SUPERMAN: The Set Up

[davidbrenton]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

[nipvillesmlltuk]

You know what, I was JUST about to say something like this topic.

I understand that many thought the season finale "sucked" or that killing "hoohoo" off was a harsh move or where the heck is Lois now? BUT, I have to agree with the OP.

If Jimmy's brother is the REAL Jimmy, then I think it does fall into the storyline. Lois in the future (I'm not sure how they'll pull that off, maybe have her only in the near future and not that far away) makes sense to me. Clark finally embracing his destiny (I hope maybe he gets sent off to "grow into" Superman)....you know what, I really don't know what I'm writing. All I know is that it's clear in my head but I can't seem to bring it out on here. Someone help?

[madcatlady]

Maybe when Lois comes back it's when Clark is already Superman???

[faz]

I see what you're saying, I don't think that's the case, but either way, all of the issues I had with the episode had nothing to do with the "Clark Kent is dead" scene. Good thought, its a possibility, but I don't think that's what's going on here.

[LoveHurts38]

Maybe when Lois comes back it's when Clark is already Superman???


And maybe wearing glasses.

[davidbrenton]

You know what, I was JUST about to say something like this topic.

I understand that many thought the season finale "sucked" or that killing "hoohoo" off was a harsh move or where the heck is Lois now? BUT, I have to agree with the OP.

If Jimmy's brother is the REAL Jimmy, then I think it does fall into the storyline. Lois in the future (I'm not sure how they'll pull that off, maybe have her only in the near future and not that far away) makes sense to me. Clark finally embracing his destiny (I hope maybe he gets sent off to "grow into" Superman)....you know what, I really don't know what I'm writing. All I know is that it's clear in my head but I can't seem to bring it out on here. Someone help?

thanks for the support, in return I'll offer...they set up something with so many possibilities and definitely moved FORWARD with the mythos....I have a suspicion they'll be a time jump, and Lois is the character who's eyes we'll be seeing next season's (Superman) story from.

---The time jump will allow Jimmy's brother to grow up, Chloe to become fully embraced as Watchtower, and Superman to arrive.

[kryptotrite]

Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.

[davidbrenton]

Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.

He is PURELY committing to being the hero the world needs. He fully accepted his hero-destiny.

I don't know what part of, "I need to be the hero the world needs" was mistaken for regression.

[THE"Lurker"]

:cool:
thanks for the support, in return I'll offer...they set up something with so many possibilities and definitely moved FORWARD with the mythos....I have a suspicion they'll be a time jump, and Lois is the character who's eyes we'll be seeing next season's (Superman) story from.

---The time jump will allow Jimmy's brother to grow up, Chloe to become fully embraced as Watchtower, and Superman to arrive.

Smart post DB. I envisioned it also when i saw Lil Jimmy:cool:

[kyl-el]

I don't think that Clark is dead personally because that speech he made at the end with Chloe just didn't fit. But then again, I don't think that Lex is dead either.

[Tebow15]

I thinkhe goes to the fortress to train and their will be a time jump, I LOVED IT!

[amandaa125]

Ok i was really upset about the fact that they killed jimmy off but i guess i can live with that now knowing that he wasnt the real jimmy olsen. I also wouldnt mind a time jump at all but i dont get it, if lois is going into the future/past wouldnt she see her future self and then there would be two lois there? I'm just a little confused on how they would do the whole time jump thing. Also in the mythos Lois didnt know clark before he came to the Daily planet...Are they trying to set that up too?

[THE"Lurker"]

Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.

Wow who would have thunk it, Embracing his Kryptonian side is regression:rolleyes:

[HotStudsSuccess]

And maybe wearing glasses.

You took the words out of my mouth. :\ :D

[nipvillesmlltuk]

TY, David :)



Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.




Just because the old writers always gave us false hope, doesn't mean the new ones will.


On that note, I agree about the time jump. Although I hope they don't go TOO far down the road, I do hope to see a whole different setting. Something more solid and concrete like all the characters embracing their future.

[griffolyon12]

Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.
While I don't think he stepped that far back in his development, I do agree that his rant at the end was not him embracing his destiny, but rather him running from it once more. Not to say that it wasn't a brilliant scene, cause it was, I just don't think it was him assuming the identity of Superman. I do think they have planted some seeds though for what could potentially be a stellar season 9.

While this finale may not have been perfect, they corrected a few things that had been nagging me since season 6, like the fact that the Aaron Ashmore Jimmy was the same age as Clark and Lois, but now they've revealed that he wasn't the real Jimmy Olsen. Personally I didn't feel that was a cop out. Sure it might have been better had they at least mentioned the brother once more before, but that funeral scene satisfied me as a longtime Superman fan. Also, even though the Doomsday fight was short, they also fully explained how Doomsday came to be trapped in the crevices of the Earth. So all-in-all I thought the episode hit its marks. Bring on season 9!

[gmhashope]

Clark has to be being controlled by the orb either that or everything in the past 8 seasons has been a waste to his character development.

[davidbrenton]

Ok i was really upset about the fact that they killed jimmy off but i guess i can live with that now knowing that he wasnt the real jimmy olsen. I also wouldnt mind a time jump at all but i dont get it, if lois is going into the future/past wouldnt she see her future self and then there would be two lois there? I'm just a little confused on how they would do the whole time jump thing. Also in the mythos Lois didnt know clark before he came to the Daily planet...Are they trying to set that up too?

She would not see her future self because she stopped existing in the present the moment she slipped into the future....she was never there to live into the future, so there would not be two Lois Lane's.

Who cares whether or not Lois knew Clark b4 the Daily Planet. That has been told before, here we saw them form a friendship and bond individually before the whole Superman chanaggins. Plus, we got to SEE Lois Lane grow up. If you want to see what's already been done, I can recommend great (Classic) movies and TV shows to watch. This is now, this is evolution, this is entertainment.

[latingirl]

OK!!!
- Clark is going to training Finally.. at least looks like that, The question is WHERE??? there is not a functional FoS in Injustice:confused:
- Lois is "in the future" How many Year after this Doomday she will back!!!:confused::confused:
-God!! Chloe is pregnant of the future Doomsday tha will kill Superman:eek:
- Jimmy was No a real Jimmy... Ok that mean that Lucy Lane is going to get marry with a Guy Maybe 8 years young, COOL:(

OOOOkkeyyy

Zod is going to be quiet meanwhile Clark is training :confused::confused::confused:

[nipvillesmlltuk]

While I don't think he stepped that far back in his development, I do agree that his rant at the end was not him embracing his destiny, but rather him running from it once more.



While I understand you, I totally refuse to agree because I don't wanna sit through another season of that "running from it once more" mumbo jumbo crap. It's getting annoying. I find it bothersome that we all would have to sit through one more season of this and basically get teased at the end when he finally embraces his destiny. :confused:

[lebangelrh]

everything said about the superman embrace and olsen jr and watchtower plays right from the finale and makes sense...but lois' scene and Rokks ring still isnt clear and wont explain in a time jump

[amandaa125]

She would not see her future self because she stopped existing in the present the moment she slipped into the future....she was never there to live into the future, so there would not be two Lois Lane's.

Who cares whether or not Lois knew Clark b4 the Daily Planet. That has been told before, here we saw them form a friendship and bond individually before the whole Superman chanaggins. Plus, we got to SEE Lois Lane grow up. If you want to see what's already been done, I can recommend great (Classic) movies and TV shows to watch. This is now, this is evolution, this is entertainment.

Ok i gotcha you're right she would cease to exsist. So this would mean if she saw clark in the future he would remember her from the last time he saw her which would be before she dissapeared? correct? And no no no i was hoping they wouldnt find a way to make lois not know clark before the daily planet, since they're trying to line up the mythos, I LOVE how smallville has formed the bond between lois and clark, it's never been done before.

[redkryptoniteisthebest]

I agree. This was no doubt a Superman set-up.

[greatodinsbeard]

I think Clark will just do he hero thing 24/7 but when he faces Zod again he'll kick ass and learn a valuabel lesson. <Insert afterschool special music>

But seriously the prospect of Clark being a no nonsense hero has awesome possibilities.

[KalEl's Destiny]

Yup. Superman is coming everyone. When Clark Kent said he was dead, that marked the death of CK and the birth of Superman. Chloe should be honored that she witnessed it.

[Baum-El]

She's been sent there so IRMA ARDEN (SATURN GIRL) and BRANIAC-5 can alter her mind to see only Clark (when he wears his glasses) as Clark & SUPERMAN (when the glasses are off & the cape is on) as Superman!

The time travel deal is an easy plot device in order to create the KENT/SUPERMAN secret identity!

WOW!

[davidbrenton]

Ok i gotcha you're right she would cease to exsist. So this would mean if she saw clark in the future he would remember her from the last time he saw her which would be before she dissapeared? correct? And no no no i was hoping they wouldnt find a way to make lois not know clark before the daily planet, since they're trying to line up the mythos, I LOVE how smallville has formed the bond between lois and clark, it's never been done before.

he hehe. I know, I can get empassioned with my rants. Yes, I agree with you....Future Clark will know her, and SHE will actually become his re-connection to human feelings...she'll be his example of what humans can be....she'll be what brings his "human" side back, and something he is proud of.

Just a theory.

[cygnusx1]

i agree some sort of time jump will take place. i thought the fact that clark accepted human emotion is his weakness was a major step forward. it will change back when he meets lois again

david: sorry for piggy back thought. i was typing this as i am watching the ballgame and get easily distracted

[davidbrenton]

She's been sent there so IRMA ARDEN (SATURN GIRL) and BRANIAC-5 can alter her mind to see only Clark (when he wears his glasses) as Clark & SUPERMAN (when the glasses are off & the cape is on) as Superman!

The time travel deal is an easy plot device in order to create the KENT/SUPERMAN secret identity!

WOW!

Although, I don't know about the first part, I totally agree with the second. He has decided to "kill" Clark Kent, "the stud...AKA version of himself" and he'll reproduce a Clark Kent that it as complete fiction...glasses/dork. That has started...and no Jimmy O to call him on the fact he's changed....so maybe your right about Lois.

[nipvillesmlltuk]

And no no no i was hoping they wouldnt find a way to make lois not know clark before the daily planet, since they're trying to line up the mythos, I LOVE how smallville has formed the bond between lois and clark, it's never been done before.



Ugh, I wanna know how they make her forget :confused:

But so far, I'm ALREADY excited for season 9 :lol:

[Shadowlord367]

I don't think there'll be a time jump.

For us to see eight consecutive years of a story and then miss a gap towards the end would be momentum killing, and also what would be the point of killing one Jimmy just to jump back in with a new one?

[dunkman]

Lois traveling through time may have something to do with her not recognizing Superman as Clark, but we'll have to wait & see. I think Clark is embracing his role as Superman, but he'll still be Clark Kent. They'll straighten most of that out in the season 9 premiere.

[Grind]

I don't think you people can say that "clark has gone backwards in his character development" Especially after only that one scene. He was incredibly emotional, all of this unbelievable turmoil just happened and his life got turned upside down. in the heat of the moment everyone exaggerates their feelings. What he means is that he is finally realizing that he must make hard choices for the greater good and that life isn't all rainbows and bunny rabbits. Some human beings are just cruel and will always be that way. He has grown up. By next season, after he will have had the time to adjust and calm down he will make more sense of his destiny. But to say he went back years in development is missing the point and taking a conversation from a clearly emotional time as his real feelings. No one can make total sense of anything after a disaster has occurred and they have lost so much.
And also, as much as I would love to see him as superman, it's not ganna happen. Everyone involved with the show has said a bunch of times that their will be no costume in smallville because thats when the show would end and the superman we all know would begin. He will become more like the future superman we know as far as maturity and his outlook on life.

[amandaa125]

he hehe. I know, I can get empassioned with my rants. Yes, I agree with you....Future Clark will know her, and SHE will actually become his re-connection to human feelings...she'll be his example of what humans can be....she'll be what brings his "human" side back, and something he is proud of.

Just a theory.

Thats a really great theory i would love it if thats the direction smallville takes.

So how long do you guys think the time jump will be? (assuming their is one)

[Aalliya]

I hope that he does "train" to be superman and next season flashes forward quite a bit .... but still kinda lost on where/when Lois will come back.. AND she MUST come back!

[davidbrenton]

Thats a really great theory i would love it if thats the direction smallville takes.

So how long do you guys think the time jump will be? (assuming their is one)

I'd say about 5 years...and to respond to others fears, the reason the time jump works is because for Lois & Clark, no time will have passed essentially...Lois will be 1 day away from literally last seeing Clark, and Clark will have been training in the fortress so we won't have missed any of his story.

[amandaa125]

wow you're right if clark trains we really wont miss out on much at all? I was really confused but the more i think about it the more i see at as really clever. I think they could pull this off really nicely.

[cygnusx1]

kal-el can finally wear the real mask which is clark kent

[rconner]

Jimmy almost said it... Super .... guy. I was hoping he was going to say it.

Tonight the Red Blue Blur isn't the disguise no more... Clark Kent is the disguise!

[LoveHurts38]

So does that mean when Lois comes back she won't remember the time she met Clark or her time in Smallville.

[xrayvision]

This is everything but Superman. Superman doesn't believe the worst in humans.

Moreover this show will turn into everything but Superman. From what I saw, it will turn into some disgusting Justice League show. Anyone who thinks Lois & Clark and other Superman characters will be the center of the show once that happens is fooling themself. The death of Jimmy is just another sign of that.

[davidbrenton]

So does that mean when Lois comes back she won't remember the time she met Clark or her time in Smallville.

Hey Love, not at all. She'll remember...she just will have to "catch up" on what she missed in regard to what's been going on in the world since she skipped through a bunch. Probably have to interview for her job again...Perry White potentially...and a much older version explaining the re-cast.

[amandaa125]

Eh i really dont like Clark being the disguise of superman. I always liked them portraying superman as being the disguise of clark kent, the direction they have been moving in in smallville. For me if you dont pull of a great clark kent, it just doesnt feel like superman. If that makes any sense?

[Tebow15]

I think Clark is in the fortress.

[warriorrenegade]

This is everything but Superman. Superman doesn't believe the worst in humans.

Moreover this show will turn into everything but Superman. From what I saw, it will turn into some disgusting Justice League show. Anyone who thinks Lois & Clark and other Superman characters will be the center of the show once that happens is fooling themself. The death of Jimmy is just another sign of that.

It's pathetic really. He actually said it. He blames his humanity...basically we humans are his problem. It's a slap in the face of the character. And I get the whole this is SV version blah blah blah. I do. But when it corrupts the core beliefs of a character then enough is enough. This is wrong. So wrong.

[davidbrenton]

This is everything but Superman. Superman doesn't believe the worst in humans.




Clark must separate himself from humans in order to be their savior. He still loves them and sees the best in them, but he must consider them different in order to effectively be "Superman". He's not "Man" as he has exhibited throughout the series, now he is "Superman." His recognition of the "Super" part is exactly the progression, the "light switch" (In a completely non-condescending use of the term) he needed to move on to the next phase.

[bennyjr123]

This wasn't a bad episode. Mostly people are just upset if they didn't immediately get what they wanted for their characters. like lois, like davis, like jimmy. It was unavoidable.

[myankskent]

This is everything but Superman. Superman doesn't believe the worst in humans.

Moreover this show will turn into everything but Superman. From what I saw, it will turn into some disgusting Justice League show. Anyone who thinks Lois & Clark and other Superman characters will be the center of the show once that happens is fooling themself. The death of Jimmy is just another sign of that.

Agreed. This is not a Superman show anymore.

[kyl-el]

Eh i really dont like Clark being the disguise of superman. I always liked them portraying superman as being the disguise of clark kent, the direction they have been moving in in smallville. For me if you dont pull of a great clark kent, it just doesnt feel like superman. If that makes any sense?

I agree with you 100%. That's why that scene with Chloe at the end just didn't sit well with me.

[davidbrenton]

It's pathetic really. He actually said it. He blames his humanity...basically we humans are his problem. It's a slap in the face of the character. And I get the whole this is SV version blah blah blah. I do. But when it corrupts the core beliefs of a character then enough is enough. This is wrong. So wrong.

No, it's absolutely right. We, as humans, are by definition fatally flawed. we die, kill each other, victimize each other for our own selfish gain, and are the cause of our own problems, but we can also be the solution. He recognizes (FINALLY) our flaws and commits to the NEED to lead us to a better existence by example and a helping hand. This is not wrong. Telling and seeing the truth and acknowledging it for what it is not wrong....people may take offense to it, but truth is never wrong, truth is the catalyst for improvement.

[Mrs. Superman]

I'm sorry but I can not get over their retcon with Jimmy. I feel like I got slapped in the face with that one, and Im not sure I'll recover from it. this is the lowest for me, when it comes to Smallville. Everything else was redeemable. Not perfect, but redeemable. Jimmy's death is not. And yes, to me he was the real Jimmy. To see one of your favorites go out with a "ha ha the joke is on you audience" really sucked.

[Theshadow129x]

I agree with the original poster. they set up Superman! What is there to complain about? It was a great episode with a great ending. Clark does seperate himself from humans thats why he creates a weak persona as Clark kent in glasses and then he's Superman the earths protector.

[xrayvision]

Clark must separate himself from humans in order to be their savior. He still loves them and sees the best in them, but he must consider them different in order to effectively be "Superman". He's not "Man" as he has exhibited throughout the series, now he is "Superman." His recognition of the "Super" part is exactly the progression, the "light switch" (In a completely non-condescending use of the term) he needed to move on to the next phase.

Clark is too clingy with humans as seen with Lana and several other things, yes.

But the stuff we heard from Clark at the end is everything but Superman. This is the twisting of Superman into something very dark. The comics would have never written garbage like this. In the comics, his fight with Doomsday was done to save humanity, which he did. The writers weren't stupid enough to have a key character die and have Superman blame himself for it and then look for the worst in humanity. Sure other 1-shot versions of Superman appeared who were not the iconic version, but the Superman has been consistently shown to be an optimist who loves humanity and dedicates his life to save it from evil and other threats.

[Theshadow129x]

no, it's absolutely right. We, as humans, are by definition fatally flawed. We die, kill each other, victimize each other for our own selfish gain, and are the cause of our own problems, but we can also be the solution. He recognizes (finally) our flaws and commits to the need to lead us to a better existence by example and a helping hand. This is not wrong. Telling and seeing the truth and acknowledging it for what it is not wrong....people may take offense to it, but truth is never wrong, truth is the catalyst for improvement.

exactly

[superdogsbestfriend]

While I like the idea of a time jump, with the spectacular appearance of Zod at the very end of the episode I don't know how they can do it. Someone's going to have to deal with Zod in the regular timeline, and my bet is on Clark. I also thought there was something a bit off about Clark at the end. In some ways it reminded me of the Superman who came back in the movie Superman - Doomsday. Kind of a "no mercy" Superman. So maybe he really wasn't the real Clark.

[kszonew]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.



I for one thought they were perfectly okay with setting up Superman without doing things like sending Lois in the future, revealing the Jimmy we knew wasn't really Jimmy Olsen, and having Clark go train for several years and come back to a world where nobody recognizes him. That is, of course, provided everyones speculation turns out to be what actually happens.

I was just fine with Lois knowing Clark and the two having a friendship in their teenage, young adult years. Likewise, the Jimmy Olsen we knew was fine as Jimmy. Chloe could have been redeemed. Lex can return and in this version of Superman know who Superman is - he just keeps it between him and Clark because he feels its HIS destiny and not anyone elses to destroy him. Thus why he keeps his identity a secret, so no one else could knows who Supes is and have that advantage.

Smallville always seemed to be promoted as a different telling of the pre supes saga that would stay true to the basics, but also set it up in a different way. Now it just feels like they are trying way too hard to bring it all back to 100% mythos. They were already on a great path, some things just needed some work. I hope they continue and that path and many of the speculations don't come to pass.

[xrayvision]

Agreed. This is not a Superman show anymore.

Will you keep watching Matt? This is the first time I really considered giving up on the show. I thought so badly after seeing the first half of the season that the show would finally become what it should have been. I was sure after Stiletto that season 9 would have been a Clark-Lois-Jimmy centric season against members of Intergang. But now, it seems like that is the furthest thing that will happen.

[davidbrenton]

I'm sorry but I can not get over their retcon with Jimmy. I feel like I got slapped in the face with that one, and Im not sure I'll recover from it. this is the lowest for me, when it comes to Smallville. Everything else was redeemable. Not perfect, but redeemable. Jimmy's death is not. And yes, to me he was the real Jimmy. To see one of your favorites go out with a "ha ha the joke is on you audience" really sucked.

I can understand your reaction, but can you see the potential here? The intense/strong bond between Superman/Clark Kent and Jimmy Olsen---the brother of his friend who died in large part because he was unable to accept/see his true role in the world. "Jimmy Olsen--Superman's Pal" has a whole new amazing meaning from here on out.

I truly hope you don't only see the bad, and see the goodness that can come from this story.

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----


While I like the idea of a time jump, with the spectacular appearance of Zod at the very end of the episode I don't know how they can do it. Someone's going to have to deal with Zod in the regular timeline, and my bet is on Clark. I also thought there was something a bit off about Clark at the end. In some ways it reminded me of the Superman who came back in the movie Superman - Doomsday. Kind of a "no mercy" Superman. So maybe he really wasn't the real Clark.

Why can't Zod exist on earth without Superman? Why can't the world be screaming for help upon Superman's arrival?

I for one, can see no better introduction to Superman than the protection of earth from it's largest, most undeniable threat to date. Having Superman appear and make headlines for "Saving a girl from a speeding car." is ridiculous and beneath Superman. Having Superman step into the world's view by saving them from an absolutely unstoppable (By human means) force is a much more effective introduction to Superman than that.

[amandaa125]

While I understand the clark kent and superman are two different identities and he needs to seperate himself from the humans i really hope that when he is clark kent he doesnt go around acting like a bumbling idiot...i understand he needs to act like the kind of guy that would be never assumed to be superman but i really like how they've shown clark throughout the years on smallville

[ywm]

I'd say about 5 years...and to respond to others fears, the reason the time jump works is because for Lois & Clark, no time will have passed essentially...Lois will be 1 day away from literally last seeing Clark, and Clark will have been training in the fortress so we won't have missed any of his story.

ITA

[myankskent]

Will you keep watching Matt? This is the first time I really considered giving up on the show. I thought so badly after seeing the first half of the season that the show would finally become what it should have been. I was sure after Stiletto that season 9 would have been a Clark-Lois-Jimmy centric season against members of Intergang. But now, it seems like that is the furthest thing that will happen.

I don't know what I would be watching for. Lex is dead. Jimmy is dead. It would not surprise me if the show turned into a Justice League show and the DP stuff died out. So...to answer your question, I'm very close to not watching. It's like you said above, this show has lost it's identity. It has been losing it's identity little by little over the last few years and "Doomsday" just took a big step in the wrong direction, IMO.

[davidbrenton]

Clark is too clingy with humans as seen with Lana and several other things, yes.

But the stuff we heard from Clark at the end is everything but Superman. This is the twisting of Superman into something very dark. The comics would have never written garbage like this. In the comics, his fight with Doomsday was done to save humanity, which he did. The writers weren't stupid enough to have a key character die and have Superman blame himself for it and then look for the worst in humanity. Sure other 1-shot versions of Superman appeared who were not the iconic version, but the Superman has been consistently shown to be an optimist who loves humanity and dedicates his life to save it from evil and other threats.

How can you save the world from evil if you are unable to recognize it's various forms? Human's are capable of much evil...Clark is recognizing that he's been (A little) too close to actually differentiate between good and evil...Clark Kent recognizing the dark side of even the best people is one of the most optimistic events I've witnessed him endure.

[kyl-el]

How can you save the world from evil if you are unable to recognize it's various forms? Human's are capable of much evil...Clark is recognizing that he's been (A little) too close to actually differentiate between good and evil...Clark Kent recognizing the dark side of even the best people is one of the most optimistic events I've witnessed him endure.

I think that you're forgetting that kryptonians can go bad as well. Don't forget about General Zod or Zor-El. They may be wiser entities, but they are not transcendent.

[Theshadow129x]

there is alot of whining but this is how Clark creates dual identities. He creates a persona to live amongst us and another to live above us.

This season has proved to me that Clark has in fact put humanity on a pedestal. He overlooked the terribly bad deeds of Lana and Lex in the past because he thought they would correct themselves and they went on to make even worse decisions than they had before.

Clark simply isn't going to think like he has before. Look at what has come about from his decisions thinking all humans are great they just dont know it.

We got a second meteor shower, the death of his father, the invasion of Zod, brainiac, Black Thursday, Phantoms, Bizarro, more kryptonian madness, and the Doomsday problem we just got over.

[davidbrenton]

I think that you're forgetting that kryptonians can go bad as well. Don't forget about General Zod or Zor-El. They may be wiser entities, but they are not transcendent.

But growth for Clark isn't recognizing the bad side of Kryptonians. He's believed that pretty much his whole life (of knowing where he's from). Recognizing that, again, is not progression.

[Kschreck]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?


This is the big issue, they have been claiming that Clark would embrace his destiny for many years now and it hasn't happened. When spoilers and rumors started coming out for season 8, everyone got all excited and thought to themselves, "THIS IS IT!!!". Then we get the opening with Clark taking the job and the Daily Planet, etc. However then the story takes giant leaps backwards with Lana, Clark's guilt from Doomsday, etc and we never got flying or anything.

The producers are amazing when it comes to marketing. Once Comic Con comes around you better believe that the producers are going to be promoting season nine to the fullest making all sorts of claims and teases to get everyone excited just like they did with season eight. They will tease flight, embracing of destiny, etc and you know what? We're going to end up with another low budget and horribly written season with no sense of progression and tons of recons on past story arcs that were actually written well.

Don't get all excited for season nine when season eight is nothing to be excited about. There were a couple good episodes like Legion but lately, most of the second half of the season has been really bad and I hate to say it but the budget really prevents this show from doing anything actually good.

[kszonew]

I don't know what I would be watching for. Lex is dead. Jimmy is dead. It would not surprise me if the show turned into a Justice League show and the DP stuff died out. So...to answer your question, I'm very close to not watching. It's like you said above, this show has lost it's identity. It has been losing it's identity little by little over the last few years and "Doomsday" just took a big step in the wrong direction, IMO.

Though I suspect Lex isn't truly dead, a part of me wishes he is. I'll explain. In Smallville's version of the tale Clark and Lex were pals. Lex turned to the darkside, slowly but surely and they became enemies. But even in his darker moments Lex may have still been redeemed. Comes Descent and Lex is now truly evil, Clark and him have their showdown, and Lex and him both get crushed under the Fortress. In his dying moment, we see some redemption in Lex when he tells Clark he loved him like a brother. A tad cheesey but it makes sense and was true to the story between them we saw onscreen.

In Season 8 Lex is barely hanging on. He's a shell of his former self, a freak on life support that perishes after seeking revenge against Clark and Lana. Personally, I thought his "death" in Arctic was more fitting given his Smallville portrayal. But at the end of the day, the arc of Lex Luthor is kind of complete. He was good, he was in between, he turned evil, he learned the truth and perished, maybe somewhat redeemed despite his intended vengeance.

As for how this ties into this thread. People are talking about giving up on the show, well without Lex I feel the show has lost part of itself. I realize the actor choose to leave and I think he'd return for a few, but his part in the every week tale was as improtant as Clark so without one half of the whole it just isn't right.

[colibri]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

Oh, I saw it but hated the way it was written. Perhaps if they had taken the time this needed it might have worked better. Tried to tell the story in 2 hours and given more set-up for certain things but right now it looks like a mind-wipe retcon. And although I agree that he's accepting his Kryptonian side he is still regressing because he's turning his back on his human side just like he's previously done with his Kryptonian. He's still doesn't get it. There were other things that were quite aggravating as well.

Look, I'll concede that part of the problem lies with the history we've had with this show in the past. History has shown us that the writers just don't get it and fail constantly. What guarantee do I have they actually will get it right this time? The Chloe storyline certainly doesn't inspire confidence; it's Lana all over again. How do we know they'll do things right next year?

[galatians221]

I'm going to have to see it again as I'm really confused. Did Clark vaporize when he walked away from Chloe? I mean what happened to Clark at the end? Is Doomsday buried and contained or did the explosion tear him to pieces and kill him?

[kszonew]

Don't get all excited for season nine when season eight is nothing to be excited about. There were a couple good episodes like Legion but lately, most of the second half of the season has been really bad and I hate to say it but the budget really prevents this show from doing anything actually good.

I'm glad to see someone else recognized they had a smaller budget this year. I mean, the centerpoint of Metropolis for the longest while was a street with a coffee shop and pharmacy. Vancouver is a beautiful city to use as Metropolis, it would be nice to see more of it on the show.

[galatians221]

Clark must separate himself from humans in order to be their savior. He still loves them and sees the best in them, but he must consider them different in order to effectively be "Superman". He's not "Man" as he has exhibited throughout the series, now he is "Superman." His recognition of the "Super" part is exactly the progression, the "light switch" (In a completely non-condescending use of the term) he needed to move on to the next phase.

I loved the way Welling portrayed his character when Jimmy found out. He was powerful, authoritative and it seemed to me that at the end he hopefully will cease to be this naive, conflicted, tortured soul who can't figure out if he wants to be a normal human or fulfill his destiny. I think he made the decision to be Superman. Hopefully the writers will remember that he made that decision and S9 will show us Superman.

[davidbrenton]

And although I agree that he's accepting his Kryptonian side he is still regressing because he's turning his back on his human side just like he's previously done with his Kryptonian.

History has shown us that the writers just don't get it and fail constantly. What guarantee do I have they actually will get it right this time? The Chloe storyline certainly doesn't inspire confidence; it's Lana all over again. How do we know they'll do things right next year?


How is committing to be HUMANITIES HERO turning on humanity?

Sorry, that argument doesn't fly. He's assessing humanity and grading it accurately. That, does not, a villain make. If a guy came along and said to me, "I'm going to save the world." I'd ask, "What's wrong with it?"

--Previously, our Clark wouldn't have been to string together an accurate, non-rosey sentence. I'd tell this person to go....blank.

--Now, this Clark would bat an eye before telling us exactly what the darker sides of humanity are that he is specifically trying to save us from. That's a hero I'd believe in.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


I'm going to have to see it again as I'm really confused. Did Clark vaporize when he walked away from Chloe? I mean what happened to Clark at the end? Is Doomsday buried and contained or did the explosion tear him to pieces and kill him?

That was the image of the "metaphorical" death. The Clark Chloe has known has disappeared--- it was no accident or coincidence it showed him disappearing from her viewpoint. Clark Kent has officially grown up.

[kyl-el]

But growth for Clark isn't recognizing the bad side of Kryptonians. He's believed that pretty much his whole life (of knowing where he's from). Recognizing that, again, is not progression.

Of course its not progression and it doesn't move the storyline anywhere, but it is a fact. It's also a fact that Clark has dealt with enough evil humans, ex. Lex Luthor, to know already that we are a fallen race. Yes, he did need to accept that fact more fully, but I fail to see how this episode would make him come to that realization. Sure one human kills another, and he happens to know one party, but kryptonians have done the same. It shouldn't matter if kryptonians are good or bad, its how he uses the powers he's been given.

Clark has always used his powers for good, so what is going to change? I don't know what sudden changes everyone is expecting to see here as far as progression goes. What criteria does he have to meet for people to be happy? Put on a cape? Fly? Something else?

[Odysseus]

Clark must separate himself from humans in order to be their savior. He still loves them and sees the best in them, but he must consider them different in order to effectively be "Superman". He's not "Man" as he has exhibited throughout the series, now he is "Superman." His recognition of the "Super" part is exactly the progression, the "light switch" (In a completely non-condescending use of the term) he needed to move on to the next phase.

Nope. This idea was thrown out after the Crisis on Infinite Earths (and rightfully so)

Clark himself has said it best: his humanity is what makes him a hero. The fact that he actually allows himself to love, and rejects Jor-El's cold and soul-less "duty-bound" form of heroism, and instead chooses to save people because he loves humanity.

This is just a phase. Clark is just having a personal crisis because Davis has made him doubt his beliefs about humanity, but I feel 100% confident that next season Lois and Chloe will help Clark find his faith in humanity once again. It's what Jonathan and Martha would want, after all.

[davidbrenton]

Of course its not progression and it doesn't move the storyline anywhere, but it is a fact. It's also a fact that Clark has dealt with enough evil humans, ex. Lex Luthor, to know already that we are a fallen race. Yes, he did need to accept that fact more fully, but I fail to see how this episode would make him come to that realization. Sure one human kills another, and he happens to know one party, but kryptonians have done the same. It shouldn't matter if kryptonians are good or bad, its how he uses the powers he's been given.

Clark has always used his powers for good, so what is going to change? I don't know what sudden changes everyone is expecting to see here as far as progression goes. What criteria does he have to meet for people to be happy? Put on a cape? Fly? Something else?

The change is that he refuses to become caught up in it. He sees that these attachments miscolor his views and affect his judgement. Superman is not a man of many friends. He is a leader. A savior. By definition and need (our White house and politicians where everyone is in bed with each other is a prime example). To be a leader and savior, I'd argue that one must be detached. He has already detached himself and recognized Kryptonian flaws. He is now fully understanding the depth of humanities flaws, and he cannot convince people (Oliver, Chloe, etc.) to do the right thing by being one of them...he recognizes he must be better. He must be the example he wishes for humanity to save them.

[xrayvision]

How can you save the world from evil if you are unable to recognize it's various forms? Human's are capable of much evil...Clark is recognizing that he's been (A little) too close to actually differentiate between good and evil...Clark Kent recognizing the dark side of even the best people is one of the most optimistic events I've witnessed him endure.

Clark is supposed to recognize the dark aspects of humanity, but not turn his back on those who exhibit these aspects.

Right now is probably too early to debate this because Clark just died and he has to come back to life and deal with everything. But what I saw from Clark so far was him writing off all humanity as being evil and having dark motives. This is not the way Superman sees it. As long as he gets over this by the end of the premiere, I'll be OK with it. I would like to see the Eradicator showing up in a Kryptonian body and exhibiting these qualities, but not Clark Kent. Clark has clearly lost his way. He is a spirit now and given the circumstances, I could understand because he is literally a lost soul. But this better be corrected before he is resurrected because this is not how Superman sees things. Identifying evil when he sees it is something Superman does, but he doesn't turn his back on it. Clark was more like Superman when he said something along those lines in Injustice or Beast (I don't remember which episode it was, but he did say something like that).

For Clark to become Superman, he must not only save them physically from danger but make sure they are taken to someone who can help them. If Clark's soul remains like it is now and he is resurrected having this same mindset, then he will be no better than Ollie and would justify killing and having the ends justify the means--everything Superman doesn't do.

[davidbrenton]

Nope. This idea was thrown out after the Crisis on Infinite Earths (and rightfully so)

Clark himself has said it best: his humanity is what makes him a hero. The fact that he actually allows himself to love, and rejects Jor-El's cold and soul-less "duty-bound" form of heroism, and instead chooses to save people because he loves humanity.

This is just a phase. Clark is just having a personal crisis because Davis has made him doubt his beliefs about humanity, but I feel 100% confident that next season Lois and Chloe will help Clark find his faith in humanity once again. It's what Jonathan and Martha would want, after all.

I don't argue that. It's a phase. A crucial one given the Clark we've been presented with in the past few seasons. He has to grow----tremendously intellectually and emotionally...this is what he needs.

I've said that Lois (Especially) is what will be his link back, his connection to humanity.

I disagree that recognizing the need to distance oneself, at this point in time, it a "Cold, souless" action. In the contrary, it's because of his love for humanity...his connection to it that he sees he HAS TO step away from it to be an effective example.

His reconnection to the world (After the much needed separation) will be next years theme.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

I'm going to follow Clark's lead and take a break (The Grey's finale) because I see I'm getting to caught up in winning my argument to effectively decipher other people's arguments.

Thanks for responding everyone...and I know I could be wrong...but I've enjoyed fighting the negative current I saw after the finale.

Be back soon.

[Odysseus]

I disagree that recognizing the need to distance oneself, at this point in time, it a "Cold, souless" action. In the contrary, it's because of his love for humanity...his connection to it that he sees he HAS TO step away from it to be an effective example.

His reconnection to the world (After the much needed separation) will be next years theme.

I don't think any such separation is "necessary" (except maybe for dramatic tension). In the comics, Superman is described as loving humanity and loving being part of human society as Clark Kent. This is an essential component of Post-Crisis mythos, and it's further supported in the "Superman/Batman:Public Enemies" story arc, where he is actually contrasted with Batman this way (Batman is literally human, but separates himself from humanity, while Superman is not literally human but CHOOSES to EMBRACE humanity anyway).

This love of humanity is the most vital aspect of his character. Jonathan and Martha have both emphasized this verbally in previous seasons.

900th post!

[vikingjedi]

Clark has to be dead. Nothing after Clark attacked DD made any sense.

[kszonew]

Clark himself has said it best: his humanity is what makes him a hero. The fact that he actually allows himself to love, and rejects Jor-El's cold and soul-less "duty-bound" form of heroism, and instead chooses to save people because he loves humanity.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

[thejazonshow]

I'm going to have to see it again as I'm really confused. Did Clark vaporize when he walked away from Chloe? I mean what happened to Clark at the end? Is Doomsday buried and contained or did the explosion tear him to pieces and kill him?
I dont know half the stuff. Doomsday though, i do like how they finished the fight by burying him. He isn't dead. He is prolly just in some coma right now. Just like when he "died" from kryptonite. Eventually, he will wake up and come out of the earth like in the comics. So tha was ok. clark didn't seem right at the end. maybe it wasn't him? just like after superman's death? there were four "supermen" i don't know

[davidbrenton]

I don't think any such separation is "necessary" (except maybe for dramatic tension). In the comics, Superman is described as loving humanity and loving being part of human society as Clark Kent. This is an essential component of Post-Crisis mythos, and it's further supported in the "Superman/Batman:Public Enemies" story arc, where he is actually contrasted with Batman this way (Batman is literally human, but separates himself from humanity, while Superman is not literally human but CHOOSES to EMBRACE humanity anyway).

This love of humanity is the most vital aspect of his character. Jonathan and Martha have both emphasized this verbally in previous seasons.

900th post!

Awesome 900th post!

Okay, really going now....

[kyl-el]

The change is that he refuses to become caught up in it. He sees that these attachments miscolor his views and affect his judgement. Superman is not a man of many friends. He is a leader. A savior. By definition and need (our White house and politicians where everyone is in bed with each other is a prime example). To be a leader and savior, I'd argue that one must be detached. He has already detached himself and recognized Kryptonian flaws. He is now fully understanding the depth of humanities flaws, and he cannot convince people (Oliver, Chloe, etc.) to do the right thing by being one of them...he recognizes he must be better. He must be the example he wishes for humanity to save them.

So you want him to become a more prominent and public leader/savior, rather than a mystery in the night? I don't have a problem with that, its the direction the show has to move eventually. I guess that I just don't like the thought of him becoming a leader, only for reasons prescribed by Jor-El. I say that because before Clark could have the ability to lead, he needed to know both sides of the coin when it comes down to humanity. That is what Jonathan Kent showed him. Clark needed to see that humanity is redeemable before accepting that it would even be possible. I think that in the end, both of Clark's fathers were right, even though they didn't seem to get along.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that not all of his attachments inhibited his grow; he needed some positive forms of attachment to begin with to inspire him to become a leader. That's why I kind of cringed when he said that "Clark Kent is dead". If some of his experiences as Clark would never have existed, he wouldn't care to save humanity.

[Timester]

What Clark needs is an Exile to set his mind correct.

[colibri]

How is committing to be HUMANITIES HERO turning on humanity?

Sorry, that argument doesn't fly. He's assessing humanity and grading it accurately. That, does not, a villain make. If a guy came along and said to me, "I'm going to save the world." I'd ask, "What's wrong with it?"

--Previously, our Clark wouldn't have been to string together an accurate, non-rosey sentence. I'd tell this person to go....blank.

--Now, this Clark would bat an eye before telling us exactly what the darker sides of humanity are that he is specifically trying to save us from. That's a hero I'd believe in.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----



That was the image of the "metaphorical" death. The Clark Chloe has known has disappeared--- it was no accident or coincidence it showed him disappearing from her viewpoint. Clark Kent has officially grown up.

I never mentioned his commitment to being humanities hero or did I ever imply he was becoming a villain, I mentioned his turning away from his human side, everything he was taught by his parents is thrown away. The reality is that he has to have BOTH and in previous times he backed away from his Kryptonian sided (which I didn't like either) but now it's his human side he's turning from. First he talks about the dark side of the Kryptonians and now he's doing the same with the humans. What he needs is a balance to become the hero.

And again, my problem isn't so much with the intent of the episode but the execution. I realiize that his backing away from the human side is also to slow down his progression into "Superman" who has both sets of values. I can see where they are trying to go with it but I frankly don't trust the writer's to do a good job of this if they retcon everything and do it with silly stunts.

Instead of writing this silly Doomsday/Davis arc they could have shown this struggle Clark has and dealt with that in a more coherent fashion instead of this rushed mess where they snap their fingers and presto we have will now have more of a mythos when in reality this slows down his progression as well.

[thejazonshow]

I don't think any such separation is "necessary" (except maybe for dramatic tension). In the comics, Superman is described as loving humanity and loving being part of human society as Clark Kent. This is an essential component of Post-Crisis mythos, and it's further supported in the "Superman/Batman:Public Enemies" story arc, where he is actually contrasted with Batman this way (Batman is literally human, but separates himself from humanity, while Superman is not literally human but CHOOSES to EMBRACE humanity anyway).

This love of humanity is the most vital aspect of his character. Jonathan and Martha have both emphasized this verbally in previous seasons.

900th post!
thats exactly right. but thats why i dont like this. i mean, hasn't he already seen what it would be like to go fully kryptonian, just like season 4? he already has been that, and needed his human mother to bring him back. and he knew he didn't want that. so now, he sees jimmy dead, and understandably is shaken, and drops his own humanity again? it doesn't seem right. i honestly think that it isn't him. i just get this feeling. just like when he died and four "supermen" came out of no where, it might be a different person. i dont know.

[DestinyAw8s]

I loved the way Welling portrayed his character when Jimmy found out. He was powerful, authoritative and it seemed to me that at the end he hopefully will cease to be this naive, conflicted, tortured soul who can't figure out if he wants to be a normal human or fulfill his destiny. I think he made the decision to be Superman. Hopefully the writers will remember that he made that decision and S9 will show us Superman.
ITA with all you said but especially so on the bolded part. I would love to see him come to terms with exactly who and what he is and take some danged pride in his heritage and what he can accomplish because of it. I've had enough of watching him constantly warring with himself, only to come out with little to no resolution. I truly hope it sticks this time and he finally sees the light at the end of the tunnel.

[tinkerchere]

maybe this is just me and maybe I am crazy ,but i yhought the end was rather ominous. personally I think Clark is going to take a very dark turn next year.

----- Added 59 Seconds later -----

maybe this is just me and maybe I am crazy ,but i thought the end was rather ominous. personally I think Clark is going to take a very dark turn next year.

[darkphoenix21]

maybe this is just me and maybe I am crazy ,but i yhought the end was rather ominous. personally I think Clark is going to take a very dark turn next year.

Yeah, I was thinking that too because he said something to the effect that he's going to take the emotional side, his humanity, and completely disregard that. Part of what makes Superman, Superman is his compassion for humanity. How is closing himself off to his friends, family and his emotion going to transform him into Superman.

[tw1stedan9el]

I'm still worked up about Jimmy.... I mean Henry.

I'm starting to think Lois is not Lois Lane. and Clark is not the real clark kent.

This is all one big dream.

i feel cheated.

[Unsound]

I'm not going to jump to any conclusions or make any assumptions, I've learned better than to do that with this show. But I will say I'm excited for next season premiere to clear up a lot of things, and I think it's headed in a good direction. Every year there's a whole heap of people unhappy with the finale, and this or that about the season in general... and the unhappy voices are always more vocal and generally louder than those who enjoyed it. I'm sure there's a lot of people out there who were totally thrilled by the episode and the possibilities it presents. Too many times people aren't willing to look any further than the moment. Can't wait for next season. Will have to find something to distract me until then.

[colibri]

----- Added 59 Seconds later -----

maybe this is just me and maybe I am crazy ,but i thought the end was rather ominous. personally I think Clark is going to take a very dark turn next year.

Exactly. This is just as much a regression as his inability to accept his human side. I don't think when we get to the next season we are going to get Superman. I just hope they do this right and I'm just not trusting these writers to do that.

[superspider02]

this is going to be an interesting series of events to unfold now.

[Dr. Blade]

Is that what he was doing? Going to do his training? I didn't understand anything about his actions in the end. Yeah, there's room for speculation, but is anyone really sure of what's going to happen next? We don't even know if that was the real Clark Kent, as we know him.

[colibri]

Is that what he was doing? Going to do his training? I didn't understand anything about his actions in the end. Yeah, there's room for speculation, but is anyone really sure of what's going to happen next? We don't even know if that was the real Clark Kent, as we know him.

I don't know anymore. Things just weren't set up properly. I'm starting to wonder if this is Smalville's take on the Eradicator.

[Lilah]

Please do not tell me that people actually believe that "Clark Kent is dead" was Clark actually EMBRACING Superman...and his destiny.
Clark just set himself back about five years of character development.

Yeah this "CLARK KENT" is not the Superman I grew up watching... this is some unattached emo version of the iconic character... they just set the character development to way before the pilot aired....

----- Added 50 Seconds later -----


I don't know anymore. Things just weren't set up properly. I'm starting to wonder if this is Smalville's take on the Eradicator.

My thoughts exactly... I'm hoping it is the Eradicator because that would justify alot...

[SinoSupermanfromSD]

I think this finale showed more than anything that Clark is still far from being Superman. Superman represents a point in which Clark has accepted and embraced both his Kryptonian heritage and adopted humanity not as competing worldviews, but as complementary sides of his unique background that makes him him. Clark at this point at the end of season 8 is still given to extremes. For most of this season, we saw an inkling of him reconciling the two together (i.e. his acceptance of Jor-El as his father), but it wasn't perfectly Superman... He still, as he admitted in the end, put humanity on too high of a pedestal... he still saw his Kryptonian heritage as inferior. Now, he's going to the other extreme, embracing his alien-ness while seemingly rejecting his humanity. I believe and hope Season 9 will feature him arriving to more of the Supermanly embrace of both Krypton and Earth. Perhaps, as it does in other Superman media, it'll take the re-appearance of Ms. Lane to help him rediscover his humanity.

Of course, all of what I said is for naught, if the "Clark" in the end turns out to be the Eradicator.

[st_stickler]

I don't think you people can say that "clark has gone backwards in his character development" Especially after only that one scene. He was incredibly emotional, all of this unbelievable turmoil just happened and his life got turned upside down. in the heat of the moment everyone exaggerates their feelings. What he means is that he is finally realizing that he must make hard choices for the greater good and that life isn't all rainbows and bunny rabbits. Some human beings are just cruel and will always be that way. He has grown up. By next season, after he will have had the time to adjust and calm down he will make more sense of his destiny. But to say he went back years in development is missing the point and taking a conversation from a clearly emotional time as his real feelings. No one can make total sense of anything after a disaster has occurred and they have lost so much.
And also, as much as I would love to see him as superman, it's not ganna happen. Everyone involved with the show has said a bunch of times that their will be no costume in smallville because thats when the show would end and the superman we all know would begin. He will become more like the future superman we know as far as maturity and his outlook on life.


Actually, no one ever envisioned the show going this long. They envisioned 4 at most and now it is going 9 to 10. It is entirely possible that the show has been given some more freedom to incorporate more and more of the Superman character simply because this would be absolutely ridiculous to go on another two seasons and not get there at some point.

[thejazonshow]

Yeah this "CLARK KENT" is not the Superman I grew up watching... this is some unattached emo version of the iconic character... they just set the character development to way before the pilot aired....

----- Added 50 Seconds later -----



My thoughts exactly... I'm hoping it is the Eradicator because that would justify alot...
it would justify alot, but again, this would be another story tactic that has been used. clark acts different, then we find out its not clark. just like with bizarro. i mean, i hope its eradicator myself, cuz that could bring some great episodes with zod being there too (another repeated story), but still, they get paid to create. they shouldn't be repeating concepts for stories.

[Kal-El Fan]

The scene where Clark tells Chloe that "Clark Kent is dead" was almost an exact match to the scene in the comics where the Eradicator tells Lois that "Kent is gone, there is only Superman now." I seriously doubt that it was Clark, especially since he didn't seem to know how he made it out of the tunnel.
I don't see how a time jump will work if Zod is now on Earth.
Maybe Clark is "dead" and Eradicator vs Zod will be the Smallville version of "Reign of the Supermen." Leaving Doomsday buried also allows for the comic version of the Death of Superman story to occur, while also having the death/return story happen on Smallville.

[bluewolv1970]

The scene where Clark tells Chloe that "Clark Kent is dead" was almost an exact match to the scene in the comics where the Eradicator tells Lois that "Kent is gone, there is only Superman now." I seriously doubt that it was Clark, especially since he didn't seem to know how he made it out of the tunnel.
I don't see how a time jump will work if Zod is now on Earth.
Maybe Clark is "dead" and Eradicator vs Zod will be the Smallville version of "Reign of the Supermen." Leaving Doomsday buried also allows for the comic version of the Death of Superman story to occur, while also having the death/return story happen on Smallville.

thank you that has to have been the eradicator and as you said they will do a mini reign of the supermen arc

[dimefan90]

i think zod will resurrect the FoS and the eradicator will try to eradicate zod. meanwhile clark will be healing somewhere.

[Theshadow129x]

i highly doubt the writers are smart enough to do the eradicator

[Marfeic2011]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

ok maybe your right about the set up - but at the expense of a decade old friendship - he abandons chloe in her moment of need - right when she needed him more than she probably ever has - it's disgraceful and very un-supermanly - made me sick:mad:

[rconner]

Is that what he was doing? Going to do his training? I didn't understand anything about his actions in the end. Yeah, there's room for speculation, but is anyone really sure of what's going to happen next? We don't even know if that was the real Clark Kent, as we know him.

Thats the point, its a cliffhanger. No one knows for sure what Clark is going to do, or how events will be played out.

It's all speculation till we start getting the fall spoilers

[teddybairs]

I dunno, they did a little bit of just about everything but Batman, so an eradicator story arc doesn't seem so far fetched. At any rate, Clark definitely needs some time to sort some things out.

Big question, how's he going to handle Zod? He did it before, question is whether or not he will do it again. Also, how does Lois fit into it?

[Exedore]

I think it would be best if they reveal that this Kal El is actually a live action adaptation of Superboy Prime from the comics. With the constant mental anguish, every decision he takes going horribly wrong and losing everything and everyone around him, I can clearly see him going completely insane at some point and becoming the villain from the comics. This would be the final nail in the coffin. Just get it over with. :rolleyes:

[bluewolv1970]

i think zod will resurrect the FoS and the eradicator will try to eradicate zod. meanwhile clark will be healing somewhere.

exactly you know the spoilers said that the finale would feature someone old - zod and someone new - eradicator

[Kschreck]

i highly doubt the writers are smart enough to do the eradicator


I have to agree here. I have heard some very convoluted story arcs from fans and none of them ever happen. The writers have given pretty dumbed down story arcs. Clark is Clark!

[Theshadow129x]

lol Clark is Clark so except it people. He's just trying to put things into perspective right now.

[colibri]

lol Clark is Clark so except it people. He's just trying to put things into perspective right now.

I think most people think it's Clark or more like Kal-el since he's turned his back on his human side but we're just speculating a bit. I also agree the writer's aren't clever enough to make him the Eradicator if they had to resort to the stuff they did in the finale but the way it was written does give me reason to scratch my head. Think of it more as thinking out loud and trying to make sense of this mess.

[mjohn89]

hmm, Lois will more then likely land in the future where the legion is the time that rokk ( think that's his name) is from he will probably confront clark on questioning why he took her to the future and maybe clark asks that she doesnt know who he is too save her from him.
My prediction on season 9
Clark will go to the fortress to train and the 1st one or two episodes and become superman being able to fly and all meantime zod or whoever that was will find away to let out zod if that isnt him or if it is him he will find away to free his two partners forgot there names. But i think the twist will probably be that clark still will be the red blue blur and not superman yet but im hoping he can fly in season 9 since i think the restriction for no tights no flights was for season 1-8 there was a new contract signed for 9 -to whatever.

Remember they could always take cloe out of the picture if the legion just goes back in time and prevents chloe from ever meeting clark which in turn will fix the lois knowing clark gap because clark met lois through chloe so if clark never met chloe then he never would have met lois.

Also I thought they mentioned Darkseid at the beginning of the season or was that just a rumor

[I_am_LEX]

I'm not sure where the writers are going but if it makes for good episodes in the future, I'm for it. I'm a little lost on the Lois thing but my guess is that she didn't get warped too far ahead and when she is found or meets Clark again, he won't be so "Clark" anymore. I did like what he said about being the hero he needs to be, that made everything else he said in the scene make a lot of sense. He's figured out that he can't be the hero he wants to be all the time, he has to be the hero that he needs to be all the time. But he will discover that who he needs to be is who he wanted to be all along, so it balances out. Okay so Jimmy's name was really Henry i guess and his brother's is actually James. So I guess that part now makes more sense. Overall the episode was good, a little confusing at times, but now that I've had time to soak it in, I think I get it and know what's going on.

[Kal-El Fan]

Why would Lois end up anywhen but the 31st Century? Rokk gave Clark the ring to send Doomsday to the 31st Century for the Legion to fight.

[davidbrenton]

ok maybe your right about the set up - but at the expense of a decade old friendship - he abandons chloe in her moment of need - right when she needed him more than she probably ever has - it's disgraceful and very un-supermanly - made me sick:mad:

He's not abandoning her if he's putting himself first. He's just not sacrificing himself--or the world--- for another person's whimsical needs. Chloe is strong...he knows that...and it's about freagin' time Chloe started moving on from Clark....it's about time she started finding the strength within herself that wasn't Clark-Centric. Clark doing what is best for him is simultaneously what's good for Chloe.


Chloe went on a spiral this season (Yes, it was all Chloe) because of her unhealthy connection to Clark. It's time she grew past that.

[mjohn89]

I dont think that is the eradictor i think it is just a darker side to clark. I dont think the eradicator would have had the emotions to go to henry/jimmys funeral or to tell chloe clark is no more. I think they are trying to now fix the mythos and if they are how does bringing eradicator in do that zod makes a little sense besides that might not be zod on earth it could be davis maybe sending a sign to zod or something that has yet to be told. Like someone said superman is a equally balanced super hero there is more then the suite that make him and this is what they are exploring. He has to become superman before he can recreate himself as clark he dresses up as clark superman is who he is.

--------------
With chloe i think she will die in season 9 which will tear clark even more from himself and he will probably use the legion ring to go back in time and make it to where he never met chloe this will fix him from knowing lois before superman other wise why does rokk keep giving him the legion ring there has to be a reason he gave it to him the 1st time i know the 2nd time it was to send doomsday to them but there has to be a reason they even bothered showing the legion at all in this episode when he didnt use it.

[Krypto_marcus]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

I totally agree David!

[Darren5000]

You forgot to put down Shelby the dog doing something.
I miss old Shelby.:rotfl:

[davidbrenton]

You forgot to put down Shelby the dog doing something.
I miss old Shelby.:rotfl:

OMG. He's going to leave Shelby.


---Now, if that happened, I'd completely change my stance.

(Seriously)

[Theshadow129x]

I think most people think it's Clark or more like Kal-el since he's turned his back on his human side but we're just speculating a bit. I also agree the writer's aren't clever enough to make him the Eradicator if they had to resort to the stuff they did in the finale but the way it was written does give me reason to scratch my head. Think of it more as thinking out loud and trying to make sense of this mess.

i dont think he's turning his back on humanity. what he said was that he thinks of humanity too highly and if he is going to save the world then he needs to look at things differently.

He clearly didnt say he wasnt going to help the world. Thats considered turning his back on humanity.

Clark just needs to find a way to seperate his personal life from his superhero life. We have seen numerous times that the result of him not doing this is someone he's close to getting killed or being banished or whatever.


Its just like how all of us are two people outside of work and another person at home. U wouldn't dare take ur work life home with you because then ur work affairs interfere with ur personal affairs and vice versa. Clark sees this which is why he will be two people with two different characteristics.

Clark thinks with emotion which has come back to kick him in the butt over and over. Thats what Jor-El kept telling him about: Stop thinking like them because your actions have big consequences.

Humans will never understand the affairs of kryptonians and if Clark stayed on the path he was on he would cause more disaster than he already has.

[davidbrenton]

Its just like how all of us are two people outside of work and another person at home. U wouldn't dare take ur work life home with you because then ur work affairs interfere with ur personal affairs and vice versa.


See. this is where you lose me....I'm the same at work. I let everyone know when I'm on kryptonsite, don't hide it from anyone, and make no pretensions about stuff. I did put in my evaluation that I should try to be more mature, but honestly, i don't see it happening.


Side bar.

[smallvillereporter27]

He's not abandoning her if he's putting himself first. He's just not sacrificing himself--or the world--- for another person's whimsical needs. Chloe is strong...he knows that...and it's about freagin' time Chloe started moving on from Clark....it's about time she started finding the strength within herself that wasn't Clark-Centric. Clark doing what is best for him is simultaneously what's good for Chloe.


Chloe went on a spiral this season (Yes, it was all Chloe) because of her unhealthy connection to Clark. It's time she grew past that.

ITA. I love Chloe, but she's too close to Clark (and I think Clark realizes this). I think this was the best move for both Clark and Chloe. Separation will do wonders for both of them (jeez...I never thought I'd be saying that :p)

[Theshadow129x]

See. this is where you lose me....I'm the same at work. I let everyone know when I'm on kryptonsite, don't hide it from anyone, and make no pretensions about stuff. I did put in my evaluation that I should try to be more mature, but honestly, i don't see it happening.


Side bar.

thing is that people have dual identities. not everyone but people do. its the concept of this show and its the concept of humanity. Most people outside of your personal life dont know the real you....thats how it works for me at least. I tell people nothing about me outside of work. I keep my personal life to my personal life.

For a while Clark will more than likely do that.

[davidbrenton]

thing is that people have dual identities. not everyone but people do. its the concept of this show and its the concept of humanity. Most people outside of your personal life dont know the real you....thats how it works for me at least. I tell people nothing about me outside of work. I keep my personal life to my personal life.

For a while Clark will more than likely do that.

Well, I don't share my personal life. But, I don't act any differently. I guess that was my point...not sure why i was making it really.

--To your point, I definitely see the need for clark to majorly separate from earthly persona.

[Luthor5339]

It IS the set up...


Jonathan: Clark, your mother tells me you... can fly?

Clark: Kal-El can fly. Clark Kent is still earthbound.

Embracing heritage & remaining Clark is what makes him Superman. It's metaphorically the adoptee's search to be whole, which is a long and complicated process and by the set up for next season - that's exactly what the intend to do.

"Clark Kent is dead."

Clark’s not a ghost. He’s just going through a really tough time right now. He’s starting to question who he is.

As an international adoptee, a child of two worlds, I’ve also been going through a difficult identity crises and wondering if everything would be better if I stopped trying to act like I belong and just accept my “alien side” – my birth right.

So, why does Clark seem different? We’ve always seen him question this side of himself and now he’s at tipping point more than ever before, basically he feels it’s safer to truly accept the birth side than human side, which is really a confusing question and does reflect in how you act on things. Recently I made myself promise to recognize and hold strong to this otherness, to not forget that I am different and to stop pretending, that’s what Clark’s also done, I’m not sure if he’s right or wrong. I’m starting to wonder if it might be easier… so nope, not a ghost – just giving up trying to fit in. The writers even hinted as much… it is a metaphorical death - the death of the adopted self for the birth self.

Bringing in ZOD now is huge, it's going to have a really strong role to play!

Next season’s going to be epic, the battle of identity being of two worlds has a lot of conflicts, trust me… Hopefully it ends in flying…

[amalie]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

I can understand how they set up Superman but the way they did it, in regards to Jimmy, was disgusting and unnecessary. Had Davis killed Chloe instead of Jimmy, Clark's story would still have ended the same and it wouldn't have left that foul taste in my mouth which is going to be hard to get rid of.

[smallvillereporter27]

I can understand how they set up Superman but the way they did it, in regards to Jimmy, was disgusting and unnecessary. Had Davis killed Chloe instead of Jimmy, Clark's story would still have ended the same and it wouldn't have left that foul taste in my mouth which is going to be hard to get rid of.

They did it for shock factor and to fix a minor problem in the mythos. I can see why they thought this was clever, but it blew up in their faces. In a way I feel bad for the Smallville producers...:rolleyes:

[davidbrenton]

I can understand how they set up Superman but the way they did it, in regards to Jimmy, was disgusting and unnecessary. Had Davis killed Chloe instead of Jimmy, Clark's story would still have ended the same and it wouldn't have left that foul taste in my mouth which is going to be hard to get rid of.

I can understand your position, and I agree it would have been the same result with Chloe dying. I think PS1 were too afraid to go where they really needed to in order to make the story as effective and clear as it could have been.

If any character deserved to be Clark's metamorphisis (SP??) it was Chloe. There wasn't really a need to do that to Jimmy, but I (personally) don't have an issue with it since I didn't think he was the most captivating character as he stood. Unfortunately, I was just becoming enthusiastic/intrigued/captivated by where they could go with that had they kept him alive upon his finding out Clark's secret....asuming Chloe died instead.

[amalie]

I can understand your position, and I agree it would have been the same result with Chloe dying. I think PS1 were too afraid to go where they really needed to in order to make the story as effective and clear as it could have been.

If any character deserved to be Clark's metamorphisis (SP??) it was Chloe. There wasn't really a need to do that to Jimmy, but I (personally) don't have an issue with it since I didn't think he was the most captivating character as he stood. Unfortunately, I was just becoming enthusiastic/intrigued/captivated by where they could go with that had they kept him alive upon his finding out Clark's secret....asuming Chloe died instead.


You'd think this would have been the more controversial decision. They literally pulled a 'Chlois' on us, surely they know how hated that theory is. There was no way people were just going to sit back and say "oh look how clever the Smallville producers are", it was never going to happen.

I wasn't a huge fan of this Jimmy either until we got those scenes in Stiletto and then I saw potential. However, even if I thought this was the most un-Jimmy like version of that iconic character, I still wouldn't consider this a good move.

[sappro]

i'm thinking that the whole "clark kent is dead" thing is supposed to be a set up to compensate for something they'll do with lois when she "comes back"? i think they sent her to the past instead of the future, as the ring can do both. she might come back not knowing clark, or somehow not being able to tell the difference between clark as superman and clark with glasses. haha they really brought lois in way too early. they need to fix that since they fixed jimmy's situation. although it was quite rash. does anyone else think chloe is just turning into oracle from the comics? she's even got the watchtower status now.

[Kal-ed]

He is PURELY committing to being the hero the world needs. He fully accepted his hero-destiny.

I don't know what part of, "I need to be the hero the world needs" was mistaken for regression.

that line by itself is awsome, how ever placed into context then no, it was a gawd awfull line, as much as I hate, that once again, some other character has more insight into Clark´s mind thatn himself, CHloe pointed out correctly that the reason he´s a hero is cause of his human side.

Superman being born is when Clark accepts that he cant save everyone, that he has to make tough decisions that might lead to people getting killed but that its the best decision in the long run.

Im not saying it was a huge step back but it was definetively not a step forward.

[Luthor5339]

It's the only place left to turn, it's been building and eventually something was bound to break... regression, no, I'd just call it confusion concerning who he really is due to being a man divided between his home world and Earth.


“Home? I don’t have a home. I’ve always tried to forget I was an alien or a creature. I’ve always wanted to pretend I was human. I was raised to believe it was my Kryptonian part that was dangerous, but I was wrong. It’s my human side; it’s the side that gets attached, the side that makes decisions based on emotions. That’s my enemy."

Divided loyalties between birth right and adoptive right is the most confusing struggle a guy can go through.

[alexjones50]

I don't like this, i generally like the episode but not this, superman can't be a emotionless who dosen't care about anyone, clark will never get together with lois like this, i really hope clark is back to normal is season nine cos i don't like the way clark is going right now.

[Timester]

that line by itself is awsome, how ever placed into context then no, it was a gawd awfull line, as much as I hate, that once again, some other character has more insight into Clark´s mind thatn himself, CHloe pointed out correctly that the reason he´s a hero is cause of his human side.

Superman being born is when Clark accepts that he cant save everyone, that he has to make tough decisions that might lead to people getting killed but that its the best decision in the long run.

Im not saying it was a huge step back but it was definetively not a step forward.

It's the Exile sidestep.

[princessdiana]

They did it for shock factor and to fix a minor problem in the mythos. I can see why they thought this was clever, but it blew up in their faces. In a way I feel bad for the Smallville producers...:rolleyes:


My fear, and I can't get past it, is how are they going to fix the minor problem of Lois knowing CK prior to the DP. Because they are going to evidenced by the way they fixed the Jimmy situation. I don't like it. So what, we toss out everything that happend from from Season 4 on about Lois and her interactions with anyone on this show. WTF.

As to the time jump theory. I have been thinking they would do that for sometime now, but it can't be done now because a) the Zod issue b) no tights, so we are not going to time jump to when CK is 30 and he becomes Superman.

All this was done to slow down the gears so they could drag things on and reset the progression. They have now confirmed CK does not become Superman until he is older and this is a story about the time prior to that point.

[Kneel before Zod]

For those of you that think "Clark Kent is dead" is Clark reverted back five years, they obviously didn't watch the same episode as I did. He's lost his innocence, and naivete. He's a lot more mature now. He's wasn't being the whiney, self-loathing, pity-party brat, that you all seem to love so much. He's a different man now. He's finally ready to become the man that save the world. Though I do expect that he will soften up a little bit with some help from Lois. I thought it was a great episode for Clark, and I'm really excited to see what they're going to do with his character in the future. I could care less about Zod/Doomsday/Tess/Chloe/Jimmy/JLA and everything in between. This series is about Clark's journey as a character. This episode pulled it off spectaculary. Once you all calm down, and get past the initial shock, put it into perspective.

I don't know how I feel about all these Lois/Timetravel theories floating around here . . I just hope they don't do something cheesy like sending Lois a few years into the future so that she can be younger than Clark like she was in previous incarnations.

[Joanna]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

I toally agree with you David. I'm glad that more people thought the same way. I was a bit saddened by Clark's loss of faith but just a bit coz I know that Lois will come back in the next episode and cheer him up :)!

[Isabel14]

Do you really believe that time will pass by and Clark will become Superman?? I remember the show is still called:Smallville..I don't think he will become Superman yet..Yes, he choose to leave his human side, but I think that, during his training(if there is one) he will miss being human and having feelings..But what about Lois? did he give up to search for her? or I believe that while he was saying that speech to Chloe he was sent to God knows where, but he didn't totally give up:confused:

[Hopefulsuicide]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.



You and I have a very different understanding of Superman... that is all I can say...

How is Superman accepting that the Green Arrow was right all along, a step in the right direction?

[amandaa125]

I'm just really nervous for when fall comes...I can see season nine being the downfall of smallville and then there definitely wont be a season ten. But if they pull it off it could be spectacular. I guess i'm just scared they're going to ruin the show. Have to wait and see what happens!

[Hopefulsuicide]

I'm just really nervous for when fall comes...I can see season nine being the downfall of smallville and then there definitely wont be a season ten. But if they pull it off it could be spectacular. I guess i'm just scared they're going to ruin the show. Have to wait and see what happens!

Season 8 had like 30% glimmer of hope 40% WTF? and 30% complete and utter crap...

Season 9 = terrifying...

[Hakoon]

Season 8 had like 30% glimmer of hope 40% WTF? and 30% complete and utter crap...

Season 9 = terrifying...

I agree, I'm becomming cautiously hopeful for Season 9 as the memory of last nights episode fades, but I refuse to buy into any hype ever again from producers or actors or anyone for this show. EVERYTHING will be taken with a grain of salt from now on.

IMO Season 8 was great up until Episode #10 where Lana showed up...the next 4 episodes had great stuff in them, Legion, Toyman, Bulletproof stuff, etc...but it was all overshadowed in the crap that was the Lana story.

They got back on track a bit in Infamous but bounced around after that.

I will plan to watch the premiere but that episode will determine for me my future with this show.

[DarkClone]

I'm waiting until the first couple episodes of next season air to judge this . . . I mean, was that Clark talking to Chloe or one of the carbon copies that appeared after clark died? was that Zod in Davis' body, or the Eradicator, etc. Where are the Justice League peeps? Where is Lois? Is Jimmy's little brother named Jimmy as well? Will there be time travel in the premiere that somehow saves Jimmy?

These are all going to need to be resolved, in a good way for season 9 to have a chance at being good. And they'll have to step up the Clois action to boost ratings

[Blue Orange NY]

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

Let me guess the reason why you were letdown was because of the fight you were expecting, right correct me if I'm wrong....but in case that is the reason and I can't come back to response to your response.....ask yourself this when in the time line of Superman where and when has DD fought Clark Kent? Like i wrote in the other thread, the writers did right....because having CK beat the crap out of DD's to me would be bullcrap....Clark Kent isn't the person who does this, it's Superman....and CK hasn't gotten to that point....everyone needs to look a little deeper to the episode and see the true meaning the writers left for us to uncover....the only thing I have to say is the show could have stretch to perhaps 53 mins, limited commercials, or 2 hours but that isn't easy to do....commericals pay the bills.....so we move on and be thankful for what we do get and hopefully season 9 completes what ever was left unanswered.


I agree, I'm becomming cautiously hopeful for Season 9 as the memory of last nights episode fades, but I refuse to buy into any hype ever again from producers or actors or anyone for this show. EVERYTHING will be taken with a grain of salt from now on.

IMO Season 8 was great up until Episode #10 where Lana showed up...the next 4 episodes had great stuff in them, Legion, Toyman, Bulletproof stuff, etc...but it was all overshadowed in the crap that was the Lana story.

They got back on track a bit in Infamous but bounced around after that.

I will plan to watch the premiere but that episode will determine for me my future with this show.

----- Added 4 Minutes later -----


I toally agree with you David. I'm glad that more people thought the same way. I was a bit saddened by Clark's loss of faith but just a bit coz I know that Lois will come back in the next episode and cheer him up :)!


i agree....its been aligned to the best possible

[myankskent]

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

Let me guess the reason why you were letdown was because of the fight you were expecting, right correct me if I'm wrong....but in case that is the reason and I can't come back to response to your response.....ask yourself this when in the time line of Superman where and when has DD fought Clark Kent? Like i wrote in the other thread, the writers did right....because having CK beat the crap out of DD's to me would be bullcrap....Clark Kent isn't the person who does this, it's Superman.


Then don't have Doomsday on this show. Seriously, what is the point of having him? TPTB made it clear at the beginning of the season that we would see the Clark/Doomsday fight that everybody knows about and they failed. I simply don't buy the reasoning that Clark is not Superman yet so there shouldn't be a big fight. Maybe TPTB should try concentrating on things that they can actually show and that do make sense in this time period and stop playing with things that are supposed to take place in the future.

[natbug]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

IA. Though I believe there will be some sort of regression for the first part of season 9, TPTB told us so. (One instance in which I actually believe what they say.)

If they do it right: our hero needs to travel through a darkness before emerging as his true self. That's just plain classic hero's journey stuff. I cann't quite put my finger on it, but right now he's rejecting his humanity and eventually needs to find his way back seems to be part of it.

If they do it wrong: whiney, mopey - I don't look upon BDA stuff in previous seasons as the darkness in Clark journey.

All remains to be seen. I enjoyed the finale and am looking forward to season 9.

[costas22]

I will wait and see where it goes from here. It's obvious that a Supermanly Clark doesn't fit with their vision for Smallville.

[SnowBird]

=Blue Orange NY;4851474Let me guess the reason why you were letdown was because of the fight you were expecting, right correct me if I'm wrong....but in case that is the reason and I can't come back to response to your response.....ask yourself this when in the time line of Superman where and when has DD fought Clark Kent? Like i wrote in the other thread, the writers did right....because having CK beat the crap out of DD's to me would be bullcrap....Clark Kent isn't the person who does this, it's Superman....and CK hasn't gotten to that point....everyone needs to look a little deeper to the episode and see the true meaning the writers left for us to uncover....the only thing I have to say is the show could have stretch to perhaps 53 mins, limited commercials, or 2 hours but that isn't easy to do....commericals pay the bills.....so we move on and be thankful for what we do get and hopefully season 9 completes what ever was left unanswered.

My thoughts exactly...I can't understand why people are so wrapped up in the BIG battle or the lack of one between Clark and DD, and throw the rest of a great episode out the window. This was a deep emotional roller coaster ride for the characters. The cliffhanger did exactly what it was suppose to do by leaving us with questions.

Smallville is Clark's journey to become Superman. He isn't there yet and he will make mistakes, question himself and go through his own personal battles before he can become Superman. Give Clark a break and try to enjoy the ride. I plan to.

[myankskent]

My thoughts exactly...I can't understand why people are so wrapped up in the BIG battle or the lack of one between Clark and DD


Maybe it's because that's what this season was promoted as? I think that if anyone had high hopes for a huge fight, it was a result of what TPTB said at the beginning of this season. If you tell the audience that there is going to be a huge fight between Clark and Doomsday and then fail to deliver, people will be upset about that.

[baltazor]

This finale failed miserably to deliver the long awaited fight but on some other points it was rather successful. Mainly Clark's decision to be Kal-el. It is a great set up for Clark to return ready to become superman.

[SnowBird]

Maybe it's because that's what this season was promoted as? I think that if anyone had high hopes for a huge fight, it was a result of what TPTB said at the beginning of this season. If you tell the audience that there is going to be a huge fight between Clark and Doomsday and then fail to deliver, people will be upset about that.

Maybe disappointed but not to the point of judging an entire episode on just the lack of a big battle. Expectations are usually far bigger than the realization. I think people grew the battle in their minds to the point that they would be disappointed and now want to blame everyone but themselves for expecting too much.

[myankskent]

Maybe disappointed but not to the point of judging an entire episode on just the lack of a big battle.


Well, just look at the episode title. "Doomsday", right? So I think that it was reasonable to expect that this episode would be centered around a huge battle with Doomsday. Outside of the battle, I didn't see much else to get excited about with this episode. The cliffhangers were extremely lame, IMO. Clark didn't even appear in the final scene of the episode, which has always been the case for past finales. Jimmy died after a huge retcon with his character to not make him the real Jimmy. Chloe is all excited about the Watchtower at the end of the episode, with Jimmy's blood still on the floor of the building. That was fairly ridiculous. And Zod? Well, given how bad Doomsday was, there's really no reason to get excited about him next year, so expectations are low with him.

[Hakoon]

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

Let me guess the reason why you were letdown was because of the fight you were expecting, right correct me if I'm wrong....but in case that is the reason and I can't come back to response to your response.....ask yourself this when in the time line of Superman where and when has DD fought Clark Kent? Like i wrote in the other thread, the writers did right....because having CK beat the crap out of DD's to me would be bullcrap....Clark Kent isn't the person who does this, it's Superman....and CK hasn't gotten to that point....everyone needs to look a little deeper to the episode and see the true meaning the writers left for us to uncover....the only thing I have to say is the show could have stretch to perhaps 53 mins, limited commercials, or 2 hours but that isn't easy to do....commericals pay the bills.....so we move on and be thankful for what we do get and hopefully season 9 completes what ever was left unanswered.



----- Added 4 Minutes later -----




i agree....its been aligned to the best possible

I'm not dissagreeing with you in that its Superman who should do the beating...but they promised us a 'HUGE THROWDOWN" between Clark and DD. They did not deliver on that promise. I had never wanted this to be THE fight, but rather a prelude.

Message to TPTB: Don't make promises that you aren't going to deliver on.

They brought DD into this season and led us to believe they were leading up to this fight. Why bother if that was never a possibility? They could have had them beat each other up a bit before Clark did his football tackle move to bring DD to the plant for his temporary burial.

Thats one of the reasons why I'm dissapointed in this episode.

I will save a glimmer of hope due to some points made by the OP which I can see as a possibility but I'm not holding my breath.

[Mrs. Superman]

Then don't have Doomsday on this show. Seriously, what is the point of having him? TPTB made it clear at the beginning of the season that we would see the Clark/Doomsday fight that everybody knows about and they failed. I simply don't buy the reasoning that Clark is not Superman yet so there shouldn't be a big fight. Maybe TPTB should try concentrating on things that they can actually show and that do make sense in this time period and stop playing with things that are supposed to take place in the future.
So true! This goes for Doomsday and Jimmy as well. If you bring the character on the show, meet the expectations otherwise leave the character to the future.


Maybe disappointed but not to the point of judging an entire episode on just the lack of a big battle. Expectations are usually far bigger than the realization. I think people grew the battle in their minds to the point that they would be disappointed and now want to blame everyone but themselves for expecting too much.
I think the dissapointment stems from a lot more than just the lack of fight: (ie terrible writing, retcon of Jimmy, Tess and Lois were going at it for some reason I still dont understand etc etc etc).

[SnowBird]

Well, just look at the episode title. "Doomsday", right? So I think that it was reasonable to expect that this episode would be centered around a huge battle with Doomsday. Outside of the battle, I didn't see much else to get excited about with this episode. The cliffhangers were extremely lame, IMO. Clark didn't even appear in the final scene of the episode, which has always been the case for past finales. Jimmy died after a huge retcon with his character to not make him the real Jimmy. Chloe is all excited about the Watchtower at the end of the episode, with Jimmy's blood still on the floor of the building. That was fairly ridiculous. And Zod? Well, given how bad Doomsday was, there's really no reason to get excited about him next year, so expectations are low with him.

I realize not everyone is going to be happy with everything that went on with this episode which is normal with every episode. I just don't think those things you pointed out are bad. There was a lot of good in this episode that I personally found and I'm not going to tear down Smallville because of the lack of a big battle. Everyone can jump on the disappointment bandwagon if they want. I choose to be possitive and think Smallville is a great TV series and all the negative posts will not change my mind.

[Mrs. Superman]

I'm not dissagreeing with you in that its Superman who should do the beating...but they promised us a 'HUGE THROWDOWN" between Clark and DD. They did not deliver on that promise. I had never wanted this to be THE fight, but rather a prelude.

Message to TPTB: Don't make promises that you aren't going to deliver on.

They brought DD into this season and led us to believe they were leading up to this fight. Why bother if that was never a possibility? They could have had them beat each other up a bit before Clark did his football tackle move to bring DD to the plant for his temporary burial.

Thats one of the reasons why I'm dissapointed in this episode.

I will save a glimmer of hope due to some points made by the OP which I can see as a possibility but I'm not holding my breath.
This, I believe, does not bode well for Clois. I should've seen it coming, but after this finale I am convinced it'll all just be a big build up to nothing. They'll allude to the future and that is the end. They know its not a possibility before Clark becomes Superman, so they'll keep leading us on only to let the Clois fans down in the same way they let down those expecting big things from Doomsday.

[Var-Zol]

In season 9 they need to have tom play Superman Talking to Lois after she got boosted to the year 3009 and show us what the future on Earth looks like and the rest of the Legion.

[Iluvgreen]

Yeah he left. And he's going to go and become Superman.

[cesarofflorida]

What everyone here needs to realize is that even in the comics Superman has still been on a journey trying to find balance between his Kryptonian heritage and his human upbringing to this day.

In the comics and every movie and TV incarnation Clark Kent did not become Superman until he was about between 28 to 30 years of age. When he had finally become a man emotionally secure enough to deal with being the worlds hero.

He still has a journey ahead of him in trying to fully accept what he can do and not allow himself to dictate to humanity how they can live. Anyone with that kind of power has to be a Superman not only in ability but character to prevent himself from acting as our god. Its been this way in the comics.

In regards to Lois fate, she has to have gone into the future. Rokk told Clark that the ring was programmed to take Doomsday into the future, so she has to be with the Legion right now.

As for the retcon with Jimmy, at first I was like no way, they killed Jimmy but then when I saw Chloe hand the camera to Jimmy's littel brother I felt a little less shock. It can be that Arron Ashmore was the actual Jimmy but as Rokk said, every time the Legion goes back in time, things can be altered. At least there will be an Olsen in the bullpen.

The fight with Doomsday was anti-climatic. Personally this is how I would have done it.

1. Show Doomsday manhandling the pre-Justice League
2. Show Clark and Doomsday throwing each other through a few more buildings and slamming each other with some cars.
3. When Clark bull rushed him I would have shown Clark and Doomsday climb higher into space and then come back down and show the following visual...close up on Clark's face and behind shot angle of Doomsday torso as Clark pushes him into the geo thermal shaft with Clark letting out a scream or yell.

The fact that they did not show that shot and that Clark was "unclear or vague as to how he escaped" from the geo thermal shaft when Chloe asked him is telling me something like maybe this Clark is the Kal-El part of him. Remember the black Kryptonite was still at the plant, who knows if Clark made contact with it and he got seperated from his human self and the next season will be about Clark literally needing to find his human self.

Anyway this is my 2 cents.

[Mrs. Superman]

In season 9 they need to have tom play Superman Talking to Lois after she got boosted to the year 3009 and show us what the future on Earth looks like and the rest of the Legion.
That would be cool, but of course (with the way PS handles things) if it were to happen it would happen offscreen.

[Pantalaimon]

Clark isn't going to be Superman just yet.
With this decision he shot way past Superman into full Kryptonian mode. Humanity is supposed to be important to Superman. Looks like he is going to have to retrieve his humanity next season, before he can really become Superman.

I really kinda like where this is going.

[SnowBird]

What everyone here needs to realize is that even in the comics Superman has still been on a journey trying to find balance between his Kryptonian heritage and his human upbringing to this day.

In the comics and every movie and TV incarnation Clark Kent did not become Superman until he was about between 28 to 30 years of age. When he had finally become a man emotionally secure enough to deal with being the worlds hero.

He still has a journey ahead of him in trying to fully accept what he can do and not allow himself to dictate to humanity how they can live. Anyone with that kind of power has to be a Superman not only in ability but character to prevent himself from acting as our god. Its been this way in the comics.

In regards to Lois fate, she has to have gone into the future. Rokk told Clark that the ring was programmed to take Doomsday into the future, so she has to be with the Legion right now.

As for the retcon with Jimmy, at first I was like no way, they killed Jimmy but then when I saw Chloe hand the camera to Jimmy's littel brother I felt a little less shock. It can be that Arron Ashmore was the actual Jimmy but as Rokk said, every time the Legion goes back in time, things can be altered. At least there will be an Olsen in the bullpen.

The fight with Doomsday was anti-climatic. Personally this is how I would have done it.

1. Show Doomsday manhandling the pre-Justice League
2. Show Clark and Doomsday throwing each other through a few more buildings and slamming each other with some cars.
3. When Clark bull rushed him I would have shown Clark and Doomsday climb higher into space and then come back down and show the following visual...close up on Clark's face and behind shot angle of Doomsday torso as Clark pushes him into the geo thermal shaft with Clark letting out a scream or yell.

The fact that they did not show that shot and that Clark was "unclear or vague as to how he escaped" from the geo thermal shaft when Chloe asked him is telling me something like maybe this Clark is the Kal-El part of him. Remember the black Kryptonite was still at the plant, who knows if Clark made contact with it and he got seperated from his human self and the next season will be about Clark literally needing to find his human self.

Anyway this is my 2 cents.

Nice post...I'm wondering about the part in bold as well.

[Dor el]

All I can say is that I want so badly to smack Clark right upside his head. I typically do not have such a strong urge toward violence, but Clark should have been there for Chloe. Especially at her husband's (?ex) funeral which by the way Clark was not entirely unresponsible for. Chloe had sacrificed so much for him and still would dang it.

Should have given Ollie a bit of a break. Esp. sense Ollie has always been there for Clark (at least since he showed up in Smallville) sharing everything [Ollie owned] with Clark and supporting him in huge ways. Maybe Ollie did make a mistake (though I am not entirely sure that he did), but how many times has Clark forgiven other friends who made huge mistakes? Why not Ollie?

Should have called his mom to say bye when he expected to die the next day.

Should have had a tender moment with Lois; but nooooooo. Said a generic goodbye in a stinkin' letter.

Should have stayed at least long enough to help clean up his mess. With Chloe. With Ollie. With Lois (jeez, she is still missing and off he trots?). Doomsday is still on earth ready to unleash his brand of teror. Tess--he knows she is not a nice gal; nor is she safe. The geothermal plant, that explosion had to have done some damage.

Just like a man; eat dinner and leave the dishes on the table.

Yep. I feel compelled to slap him into yesterday.

[Theshadow129x]

Clark is just going to embrace his kryptonian side more and mix the two personalities together. He cant be completely about thinking with his emotions nor think completely with logic. Thats all the ending was a gtreat set up for superman

[SnowBird]

All I can say is that I want so badly to smack Clark right upside his head. I typically do not have such a strong urge toward violence, but Clark should have been there for Chloe. Especially at her husband's (?ex) funeral which by the way Clark was not entirely unresponsible for. Chloe had sacrificed so much for him and still would dang it.

With everyone knowing Clark's secret being dead or having life changing experiences, I think this was Clark's way of protecting Chloe. At least this is how I felt about Clark ending their friendship by leaving abruptly.

[Dor el]

Clark is just going to embrace his kryptonian side more and mix the two personalities together. He cant be completely about thinking with his emotions nor think completely with logic. Thats all the ending was a gtreat set up for superman

Perhaps. But, I still want to get in a lick upside his head.

----- Added 4 Minutes later -----


With everyone knowing Clark's secret being dead or having life changing experiences, I think this was Clark's way of protecting Chloe. At least this is how I felt about Clark ending their friendship by leaving abruptly.

I understand that he wants to protect her now, but she needed a strong shoulder and a good friend when she was burying her husband. He just stood over by the lake and left her seemingly all alone. No one was holding her hand. I can see why he might want to avoid everyone at the funeral. Had to have been uncomfortable. Clark should have manned up and been there for Chloe. As for leaving at then end; your point is well said in relation to that. Even still, there must be more to his departure. I was specifically talking about the funeral scene.

I agree in the assumption that this aspect of the cliffhanger is a set up for the impending emergence of Superman.

[Theshadow129x]

Chloe can deal with it on her own.....if Clark was actually a real guy he would use this to bed her.....but he wouldnt and wont......

[SnowBird]

I understand that he wants to protect her now, but she needed a strong shoulder and a good friend when she was burying her husband. He just stood over by the lake and left her seemingly all alone. No one was holding her hand. I can see why he might want to avoid everyone at the funeral. Had to have been uncomfortable. Clark should have manned up and been there for Chloe. As for leaving at then end; your point is well said in relation to that. Even still, there must be more to his departure. I was specifically talking about the funeral scene.

I agree, it would have been nice to see Clark standing next to Chloe at the funeral but I think he was already starting to detach himself from his friends and his human emotions. The debate is also, was that the real Clark?

[Dor el]

I agree, it would have been nice to see Clark standing next to Chloe at the funeral but I think he was already starting to detach himself from his friends and his human emotions. The debate is also, was that the real Clark?

The real Clark? Never thought of that. Don't think it was the Kal el who talked to Chloie in the end. Kal el would not have been concerned with explaining anything to Chloe. He'd just done whatever....

Does this, your defense of Clark, mean I don't get to hit him?

[SnowBird]

The real Clark? Never thought of that. Don't think it was the Kal el who talked to Chloie in the end. Kal el would not have been concerned with explaining anything to Chloe. He'd just done whatever....

Does this, your defense of Clark, mean I don't get to hit him?

Go ahead and hit Clark if you want but be careful you don't break your hand on the Man of Steal...LOL

[Dor el]

Oh, thank you so much. haha

[mozak]

Yea..your right...Clark should have been with Chloe at this time..I mean..shes done so much for him! and he just takes her for granted...hes never as thankful as he should be...maybe he is but he never shows...but well all in all...it was sad...its always sad for Chloe..and when she cry..its so sad..her sad face...i thought Clark may cry too after all that happened..but he looked so confused by himself...yea..it all could be leading him to being the real Superman..who know..i really hope hes going for some training at the Fortress..But you never know...Smallville has always been full of surprises and you can never expect things to be normal..cuz Smallville isnt normal..anyways...

I think maybe Clark was avoiding everyone...and he just came to say goodbye to Chloe being her close friend...maybe he just didnt want anyone else asking..or him having to explain stuff...This all might really lead him to be Superman...but they haven't done that in 8 seasons now..why would they do it now...i mean..theres surly a 10th season now...so i dont think hes gonna be Superman the next season...maybe in the last one (Hopefully)..

So i guess Sam Witwer and Cassidy Freeman are here for the next season aswell...

Iam just Glad that Chloe is gonna be there..theres no point in complaining about how things were all messed up...and wrong...cuz i think and hope that their gonna fix it all..cuz thats what they always do..and the new writers are really getting Smallville in line..i mean they getting things the way they are in the Comics...well maybe not everything..but yea..its Cool...

I really liked Aaron Ashmore playing Jimmy too...he was a really nice character..i was so happy about them until Davis had to show that the Black Kryptonite doesn't work as its supposed to or how they say it works...cuz he still had so much Evil inside him!

I Cant Wait For The Next Season! I Hope Its All Gonna Be Awesome!
Nice Post and Great Info! Thanks Guys!

[galatians221]

Clark isn't going to be Superman just yet.
With this decision he shot way past Superman into full Kryptonian mode. Humanity is supposed to be important to Superman. Looks like he is going to have to retrieve his humanity next season, before he can really become Superman.

I really kinda like where this is going.

Someone please tell me what part of Clark Kent is human? Jor El stated in the movies that "even though you are raised by humans you are not one of them". Now we're talking about black K splitting the human part of Clark from Kal. It makes no sense to me.

[patrese]

Jimmy almost said it... Super .... guy. I was hoping he was going to say it.

Tonight the Red Blue Blur isn't the disguise no more... Clark Kent is the disguise!

you said it!

[adromidon]

OK!!!
- Clark is going to training Finally.. at least looks like that, The question is WHERE??? there is not a functional FoS in Injustice:confused:
- Lois is "in the future" How many Year after this Doomday she will back!!!:confused::confused:
-God!! Chloe is pregnant of the future Doomsday tha will kill Superman:eek:
- Jimmy was No a real Jimmy... Ok that mean that Lucy Lane is going to get marry with a Guy Maybe 8 years young, COOL:(

OOOOkkeyyy

Zod is going to be quiet meanwhile Clark is training :confused::confused::confused:
I am guessing that the orb when activated at the end of Doomsday re-powered the FOS


kal-el can finally wear the real mask which is clark kent

Except as Long as TW has a say he will never wear the SUperman costume

Clark is too clingy with humans as seen with Lana and several other things, yes.

But the stuff we heard from Clark at the end is everything but Superman. This is the twisting of Superman into something very dark. The comics would have never written garbage like this. In the comics, his fight with Doomsday was done to save humanity, which he did. The writers weren't stupid enough to have a key character die and have Superman blame himself for it and then look for the worst in humanity. Sure other 1-shot versions of Superman appeared who were not the iconic version, but the Superman has been consistently shown to be an optimist who loves humanity and dedicates his life to save it from evil and other threats.

I have a theory on that what if the guy at the end talking to Chloe was not Clark at all. What if it was Bizzaro. We know from the comics he is about as frequently returning as Brainiac is

[smallvillereporter27]

The more I think about this episode, the more I agree that it was a set up to launch Clark in a new direction for season 9 and closer to his role as Superman. He will not turn into emo Clark. He said it in his last scene: he wants to remove emotional attatchments to save more people. If anything, he's going to become more proactive. My biggest hope is that Lois is the one who makes him realize that human attatchment isn't always a bad thing.

Personally, as a Chloe fan, I think that this seperation from Clark will be good for her as well. Her actions this season were a result of her strong attatchment to Clark. She needs to break away from him and find her own path. I think Clark realizes this too and it's part of the reason why he left. In Clark's eyes, human attatchment has caused pain to the ones that know his secret and has caused him to make some unwise descisions.

I know there was dissapointment in this season finale. I felt it too. However, I feel that next season will hopefully clear a lot of things up.

[patrese]

The scene where Clark tells Chloe that "Clark Kent is dead" was almost an exact match to the scene in the comics where the Eradicator tells Lois that "Kent is gone, there is only Superman now." I seriously doubt that it was Clark, especially since he didn't seem to know how he made it out of the tunnel.
I don't see how a time jump will work if Zod is now on Earth.
Maybe Clark is "dead" and Eradicator vs Zod will be the Smallville version of "Reign of the Supermen." Leaving Doomsday buried also allows for the comic version of the Death of Superman story to occur, while also having the death/return story happen on Smallville.

That seems to fit but what about clark/superman wandering as a spirit caught between two worlds. That would explain also why though he is a ghost, people can touch him.

[Bill1216]

You know what, I was JUST about to say something like this topic.

I understand that many thought the season finale "sucked" or that killing "hoohoo" off was a harsh move or where the heck is Lois now? BUT, I have to agree with the OP.

If Jimmy's brother is the REAL Jimmy, then I think it does fall into the storyline. Lois in the future (I'm not sure how they'll pull that off, maybe have her only in the near future and not that far away) makes sense to me. Clark finally embracing his destiny (I hope maybe he gets sent off to "grow into" Superman)....you know what, I really don't know what I'm writing. All I know is that it's clear in my head but I can't seem to bring it out on here. Someone help?
I see it too, but seriously.... it does't change the fact that the fight scene between Clark and Doomsday was AWFUL and extremely anticlimactic.

[kg1507]

Loved it. Just wish we had a glimpse of where Lois was.

[adromidon]

Lois was sent off to a magical place called off camera land this magical place can do tremindous things like Saving the producer an actresses salery for a few episodes and lower the wardrobe costs. When she returns from this magical place the stuio would have save alot of money

In other words it is a convieniant way for them to save money by taking her out of the picture for an episode or two

[PepsiMax]

It would be good if it was some months into the future and Clark is shown in full RBB mode, saving the world, without the Clark Kent side. But then Lois should come back and restore a little balance. He should focus on being the hero, without the 'feelings' and maybe he could get a little more done. Don't know if the writers will do much with this 'Clark Kent is dead' scenario. If you played that card you gotta stick with it and that means take it beyond episode 1. If you want to take everything away then do it and have him slowly rebuild to embrace Superman and everything that he has given up on etc. Break his Knees and give him flight in a sense.

[natbug]

What everyone here needs to realize is that even in the comics Superman has still been on a journey trying to find balance between his Kryptonian heritage and his human upbringing to this day.

In the comics and every movie and TV incarnation Clark Kent did not become Superman until he was about between 28 to 30 years of age. When he had finally become a man emotionally secure enough to deal with being the worlds hero.

He still has a journey ahead of him in trying to fully accept what he can do and not allow himself to dictate to humanity how they can live. Anyone with that kind of power has to be a Superman not only in ability but character to prevent himself from acting as our god. Its been this way in the comics.

In regards to Lois fate, she has to have gone into the future. Rokk told Clark that the ring was programmed to take Doomsday into the future, so she has to be with the Legion right now.

As for the retcon with Jimmy, at first I was like no way, they killed Jimmy but then when I saw Chloe hand the camera to Jimmy's littel brother I felt a little less shock. It can be that Arron Ashmore was the actual Jimmy but as Rokk said, every time the Legion goes back in time, things can be altered. At least there will be an Olsen in the bullpen.

The fight with Doomsday was anti-climatic. Personally this is how I would have done it.

1. Show Doomsday manhandling the pre-Justice League
2. Show Clark and Doomsday throwing each other through a few more buildings and slamming each other with some cars.
3. When Clark bull rushed him I would have shown Clark and Doomsday climb higher into space and then come back down and show the following visual...close up on Clark's face and behind shot angle of Doomsday torso as Clark pushes him into the geo thermal shaft with Clark letting out a scream or yell.

The fact that they did not show that shot and that Clark was "unclear or vague as to how he escaped" from the geo thermal shaft when Chloe asked him is telling me something like maybe this Clark is the Kal-El part of him. Remember the black Kryptonite was still at the plant, who knows if Clark made contact with it and he got seperated from his human self and the next season will be about Clark literally needing to find his human self.

Anyway this is my 2 cents.

Intriguing. I didn't think about that. Would Kal-el have went to Chloe or even cared about her or his emotional side?

[Pantalaimon]

Someone please tell me what part of Clark Kent is human? Jor El stated in the movies that "even though you are raised by humans you are not one of them". Now we're talking about black K splitting the human part of Clark from Kal. It makes no sense to me.
I mean the part that was raised by the Kents. I didn't mean he literally has a human side, but for all his Kryptonian DNA he's still mostly grown up as a human.

[adromidon]

Intriguing. I didn't think about that. Would Kal-el have went to Chloe or even cared about her or his emotional side?
The Kal-El part of him is not evil he would know she would require closure and it is possible that the break (if there was one) was not a clean split meaning some (even if only small) of Clark's humanity was left on the resulting split. Remember we never actually saw a full split in crusaide. We saw that the Kal-El half had taken control of Clark but they never split until Martha threw the black k at which point he ended the split before it finished.

Point is maybe we have some version that is more Kal-El then Clark Kent but retains some of Clark Kents feelings for his friends thus the reason for him approaching Chloe

[Uprise Phant0m]

when we say that the human side of clark is gone we mean the side that was taught by the kents is dead it's a metaphor. he knows all he could from them now he is going to learn from his other parents the house of el and then combine them. Clark Kent is dead but Kal-El lives

.............well that's my theory

[wafflles87]

I'm sorry, but I don't see this as a set up for Superman. Not by a long shot.

Supes is not just a shell that swore off emotions altogether. His compassion and his faith in humanity are some of his defining qualities. Clark reminded me of Spock more than he did of Superman at the end.

But, a SUCKY end to a SUCKY arc. Who says the universe isn't funny?

And if they DO go this route for too long next season, if they have him be an emotionless robot... I wont' be sticking around to watch that, than you very much.

[daxam77]

I'd say about 5 years....


The five year gap was used in Legion comics once...Somehow this fills me with dread though.

I do like the idea Lois goes to the future and Saturn Girl just alters her perception of how Clark looked to her. That's really all it would take to get the two of them back to working at the Planet and her not knowing.

And while I'm putting in my two cents...
You know, they COULD actually have Superman in SV (IF DC allows it) without showing Tom in the suit. There could be glimpses of the cape...talk about him...people gathered around a TV watching a newscast of him doing something spectacular...while Clark is right there at his desk.

I would prefer him in the suit, flights and tights all the way, but I could live with that.

[galatians221]

I mean the part that was raised by the Kents. I didn't mean he literally has a human side, but for all his Kryptonian DNA he's still mostly grown up as a human.

He has a human values system but he's still fully Kryptonian. The point is that he isn't two people wrapped into one. I am adopted and never knew my biological father. I have his genes in me and while raised by another family and legally theirs I am not half and half; I'm still fully a descendent of my biological father and mother.

[Pantalaimon]

^I was just answering you question.

But I do think the writers have been trying to make the point that there are two sides to Clark. Doubt there was any black Kryptonite was involved, but something has changed in Clark.

[Theshadow129x]

if they do say something about black k in the premiere then its a cop out instead of them trying to get out of the mess they got themselves into.

Just say it was a decision he made and show us the results of this dont cop out with black k. its the worst way to end and begin a storyline.

[adromidon]

He has a human values system but he's still fully Kryptonian. The point is that he isn't two people wrapped into one. I am adopted and never knew my biological father. I have his genes in me and while raised by another family and legally theirs I am not half and half; I'm still fully a descendent of my biological father and mother.
That is a good point and also the reason i think he rebelled against Jor-EL at first. I am sure if your biological father showed up and said you were destined for much greater then persisted to hound you about it over and over that you would begin to hate him as well the point is that up until this point maybe he was thinking Jor-El was nothing more then an annoying biological father that he could not get rid of and thus refusing his destiny. Now he has seen what is necessary and saw his father ment well so he has decided to focus on his destiny and take a step toward the cape

[Dyanara]

Sorry Im a pessimist, but I think there is no way in heck this show can ever become Superman
Clark is ruined, Lois is ruined, Oliver Queen is ruined...thank God they have not been allowed to touch Batman

[ironman29758]

I'm sorry, but I don't see this as a set up for Superman. Not by a long shot.

Supes is not just a shell that swore off emotions altogether. His compassion and his faith in humanity are some of his defining qualities. Clark reminded me of Spock more than he did of Superman at the end.

But, a SUCKY end to a SUCKY arc. Who says the universe isn't funny?

And if they DO go this route for too long next season, if they have him be an emotionless robot... I wont' be sticking around to watch that, than you very much.

but Clark is trying to become a better hero but I kinda thought he could have taken a more active part in the JLA at least

[edvedder]

I have watched Smallville since the pilot, long time visitor of this site, but first time poster. I typically frequent this site to read up on people’s points of view, and to gain insight on things I may have missed or overlooked when watching an episode. I do not believe that what we saw in the final scene in the finale was any indication that CK was going to “return as Superman” in season 9. However, unlike many with extreme points of view, I also do not view it as a regression of character. Honestly, it feels like the writers this season have been obsessed with giving us ambiguous scenes that can be interpreted in many different ways. A good example of this is the arc with Clavis, cloe’s feelings were presented as ambiguous so the viewer couldn’t determine with any degree of assurance what her intensions really were. Did she love <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/ /><st1:City w:st=Davis</st1:City>, was she being selfish, was she trying to protect <ST1:pClark</ST1:p all along? Whether u agree with the approach the writers took this season- I personally don’t as it seems like a weak attempt to keep people viewing just to understand whats going on rather then coming up with decent story lines that create interest in the show- its still smallville and for the most part we are all still watching it and talking about it after 9 years which is a major achievement in itself.

The major problem with the writers approach is that they set the audience up for a major let down. As in the case with Cloe, people had to fill in their own interpretation of why she was doing what she did. Her ambiguous reactions continued for a good 3 episodes, then when we finally get to the end of doomsday, its resolved in a short 2 minute scene where Jimmy or Henry or whoever, praises her for being a hero. My question is why even create the ambiguity to begin with if their intention was just to portray her as a hero and doing it for <ST1:pClark</ST1:p all along… All the while viewers think they are doing this to set up something big and in fact its nothing—leading to the major letdown. I personally believe the last scene with Clark<ST1:p</ST1:p will be resolved in a similar fashion in Season 9. While we will expect some major turn of events, nothing will happen except for he will just realize that he was wrong. So three months of the audience wondering what major thing may happen, and all this talk about him coming back as Superman is going to lead to the same negative reactions and letdowns that happened with Doomsday.
<O:p></O:p>
I personally did not feel the Finale was as bad as people made it out to be, however I can understand why people responded to it the way they did. It all points to the fact that people had to fill in too many blanks, only to be let down by the resolutions. The fight with doomsday was lame, I must admit, and the fight with Lois and Tess felt forced. However, I didn’t really care about Jimmy dying nor did I care that the Justice League standing around doing nothing. To each his own I guess.
<O:p></O:p>
What made smallville so good especially early on, is that people wanted to watch to see what happens next. What cool power will Clark <ST1:p</ST1:pdiscover next, how will he learn to control it, what valuable lesson will he learn from Jonathan? Even later on we were kept interested with the Lex story lines, will he find out who <ST1:pClark</ST1:p is? Is this episode when he becomes the diabolical luther we all know? Seeing both Lex and <ST1:pClark</ST1:p grow was a real treat and handled beautifully by the writers. I guess my point is they need to stop trying to create interest with ambiguity and get back to the roots that made the show great. I understand that they have lost all of the Lex Arc, and <ST1:pclark</ST1:p has all his powers, and John is gone. If anything it seems that their hands may be a bit tied as that the only thing left would be for Clark to begin Superman, showing how he adapts to the new role in full form (which to me would be interesting and not really explored before- the first superman movie really glazed over that). I personally don’t think we will get to see superman, not due to restrictions from DC but because Jerry Siegals granddaughter has been suing everyone, including warner for using the Superman Liscence. With smallville’ already tight budget, I doubt they could afford the settlement. The only way we see superman is in the very last episode of the series. Its shame too as there would be a lot of potential for the show, which would not require the writers insert this artificial ambiguity to try to force interest in the show. Also I personally think that these new writers & producers, who appear to be dead set on lining the show up with the mythos would introduce superman if they could. Superman in smallville would all be guarantee a season 10!
<O:p></O:p>
I will probably post more later, but I got to get back to work J

[Supermania]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

The season finale aired for the first time on E4 in the UK last night and, by god, was it brilliant! It was seriously the darkest hour I have ever seen of Smallville. Clark now attempting to give up his humanity will doubtless lead him towards becoming Superman. He's probably going to go travelling away for a few months and come back a whole guy...and hopefully with glasses! Maybe a suit? who knows? I'm all cooked up for Season Nine and Clark's character development among the many other things!

[petitemimi]

I have watched Smallville since the pilot, long time visitor of this site, but first time poster. I typically frequent this site to read up on people’s points of view, and to gain insight on things I may have missed or overlooked when watching an episode. I do not believe that what we saw in the final scene in the finale was any indication that CK was going to “return as Superman” in season 9. However, unlike many with extreme points of view, I also do not view it as a regression of character. Honestly, it feels like the writers this season have been obsessed with giving us ambiguous scenes that can be interpreted in many different ways. A good example of this is the arc with Clavis, cloe’s feelings were presented as ambiguous so the viewer couldn’t determine with any degree of assurance what her intensions really were. Did she love <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/ /><st1:City w:st=Davis</st1:City>, was she being selfish, was she trying to protect <ST1:pClark</ST1:p all along? Whether u agree with the approach the writers took this season- I personally don’t as it seems like a weak attempt to keep people viewing just to understand whats going on rather then coming up with decent story lines that create interest in the show- its still smallville and for the most part we are all still watching it and talking about it after 9 years which is a major achievement in itself.

The major problem with the writers approach is that they set the audience up for a major let down. As in the case with Cloe, people had to fill in their own interpretation of why she was doing what she did. Her ambiguous reactions continued for a good 3 episodes, then when we finally get to the end of doomsday, its resolved in a short 2 minute scene where Jimmy or Henry or whoever, praises her for being a hero. My question is why even create the ambiguity to begin with if their intention was just to portray her as a hero and doing it for <ST1:pClark</ST1:p all along… All the while viewers think they are doing this to set up something big and in fact its nothing—leading to the major letdown. I personally believe the last scene with Clark<ST1:p</ST1:p will be resolved in a similar fashion in Season 9. While we will expect some major turn of events, nothing will happen except for he will just realize that he was wrong. So three months of the audience wondering what major thing may happen, and all this talk about him coming back as Superman is going to lead to the same negative reactions and letdowns that happened with Doomsday.
<O:p></O:p>
I personally did not feel the Finale was as bad as people made it out to be, however I can understand why people responded to it the way they did. It all points to the fact that people had to fill in too many blanks, only to be let down by the resolutions. The fight with doomsday was lame, I must admit, and the fight with Lois and Tess felt forced. However, I didn’t really care about Jimmy dying nor did I care that the Justice League standing around doing nothing. To each his own I guess.
<O:p></O:p>
What made smallville so good especially early on, is that people wanted to watch to see what happens next. What cool power will Clark <ST1:p</ST1:pdiscover next, how will he learn to control it, what valuable lesson will he learn from Jonathan? Even later on we were kept interested with the Lex story lines, will he find out who <ST1:pClark</ST1:p is? Is this episode when he becomes the diabolical luther we all know? Seeing both Lex and <ST1:pClark</ST1:p grow was a real treat and handled beautifully by the writers. I guess my point is they need to stop trying to create interest with ambiguity and get back to the roots that made the show great. I understand that they have lost all of the Lex Arc, and <ST1:pclark</ST1:p has all his powers, and John is gone. If anything it seems that their hands may be a bit tied as that the only thing left would be for Clark to begin Superman, showing how he adapts to the new role in full form (which to me would be interesting and not really explored before- the first superman movie really glazed over that). I personally don’t think we will get to see superman, not due to restrictions from DC but because Jerry Siegals granddaughter has been suing everyone, including warner for using the Superman Liscence. With smallville’ already tight budget, I doubt they could afford the settlement. The only way we see superman is in the very last episode of the series. Its shame too as there would be a lot of potential for the show, which would not require the writers insert this artificial ambiguity to try to force interest in the show. Also I personally think that these new writers & producers, who appear to be dead set on lining the show up with the mythos would introduce superman if they could. Superman in smallville would all be guarantee a season 10!
<O:p></O:p>
I will probably post more later, but I got to get back to work J

I agree with what you said especially the parts in bold. But I don't believe the producers want to line the show with the mythos. If they did, we wouldn't have superLana with a kryptonite suit. For me, the many ambiguities are just weak writing.
I agree that the "Clark Kent is dead" thing will be nothing in the end; he will say to Chloe that she's right and he's wrong and that's it. That declaration and Clark vanishing at the end was just for shock value; as well as Jimmy not being the real Jimmy. People seem to infer that this means his real persona will be superman and Clark will be the disguise. I'm not knowledgeable in Superman comics, but I've been told that this is an outdated way of seeing Superman/Clark that has been abandoned a long time ago.
And btw, I don't think the problem from the episode was Clark. The problem was his "friends". Whatever he does, there's always someone telling him he's wrong, not enough of this, and too much of that. Clark was like the ball in the pinball machine. Everyone is taking turns in beating him up. I understand the need to create drama, but this is too much. Clark struggles with his allies more than he struggles with the real enemy. This is tiresome.

[Dominicus]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?Nice David, nice.:D

[davidbrenton]

Nice David, nice.:D

Thanks D!

[Joanna]

Sorry Im a pessimist, but I think there is no way in heck this show can ever become Superman
Clark is ruined, Lois is ruined, Oliver Queen is ruined...thank God they have not been allowed to touch Batman

If you hate the show so much, why bother watching it?

I agree that this may indeed be a good set-up for Superman. Although, as some posters have stated, Superman's faith in humanity was a part of what made him Superman. I hope, it's just a tiny hope, that thay will show us that Lois is the link, just as she was in all the other Superman stories. And Clark will not only be stronger but he will regain his faith.

[Sports72Xtrm]

I'm with you David. Keeping the Smallville is great optomist train going. I don't see anything wrong with what the writers did so far except maybe the Clana arc but that's mostly because I'm not used to my Lanas being superpowered but everything else looks fine to me.

[redkryptoniteisthebest]

I hate to see so many complainers when what I saw was so right on. They set up Superman. All I can say is, prepare for the hero everyone's been screaming for since day 1.

They set it up in a BIG WAY. Who can say this episode, which showed us how the heck Clark Kent gets passed his emotionally LOW IQ and utterly accepts being the WORLD'S HERO , was crap, please please please stop complaining, and look at the gift we've been given.

But, we all have opinions, so shout out below and vote whether or not you thought this indeed set-up the show we've been collectively yearning for.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

Nobody else saw this?

After reading current spoilers, I agree with this even more! Great job. :)

[supercatmom]

I don't think the finale showed Clark embracing Superman. I think it just showed another step in his journey. For 8 seasons, Clark has rejected his Kryptonian side, trying to only embrace his human nature.
Only when Clark fully embraces both his Human and Kryptonian sides will he become Superman.
IMHO

I just want to add, I know that Superman is 100% Kryptonian, but he was raised on Earth by human parents with human valvues.

To me this is what Superman is, a Kryptonian god with human morals. This is what makes him a very special Superhero.