it.

They will advertise the guest stars as and when an episode is near showing. Obviously in an attempt to attract new viewers. Maybe they dont realise the diehard fans arent impressed. Or maybe they do, and dont care since they know we will keep tuning in week in week out. Even the ones that threaten to never watch the show again. (Like some on these boards who have made such empty threats)

myankskent

09-26-2006, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by gj430
but what I don't understand is how is it suppose to be to boost ratings if people are obviously having problems with them. Casual viewers don't have a clue about these people being on the show, so why would they think putting these people in would boost ratings if the people finding out about it for the most part aren't liking it. Or is it that they are donig thinking we will like it and then it has the opposite effect. I don't know but I think maybe they are just putting some people on the show knowing full well some will like it and some won't. I don't something about about C list stars doesn't scream ratings to me. Maybe they are just putting them in there because they feel like it.

Casual viewers will notice these guest stars in the promos for the show or in their local newspaper. My local paper, the New York Newsday, always advertises the WB shows so chances are, this is done across the country in the big markets.

D.M.A.

09-26-2006, 02:59 PM

I agree,nothin new or sumthin to make a big deal out of...Besides if it helps then why not,long as the actual show isn't hurtin I'm cool wit it.Sum actors I may not agree wit at first but if they come off good on camera then be my guess,but I don't think this is unusual tho.SV has done this in the past as sum have listed guest

Nospam

09-26-2006, 03:00 PM

Originally posted by Damali
I disagree with this point. Batista, is playing a character escaping from the Phathom Zone and the PZ is part of Superman Mythos. Tori Spelling is playing gossip columnist at the DP, her character might be very Cat Grant-like. As for Bow Wow, he could be playing a DC character or have a shared history with Lex and Ollie. Its seems stunt casting or not, these guest aren't playing themselves and are being worked in to the story arcs.

True, the list I posted contains guest stars connected to Smallvile in various ways, but lets be fair, using Tom Wapot and having him and JS ride around Smallville in a fast car, was a little gimmicky. Same thing with James Masters using 'spikes' to kill people.

The newest celebs may be more obvious, and the CW may be forcing this, but spoilers so far aren't that bad IMO.

I think the real problem might be, the type of celeb that is guest starring. Wrestling is considered lowbrow to some. Tori is more famous because of her family and Bow Wow is teenage rapper. But then again my sister likes the All-American Rejects, I don't, and I don't want too, but no one is really complaining about them and their guest spot.

I chalk this up to The CW doing whatever they have to do, to increase ratings, but as of now it just doesn't bother me.

When AlMiles are complaining that CW brass are pushing stars onto the show that don't belong then you know something is wrong. These new stars have none of the appeal or connectedness to the show that James Marsters or Tom Wopat did, so if you thought that Tom Wopat was contrived, Tori Spelling screams it. Personally, I thought that Tom Wopat was a fun addition to the show as was James Marsters.

That said, how good or bad these stars turn out to be depends entirely on execution. As much as I think that Tori Spelling has no place on Smallville, I do think that she could do a credible job as a DP gossip columnist. Despite my initially negative reaction, I am keeping an open mind about this season as much as possible.

Closet Cloiser

09-26-2006, 03:08 PM

I don't know about you guys, and this may seem a little childish, but I'm pumped Bow Wow is going to be on the show. :D

Reason being, I sold the guy 4 XBOX 360's not too long ago. Just knowing that and being able to point at the TV while watching one of my favorite shows and say "I sold that guy his XBOX's!" is more than enough to make me like it. He has acting experience as well, so hopefull it won't be too bad!

Again, it might seem a little petty, but hey, I'll take what I can get. At least now I can say that I've met someone from Smallville :lol:

BTW I voted bad anyway, I don't much like seeing big names on shows like this. :\

The Astronomer

09-26-2006, 03:20 PM

I just finished a "Lois and Clark" marathon (Seasons 1-3), and I enjoyed seeing Raquel Welch, Bruce Campbell, James Earl Jones and others in their roles. I'm waiting to see the results before I say good or bad.

Generally, I dislike the practice because it is usually to bring in new viewers, boost ratings, etc., not enhance the story. Smallville's use of actors from prior Superman related movies and television is, to me, a positive nod to the actor and the devoted fans.

A Magician

09-26-2006, 04:16 PM

It jumped the shark awhile ago

j03superbat

09-26-2006, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by bluehybrid69
Am I the only one who feels that the new guest stars are going to hurt the show?
No - as far as Bow Wow and Batista are concerned, I agree with you. I couldn't care less about Tori Spelling showing up - to me she's just another actress and while I don't understand the negative reaction to her casting, I'm also not the slightest bit inclined to watch her episode for any reason.

But IMHO - the show jumped the shark at least two seasons ago - around the time we got introduced to Lois Lane, subsequently followed by her running the Talon with Martha, then becoming her campaign manager, and then her Chief of Staff (last I checked, that position has some pretty damn big shoes to fill, and not only does it not get handed out to just anyone, but would look very good on a resume for someone applying to anywhere).

Yeah, stunt casting's among the least of Smallville's problems.

Wildfire

09-26-2006, 05:46 PM

I want to give them a chance now that they are free of Superman movie and wont have to worry about a sequal, they may actualy do soemthing good this year. . .

Ok maybe its wishful thinking but I at least think I should give them to mid season.

HalJordan4184

09-27-2006, 03:19 AM

what do you mean they won't have to worry about a sequel. Superman Returns sequel is tentatively set for a 2009 release. THe sequel though has been confirmed.

Also, Smallville jumped the shark at the start of season three, when CLark developed a drug dependency, and became a bank robber. At that point, he lost pretty much all credibility as far as being Superman went.

Wildfire

09-27-2006, 04:53 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HalJordan4184
what do you mean they won't have to worry about a sequel. Superman Returns sequel is tentatively set for a 2009 release. THe sequel though has been confirmed.

Also, Smallville jumped the shark at the start of season three, when CLark developed a drug dependency, and became a bank robber. At that point, he lost pretty much all credibility as far as being Superman went. [/QUOTE

The sequel is scheldued for 09 but this show has ab out a year left so they wont be as contrained plus with Superman Returns box office figures from this summer being as they were I for see a change at least in director if not more before they make another.

Pal-El

09-27-2006, 05:07 AM

The sequel is scheldued for 09 but this show has ab out a year left so they wont be as contrained plus with Superman Returns box office figures from this summer being as they were I for see a change at least in director if not more before they make another.

They arent changing the director. The sequel is still Singers.

Lightning Flash

09-27-2006, 05:54 AM

Personally, Bow Wow is a good choice... for the young audience... and Tori Spelling could be good for Baywatch/Tori Spelling fanatics.

Kryptonian-Ronin

09-27-2006, 12:11 PM

While jumping the shark is a bad thing, its been humping the pooch for awhile and that is even worse.

ineedkrypton

09-27-2006, 12:40 PM

i don't think it's jumped the shark yet, but it may be on the ramp at current

gbsrnumber5

09-27-2006, 03:38 PM

This show has definitely not jumped the shark...it is definitely taken its own course, and the writers cant please everyone. I'm not too impressed with the show's direction, but its not my show so I'm just enjoying the ride.

CallMeClark

09-28-2006, 04:12 AM

Bow Wow actually makes me sick... I don't want him on that show!

1.21 gigawatts

09-28-2006, 04:14 AM

"Jumped the shark"? I know the reference, but I'd much rather say "raped by a panda." For those of you that understand that reference...

But yeah, if you get that reference, it means the same thing as "jumped the shark." The show is scraping the bottom of the barrel. And I do believe the show that originated the term "raped by a panda" hit that point at least five years ago. Smallville certainly has.

jimmyolsenblues

09-28-2006, 05:57 AM

I bet the smallville budget has increased because this new CW channel is pushing hard with advertising. Here is the number one slot thursday at 8pm, and smallville has to be considered the flagship of the Cw channel. So that shows me that "Name" actors can come to show because the budget, and more power is behind the show and network then before.

HalJordan4184

09-28-2006, 06:09 AM

I don't see any "name" actors. I see at best B list actors, and more commonly C list actors, with little to no fame outside of an extremely young audience. And a wrestler, can't forget the wrestler.

I'd also bet Smallville's budget isn't up at all, especially citing Steve DeKnight, and him saying they couldn't do a two part opener because of the budget constraints.

DMA2Superman

09-28-2006, 07:27 AM

Originally posted by 1.21 gigawatts
"Jumped the shark"? I know the reference, but I'd much rather say "raped by a panda." For those of you that understand that reference...

But yeah, if you get that reference, it means the same thing as "jumped the shark." The show is scraping the bottom of the barrel. And I do believe the show that originated the term "raped by a panda" hit that point at least five years ago. Smallville certainly has.

OK, for the reference challenged, please give me the definition of "Jumping the Shark" and "Raping the Panda". Gracias.

Ares

09-28-2006, 07:39 AM

Most episodes will suck but we'll still continue to watch them . Why? cuz its they're we like the story of Superman. If I had a quarter everytime I seen a thread with " Smallville Jumping the shark " I'd have like 55 dollars. I'd take that 55 dollars an buy the New dvd box . That way I wouldnt have to use my own money I worked for. So lets look forward to the New Smallville with open arms.

DMA2Superman

09-28-2006, 10:00 AM

Jumping the shark
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fonzie jumps over a shark while on water skis. Jumping the shark is a metaphor that was originally used to denote the tipping point at which a TV series is deemed to have passed its peak. Once a show has "jumped the shark", fans sense a noticeable decline in quality or feel the show has undergone too many changes to retain its original charm. Jumping the shark
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

Fonzie jumps over a shark while on water skis.Jumping the shark is a metaphor that was originally used to denote the tipping point at which a TV series is deemed to have passed its peak. Once a show has "jumped the shark", fans sense a noticeable decline in quality or feel the show has undergone too many changes to retain its original charm. The term has also evolved to describe other areas of pop culture, including movie series, music, or acting celebrities or authors for whom a drastic change was seen as the beginning of the end. These changes are often attempts to attract their fans' waning attention with over-the-top statements or increasingly overt appeals to sex or violence. Some have broadened its use to simply describe any decline in appeal for the subject in question, without requiring a significant "jump the shark" moment as justification.

Jump-the-shark moments are typically scenes that finally convince viewers that the show has fundamentally and permanently strayed from its original premise. In these cases, they are viewed as a desperate and futile attempt to keep a series fresh in the face of a decline in ratings. In other cases, the departure or replacement of a main cast member or character or a significant change in setting changes a critical dynamic of the show.

Origin
The phrase specifically arises from a scene in the hit TV comedy series Happy Days. Towards the end of the show's run, the writers were challenged to come up with new, fresh stories; they developed a story where Arthur "Fonzie" Fonzarelli is on water skis, wearing his trademark leather jacket despite the well-known negative effects of salt water on leather, and, quite literally, jumps over a shark.

Many have noted the shark episode as the moment when they realized the show was no longer worth watching, considering the scene to be unrealistic and of poor quality, making it impossible to maintain suspension of disbelief. Even before "jumping the shark" was employed as a pop culture term, the episode in question was cited many times as an example of what can happen to otherwise high-quality shows when they stay on the air too long in the face of waning interest. Producer Garry Marshall later admitted that he knew the show had lost something as the crew prepared to shoot the scene. However, as he pointed out in the reunion special that aired on February 3, 2005, Happy Days went on to produce approximately 100 more episodes after the "jumping the shark" episode. During the same special, in response to an audience member's question, Marshall introduced the notorious clip and noted how the show had inspired the term.
or whom a drastic change was seen as the beginning of the end. These changes are often attempts to attract their fans' waning attention with over-the-top statements or increasingly overt appeals to sex or violence. Some have broadened its use to simply describe any decline in appeal for the subject in question, without requiring a significant "jump the shark" moment as justification.

Jump-the-shark moments are typically scenes that finally convince viewers that the show has fundamentally and permanently strayed from its original premise. In these cases, they are viewed as a desperate and futile attempt to keep a series fresh in the face of a decline in ratings. In other cases, the departure or replacement of a main cast member or character or a significant change in setting changes a critical dynamic of the show.

Origin
The phrase specifically arises from a scene in the hit TV comedy series Happy Days. Towards the end of the show's run, the writers were challenged to come up with new, fresh stories; they developed a story where Arthur "Fonzie" Fonzarelli is on water skis, wearing his trademark leather jacket despite the well-known negative effects of salt water on leather, and, quite literally, jumps over a shark.

Many have noted the shark episode as the moment when they realized the show was no longer worth watching, considering the scene to be unrealistic and of poor quality, making it impossible to maintain suspension of disbelief. Even before "jumping the shark" was employed as a pop culture term, the episode in question was cited many times as an example of what can happen to otherwise high-quality shows when they stay on the air too long in the face of waning interest. Producer Garry Marshall later admitted that he knew the show had lost something as the crew prepared to shoot the scene. However, as he pointed out in the reunion special that aired on February 3, 2005, Happy Days went on to produce approximately 100 more episodes after the "jumping the shark" episode. During the same special, in response to an audience member's question, Marshall introduced the notorious clip and noted how the show had inspired the term.

Maybe we are "jumping the gun" or "putting the cart before the horse". This season could amaze us all.

Eh,Man?You-El?

09-28-2006, 10:36 AM

"Raped By a Panda" refers to a Simpsons episode where Homer is trapped in a panda suit and is ... *ahem*.

IMHO, the worst of the Simpsons episodes are still better than the best of the "Family Guy" episodes. (Peter Griffin: "Remember the time I [insert non-sequiter here] with [insert non-sequiter here] ?")

Ares

09-28-2006, 10:39 AM

There was never an episode of Smallville that was amazing..

Family Guy owns simpsons.. Simpsons isnt funny its just stupid they try to be funny but its humor for an 8 yr old. Oh an yeah.. Go Smallville an woo for the jumping of the sharks

j03superbat

09-28-2006, 01:53 PM

Originally posted by Ares
Most episodes will suck but we'll still continue to watch them . Why? cuz its they're we like the story of Superman.
Assuming you meant to say, "cuz we like to watch the story of Superman" (and correct me if I'm wrong, by all means), some of us feel that this isn't the story of Superman. This is the story of Clark Kent whom we are led to assume will one day put on tights and fight for justice under the moniker Superman despite the fact that Clark has already done things that are outright against the morals of Superman and whose only excuse to brush everything under the rug every week was that "he wasn't under his own influence" (even though that doesn't make everything OK) and that even Tom Welling doesn't want to put on a costume.

Yyyyyyyyyeah, I stopped watching a show about Superman and started watching a show about a pretty boy with superpowers a while ago. Then the entertainment factor started to go...

MidgardDragon

09-28-2006, 03:38 PM

How many times have people claimed Smallville's jumped the shark now? *starts a list to see how many different places different people think it's jumping the shark*.

What's this about Bow Wow, though? That one might make me groan a little more than Tori Spelling did, but it could be much much worse.

Coyote

09-28-2006, 04:53 PM

I think this is "jumped the shark" thread number 15,276. Most of them created by people who will still watch the show every week and come here to write thousands of posts about it. Mostly whining about how much they don't like it. As they continue to watch it every week....

Timester

09-28-2006, 05:00 PM

STFanatic

09-28-2006, 09:52 PM

I had to jump (pun intended) to the rumors area to find out who or what a Batista was (I thought someone was masking a vulgarity) I still am not sure about a Bow Wow (one of Shelby's pals? As for Tori Spelling she I have heard of.
Then again, I am an old fogy ;)

I felt a jump or maybe at least a skip back when they had Jor-El and Lana's aunt do the dirty deed just to appease some of the Clana fans.

The episode I am looking forward to is Justice.

Eckyboy

09-29-2006, 07:19 AM

Personally I think Smallville jumped the shark at the beginning of Season 4 with the lame Clark alter-ego cop-out flying sequence and the pointless arrival of Lois Lane. Season 5 and the whole stupid Lex as Zod storyline have confirmed this in spades. It also never ceases to amaze me the ignorance of some people who believe that unless you are saying something positive and cheery about their show then you must have something wrong with you. Last time I checked we all have the right to express our opinions. Blind faith loyalty is a far worse trait to have.

Crispin Glover

09-29-2006, 09:03 AM

It's terrible, especially when they can't act. I mean if Smallville gets Carrie Fischer on for one episode and then never uses her again than it can't be good to have Spelling and Bow Wow on. It will focus the episode on them and not where it needs to be focused on, which is our main characters!

Immortal

09-30-2006, 12:50 PM

I personally am only looking forward to Tori Spelling's appearance. Batista and Bow Wow are crap on a stick.

jonpetersbites

10-02-2006, 09:43 AM

The show has definitely took its own course, but it really kind of had to and still has to in order to make 6+ seasons out of this particular portion of the Superman mythos. Various comic stories have dealt with Clark's years in Smallville, but not extensively unless you count Pre-Crisis Superboy. The original movie had only 20 minutes or so of Smallville backstory (which served as somewhat of a blueprint for this show). Superman III featured Smallville (regrettably, glad SR retconned that out) The Superboy TV show brought some episodes to Smallville, and so did Lois & Clark, and those made for some of the best episodes of those shows, but they weren't memorable enough to be considered canonical or "semi-canonical". The WB's lineup of teen shows made for the perfect environment to tell this story. Warners' rights aside, I can't imagine this show ever having been picked up on CBS, NBC, FOX, UPN, or even ABC, which ran Lois & Clark.

I would have loved to see future TV or silver screen movies based off of the show featuring Tom Welling as Superman once the series ended, much like Star Trek has managed to do about half of the time, and like the idea of expanding the X-Files franchise with more films beyond the first one done during the series, but with the Superman film franchise firmly reestablished with SR, it ain't gonna happen. And I think Tom Welling had stated years ago he wasn't wild with the idea of playing the Superman character. So you have to finish the story that the series set out to be told, and do it well enough that series and characters will continue to stand on their own, even with and especially with its many contradictions to the films and comics. I can honestly say that I like the character of Clark Kent on Smallville for different reasons than I do Chris Reeves' or Brandon Routh's Superman.

All that said, I hope that they don't get so tied up with finshing the various storylines that have weaved throughout the show that they spend all of their time in the last episodes of the show finishing the Smallville mythos and then give us just a glimpse with an episode or two of the Superman mythos. The whole show has been about introducing Superman, so I hope that they make it quite obvious at least 10-12 episodes out that they are headed there. Clark doesn't need to decide to be a DP reporter, and Superman, and get a disguise wearing glasses, and have his costume created, and move to Metropolis, and learn to fly, and show up for the first time as Superman all in one episode. They need to do all of those things with enough storytelling space to show how all the Smallville characters will react to those major events. If Al and Miles can do that effectively, then every event, piece of backstory, and even guest star, will have served to give the show's payoff some serious weightiness to it, making the series stand on its own apart from Superman while at the same time enhancing Superman's best qualities in future stories to be told.

As an aside, I just got a funny mental image: What if in the episode Justice, our five heroes find themselves at the Metropolis Zoo in pursuit of a super-powered kryptonite freak to be played by guest star Henry Winkler. At some point all six people have to jump over a giant shark tank......

jackieTHEjokeman

10-06-2006, 09:03 AM

So far they are 0 for 2 this year. I'll give it 4 or 5 more flops before I label this show "jumped the shark". They are not explaining anything in the show anymore. Is Clark still sick? Exactly how did Clark's mom and Lois not die from the plane crash? Amongst others...

JLA

10-06-2006, 09:24 AM

I disagree with your assertion that the show is 0 for 2 so far. As far as the plane crash goes, it was explained that Jor-El brought them to the fortress-obviously to protect them. Do they really need to discuss it in further depth? Not for me.

As far as Clark still being sick - he had a cold in "Sneeze" and appeared to be getting over it by the end of the episode. What more "explaining" are you looking for?

I am very pleased with the season so far - especially the humor shown between Clark and Chloe. Overall, I think the show is alive and well - no sharks in sight!

thehenry89

10-06-2006, 09:30 AM

(sighs) another jump the shark thread.

jackieTHEjokeman

10-06-2006, 09:49 AM

Originally posted by thehenry89
(sighs) another jump the shark thread.

Yup, you're right. Crap. I usualy do a search for the topic I want to talk about first....Except this time of course. I'm changing it right now.

son2380

10-06-2006, 12:37 PM

How did Clark get sick I thought that was impossible

shirkie

10-06-2006, 12:51 PM

Clark apparently picked up some kind of bug while he was in the Phantom Zone. Martha had that discussion with him in the Kents' kitchen, remember?

I don't think this was a "Jump the Shark" episode. I always hesitate to use that phrase because that means a show is perpetually downhill from there. There have been some downright clunkers (notably "Ageless" with that exploding baby), but nothing that I would deem as signifying the end of all good "Smallville" episodes or the point of no return.
shirkie

son2380

10-06-2006, 01:06 PM

I haven't seen it yet

I guess you haven't seen season 5 yet. That was the bottom of the totem pole

Kara15

10-06-2006, 01:41 PM

I don't think this season has jumped the shark quite yet. Just hope there'll be no witches, vampires, or exploding babies.

xrayvision

10-06-2006, 07:21 PM

Well, there are Kryptonian phantoms, and that seems like something very stupid and very far from the direction of the show's original intent. Regular Kryptonians makes sense. But phantoms? Why then don't the phantoms of everyone who died on Krypton not invading Earth?

Spirit Detective

10-06-2006, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by xrayvision
Well, there are Kryptonian phantoms, and that seems like something very stupid and very far from the direction of the show's original intent. Regular Kryptonians makes sense. But phantoms? Why then don't the phantoms of everyone who died on Krypton not invading Earth?

TPTB retconned a retcon. In Vessel, Jor-El tells Clark that Zod could only escape the phantom zone if he had a body - "a vessel to inhabit". Now we find out that phantoms CAN escape the Zone without a body?

STFanatic

10-23-2006, 12:05 PM

Jumped the minnow right now, the shark is circling.
:lol:

DWBSR620

10-23-2006, 06:15 PM

It hasn't jumped the shark. Take care.

Peace To All.

avidreader

10-24-2006, 06:29 PM

It will never jump the shark because to jump the shark would mean that all the characters would end up at their destination, including Clark putting on the suit.

And when they decide to do all that, the show is over.

SVilleGal03

10-27-2006, 10:27 PM

Through 115 episodes thus far, I would say that Smallville has not yet "jumped the shark"; however, I would say that on several occasions, there has been some fin showing (namely, the Lana/Isobel-Teagues-elements stuff from S4).

/) /) /)
~^~~~^~~~^~~~~

*cue theme from Jaws* :D :lol:

TKI

10-28-2006, 08:48 AM

bow wow's acting isn't so bad haha. and who cares if they're getting big name random stars to play random people from the phantom zone, did that park ranger chick have anything to do with the superman mythos? no, it's just a random freak of the week from the phantom zone. it'll just boost smallville's popularity to have these big name stars on is the way i see it.

Kal-ed

10-29-2006, 04:02 AM

How many times has SV jumped the shark acoording to fans???, SV would have to have flight abilites of their own to jump as many sharks as fans have stated. So this thread´s name should be changed to: Has SV flown over the shark infested watters??

chlarkfan333

10-29-2006, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by Kal-ed
How many times has SV jumped the shark acoording to fans???, SV would have to have flight abilites of their own to jump as many sharks as fans have stated. So this thread´s name should be changed to: Has SV flown over the shark infested watters??
:lol: :lol:

Fly by guy

10-30-2006, 02:55 PM

SV lost it's momentum on the jump and just got a huge bite taken out of it. The shark is full but it is SV that sometimes looks alittle bloated. The good news is this season is showing some continuity. The bad news is there are alot less fans to see it.

avidreader

10-30-2006, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by Fly by guy
SV lost it's momentum on the jump and just got a huge bite taken out of it. The shark is full but it is SV that sometimes looks alittle bloated. The good news is this season is showing some continuity. The bad news is there are alot less fans to see it.

In the Male 18-34 Demographic, last Thursday, Smallville came second to the Baseball.

They're still on target for their key audience.

Sid

11-03-2006, 03:30 PM

bring big names wil boost rating, its been lagging abit

HotRodTE

11-28-2006, 09:56 AM

I say yes, it happened when Lex and lana got kissed and got together. and i'm not a clana fan that just my opinon.

jumping the Shark---> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

michel

11-28-2006, 01:10 PM

i dunno.. but i see alot of good stuff coming up (if the writers are as clever as i think they are)

Tia

11-28-2006, 05:46 PM

I agree with Michel, the writers just need to be more clever. It would also help if the budget was increased. I think the show will continue for another season because HELLO it is still the highest rated show on CW whoooo!

cloisinmyheart

11-28-2006, 07:19 PM

well at first. i totally thought it jumped the shark because of the new characters ollie and jimmy
but they seem to fit in well with the plot. but jimmys useless

clois isnt even developed yet, so the writers can have a good time with that

but yeah lana getting pregnant with lex is straying way too far from the original comics

Kal26

11-28-2006, 07:30 PM

if you want to talk about straying from the origional comics how about Clark meeting Lois in Highschool or even having a friend named Chloe?

You also have to decide which line of comics you want to follow. But I do get your point. I think we have to remember that this isn't the story of superman from the comics. This is a totally different version of sups than we have ever seen, and I like it! I don't think there's anything wrong with the show.

I mean no offense to anyone on this site when I say this because clearly you are all devoted fans, but the only thing wrong with smallville is that it has a large number of fans who are too willing to be over critical of what could be the best show ever put on television. Give it a chance, the writters will come through.

hassenmorad

11-28-2006, 10:05 PM

Originally posted by HotRodTE
I say yes, it happened when Lex and lana got kissed and got together.

Yea, I think that's when it happened too. Many have said that Smallville Jumped the Shark long ago, but I think it was last season, when Lexana started.

FrankTJMackey

11-28-2006, 10:28 PM

season 7 will be disappointing because seasons 5 and 6 came before it. these two seasons should have never happened. period.

cryptus

11-29-2006, 08:35 AM

Season 4 was the worst overall Season ever.

biaaly

11-29-2006, 08:42 AM

What was wrong with season 5? I actually happened to like it, and I like this season as well, (not Static though, and not nearly enough Clark) but it hasn't been the worst! Actually I liked season 4 as well LOL, but that's probably my Lois bias talking..

HalJordan4184

11-29-2006, 10:44 AM

I mean no offense to anyone on this site when I say this because clearly you are all devoted fans, but the only thing wrong with smallville is that it has a large number of fans who are too willing to be over critical of what could be the best show ever put on television. Give it a chance, the writters will come through.

That right there is the exact problem. We've waited six years for what COULD be the best show on television. It COULD have been great, it COULD have been stellar, it COULD have been ground breaking and trendsetting. It IS none of those things. I'm tired of waiting for the writers to pull through. They've shown time and again they can't. Heck, when you fire your first and second season writers, who wrote the shows highest rated episodes to that point, you have problems.

Also, it's not being over critical of someone, to point out what to them is an obviously glaring flaw. THis Clark will never be Superman. He will never ever, because of the writing and portrayal of the character on this show, be anything close to what has come before. That's a flaw, when the goal of the show was so show us how the Clark of the comics, Lois and Clark, or even the Reeve movies came to be. We aren't getting that. We're getting a how a Clark who is nothing like Clark Kent's of before, will grow up to become nothing like the Superman's of before. Why even bother making the show about him then?

FrankTJMackey

11-29-2006, 10:51 AM

season 5 is a total con with "theme" episodes and the icky Lexana foreshadowing. TPTB are so brazen this year, that they can't even *attempt* to pull one over on us. they got away with it for one year, but this season, their bluff was called. if anyone thinks this year isn't as bad as it is because of last year, then you're lost. there was NEVER a plan for this series to go past high school, which is PAINFULLY obvious. there was NO thought, even in season 4, about where this was going for season 5 or 6 if they were lucky enough to extend it that far. season 5, but now the dismal season 7 with seasons 5 and 6 in tow, IS in every possible/conceiveable way, the training and realization of superman.

instead, it's the let's-make-a-joke-out-of-a-franchise/legacy/mythology/young cast/television network tv show, and say all the DC characters knew each other as kids and make it so NO SANE person could think that lois and clark should end up together.

season 5 hooks us simply because it's a con. then why have jonathan die? what in God's name has clark been doing for 3 years after jonathan dies besides watch green arrow feel up the love of his life? NOTHING!

this whole thing is a disaster of the highest order. I remember just a month ago that fans were vehemently fighting, yet still, over the worthiness of this show. now, NO ONE will disagree that this show is nothing more than a...

SH*T STEW.

Kids, this is what it looks like when a once likeable tv show goes KABOOIE. Whoops, it's over.

kickarse

11-29-2006, 12:50 PM

It has definitely jumped the shark... I've curious as to why there isn't a place for it on the site www.jumptheshark.com

xrayvision

11-29-2006, 01:54 PM

I believe it jumped the shark with the witch arc. Though it may be one of the only shows that after that had at least half a stellar season (they screwed up very badly with Reckoning and some of the episodes after). Reckoning should have been about Fine exposing Clark's secret to Lana while being revealed to have been Lana's astronomy professor at Met U. Him doing that could have been done as a HUGE distraction to Clark so that he could continue his plans. The big mistake was making this Lex-Lana arc and not having enough stuff with Marsters, who was awesome.

Another big mistake of the show was having Lex & Clark become enemies over a girl. They were setting it up great in the 1st three seasons & had it set up perfectly at the end of season 3 for Lex and Clark to become enemies over Lex's tactics when fighting with Lionel and his obsession with Clark and the mysteries surrounding him. If they would have combined that with his intense interest in the stones from season 4 and the black ship from season 5, Lex by now could have been the evil bastard we expect him to be, with Clark training (which I posted a theory for). Then, season 7 would be the season where Clark would be Superman minus the suit, working on his career and foiling Lex's evil schemes. This show has had an incredible potential, but has failed to even come close to it. Why can people like me who don't even write shows for a living come up with better stuff than they have been showing lately? They are stubborn and refuse to give fans what we want and want to instead feature the idiotic plots that they have been wanting since day 1.

STFanatic

11-29-2006, 02:27 PM

I posted my thoughts in the other Shark thread.

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k292/Startrekfanatic/shark20.jpg

I took this pic on Thanksgiving off the Texas Gulf coast.

xrayvision

11-29-2006, 04:14 PM

I do think they had no clue what they were going to do in season 4 in the summer after season 3. I think this being the case, they decided to throw Lois in the show and see if the s--t stuck. And it obviously didn't. If they had to bring Lois, which I think she is still unneeded, they should have done it this season. She had basically nothing to do the past 2 seasons.

Looking back, season 4 should have included the stones, but no way the witches. And the story behind the stones should have been built in season 4, instead of just ramming it in our faces and having Lex talk about "legend has it that 3 stones when united, blah blah blah". What legend is this? They NEVER, not once ever mentioned such a legend. Now that was stupid.

With season 5, I thought they did a very good job with the episodes up to & including Lockdown. Reckoning totally screwed everything up. As I said before, that episode should have been about Milton Fine being revealed as Lana's astronomy professor, where he would give her the final clue that would expose Clark's secret to her, which would be a major distraction to Clark while Fine continued to do what he was doing. Had they done that, the entire season would have been great, and this would make them use Marsters (who totally worked for the show) far more. The problem with seasons 5 & 6 was that they wanted to have Lexana from day 1. They used this as their reason to make Clark and Lex enemies, which is the single biggest mistake they made. At the end of the 3rd season, they were on the right track, with Clark telling Lex the more he battles Lionel, the more like Lionel he becomes. They also had that incredible statement from Lex about what if Sigeeth is the hero. They should have combined these 2 things along with his obsession into technology & power (like the stones & black ship) to give the true reason why Lex and Clark become enemies. Now that would have been great, dramatic, action-packed TV.

The sad thing is that I posted about the Milton Fine being Lana's professor before Reckoning, so this was not hindsight on my part. I thought this was the logical step for them to take after Lana had those satellite photos and pondered if a ship landed during the 1st meteor shower also. I also posted several ideas about what they should do in season 6 over the summer given the events that happened in Zod, and they are far better than what I have seen this season. It is a shame how little time Clark is getting this season and how other heros and Lexana is getting far more.

FrankTJMackey

11-29-2006, 04:44 PM

the only "out" for TBTB is to officially declare that they know that we know that they know Smallville is an unrecoverable JOKE. just make the shows funny. these episodes of excruciating drudgery where it seems that TBTB think(?) it can pass them off as pacing until the juicy stuff "surprises" us is

F'N EMBARRASSING.

again, just make this virtually a sitcom now. you see, it's teetering on being worse than that at this point. No, wait, so far, season 6 IS worse than a bad sitcom.

a cry out from all of us telling TPTB the ONLY way to spin this is to see how funny you can make it.

DAMN THIS SEASON SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKSSS

Kal26

11-29-2006, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by HalJordan4184

THis Clark will never be Superman. He will never ever, because of the writing and portrayal of the character on this show, be anything close to what has come before. That's a flaw, when the goal of the show was so show us how the Clark of the comics, Lois and Clark, or even the Reeve movies came to be. We aren't getting that. We're getting a how a Clark who is nothing like Clark Kent's of before, will grow up to become nothing like the Superman's of before. Why even bother making the show about him then?

That really wasn't the point of this show. The point of this show was to create a whole new theory on the creation of superman. It's just like a comic. Before crisis how many times was the origin of sups redone or retold? For crying out loud I'm reading three different versions of the story right now. They are creating what they want superman to be.

Of course you'll be disapointed if you already have expectations for seeing the true blue story of superman retold, (and there's nothing wrong with that). But, you have to give them room to be creative and step outside the box a little.

I like the portrayal of clark on smallville. He wasn't born perfect, he had to grow to become superman. Besides the in control, sure of himself attitude of superman was all for show. He was verry clark at heart. He simply knew he had to be bigger than life to comfort the masses. They are showing us the human side of clark.

xrayvision

11-29-2006, 05:31 PM

I still think that he is *very* far from being the Superman we all know.

I don't mind it if the path they take for getting him there is different as long as it doesn't compromise the morals that Superman has (that we know have been instilled in him by his adoptive parents).

I think the angst of this show will make him much different than the Superman in the comics. What would have been great is if they had him meeting Lex in Smallville as they did, but having them grow apart because Lex started fighting Lionel in ways that clashed with the morals that Jonathan & Martha taught Clark to have.

You could see in Shattered how he rebelled against his parents and helped Lex anyway, which was the right thing to do, even though his parents didn't want him in the middle of the danger there was. Even after that, Clark towards the end of season 3( Forsaken, Talisman) started telling Lex that every time he and Lionel clashed, Lex became more like Lionel. This is what they should have played off of. If they would combine this with Lex's theory on how Sigeeth is the hero (showing that he does have morals, but those that are twisted and horribly misguided) and also combine it with his obsession for knowledge & power when dealing with the stones and black ship (which would turn into distrust for Kryptonians), I think they could have created the perfect reason why these 2 became enemies and why Clark realizes there must be a Superman.

Their reason for having to be a Superman now is because of Lana getting taken advantage of by Lex and because some punk archery dude in a green hood and shades yells at him for staying on a farm and not using his powers. These are the wrong reasons for Clark to become Superman. It just shows that this Clark will become Superman for external, not internal reasons--and by doing that, they will create a flawed and compromised Superman.

Kal26

11-29-2006, 05:57 PM

you have a good point, but I think he's just scared. I know at the age clark is in the show right now I would have a hard time strapping on the responsability of being a savior to the world.

He wants to put off his destiny as long as he can because he is still holding on to the idea of being human. At some point in the story of superman he desided to set those ideas aside and stand up for the good of humanity. It wouldn't be very realistic if there wasn't something happening to set him down that path. Superman in all media has always struggled with self confidence. He needs to be shown that we want him here. I don't understand how anyone thought he would be any different as a teen.

I have to agree with your ideas for the storyline though. I don't like to see clark not acting like himself either, but it is a time we all go through human, or super.

I do have to say this. Superman was created by external forces. If there was no crime or natural disasters, there would be no need for clark to become superman. However if he had become superman for internal reasons it would be for pride or self gain and that would be against everything superman stands for. When he became superman, he became selfless.

xrayvision

11-29-2006, 06:05 PM

I still think he should be more scared of facing the zoners without knowing anything about them than being scared of letting go of his human life. All he has to do is visit Jor-El for pointers since Jor-El put them all in the PZ. It would be a step to take before he sacrifices his "normal life" to become Superman. I think it would make it be a whole lot more believable. You said something would have to happen to make him realize and want to become Superman. If this has not already happened with all that has gone wrong (Zod coming back, the 2nd meteor shower, etc), then it would definitely happen as Jor-El teaches him about the zoners' weaknesses and he uses that while he fights them. It would prove to him how much easier his life would be by finally giving in and accepting his powers and his duty since the world would not fall into disarray.

Kal26

11-29-2006, 06:09 PM

I agree. They should have used this season as a transition, to kind of show clark becoming superman. Season five left off in the perfect place for that to happen. Still, the responsability would be a lot to deal with. It would take some time. Denile is a strong device.

Joelito

11-29-2006, 06:13 PM

I voted for What's jumping the shark?.. :)

but, I think... "maybe".

Kat_Halliwell

11-29-2006, 06:18 PM

And this thread relates to "Static" how exactly...? :rolleyes:

Rockstar189

11-29-2006, 07:02 PM

Season 5 would be good to watch on TV only, because alot of dramatic stuff happens. I bought the DVD, and it's not as good as watching a new episode.

Season 6 so far is pretty bad. They can do better.

Netwolf

11-30-2006, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by cryptus
Season 4 was the worst overall Season ever.

I would have to agree, if I had to choose the worst season it would be 4. The whole Lana witch thing along with the "Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon-ish" episode in which they went to China blew.

HotRodTE

11-30-2006, 10:17 AM

so its about even now interesting

HalJordan4184

11-30-2006, 05:28 PM

That really wasn't the point of this show. The point of this show was to create a whole new theory on the creation of superman. It's just like a comic.

I quote Al gough and Miles Millar from season one, "the goal is to show how this kid, becomes the Superman we all know". This show was not about giving us a new take on Superman, or a new Superman all together. From day one, they said this was a show, showing us how Superman came to be. Not a new version, the one we all knew. It's only since season four, and the fan outcry with how crappy they were being, that they said this wasn't about becoming Superman, but was their own take on Superman.

mfarhaniqbal33

12-01-2006, 07:52 AM

I have seen alot of people agree and disagree with how the show is going so who agrees that show should continue like that or if there is time to change the track it should be now?

Mysticlies

12-01-2006, 10:14 AM

Mod note: Merging this thread.

Kal26

12-01-2006, 08:05 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HalJordan4184
I quote Al gough and Miles Millar from season one, "the goal is to show how this kid, becomes the Superman we all know". This show was not about giving us a new take on Superman, or a new Superman all together. From day one, they said this was a show, showing us how Superman came to be. Not a new version, the one we all knew. It's only since season four, and the fan outcry with how crappy they were being, that they said this wasn't about becoming Superman, but was their own take on Superman. [/QU

Then they needed to look at there own material. The only part of season one that really stuck with the origional superman was the first episode, and even that was different. You also forgot the part where this was a retelling for this time period. Of course it's going to be different, it's not the 30's. And of course it's their own take. If it wasn't they would have followed the comics perfectly. Some times you have to read between the lines. Key words "how this kid becomes the superman we all know". I guess I should have worded my origional post a little differently. He may eventually become the superman we all know, but they are getting him there on a more modern path. I dunno, I feel like even with all the differences he still is heading in the right direction. Clark kent is not perfect, superman is. Superman is a character created by clark kent to symbolize all that is good. Clark had many issues that were kept behind the cape. To think otherwise is nieve.

Maybe it wasn't touched on as much in the comics (and I mean the very first action comic), well, I can't say that either. I'm reading a re-issue of the first action comics right now where superman is breaking down the door to the mayors office and threatening him. Yes, actually man handling people and forcing his way in, not scum but government officials. So this superman is perfect and flawless stuff doesn't hold up. Unless you're only talking about the Reeves show.

Ask yourself this question. You have the chance to tell the story of superman. Do you stick with what was told in the thirties, or do you tell it the way you have always thought it would be told?

I myself would change things in my opinion for the better, and I think that's what the writters of this show are doing. We may not always like it, but then we're not writters for television. I would like to think some of us may be someday, but as for now we just have to whatch what others produce. I still think smallville is the best!

HotRodTE

12-04-2006, 04:19 PM

finally a Red K Episode that just may give Smallville a shot in the arm

metalwarrior1975

12-07-2006, 03:19 PM

HalJordan4184 im sorry to say this but not only do I completely disagree with you on every thing but your information is wrong. The producers have stated from day one this is the journy of a boy who grows in to a man who becomes Superman.

The fact is there doing that in a nut shell, they never said how they were going to go about doing it, only that they were. They have not done any thing that has changed the character to a point that is completely different then the character from the comic books.

This the journy of how Clark becomes Superman, and its not just about Clark becoming Superman. Its about how Lex becomes the man he becomes, how Lois becomes the person she becomes in the comic book. If you watch the show they are doing just that. Is it dead on with comic book, no. They have changed a lot of the lore to make this show. However if the end results bring the characters to the same point as they are in comic's then they have accomplished there goal.

Lets look at this for second. Take the whole Lex and Lana deal. Now we know from comic book that Lana and Clark are good friends, we also know that she knows Claks seceret. Right now there so far from that its not even funny. Right now she and Clark are not on best of terms and she has become a lot like Lex. Yet Lex is not truely the man he is in the comic book.

Now lets say by this time next season Lex has been dumped by Lana this leads him further down the dark Path. Lana and Clark rebuild there friendship and settle in to a long lasting friendship. Which is what I believe there doing.

Now because they didn't go the same route as the comic book doesn't mean the end resaults won't be the same.

Right now Clark has refused to except his destiny. However were starting to see that he becoming more and more open to the idea. Every thing there doing right now is showing Clark how much the world needs him. The show is about progression, its a slow process and though its a lot different then the comic book it still holds to the ideals and principles that are found in the comic book.

Now on a personal level, Smallville for all of its differences and changes to lore is more up to par with the comic book then Superman Returns could ever hope to be.

Tom in my opinion has diminstrated the ability to pull off playing Superman more then any other actor who has come before him. Christoper Reeves was a joke as Superman, I kept expect him to throw on a pink TuTu and break out sing songs in the original Superman. He didn't have that Edge need to play Superman. Brandon didn't sale the character, he played it much better then Christoper Reeves but he just couldn't sale me on him being Superman.

Tom can, when you watch him you see the compassion in him while at the same time has the ability to have the edge, that strength that you see in Superman in comic book.

The fact Smallville is just fine, there fact that it is CW highest rated show still speaks for it self. For a bunch of fans that are outraged by the direction Smallville is going every still keeps watching it.

Keep in mind boys and girls this show is far from over, it still has another season or two after this one. I personally believe they will carry this show through to the 8th season at the very least it will got through till 7th season. Just because you don't see were there going with it doesn't mean there isn't a method to there madness.

The fact is that want use to hate Lana right now, when there done every thing will snap in to place and be as it should. We just need to keep watching.

No show jumps Shark, the take the show just how they planned to take it from one season to the next. Just because you don't agree with the direction its going doesn't mean its the wrong one.

I personally like every thing they have done. I see the treads and the general direction there going and have for many seasons now. Think back to 2nd season when they wrote Jor-El in a sort of dark and evil way and yet were starting to realize now that he wasn't evil or some cruel father. This has always been there plan. Clark has been raised by humans and thus its not hard to understand that he would miss interpt every thing about his father.

Think about this, the message in ship said that clark would be a god among men, that humans were flawed race and to rule them with strength for that was his greatest power. Now clark read that message and took it as he was supposed to rule humans with his powers. Yet that wasn't what it meant. It meant rule them with strenght of character. Only a human would think in litteral terms. Krytonians think in vastly different way. Every thing they have done is part of the overall story of how clark becomes Superman, its about the trails and tribulations that lead him to that destiny.

Im not saying there having been mistakes, the caves were never really explained all that well and they move away from it. However its wasn't such a big deal that it ruined the show, it just leaves a lot of unanswered questions.

So dont be to critical of the show. I understand if you don't like the show but it doesn't mean there going the wrong direction. Come back after they complete the entire show and then say that if you still think that. However every one should wait and see how it all ends.

STFanatic

12-07-2006, 03:44 PM

Smallville is not CW's top series, the Top Model & Gilmore Girls get better ratings.
That being said, the only series on CW I watch is Smallville, they offer nothing else that intrests me, I may give Supernatural another chance during reruns, but that would be the only series I could go for.
My wife still watches 7th Heaven, but not if there is something else on.
I will stick with Smallville till the end, but the stories really need to get a little more away from the romance and more into about what the series was touted from the first.
I mean seriously, if you had a fortress of solutude to go hang out in, wouldn't you check it out instead of bouncing a ball off the wall in the loft?
Sci-Fi stories are something we are expected to suspend belief in, but to suspend common sense is another thing.

Kal26

12-07-2006, 04:44 PM

Think about it this way. I'm into comics. My family may be into I dunno, football. Now I would rather sit in my room and read comics than go to a football game, even though I live right down the road from the coolest field ever. They think I'm nuts, and I think they're nuts. Who's to say who's right. Clark is more into relationships and fitting in as a human than learning about Krypton. Who's to say that's not right.

He's just getting to the point in his life where he will start to question his choices and the things he cares about. It will come.

STFanatic

12-07-2006, 04:57 PM

The last game I attended was in 1976, my senior year.
The last sports game I watched was sometime in the late 80's.

Kal26

12-07-2006, 07:44 PM

yeah, I hate sports. It was just an example.

Clana_4ever2005

05-07-2007, 02:32 PM

I don't think it matters as long as the writing and characters are good.

Bonita_LovesSuperman

05-07-2007, 02:35 PM

This is an old thread a very old thread so Smallville has gone pretty good:D

The_Promise

05-07-2007, 03:32 PM

You all have got to be kidding me!
Are you serious?!

The entire show jumped the shark ages and ages ago.

EVERY TIME spoilers come out for just about every single episode since season 2 people have been saying the show has been jumping the shark!

I can't believe threads like this are only re-appearing now!

I mean, I feel sorry for the poor sharks :)

God knows, hell everyone knows, I am obsessed with this show and Supernatural but come on!

The Fonz has come and gone so many times in Smallville, he just leaves his motorcycle in the barn and his leather jacket in Clark's closet for Clark to borrow on his next Red K acid trip.

The damn funniest thing about this whole show is the amount of trips EVERYONE takes to The Smallville Medical Center!!!

I mean the whole show should just be called:

Smallville Medical Center

Then they could make it a mix of ER and Heroes with an angsty doctor/patient/FOTW love triangle hehe!

Oh wait a second that whole thing happens every week with Lana anyways! Forget it :)

My friends and I did a drinking game where we take a drink every time there's a hospital scene. We were wasted even before the end of Season 1!

Ah Season 1...good times :)

CDLBLUE

05-07-2007, 07:12 PM

Series rot set in during the fourth season, with the witch storyline, with everybody exchanging bodies, with the Lana/Jason storyline, ( they had zero chemistry together), the scene when Lana wanted Jason to be her "first" was in the worst possible taste, the whole series was working up to Clark and Lana being each others "first", to try to derail that was a slap in the face to the fan base, they made a brief comeback in the first half of season five, but when they started the Lex/Lana affair they betrayed the Superman canon, (Lana in the Superman legend detested Lex ), the non-pregnancy storyline made Lana look stupid as well as foolish, there have been one or two good episodes in season four, five and six, but upon the whole they betrayed legend that the Superman canon is based on.

Shadow116

05-12-2007, 11:29 AM

I agree completely with CDLBLUE

keeforelli

05-12-2007, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by Coyote
I think this is "jumped the shark" thread number 15,276. Most of them created by people who will still watch the show every week and come here to write thousands of posts about it. Mostly whining about how much they don't like it. As they continue to watch it every week....

i have to say i was looking for a way to put into words how odd i find people moaning about something as much as they do here on a supposed fansite. and you have!!!!...at what point do you become someone that simply finds the 'off' button?..or is it that the complainers here simply like complaining- i mean some here are writing at the end of season six that the show went downhill after season three!!..whats that about????!!.. good god people thats thats four years of watching something you dont like!!!!..why!!!..why!!why!! its a sad fact that long running series often lose the initial shine...just enjoy it for what it is...a good programme...;)

STFanatic

05-12-2007, 12:24 PM

Because we know how well this series can or could have been.
The subject matter the writers have available could have been the greatest series ever, but, they took the main character who is to be the most powerful and admired hero in history and neutered him down.
Could I do better? Probably not, but I am not a highly paid professional hired to do so. I am a consumer, one who the advertisers who pay these professionals to do it target, which makes the whole thing happen.
Clark Kent/Kal-el has now been reduced to a self absorbed one woman obsessed shadow of character who should be bigger than life.
Before Smallville when one thought of Clark Kent, the image of a selfless hero thinking of others before himself.
A hero who would never sit in a barn bouncing a rubber ball against the wall instead of helping others. Shirking his responsibility of training himself by hanging around moping over a woman, instead of beginning to prepare himself for the future, hanging around pitching hay instead of stopping crime.
In season six, he is no longer a kid trying to figure out what to do, he has had more than one person advise him as to what and where he is needed, Green Arrow who is only a mere but highly trained human has told him what he needs to do, and in no mixed words said how he envys the abilities Clark is wasting.

Complain about how the series has been handled, YES I do, and will continue to do because I know the creative team can and could have done better.
When the series first began, I had high hopes as to the direction it would proceed. The pilot was awesome the following episodes were great as well, then, the whole premise of the show began a severe decline in quality and that trend has continued throughthe following seaons.
"If I am not happy with the series, why keep watching"
Because I am a fan of Superman, and I have invested close to six years in this attempt at a portrayal of the greatest hero in history.
I will continue to watch, but as I have stated on other threads, if the series finale doesn't grab me and keep me wanting to see the seventh season, then I may just follow your advise and move on, however, there are other areas on Kryptonsite that I visit often, and as long as Craig keeps Kryptonsite available, I will be here.
I am keeping hope that the creative team will pull it off and really amaze and thrill us in the seventh season.
Clark Kent is supposed to be the central character, but is not centered on is most of the episodes.
The series is not about a witch, a vampire, a death drugged female, an amazing growing baby, and never in history has Kryptonite transformed normal humans into superpowered freaks.
I began reading Superman comics in the mid '60s, and continued through the late '90s (shortly after the death and resurection of Superman).
Any incarnation of Superman that was presented to me in visual or audio form I have been excited to be a part of, and I will do the same about the next project that may be released in the future.
I followed every superhero type series that has came out, all the way back through the sixties, and will follow suit in the future, and I as a member of the viewing public reserve the God given right to criticize or complement such a program in any style media it is presented to me as I see fit.

STFanatic

05-12-2007, 12:56 PM

I thought about just posting the link to the board rules http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/announcement.php?s=&forumid=30
And refer them to rule #15, but I am not that kinda guy ;)

keeforelli

05-12-2007, 01:24 PM

perhaps i misunderstood the amount of passion there is for things to be the way you want them to be...but..and its a big but..there are a large amount of people on here..and a large even within this thread..that STILL really like where the series is going- i suppose my understanding needs to be more in how strongly some of you guys feel about it....im happy just to like it...oh and i didnt read rule 15 until just now..but wont be making the same error twice....but i do reserve the right to challenge within the rules the comments that have been made on here....i dont feel its out of order..as its MY opinion...

and ......im now part of a brand new clique!!!..complainer of complainers!!!..i suppose i just like to raise things as i think of them...no offence intended guys..

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

ah the smallville medical centre drinking game!!!....LMAO!!!

STFanatic

05-12-2007, 01:26 PM

None taken :D

Don't get me wrong, I do truly love Smallville, elsewise I would have no invested six years into the series.

I just want to hold TPTB to higher standerds than they have used thus far.
If everyone in any area of life were to just lie there and take whatever is dished out, nothing will ever improve.
We would still be watching black & white TVs and there would be no high speed internet ;)

keeforelli

05-12-2007, 02:08 PM

um may i ask what TBTP is?

STFanatic

05-12-2007, 02:11 PM

The
Powers
That
Be
All the lingo is posted here.
Enjoy :D
http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61706

Action Comics # 1

08-01-2007, 05:45 AM

Hey,

I was just curious on what other's thoughts on this topic might be. I mightve posted something similiar to this some seasons ago, and wanted to see what everyone was feeling.

I, by no means, am putting down the tremendous work the producers, writers, etc have done over the years, but it is the basic nature of any series to "jump the shark" as they say. For more info on that term, click here (http://www.jumptheshark.com/index.jspa)

I am always a Superman fan first, Smallville fan second, but having said that, I still enjoy the show, but just have questioned a few things plotwise with everyone's favorite Kryptonian.

What do you guys think?

Digitalsteel

08-01-2007, 07:20 AM

Nah, not yet. I think this season will be the climax of the series

hassenmorad

08-01-2007, 12:04 PM

If this term can ever be applied to Smallville, then it would have been during season 4. However, I think the show has evolved over the years and it probably won't die out (or jump the shark), but rather it will go out with a bang.

Jaded Wolf

08-02-2007, 05:50 AM

It jumped the shark, turned right back around, kicked it in the head, and then jumped it again. It started with the intro of Lois Lane. Then Aquaman. Then last season Green Arrow and the junior JL. It's all about gimmicks now. What do we have next season??? Supergirl. Great!!! Forget jumping the shark. They're hurdling over it.

bobowayney

08-02-2007, 10:15 AM

I myself don't think SV has jumped the shark, it was certainly trying to in the secong and third seasons but if the fourth it orrected itself and hasnt jumped yet

Kal26

08-02-2007, 01:23 PM

I'm still going with no, it hasn't.

hemmy

08-02-2007, 03:16 PM

In terms of viewership, yes it has probably reached its peak back in like Season 2.

But the plot is getting thicker and episodes getting better in my opinion.

cksidekick

08-02-2007, 03:18 PM

no...i think it has turned into an entirely different show....jumping the shark??? IDK

...it WAS Clark on his journey through puberty to manhood (as a kid who is not normal) pretty much....now it is a MAN'S journey to become a Super Hero (while trying to STAY normal)....

all the "gimmics" are his world changing around him...he has to grow and adapt....:)

Joelito

08-02-2007, 05:44 PM

I don't think so, but if keeps doing stuff like "Noir"...maybe :\

The Great Ymmij

08-02-2007, 11:15 PM

Hmm..I personally don't think a show like Smallville could "jump the shark." It's a sci-fi show and ANYTHING is possible in this kind of show. In Happy Days, the show "jumped the shark" when the Fonz actually jumped the shark, which was absolutely ridiculous and unrealistic from that genre of a show. Like for instance(I'm just making a totally random example), if you're watching a series like House, which is supposed to be like real life in a way, it would "jump the shark" if House all of a sudden had the ability of flight b/c no one in real life could possess such a power.
Anyways, haha, I'm probably all wrong or w/e, but Smallville is capable of doing anything, so nothing really can make it "jump the shark"....well, unless it does something SO RIDICULOUS, like killing Clark Kent and making Jimmy Olsen the new star of the show. Or better yet, if they kill off Lois Lane and make Chloe become the new Lois Lane....LOL, sorry Chloe=Lois fans, I just had to. Don't take it personally.

MidgardDragon

08-02-2007, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by Jaded Wolf
It jumped the shark, turned right back around, kicked it in the head, and then jumped it again. It started with the intro of Lois Lane. Then Aquaman. Then last season Green Arrow and the junior JL. It's all about gimmicks now. What do we have next season??? Supergirl. Great!!! Forget jumping the shark. They're hurdling over it.

Yep, adding DC Universe characters to a show about Clark Kent, that's jumping the shark alright. Like totally for sures dude. Heck, they shouldn't have even had Lex, that's just a gimmick. :/

.sarcasm

Digitalsteel

08-03-2007, 07:33 AM

Originally posted by MidgardDragon
Yep, adding DC Universe characters to a show about Clark Kent, that's jumping the shark alright. Like totally for sures dude. Heck, they shouldn't have even had Lex, that's just a gimmick. :/

.sarcasm

Yeah but you must admit, without all these characters...the show would have ended by now

I personally like the addition of all the DC characters weve had so far, I do think they may start to get a little carried away with revealing his identity to everyone though. and why does every tragedy ion the world happen in Smallville? lol (I know, I know..)

Saber

08-03-2007, 08:15 AM

:lol: I think your point/sarcasm was lost in translation with the last poster MidgardDragon but I got it & see your point.

IMO, yeah it has jumped the shark. I don’t really have the same connection to the characters that I did in season 1 & 2. They just exist without moving forward.
TPTB threw in all these DC characters in order to shake things up but they forgot about Clark Kent as a character of interest. I wanted to see a coming of age story with different angles to his personality, growth, more growth and the development of a “man” that will be a future super hero.
He turned out to be nothing more than an obsessed kid, now an obsessed man for one girl. That’s it!
When you think of Clark Kent, all you can hear is, he’s the guy that loves Lana to no-end. Do you remember any of his good deeds or even his credo, values or morality?
Nope, because he is the guy in Smallville, that loves Lana only and that kind of puts his existence in a nutshell. Never moving forward and always lagging behind the DC characters that should be show-casing Clark's lead.

Die Clana! Die

08-03-2007, 09:18 AM

No, it has not jumped the shark yet. It was circling the shark in season 4 with the witch story...but it pulled it off IMO. For me personally, after season 4 the show just kept getting better and better.

And, yeah. Maybe because of all the gimmics and DC characters, but mostly because Clark is closer to Superman than before.

Digitalsteel

08-03-2007, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by Die Clana! Die
No, it has not jumped the shark yet. It was circling the shark in season 4 with the witch story...but it pulled it off IMO. For me personally, after season 4 the show just kept getting better and better.

And, yeah. Maybe because of all the gimmics and DC characters, but mostly because Clark is closer to Superman than before.

I agree 100%

ClarksGal

08-03-2007, 11:23 AM

I agree with the poster above who said that SV "circled" the shark with the witch thing. But I still really loved S4, with their Sr. year, Clark finally getting to play football and growing up a bit, and culminating in my all-time favorite Finale-Premier combo. And for me, the show continued to build right up until Reckoning. Then, the show changed in a way that I don't feel it has ever fully recovered from. I still enjoy the show and continue to hope that it will restore itself to its former glory (I mean for 99 episodes, this show could do no wrong as far as I was concerned).

So what is missing now? Well, to me, I think that was the point that I started to blame Clark for all the bad things that were happening. I mean, before that, he made choices that may have ended badly, but he always seemed to make the choices for good, logical and half-way mature reasons. After Reckoning, I just felt that his choices were juvenile and that he seemed more mature and supermanly in S1 than he does now. It's hard to look up to a superhero who is an idiot. :)

So, to answer the question, has SV jumped the shark? Well, that depends on whether jumping the shark is a permanent event. The show changed after that, some of it was cool, some of it sucked. My answer will be 'no' as long as Clark starts acting like a man in S7. A good man. Strong. Who makes the right choices even if it means he doesn't get to kiss the pregnant/married lady. That's my Superman. :)

If we end up with more Clana crap, then I will say that SV jumped the shark in Reckoning.

Jaded Wolf

08-03-2007, 01:39 PM

Originally posted by MidgardDragon
Yep, adding DC Universe characters to a show about Clark Kent, that's jumping the shark alright. Like totally for sures dude. Heck, they shouldn't have even had Lex, that's just a gimmick. :/

.sarcasm

All bow to the forum master whose opinions must mean the end all be all. That is sarcasm.

Anyways... I don't mind the addition of the other superheroes to the show but there was a time the show could stand strong without them. Also, there was a time when the show was not all soap opera like with the whole Lana-Clark-Lex stuff. While the show has had its cool moments in the last season, and while I will continue to watch it because I am a comic book geek, the show has lost what it once had. Maybe I'll eat my words and the addition of Supergirl will be the best thing to happen to Smallville since the construction of the Fortress of Solitude. I'll wait and see...

MJDSuperman

07-09-2009, 02:42 PM

When did Smallville begin going downhill as it has done latley?

I think after season 5 is when it started maby 6

The show was so good back then!

If this isnt where this goese im sorry im new to the site

Joelito

07-10-2009, 05:11 PM

Yeah but you must admit, without all these characters...the show would have ended by now
It's because it should be ended by now

Charles Griffyn

07-11-2009, 05:52 AM

I disagree, i think it got better during season 5, it became its own show. Season 1-4 it was a buffy clone with Superman in it. Season 5 it found its own identity, Season 7's worst episodes where the ones when it went back to the villain of the week (buffy clone) style of the first few seasons. 6 and 8, when we got proper arcs played otu without interuptionis when its worked best. Obviously none of the eight seasons have been perfect, but when they have to write 22 episodes a year, with each one constrained by budget or actor availability, thats not surprising.

Night_Hawk90

07-11-2009, 03:09 PM

jumped the shark in season 4 with the addition of lois, and the arrival of a dimwitted clark who had no interest in becoming a hero.

Joelito

07-12-2009, 06:33 AM

jumped the shark in season 4 with the addition of lois, and the arrival of a dimwitted clark who had no interest in becoming a hero.
Agreed if TPTB haven't had in mind the transition from Smallville to Metropolis, and by the transition I mean from the farm to the Daily planet..to become superman.

Clark/Lois-fan

07-12-2009, 11:54 AM

it has only come close when tptb focused their time on the girl next door.

borednow

07-14-2009, 09:44 PM

There kinda isn't a shark here to jump... or is it that there is no rope and water skies...

RedKRules

07-15-2009, 03:31 AM

A long time ago.....

bonoferox

07-30-2009, 09:21 AM

The show has had its bad and good episodes since the beginning, so I don't think it's jumped the shark.
However, I do think it should have ended after just 5 or 6 seasons

captaincrunch1199

07-31-2009, 06:28 AM

the thing is they can fix it with return of Lex, and introduction of Flight

9-SOSIHTWB

07-31-2009, 07:49 AM

No, I don't think it has!
After watching Season 7 I thought SV would never recover, but it did slightly in season 8!
The trailer for season 9, to me, looks like SV is back on track!

Lexsghost

07-31-2009, 04:36 PM

Yes it has but I still watch it though odd... haha. I really so think it has gone on way too far off base.

terri7015

08-01-2009, 01:00 PM

I think they definitely got off track... but season 8 was pretty good and season 9 looks amazing. We're just gonna have to wait and see if it really will be. :)

Andyville

08-04-2009, 12:49 PM

So, I wanted to post this for a long time but never got the time. Now that I have this is what it is all about: I believe that every SV fan out there considers the Veritas arc to be more or less the down point or the almost jump the shark moment for SV simply because it retconned much of the earlier things that happened in seasons 2 and 3. So this thread is about you giving ides of how the second half of season 7 would have been better. Instead of Veritas what else could the writers offered us? The Kara arc finished in Blue though they gave her the memory loss arc which was resolved in the same episode that Veritas kicked off. I have a pretty cool idea of how they could have played it without retconning earlier establishments but I want to hear some of your ideas first.

HeroesUnlimited

08-04-2009, 02:59 PM

I enjoyed the Veritas storyline. I thought it saved an otherwise forgettable season 7.

Nerwen Aldarion

08-04-2009, 05:40 PM

I enjoyed the Veritas storyline. I thought it saved an otherwise forgettable season 7.

I have to agree and disagree with you.

I loved the idea of this secret society, it makes sense going all the way back to the pilot with the newspaper Lionel is reading. I also loved seeing Lex's descent into darkness like this.

That being said I found the result of Veritas being disappointing, most notably the episode where Jason Teague's father shows up, I hated that episode, I just found it boring and pointless. I also found the season finale to be disappointing too and they never really did resolve HOW Lex would control Clark or what the danger truly was.

HeroesUnlimited

08-04-2009, 05:47 PM

I have to agree and disagree with you.

I loved the idea of this secret society, it makes sense going all the way back to the pilot with the newspaper Lionel is reading. I also loved seeing Lex's descent into darkness like this.

That being said I found the result of Veritas being disappointing, most notably the episode where Jason Teague's father shows up, I hated that episode, I just found it boring and pointless. I also found the season finale to be disappointing too and they never really did resolve HOW Lex would control Clark or what the danger truly was.

Edward Teague showed up in Quest, one of my favorite episodes of the series. I loved the treasure-hunting aspect to Veritas (finding the keys, the cryptograph - decoding the meaning of the song - the orb in the fireplace). I find that kind of stuff interesting. I just wished they would have teased the existence of Veritas in an earlier season so when they finally did the storyline, it wouldn't have been so out-of-the-blue.

Jlvsclrk

08-05-2009, 07:14 AM

I think S7 shows how bad a mistake it was to bring a flying Supergirl onto the show in the first place. It really limits the number of stories you can tell and still have genuine danger/conflict for Clark (which is the lifeblood of drama). If I had brought Kara to the show, she would have been younger and had a LOT more trouble fitting in and adapting to the idea of the death of Krypton. My Kara would have been sent by her father as a weapon against Clark, although she herself did not know it, as is suggested in Apocalypse.

For the latter part of the season, I would have strung out Kara's powerless-ness, had Lex much more involved in the recovery of her memory with him finding out the truth about Clark that way rather than via retcon, turned around Traveler so it was Kara in the cage not Clark, still had Apocalypse without the "they'll all be better off without me" beginning and if I did have something like the Control Orb or whatever you want to call it, make it the work of Brainiac and Zor-El, not some batshit insane and unnecessary device sent by Jor-El.