Was there a point to the ep? [Archive] - KSiteTV Television & Movie Forums

Billy Jor-El

11-03-2005, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by jarethmc
I believe the whole point to the episode was in dealing with
moral and ethical values concerning right and wrong, lies and truth and honor.

Why am I hearing the phrase "truth, justice, and the American way" right about now? :D

Mr.Bond

11-03-2005, 11:02 PM

Come to think of it, Who was the Villain? I know the Senetor was just lying about the girl to Pa Kent but he was not the Villain.

And about the russian/diplomat guy? what is he all about? what's his obsession with the strippers? they really did not explain to much about that story.

phatum

11-03-2005, 11:08 PM

since when do they need a point

Spoon AZ

11-03-2005, 11:38 PM

points?

um how bout progressing Chloe's story at the Planet?

how bout setting up Lex's run for senator?

How bout setting up a potential run for Senator for Jonathan?

sounds like it had a point to me.

And it was technically a filler episode. And it progressed things nicely.

So I'm not sure what the complaints stem from unless you're just playing the morality card.

Summers

11-03-2005, 11:40 PM

Don't forget it also showed hints of Lois and Clark realizing about justice as well thanks to Sawyer. Plus it was big wake up call to Chloe and Clark that they are no longer in Smallville. The way the use to solve mysteries in their small town will now have to upgrade and thoughtout since they are in the big city.

Spoon AZ

11-03-2005, 11:43 PM

good point summers.

I keep forgetting about that great scene with Sawyer. Very true.

I half expected Clark to reply with something like "Somebody has to change that..."

It would have fit with the whole "good man to lead" theme of the episode.

Mr.Bond

11-03-2005, 11:44 PM

Originally posted by Spoon AZ
points?

um how bout progressing Chloe's story at the Planet?

how bout setting up Lex's run for senator?

How bout setting up a potential run for Senator for Jonathan?

sounds like it had a point to me.

And it was technically a filler episode. And it progressed things nicely.

So I'm not sure what the complaints stem from unless you're just playing the morality card.

I agree with you about the set up of the following story you have listed, but that still doesnt answer the question on what's the point of the villain? the crazy stripper killer? The main Plot of the story? where was it? All the stuff you mentioned are subplot to move the season along but we are still left with questions.

Summers

11-03-2005, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by Spoon AZ
good point summers.

I keep forgetting about that great scene with Sawyer. Very true.

I half expected Clark to reply with something like "Somebody has to change that..."

It would have fit with the whole "good man to lead" theme of the episode.

I thought the same thing Spoon. I thought either Clark or Lois would say something like it. That would made the scene just perfect.

Originally posted by Mr.Bond
I agree with you about the set up of the following story you have listed, but that still doesnt answer the question on what's the point of the villain? the crazy stripper killer? The main Plot of the story? where was it? All the stuff you mentioned are subplot to move the season along but we are still left with questions.

Sometimes you need transitional episodes to just concentrate on the character's mindset so they can be ready for the next episode. You shouldn't just leap right into it.

IMO The villain was Metropolis society. Nothing special about the villain, but the sad fact is there are so many like him. A lot in Suicide Slums. To show the bad parts of Metropolis more. We saw hints of it with "Run" and "Exile" now we are seeing more of it. That Metropolis needs people like Chloe, Lois, and Clark helping this city.

MidgardDragon

11-03-2005, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by Mr.Bond
Come to think of it, Who was the Villain? I know the Senetor was just lying about the girl to Pa Kent but he was not the Villain.

And about the russian/diplomat guy? what is he all about? what's his obsession with the strippers? they really did not explain to much about that story.

I think you must have not been paying attention to parts of the show. You are correct that the Senator was not the villain, the Senator's purpose was to show Clark that even heros have faults, but that doesn't necessarily make them bad people.

As for the Russian/Diplomat - his point was he was the villain. He didn't just "have an obsession with strippers" - he was selling them into slavery as sex slaves. They explained everything about the story. His second point was to illustrate to Chloe, Lois, and Clark that not everything is black and white, there are some people who do bad that get away with it. And also to demonstrate that "This ain't Smallville anymore Toto." They're in the big city now (at least part of the time), their small town crime solving is going to have to go through a metamorphosis if they want it to be effective in Metropolis. (IMO, they were also foreshadowing why Clark will decide that he has to become a hero, since there are some things even the police can't fix due to legal loopholes like Diplomatic Immunity.)

Spoon AZ

11-03-2005, 11:53 PM

Yeah summers, it was a good transitional/filler episode.

And they need to establish that Metropolis is not a safe city before Supes arrives.

Summers

11-03-2005, 11:56 PM

Originally posted by MidgardDragon
I think you must have not been paying attention to parts of the show. You are correct that the Senator was not the villain, the Senator's purpose was to show Clark that even heros have faults, but that doesn't necessarily make them bad people.

I like that, and Lex said it great especially with the King David story.

MidgardDragon

11-03-2005, 11:57 PM

Originally posted by LoisLaneIsHott
K, is it me or did it seem like it was going nowhere? I mean, the guy didnt even get arrested for anything. I dont know, maybe they were just trying to get a reason for lois to strip(which i dont mind). :confused:

See my other reply, I listed the obvious points. Him not getting arrested was *part of the point!* It taught Chlarkis (Chloe/Clark/Lois) a lesson about how the real world works sometimes, and was likely meant to explain part of why Clark becomes who he becomes and could be a driving force in Lois becoming who she becomes.

I think a lot of people are outting this episode as filler because the Lois stripping was a clear sweeps stunt, but I think that is unfair. It was more story-oriented than Aqua or Thirst, IMO. We can't expect every episode to be an Arrival or Hidden, but this was the least filler of the "filler" episodes so far. So, yes, there was a point to all of it, as listed by myself and several others in this thread.

Summers

11-03-2005, 11:57 PM

Originally posted by Spoon AZ
Yeah summers, it was a good transitional/filler episode.

And they need to establish that Metropolis is not a safe city before Supes arrives.

Exactly. Batman Begins showed that "Gotham can still be saved", and I'm getting that feeling with Metropolis over the past few seasons.

Spoon AZ

11-04-2005, 12:00 AM

and kudos to who ever came up with the idea to bring Sawyer into a bigger role. Continuity has been surprisingly good for Sville this year.

They even mentioned Chloe's halloween costume

sprman808

11-04-2005, 12:00 AM

How about Lex saying...

"We all need to believe in heroes Clark....even the best ones are far from perfect"....

I would say that was a point.

MidgardDragon

11-04-2005, 12:01 AM

Originally posted by Summers
I like that, and Lex said it great especially with the King David story.

Yeah, I liked it too. I thoght that whole plot (heros aren't perfect) was just subtle enough to make it truly awesome but not an anvil. And it gave a good excuse for Duke Boy #2 to be on the show other than the whole DoH homage.

Scorpio31

11-04-2005, 12:01 AM

Didn’t they mention somebody getting arrested thanks to Chloe in the Talon scene? If they did who was it??

MidgardDragon

11-04-2005, 12:02 AM

Originally posted by sprman808
How about Lex saying...

"We all need to believe in heroes Clark....even the best ones are far from perfect"....

I would say that was a point.

Hmm, I forgot about that line, perhaps it was a bit of anvil. :P Either way it was a good subplot.

Spoon AZ

11-04-2005, 12:04 AM

I'd have to say Wopat's appearance is probably one the best stunt casting roles of this show outside Reeves.

They actually had a great role for him.

MidgardDragon

11-04-2005, 12:04 AM

Originally posted by Scorpio31
Didn’t they mention somebody getting arrested thanks to Chloe in the Talon scene? If they did who was it??

Maybe it was the Club Owner/Operator who was allowing underage girls (the girl who got killed was 19 and based on other lines in the show we are to assume that 21 is the legal age to work or attend a strip club in Metropolis) to work in his club. Wasn't he also assisting the diplomat by providing specific girls for a fee? I'd say it's a pretty good bet he's the one that got arrested but I'd have to rewatch to be sure.

Scorpio31

11-04-2005, 12:06 AM

Thanks!!!

Summers

11-04-2005, 12:06 AM

Originally posted by sprman808
How about Lex saying...

"We all need to believe in heroes Clark....even the best ones are far from perfect"....

I would say that was a point.

I could be reading too much into it, but it reminded me of Lex's outlook on the Kawattach prophecy. Where Lex sees himself as the hero (which contradicts "Onyx" but considently contradicts "Tailsman") that it touches on that notion again. It foreshadowed the triangle as well.

MidgardDragon

11-04-2005, 12:07 AM

Originally posted by Spoon AZ
I'd have to say Wopat's appearance is probably one the best stunt casting roles of this show outside Reeves.

They actually had a great role for him.

Yeah, I'd have to rate those stunt castings in this order:

- Christopher Reeves

- Wopat

- *a bunch of others that I either can't remember or may appear in the future*

- And way down at the bottom - Margot Kidder. Seriously, she was alright in the Supes movies, but her role on Smallville was absolutely horrible.

ETA: Actually, if they ever get Dean Cain, he will be closed to tied with Reeves for me. I loved Lois and Clark.

Summers

11-04-2005, 12:08 AM

Originally posted by Scorpio31
Didn’t they mention somebody getting arrested thanks to Chloe in the Talon scene? If they did who was it??

They did at the very end of the episode when Clark was reading Chloe's article.

vyperman7

11-04-2005, 12:08 AM

This episode was a filler episode. I will give you that.

However, it was well written and extremely entertaining. I really loved the episode. It forshadowed the future well and gave us some continuity. It did not advance any big plotlines this season, but it was a great episode, and that is all that really matters in my opinion.

Kal-El18

11-04-2005, 01:02 AM

Originally posted by jarethmc
I believe the whole point to the episode was in dealing with
moral and ethical values concerning right and wrong, lies and truth and honor.

i belive it was too see the hole jonathan running for senator <.<

MidgardDragon

11-04-2005, 03:27 PM

To add to the "who got arrested" discussion - I looked at the newspaper article and the headline was "Lowry's Son Arrested By Interpol in Europe" or something like that. Was the diplomat "Lowry's Son" or did I miss something entirely? I never heard them mention his name so I guess we can only assume it was him.

As a further question, does this mean Interpol has the authority to arrest a diplomat who has committed crimes on another foreign country's soil? Or did they catch him because the sex slave trade was illegal in whatever country he was from as well? The news article definitely left room for confusion, but maybe I'm just missing something.

Lord_Balthaazar

11-04-2005, 03:53 PM

I loved this episode, it had great moments. I loved when Lois and Clark each went "undercover" to investigate and then ran into each other (good lord did that woman look sexy!) and the coments back and forth, the times when they just showed care for each other for even a moment, however grudgingly, it was great, and Lois hanging around the Daily planet, I love it, its showing how she gets interested in Journalism. Then there was the greatest moment, when it was alot like the future and Clark stopped a helicopter to save Lois, only in the future hell do it more smoothly and shell be in more danger and shell be in awe of him, Superman. :D

There were other moments, with the good ol boys, that were great. We see parts of Johnathan's past, yehaaaw!' and we see Lex's tendancy to be honest at least, even if hes doing bad things, hes aware of them and tries to let those close to him know the truth of the matter (sometimes, other times hes smart and doesnt show all his cards, but he still has care for his friend even if they arnt exactly best buddies right now. I think Clark telling Lex how he had stood up for him, made him think, if not changing his ways, at least being a better friend to Clark )

SuperStupidPower

11-04-2005, 04:47 PM

To answer the OP's question, the point of this show, which was verbally driven home at every turn....

In the real world sometimes the bad guys win.

(This of course was contradicted by the diplomat getting caught of course.)

But Lex won... so they sorta stuck to their point.

Watching Smallville

11-04-2005, 04:53 PM

Originally posted by Summers
Plus it was big wake up call to Chloe and Clark that they are no longer in Smallville. The way the use to solve mysteries in their small town will now have to upgrade and thoughtout since they are in the big city.

I thought this was a very important point made in the ep. All the stakes went a step up this week. Lex entering into public office with even more control over people's lives? Yikes. And Jonathan as State Senator ... I don't know. I have to see how it plays out, but that was definitely another point to the ep.

These were all reasons, among other things, that I liked this episode.

Superman790

11-04-2005, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by Summers
IMO The villain was Metropolis society. Nothing special about the villain, but the sad fact is there are so many like him. A lot in Suicide Slums. To show the bad parts of Metropolis more. We saw hints of it with "Run" and "Exile" now we are seeing more of it. That Metropolis needs people like Chloe, Lois, and Clark helping this city.

totally agree with you. maybe seeing the things that go on in Metropolis will make Clark realize they need a hero.

also the luke duke's character let Clark see that even the greatest people have faults and will allow him to allow himself not to be perfect.