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MrZeppo
05-01-2009, 05:46 PM
I've noticed a lot of people in different camps, especially after this episode, over the justification of murder. Our own characters seem to be in the same camps.

-Clark is adament in not killing. Ever.
-Oliver obviously feels killing one person is necessary in order to protect the lives of of many. However I think he's rather quick to judge that.
-Chloe seems to feel killing can be justified (she killed Sebastian and tried to kill Davis. Both were done to protect Clark).

The problem is what murder is. When is it acceptable? When is it not? Who decides who lives or dies? Who gets to play God?

I see people here with pitchforks clamoring for Davis' head on a pike because he's killing bad people to surpress the Beast. I get that. Because I personally find murder and killing others to be horrifying. However I cannot ignore how doomed the Davis situation is. Either he kills someone by his own choice to surpress Doomsday. Or he doesn't and allows Doomsday free reign to kill as many people as he wants. Kill 1 person to save potentially 1000 people. Choosing the needs of the many over the needs of the one. Everything Davis has done to stop it has failed, even dying, because he cannot die. And he can't seem to keep away from Clark because he's drawn back to Smallville & Metropolis.

So because Davis kills, because he plays God by deciding who lives and dies, people hate him. I pity him. I feel sorry for his sad existence. I understand why he is so obsessed with Chloe, she's the only good thing in his life. Personally I hate that he involved her, that he dragged Chloe into a no-win scenario. But he's damned either way he chooses. I think because he's drawn ultimately to Clark, the fact they are running away will not work and he will keep coming back to kill him.

But what does this mean for Clark? Because the VERY same choice is something he faces. It's obvious considering the idea of Clark killing someone has been a theme that has been touched on fairly often this season. But he's going to have to kill Davis to save us all. He will have to murder a living being to protect the world.

The contrasts and duality of the situation are intriuging to me. Because it's a damned situation for both of them. So many people here are crying out over Davis murdering, will they cry out with the same outrage when Clark has to kill? A part of me believes not because Clark is our hero, the hero of this story, we will excuse it and let it slide saying it's justified. But he won't think so. I think killing someone will haunt him.

ginevrakent
05-01-2009, 05:56 PM
The contrasts and duality of the situation are intriuging to me. Because it's a damned situation for both of them. So many people here are crying out over Davis murdering, will they cry out with the same outrage when Clark has to kill? A part of me believes not because Clark is our hero, the hero of this story, we will excuse it and let it slide saying it's justified. But he won't think so. I think killing someone will haunt him.

While I really do appreciate this point of view, I respectfully disagree. Clark had a choice in this episode that did not involve him killing anyone. He was going to confine Davis to the Phantom Zone. Davis is unambiguously a criminal and a criminal's fate would have been cosmic justice.

I would also like to point out that the notion that Clark will be haunted by killing Doomsday does not make any sense because Doomsday cannot die. Clark can never murder him because it is impossible. Unfortunately, Clark can die, and now Doomsday is even closer to killing him. The only solutions involve imprisonment in the Phantom Zone or being sent to the end of time. In Beast, Clark had the perfect opportunity to end this mess, but Chloe and Davis's own selfish needs prevented Clark from doing what is ultimately necessary.

Pamela
05-01-2009, 05:57 PM
Davis is a living being, but he wasn't created by God or even by people with "good" intentions. So I wonder if it would really be "murder" if someone killed him.

magic
05-01-2009, 06:21 PM
oh give me a break, this superhero ethics are ridiculous
killing is part of nature, there's no creature on this planet that isn't responsible for the death of another.
be it through war, slavery, poverty, hanger or countless others. every day countless people die so we can keep our foods and homes and cars running.
that's how the world works
if you think taking a life is so unholy maybe you should think twice before buying that diamond/gas/steak/whatever because you might as well have pulled the trigger yourself.

elfina
05-01-2009, 06:40 PM
Interesting insight. Yeah, we are always quick to judge but <?xml:namespace prefix = u1 /><u1:City u2:st="on"><?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/ /><st1:City w:st=Davis </U1:p</u1:City></ST1:p</st1:City>isn't responsible for the situation in which he finds himself in. He is the quintessential anti-hero like Heathcliff was in <U1:p<u1:PlaceName u2:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Wuthering</u1:PlaceName></st1:PlaceName> <u1:PlaceType u2:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">Heights</u1:PlaceType></st1:PlaceType> and both share similar qualities. They are both profoundly flawed characters who are psychologically damaged due to the circumstances that shaped their lives. However underneath it all, they just both want to be loved: Heathcliff by Catherine and Davis by Chloe. As an anti-hero, <U1:p<u1:City u2:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><ST1:pDavis</u1:City></U1:p </ST1:p</st1:City>is meant to be both loved and hated and ultimately pitied by the audience as you mentioned. As everyone has pointed out he is the opposite of Clark <U1:p<ST1:p</U1:p</ST1:pand he may be unredeemable as Heathcliff was. <u1:City u2:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Davis</u1:City></st1:City>' characteristics are supposed to complement <U1:p<ST1:pClark'</U1:p</ST1:ps heroic one. The use of this plot device is a bitter one but it ultimately leads to an intriguing climax in which both our 'heroes' are being put into the same situation: to kill or not to kill. It seems that <u1:City u2:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Davis</u1:City></st1:City> can follow Clark's 'no killing' rule but only as long as Chloe stays with him. Regardless, it is a reoccurring theme that explores the depths of the human psyche and it will continue to entertain us.<O:p</O:p

Dustmite
05-01-2009, 06:53 PM
oh give me a break, this superhero ethics are ridiculous
killing is part of nature, there's no creature on this planet that isn't responsible for the death of another.
be it through war, slavery, poverty, hanger or countless others. every day countless people die so we can keep our foods and homes and cars running.
that's how the world works
if you think taking a life is so unholy maybe you should think twice before buying that diamond/gas/steak/whatever because you might as well have pulled the trigger yourself.

I'm a little baffled by your post and I don't want to go way off-topic but I will say this. There's a huge difference to me between pulling the trigger yourself and buying gas.

The Superhero ethics are what they are and what this show is based on and so need to be viewed in that context. There are ways to stop a danger to society without killing and that's not always possible in the real world but we're talking about a show based on the comics about man who's a symbol of hope. I don't find anything at all wrong with Clark's stance or his ethics on this subject.

xrayvision
05-01-2009, 06:54 PM
While I really do appreciate this point of view, I respectfully disagree. Clark had a choice in this episode that did not involve him killing anyone. He was going to confine Davis to the Phantom Zone. Davis is unambiguously a criminal and a criminal's fate would have been cosmic justice.

I would also like to point out that the notion that Clark will be haunted by killing Doomsday does not make any sense because Doomsday cannot die. Clark can never murder him because it is impossible. Unfortunately, Clark can die, and now Doomsday is even closer to killing him. The only solutions involve imprisonment in the Phantom Zone or being sent to the end of time. In Beast, Clark had the perfect opportunity to end this mess, but Chloe and Davis's own selfish needs prevented Clark from doing what is ultimately necessary.

I was going to say the same. Clark in this case shouldn't be too hard on himself because if he kills Doomsday, he will just return again. Clark's choice was the best--one where he didn't even have to kill Doomsday even once. But now thanks to Chloe messing things up royally, he will. And when he does, Doomsday will be stronger and invulnerable to being killed again by Clark if ever he needs to stop him again.

The very trait of Davis' that damns him also justifies Clark in killing him, because he just can't stay dead. Sure Clark may be against inflicting physical harm on DD, but there literally is no other choice, especially when DD wants him dead, can't be reasoned with & will only rise again after being killed.

Chloe just delayed the inevitable. Doomsday will likely end up in the Zone after he's killed because he's too dangerous just to be thrown to space where he will awaken some day and kill life on another planet. The problem is, now people have to die before DD ends up in the Zone again. This is why no matter how I look at it, Clark had the perfect solution and Chloe screwed up.

MrZeppo
05-02-2009, 12:29 AM
I respectfully disagree because the PZ isn't a perfect solution. All it does is move Davis to another place to kill, it doesn't stop him from killing. While I'm not going to say that Chloe has made the best choices, I don't think many characters have. Clark and Ollie could have had her back, instead of writing Davis off and not even trying to help him. Clark wanted to toss him into the PZ and Ollie wanted to kill him. Ollie runs a multi-billion dollar company, are you saying he couldn't have gotten a team together and studied Doomsday there with Chloe around to sooth the Beast. They might not have succeeded, but they could have tried. And at least Chloe didn't just write him off. He is a tortured being that wants redemption but is doomed never to have it. The sad fact of the matter is they don't know that yet. And based on next week's preview that is when Clark and Chloe start realizing how doomed Davis really is.

My own problem with the PZ argument is the fact that if Clark did end up sending Doomsday to the PZ he'd destroy everything there. Maybe not the wraiths, but all the corporeal Zoners would end up dead if he were sent there. What if it evolves to the point where it can kill the wraiths too? It's not like the PZ follows comic rules and all the beings there are intangible.

I don't like the PZ in this situation because it's an easy out. It would be an anticlimactic end to the whole storyline as I want to see Clark and Davis face off. I want to have Clark face the morally ambiguous choice of killing to serve the greater good. Condemning Davis to the PZ would be condemning him to a life of misery and condemning all the Zoners to death.

I find the whole argument to be essentially "Out of sight out of mind". It's horrible if Doomsday kills living beings on Earth but what about the living beings in the PZ? Just because they are Zoners they have no rights?

Clark would be sending a living weapon somewhere that it would get stronger and stronger each time it's killed.

It's essentially like sending a live nuke into storage in a prison hoping it won't go off but knowing it most likely will. It's not a perfect solution.

I also was freaked out Clark was using Brainiac's crystal. Are you kidding me? After all the drama and angst about destroying all that remains of Brainiac, Clark is going to use a Brainiac Black Crystal? That's crazy talk! The crystal is part of Brainiac. If even a tiny fragment of Brainiac survives then it's Brainiac-time all over again. I can't believe Clark used the stupid thing. But I guess it needed to be addressed so we the viewers learn the writer's reasons for having the characters avoid just tossing Davis into the PZ.

ginevrakent
05-02-2009, 01:10 AM
I respectfully disagree because the PZ isn't a perfect solution. All it does is move Davis to another place to kill, it doesn't stop him from killing.

Chloe can't stop Davis from killing either. She simply cannot be with him 24/7, and the Phantom Zone may not be a perfect solution but it's a heck of a lot more sensible than Chloe's plan.


While I'm not going to say that Chloe has made the best choices, I don't think many characters have.

Just because other people do things that are wrong, doesn't make another person's wrongs less repugnant in comparison.


Clark and Ollie could have had her back, instead of writing Davis off and not even trying to help him.

Davis is beyond all help, and I would have preferred Chloe having Clark's back. He is the hero of the show after all, and this is his life we're talking about.


Clark wanted to toss him into the PZ and Ollie wanted to kill him. Ollie runs a multi-billion dollar company, are you saying he couldn't have gotten a team together and studied Doomsday there with Chloe around to sooth the Beast. They might not have succeeded, but they could have tried.

You know what? This would have been nice, but Chloe sought out Dr. Hamilton's help to no avail and honestly Chloe did her darndest to keep all of this a secret from Clark and Ollie for weeks, so I really don't think any team would have been gotten together because Chloe didn't want to do it. That was her dumb decision.


And at least Chloe didn't just write him off. He is a tortured being that wants redemption but is doomed never to have it. The sad fact of the matter is they don't know that yet. And based on next week's preview that is when Clark and Chloe start realizing how doomed Davis really is.

A tortured being who wants redemption would have recognized that he's too dangerous and beyond saving. He would have done what Kara and Raya did and stayed in the Phantom Zone willingly--Kara to prevent phantoms from escaping and Raya to guard the prison Jor-El made for the criminals of all the known galaxies.


My own problem with the PZ argument is the fact that if Clark did end up sending Doomsday to the PZ he'd destroy everything there. Maybe not the wraiths, but all the corporeal Zoners would end up dead if he were sent there. What if it evolves to the point where it can kill the wraiths too? It's not like the PZ follows comic rules and all the beings there are intangible.

How do we know that Doomsday would destroy everything in the Phantom Zone? All I know is that if Chloe has a toothache and has to go to the dentist or she gets cancer and needs treatment, or God forbid Davis wants some fresh air some night and cops recognize him and take him away, Doomsday will be released and innocent lives on Earth will be in jeopardy. So, to me there is no ideal solution, but the Phantom Zone comes closest, though.


I don't like the PZ in this situation because it's an easy out. It would be an anticlimactic end to the whole storyline as I want to see Clark and Davis face off. I want to have Clark face the morally ambiguous choice of killing to serve the greater good. Condemning Davis to the PZ would be condemning him to a life of misery and condemning all the Zoners to death.

Yeah, well I don't care if something is easy or anticlimactic. I care about Clark being able to be a hero, and making the tough decisions instead of Chloe making worse ones for him. It's ludicrous that Chloe thinks Clark can abandon her so easily despite her wishes as she stated them in Legion and in Beast. No matter what he would go looking for her, and as a consequence a confrontation with Doomsday would be inevitable. I would rather Davis go to a prison for criminals such as himself, than for Chloe to live her life in misery and being condemned to roam the Earth with Davis for the rest of her days while Clark labors under the guilt of losing her and never giving up on finding his best friend and ally.


I find the whole argument to be essentially "Out of sight out of mind". It's horrible if Doomsday kills living beings on Earth but what about the living beings in the PZ? Just because they are Zoners they have no rights?

Either way beings--human or otherwise--are getting hurt, so I'm not sure what your point is. Doomsday has been imprisoned in the Phantom Zone in the comics and there's no telling what would happen to him there. Clark was sent to Earth to be its protector. It's a tough decision he made, and was willing to follow through with until Chloe interfered. Again, the PZ isn't ideal but I don't think there is a better option.


I also was freaked out Clark was using Brainiac's crystal. Are you kidding me? After all the drama and angst about destroying all that remains of Brainiac, Clark is going to use a Brainiac Black Crystal? That's crazy talk! The crystal is part of Brainiac. If even a tiny fragment of Brainiac survives then it's Brainiac-time all over again. I can't believe Clark used the stupid thing. But I guess it needed to be addressed so we the viewers learn the writer's reasons for having the characters avoid just tossing Davis into the PZ.

It was risky, but it did exactly what Clark remembered it would do. However, if we're going to talk about freaking out about Kryptonian creations that might be unpredictable let's focus on Doomsday shall we. Chloe thinking she can succeed in her mission is "crazy talk" and I saw nothing in this episode to suggest that the Phantom Zone wouldn't have been a workable option. Plus, who's talking about tossing Davis anywhere. He should go there willingly.

xrayvision
05-02-2009, 01:46 AM
I respectfully disagree because the PZ isn't a perfect solution. All it does is move Davis to another place to kill, it doesn't stop him from killing. While I'm not going to say that Chloe has made the best choices, I don't think many characters have. Clark and Ollie could have had her back, instead of writing Davis off and not even trying to help him. Clark wanted to toss him into the PZ and Ollie wanted to kill him. Ollie runs a multi-billion dollar company, are you saying he couldn't have gotten a team together and studied Doomsday there with Chloe around to sooth the Beast. They might not have succeeded, but they could have tried. And at least Chloe didn't just write him off. He is a tortured being that wants redemption but is doomed never to have it. The sad fact of the matter is they don't know that yet. And based on next week's preview that is when Clark and Chloe start realizing how doomed Davis really is.

I just can't agree. Chloe was the one who knew Davis was alive and didn't tell anyone. So how is this Clark's fault? She could have easily come to him when she first found out so they could have worked together. But instead she comes to him after harboring him for weeks and lying to him, causing him not to trust her. Given Clark's neverending optimism, he would have heard her out. But she didn't do that & did everything in the extreme. She planned to run away with him. Then Ollie & Jimmy were almost killed. Suppose she did run away with Davis and then Clark went looking for her, what did she expect? That Clark wouldn't automatically attack Davis when he eventually found them, setting off the battle anyway? This was not thought out at all by Chloe.


My own problem with the PZ argument is the fact that if Clark did end up sending Doomsday to the PZ he'd destroy everything there. Maybe not the wraiths, but all the corporeal Zoners would end up dead if he were sent there. What if it evolves to the point where it can kill the wraiths too? It's not like the PZ follows comic rules and all the beings there are intangible.

I don't understand why so many people think Davis would have powers there. Davis is a Kryptonian being after all. He's a mix of a humanoid Kryptonian (Zod & Faora's DNA) spliced with the DNA of a clone of a prehistoric Kryptonian creature who was cloned until death no longer permanently affects him. The Phantom Zone's physics strip the powers of any being in there. Therefore Doomsday is included. This is the nature of the Phantom Zone. It's been the case with all version of the Zone. Davis wouldn't have any special advantages there.


I don't like the PZ in this situation because it's an easy out. It would be an anticlimactic end to the whole storyline as I want to see Clark and Davis face off. I want to have Clark face the morally ambiguous choice of killing to serve the greater good. Condemning Davis to the PZ would be condemning him to a life of misery and condemning all the Zoners to death.

Of course we all want to see them fight. But I think the ending of Beast was an easy out & a copout. The episode seemed pointless. They had to waste a 40 minute episode to just have that ending? They could have at least given us a plot involving Clark taking him to the Zone, only to fail in keeping him there before getting out. It would have allowed us to see a fight between Clark & Davis so the battle in Doomsday could have been entirely Clark vs. Doomsday on Earth. All this episode did was justify Oliver's statements from Bloodline when he told Clark that Chloe was messing around with stuff no human was meant to mess with and told him to make her stop. And that to me is a waste of an episode that should have focused on Clark getting prepared for his battle with Doomsday.


I find the whole argument to be essentially "Out of sight out of mind". It's horrible if Doomsday kills living beings on Earth but what about the living beings in the PZ? Just because they are Zoners they have no rights?

Again, if the Phantom Zone is like all other incarnations, it would strip Davis of his powers. Therefore, he would be just another prisoner. Sure it sucks for him since he didn't want to be a killer, but what else can Clark do with him? The only other thing is to send him to the End of Time, and Clark doesn't have the ring anymore to do that, plus he probably wouldn't think about that now.


Clark would be sending a living weapon somewhere that it would get stronger and stronger each time it's killed.

But he would not have powers. He may be able to resurrect himself, but even that's questionable. If he can, then he would just be vulnerable again. If in case he can't resurrect himself, then he would have to be dragged out of the Zone to come back to life.


It's essentially like sending a live nuke into storage in a prison hoping it won't go off but knowing it most likely will. It's not a perfect solution.

Again, I doubt he would have powers, unless Smallville will have a major inconsistency & plothole.


I also was freaked out Clark was using Brainiac's crystal. Are you kidding me? After all the drama and angst about destroying all that remains of Brainiac, Clark is going to use a Brainiac Black Crystal? That's crazy talk! The crystal is part of Brainiac. If even a tiny fragment of Brainiac survives then it's Brainiac-time all over again. I can't believe Clark used the stupid thing. But I guess it needed to be addressed so we the viewers learn the writer's reasons for having the characters avoid just tossing Davis into the PZ.

That in itself was a plothole. That crystal had to have disappeared when Brainiac's Milton Fine & Black Ship forms disappeared when his Milton Fine form was impaled on the console in Solitude. The crystal like the Ship & Fine was Brainiac. Having it appear now is one of the dumbest things I've seen. Had the Black Ship returned, I would have believed it. But for that crystal not to have disappeared along with Fine & the Ship is BS. Also, where did Clark store it all that time if he really had it (which I just don't believe)? And why not use it when the Fortress was broken in season 6 and he had to send prisoners like Gloria back?

Sarevokcz
05-02-2009, 02:19 AM
My own problem with the PZ argument is the fact that if Clark did end up sending Doomsday to the PZ he'd destroy everything there. Maybe not the wraiths, but all the corporeal Zoners would end up dead if he were sent there. What if it evolves to the point where it can kill the wraiths too? It's not like the PZ follows comic rules and all the beings there are intangible.


EXACTLY, this PZ doesnt follow comics, they can do basically whatever they want with Doomy in here

from what we know, he wont be able to escape and there are only reaaaaaaly bad criminals, so its still lesser evil then letting him be on Earth. he cant be killed, so only 2 options right now are letting him be or sending him to PZ. PZ >> the other option any day of the week.

presumptions that he has or hasnt powers are just that, presumptions, writers can write it any way they want

if anyone is trying to justify Chloe moral code by telling us, that Doomy will murder worst of worst villans in Universe over letting him be on Earth as time bomb, which no doubt one day would kill millions of people, then i doubt its because they believe Chloe is right, but more like wont believe Chloe can be utterly wrong no matter what she does. Denial >> logic i guess.

Davis Bloome
05-02-2009, 04:23 AM
The question if Davis would have powers in the PZ is a good one. Well Davis is the mask, DD is his true self, isn't it? There will come a point that the beast will evolve and that it will permanently stay DD forever. I'm not sure what the result would be by sending Davis to the PZ. But is a great possibility he would become DD and that creature still has a thirst for blood, and the other powers DD has, to they come from the yellow sun, cause that is why kryptonians have powers on earth but not in the PZ.

Either way DD would still have been most likely a very strong monster with a thirst of blood which possibly can't be killed, so condemning Davis to the PZ would be like condemning all prisoners there to death. So I find it a bit hypocrite that Clark can play God and in the end be responsible for the killings of who knows how many criminals in the PZ, while Davis is condemned for killing criminals here on earth.

MrZeppo
05-03-2009, 02:53 AM
Okay, so then humor me for a second. Let's say in "Beast" the writers did what you wanted. They had Clark convince Davis to go into the PZ and Chloe was all for it and he went to the Phantom Zone... Then what the hell would be the point of this Doomsday arc? What would be the focus for the last to episodes of the Season? So all the people arguing for Davis to just walk into the PZ would rather have us left hanging? No Doomsday/Clark brawl?

And this is all based on an assumption by many that Davis would be depowered in the PZ. Doomsday doesn't follow the normal rules. And he's only half krytonian. The Doomsday side of him might not get "depowered". From everything I've seen, only Kryptonians get depowered in the PZ. But Doomsday isn't powered by a yellow sun like Clark is. In the comics he wasn't powered by the yellow sun, and in Smallville I've seen nothing to indicate he is powered by the sun. We've never seen the show say anything about other types of beings losing their abilities in the PZ. So I think that's an assumption people just make when really we have no proof.

And I am sorry, but I will continue to believe that with the setup we've been given having Davis/Doomy just go into the PZ would have been an anti-climactic end to the storyline. Especially with 2 more episodes to go. I could see it making sense for a season finale, but that's not the case. It would be an unappealing end to the current storyline. The PZ is an easy out in this situation and boring and not what I want to see after having watched the season so far. Because I have become vested in Clark and Davis' storyline. I know some people aren't, that they don't care if it's an easy out, but I do.

Ginerva you say you want to see Clark make the tough decisions, so do I. The constant theme this season is the idea of Clark taking a life. That's the tough decision I want to see him face, not the relatively easy decision of having Davis go to the PZ.

I look at "Beast" as the writer's attempt to address why Clark doesn't just put Davis in the PZ and we got our answer. Personally I think they never should have said anything about the PZ, leave Brainiac's crystal lost, and just had it so the PZ wasn't an option. But the writers want to continue to murk around in morally grey situations and the chose differently. I don't feel an over-inflated sense of entitlement that they have to do everything that I want, exactly the way I want, so I accept that.

I find the Chloe/Clark scene in the Fortress to be a morally grey argument, Clark arguing to send him, Chloe's argument that sending Davis to the PZ would haunt Clark. I can see both of their points. And while we may debate it, the simple fact of the matter is Clark didn't stop Chloe and Davis from leaving. That's a fact. That tells us that her argument rang true and he realized she was right, that it would haunt him. That is why Davis isn't in the PZ right now. The writers gave us the reason why Clark ultimately didn't do it, why Chloe didn't do it. Clark could have supersped and taken the crystal from Chloe, thrown the weakened Davis into the portal, all in the blink of an eye. But he didn't. So personally I see this as the final answer on the "Send Doomsday to Phantom Zone" arguments from Clark and Chloe's POV. If Ollie or Tess wants to send him, that's another story.

We may argue with it all we want. But if it was a valid argument to Clark, I'm going to accept it.
That it would haunt him. Sadly that will not be anything compared to what he faces when he does finally decide to kill Doomsday. When he finally does take a life. That is huge in terms of character development for Clark and I really want him to face that choice. Especially after being teased with it all season. And maybe sending him to the PZ would have been the "right decision", but it was a decision that would have been least entertaining to me as a viewer. Because it's a cop-out to what I want to ultimately see, the storyline they writers are trying to pay homage to in their own Smallvillian way, Clark and Davis/Doomy fighting it out. Clark having to make the tough choice and killing Doomsday.

And everyone here who is up in arms about how I defend Chloe should realize that I DO NOT think Chloe is making a smart choice. Because Davis is doomed. The situation is doomed. She can't help him. She can't be with him 24/7, however much she can think she can. It's naive. It's dumb. It's hopeless. BUT! I have knowledge she doesn't, I know who Doomsday is meant to be, I know there is no way she can keep the Beast surpressed. I however can't fault her in trying to save him, because it ultimately saves Clark. And THAT is what I care about. The fact that even though I disagree with her, that Clark disagrees with him, she's doing this to protect his life and his ultimate destiny. That's why I don't find her actions repugnent.

She is doing all of this to protect Clark. It's like she isn't just trying to protect his life, but his soul. Protect him from dying, from killing, from making the hard choice and having blood on his hands even though that is ultimately where this is all leading. It's their destiny. To kill each other. Clark is destined to be the savior and Davis is destined to be damned.

Also, in "Infamous" we learned that it isn't Chloe that draws Davis to Metropolis. It's Clark. He's the reason why Davis can't just walk away. He's the reason why Davis came back to Metropolis from the Artic. It's the reason why I think Davis would never have gone into the portal. Because even if he wanted to, I doubt the Beast within him would allow it.

Personally I don't find this situation as black and white as people make it out to be. I don't see Davis as a criminal. I see him as a damned soul either way he goes. Everyone up in arms over the fact he kills may disagree with me. But I can't help but think about what would happen if Davis didn't kill. Because if he just let Doomsday get released there is no telling all the harm we could have already seen. If Davis hadn't started killing in "Infamous", Clark could very well be dead right now.

Sarevokcz
05-03-2009, 04:22 AM
Okay, so then humor me for a second. Let's say in "Beast" the writers did what you wanted. They had Clark convince Davis to go into the PZ and Chloe was all for it and he went to the Phantom Zone... Then what the hell would be the point of this Doomsday arc? What would be the focus for the last to episodes of the Season? So all the people arguing for Davis to just walk into the PZ would rather have us left hanging? No Doomsday/Clark brawl?

there were another ways to make this plan not working, its was, after all, Brainiac crystal, it could have had boobietrap of some sort, it might not work on DD for whatever reason, Brainiac was there, he could have reprogrammed it easily in Legion, they didnt need to involve Chloe in this. Imo it would be way better without her, i would actually believe, that she did it for Clark, if it wasnt for FOS scene, also this scene make look Clark again as someone who is indecisive, lectured by someone, who risks lifes of milions of lifes on Earth. if Chloe did it for Clark and hat to sacrifice something from herself, she should have let him do it.

Odysseus
05-03-2009, 01:18 PM
I was going to say the same. Clark in this case shouldn't be too hard on himself because if he kills Doomsday, he will just return again. Clark's choice was the best--one where he didn't even have to kill Doomsday even once. But now thanks to Chloe messing things up royally, he will. And when he does, Doomsday will be stronger and invulnerable to being killed again by Clark if ever he needs to stop him again.

The very trait of Davis' that damns him also justifies Clark in killing him, because he just can't stay dead. Sure Clark may be against inflicting physical harm on DD, but there literally is no other choice, especially when DD wants him dead, can't be reasoned with & will only rise again after being killed.

Chloe just delayed the inevitable. Doomsday will likely end up in the Zone after he's killed because he's too dangerous just to be thrown to space where he will awaken some day and kill life on another planet. The problem is, now people have to die before DD ends up in the Zone again. This is why no matter how I look at it, Clark had the perfect solution and Chloe screwed up.

I gotta agree with this. No matter what, DD is practically immortal. The only solutions I can think of would be A. Putting him in the Phantom Zone or B. Putting him on the Moon or on an uninhabited planet.

I can understand where Chloe is coming from, after all she's seen the human side of Davis and pities him (and throughout the series Chloe has always had a kind of self-sacrificial tendency when it comes to helping people). But at the same time, she's gotten way too close to the situation.

My guess is, when the Doomsday situation inevitably blows up in all of their faces and Clark and Doomsday finally have their climactic battle, Chloe will probably end up feeling extreme guilt over the whole thing.