Its a dark, dark world

[bobsuncorp]

So for my first thread about this amazing new show that I absolutely love (just in case anyone is any doubt) is in fact a bit of a complaint. Oh well:

My problem is with the Dollhouse itself, as a concept. And my problem is that it is a bad place full of bad people. So in fact my problem is one that is I'm sure intended that all viewers (that aren't sociopaths) should have. Which is that Echo (or Caroline) is the victim of being repeatedly raped and abused in all sorts of ways that don't include being hunted by a psycho. The idea of hypnotising a beautiful girl into sleeping with you is a common fantasy among geeks/teenage boys but all they really want is to be in a world where that girl wants to sleep with them because they like them enough. The reality of such mind control (as very ably demonstrated in the Buffy season 6 episode where Warren kills his ex) is rape.

So to have the protagonist of the show put in that situation every single week just makes me feel uncomfortable. As if, as the viewer, I am enabling this crime to continue. I was actually relieved when the guy revealed that he was going to start hunting her because then she displayed some free will.

I feel certain that Joss will have Echo escape the Dollhouse at some point, and I for one hope it happens soon. Or maybe it could be delayed if Echo started to retain some memories that allow her to make some decisions on her own and avoid the clutches of amorous clients.

[Xanderman]

I feel certain that Joss will have Echo escape the Dollhouse at some point, and I for one hope it happens soon. Or maybe it could be delayed if Echo started to retain some memories that allow her to make some decisions on her own and avoid the clutches of amorous clients.I doubt escape is in the immediate future as they probably want Echo to build up a bunch of imprints first. We're seeing that imprints aren't completely wiped from her, that she has the ability to retain them--no doubt one day she will be able to access all her past imprints at will. Then she will have a ton of memories/skills/experiences at her disposal. I agree that it would be good if they have the increasingly self-aware Echo start to make decisions on her own, independent of the current imprint or programming, in order to do what's right, especially to avoid being taken advantage of sexually. They'll probably do something like that...I doubt we'll be seeing much more of Echo sleeping with clients, unless she herself (her "aware" self) chooses it. (That said, didn't she willingly become a doll? If that's the case, should we feel sorry for her or care if she's exploited? I mean she sort of asked for it...dolls are apparently promised a huge sum of money after their term of service is complete.)

[bobsuncorp]

That said, didn't she willingly become a doll? If that's the case, should we feel sorry for her or care if she's exploited? I mean she sort of asked for it...dolls are apparently promised a huge sum of money after their term of service is complete.

Well thats the point isn't it? The flashback right at the start of the pilot seemed to show that while Caroline did not have a gun to her head, she was definitely under duress. It seemed like she was maybe protecting someone else? I think she talked about a "her" being the reason she is there.

Even if it turns out that she is not under duress in the classic sense, I don't think any of us would be surprised if they tricked her in some way.

[Hopefulsuicide]

I don't think it was for someone else that she was there.

The 'her' was her teacher, that was explained by the video at the end of the first episode. Go back and watch those two scenes, and it fits together.

However she must have done something. A lot of talks about consequences. I think she is in there because of something she did... but i have no idea what :lol:

[bobsuncorp]

When I saw that scene I was reminded of La Femme Nikita, specifically the tv version. In the original Nikita movie, she was a murderer who was recruited because she was a beautiful woman with the capacity to kill that they could train and turn into an assassin. In the tv show she was framed for the murder to make her less of an antihero. In that context I didn't like it, but if Echo had been framed for a crime by the dollhouse and then given this as the only way out, then this would make total sense.

[Hopefulsuicide]

i don't know, it just gave me the impression that Caroline recognised that she had actually done something that her gotten her in this situation... she said something like 'i was just trying to do goo in the world, like she always said'... so it sounds like an action that was supposed to be good but ended up going wrong and got her in a sitcky situation

[Rays523]

They implied in the first episode that echo had done something that was compelling her to become a "doll" in the "dollhouse". She also made a choice to willingly become echo by signing that paper/contract. So it's not like they are raping her it's more like she's a prostitute which morally I see nothing wrong with that.

[Hopefulsuicide]

In some ways she's luckier than a prostitute, because she doesnt have to live with the memory of all the different guys she sleeps with... and she doesn't have to feel the inevitable grossness and reluctance that a prostitute must feel because she believes she is having fun...