PLEASE READ: Stop The Bashing

[KSiteTV]

I understand some people here might have issues with a particular 'ship or not like certain directions... but please don't bash for the sake of baiting other people.

It's really embarrassing and downright mean to have seen threads and icons with "Lana Fu Fang," which I would highly recommend that if you have them, please change them. We don't allow terms like "Nois" or "Chloogle" and "Lana Fu Fang" is, in my opinion, just as offensive.

You're all welcome to let opinions be heard here... but there is a big difference between having an opinion and creating posts to bait others into being mad. Baiting is against the K-Site rules... and I'd just like to ask, personally, to be nice. And that goes for bashing of ANY relationships... it seems a lot of posts are made just to infuriate "the other side," and that just makes the KryptonSite Forums a hostile place. We don't want that, do we?

(And yes, this is boards-on-boards, but consider this an announcement from your friendly neighborhood moderator.)

[Bre723]

I agree.

[Timester]

It kinda spread all over the K-Site by now, not just on the episode forum. :\

[Dustmite]

Thank you Craig :)

I think this reminder was needed right now.

[ledzepfan23]

ya its kinda getting out of hand

[KSiteTV]

It kinda spread all over the K-Site by now, not just on the episode forum. :\

Well, those doing it are going to have to stop.

[Vergon6]

It is getting a bit ridiculous. It's one thing to be frustrated with the show, it's another thing to start with the bashing nicknames and icons.

[Sue Denim]

Thank you.

[skully]

Damn straight Craig. Nice work.

[dotsie23]

Thanks Craig for calling this matter to attention. I think a lot of these threads with polls like "who's the Cutest, Hottest, Prettiest, tend to make it even more of a bashing when ppl cast their votes for said actor and then are immediatedly chastised.

[SnowBird]

Thanks Craig for bringing this to everyone's attention. It gets discouraging reading those kinds of posts for all of the SV characters.

[redkryptoniteisthebest]

100% correct, Craig. All I ever see nowadays on these episode discussions are people bashing Clana (that ship in particular), Lana, Chlark, etc. Its getting annoying. I hope everyone reads this.

[suzieQ]

Thanks Craig,

It is a big turnoff to come to a general fan site and in every thread certain posts are continually baited and belittled. The general SPOILER and SPEC threads should at least be a place where you can come and get news and discuss the episode and not have to be subjected to a lot of belittling by people who are not interested in the storyline.

[Red-Kal]

Thank you for the message, the show is supposed to be fun and so many people are just downright horrible about it

[Clois4eva89]

Can someone clear up what this whole lana fang fu means? I´ve seen it on the board every once in a while. And it's had me scratching my head a pm will be fine I don't want to drag this out. And I agree bashing is uncalled for & I hope it stops.

[skully]

Can someone clear up what this whole lana fang fu means? I´ve seen it on the board every once in a while. And it's had me scratching my head a pm will be fine I don't want to drag this out. And I agree bashing is uncalled for & I hope it stops.
It is a closed thread elsewhere on these boards that pokes a lot of fun at Lana and particularly her role in Thirst.

Craig has definitely done the right thing in calling for the bashing to stop.

[Clois4eva89]

thanks for the info skully

[geminis]

Yet again, this is another reason why I love KryptonSite. When people go over the top, deliberately bashing or even unintentionally doing so, it is recognized and stopped.

Thank you Craig!

[kaam]

I am not the biggest fan of Lana and I kinda felt bad for her! Thanks for keeping everyone in line, Craig!

[skully]

Maybe Craig's timely intervention will refocus everyone on the next episode and allow the episode to be given a fair hearing (or airing!! :)).

[marikology]

:::applauds::

thanks, Craig.

[ColdPlay3r]

i guess a i have 2 behave now:)

[Loisdragon]

i guess a i have 2 behave now:)

Yeah me too.

[SmallvilleMan]

100% correct, Craig. All I ever see nowadays on these episode discussions are people bashing Clana (that ship in particular), Lana, Chlark, etc. Its getting annoying. I hope everyone reads this.

Yep, it's only been happening for four years now........Glad it's being brought to attention about two weeks before the Clana ship and Lana are offcially gone. Good to know........:rolleyes:

[pizzahead2490]

i am sorry :( oh my god i feel so bad

----- Added 11 Minutes later -----


i guess a i have 2 behave now:)

i know me too

[costas22]

It's not about having to behave you guys.What Craig is saying is that it's better to support your own favourite character than to bash the one you don't like.I was glad he did something because if you look at other websites they have gone over the top.Especially a specific one where the term "Nois" is almost as popular as the term "Smallville".This is just a TV show not a political debate.

[Imzadia]

Thanks, Craig! ITA ...for the sake of the 'Fun' we're supposed to be having and sharing here; and for the sake of PEACE and RESPECT, IMO.

[Becc]

I'm glad a topic was posted on this character bashing and ship bashing in this site seem to be more and more prevalent. And can I just say that the Lana hate I've witnessed here seems to be so very irrational.

[costas22]

Becc you should check the forum on TWTP.It's even worse.Towards Lana but mostly against Lois.

[Lazy Boy]

I'll be on my best behaviour from now on! ;)

Seriously, we appreciate the reminder and I do find it off putting to go into a thread where there is bashing. There has been several posters who are posting less and less or leaving the board altogether due to too many negative comments about ships, characters and actors so cheers for the reminder Craig.

[Reeve_290]

Thanks for the reminder Craig - it seems over the course of the last few years some people have forgotten what the show is about and what this is forum is for.

But just a question; is there any way you can post this reminder in a more public place? While a lot of the most recent incidents have located in the Bulletproof thread, a greater majority of the bashing towards a certain character/ship exists elsewhere and posters who don't come here wont see your message.

Thanks a lot :)

[Jaderoyale]

Its obviously just what happens usually; people having a little bit of fun that has gotten COMPLETELY out of hand.
I'm happy to say i haven't been a part of it.

And you're right Craig, you don't allow other terms that are offsensive, so this "Lana-Fu-Fang," really needs to stop.

[kentfamily]

Thank you. I agree with you Becc. Its always the same individuals that bash a certain character. Its probably geared towards the actor. Cannot say that they hate the character and not the actor because its the actor that portrays the character. So these individuals who are are always bashing a certain character probably hates the actor.
Yes I wish they would understand how to analyze and critique a show and not bash a character.
As for Lana Fu minus the Fang nickname, I disagree about it being offensive. I am not sure where the Fang came from. I think its a positive nickname for Lana because she knows how to use martial arts. I love it when she kicks Arse! I dont think its used in a derogatory way. Maybe to some but not to me. But calling Kung Fu and Lana being a ninja is ignorant because Kung Fu is a Chinese martial art not Japanese and Ninjas are Japanese forms of Martial Arts! and thats what she was using Kung Fu. Cant tell the difference between the 2 cultures is a form of ignorance wouldnt you say?

[Jaderoyale]

Thank you. Its always the same individuals that bash a certain character. Its probably geared towards the actor. Cannot say that they hate the character and not the actor because its the actor that portrays the character. So these individuals who are are always bashing a certain character probably hates the actor.
Yes I wish they would understand how to analyze and critique a show and not bash a character.

I'm just going to disagree with you in this case and say; this time, its general hatred towards the character. Noone i've come across while this has been happening has been bashing the actor, purely the character.

[Alania]

I am not the biggest fan of Lana and I kinda felt bad for her! Thanks for keeping everyone in line, Craig!


I feel the same way, Kaam! I'm not the biggest fan of Lana as much as i'm not a biggest fan of bashing. Lois Lane's hard-core fans such as myself know pretty well how does that feel like, not good at all. I was starting to feel sorry for Lana! I don't read a lot of interviews about KK, but i heard somewhere that this vampire episode is something that even she enjoyed the least in all SV.

[darkone]

Thanks. You are right it is embarassing for a general fansite. I hope those people learned their lesson.

[TOMophilus]

Thanks for the reminder! The place has indeed become quite aggressive lately.

But if you try to cut down on bashing, may I suggest including the BDA? I don´t see a difference between calling Clark a BDA and calling Lana Lana-Fu or Chloe Chloogle. Worse, in Clark´s case the bashing is sanctioned by Kryptonsite itself, for in the character forum it says: "Clark Kent. The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!" It would set a good example to remove this. Bashing protection should not just apply to the girls but to every character. Thanks! :)

[kentfamily]

Jaderoyale---

How does one critize/hate the character without the actor being involved? I just dont understand that logic?
Isnt the actor portraying the character through their own interpretation? So doesnt the actor's feeling is in it to be able to act that part? A little bit of their persona in it? A little? I guess thats why its called acting.

I do not like the Lois character in this show but I would not go and bash it by hoping it death or something, like the Clana haters do..But anyways, bashing is getting old in the website and everytime I read a thread it is sooo depressing due to all the bashing.

[Tompouce]

Thanks, Craig! ITA ...for the sake of the 'Fun' we're supposed to be having and sharing here; and for the sake of PEACE and RESPECT, IMO.
Exactly, thanks Craig:)

[Jaderoyale]

Just so you know, i am not arguing with you here, i'm simply stating my opinion :)


Jaderoyale---

How does one critize/hate the character without the actor being involved? I just dont understand that logic?

I'm speaking for myself here.
At times in the past when i've said i don't like Lana i specifically mean LANA. Not KK as an actress, i admire KK as an actress and a role model to young women worldwide.
When i say i dislike Lana, i always say why i do, and in a way its to do with the way the character has been written in past seasons by ALMiles; the whole making her the object of Clark and Lex's affections, choosing the life with Lex etc etc; i know many agree with me in the fact the character of Lana was really written badly. Though i admire KK for sticking with what she was given and acting it to the best of her ability; in a way it prooves what an amazing person she is, that he character is so severely disliked, yet she still plays the part.

Lana is meant to be Clark's confidant during the later parts of his life, and this should have been addressed much earlier on, it seems like ALMiles were more concerned with the romance between the two that they didn't realise how hard it was going to be to mke them have closure and have Lana become who she is ultimately meant to be in the comics.


Isnt the actor portraying the character through their own interpretation? So doesnt the actor's feeling is in it to be able to act that part? A little bit of their persona in it? A little? I guess thats why its called acting.

Not in the past seasons. I see more of KK coming through during the episodes she's been in this season so far, which i must say though i dislike Lana as character, she is a lot better than she has been for past seasons. I think PS3 are giving her the chance to try and rectify her character before she leaves, which is what the character needs.


I do not like the Lois character in this show but I would not go and bash it by hoping it death or something, like the Clana haters do..But anyways, bashing is getting old in the website and everytime I read a thread it is sooo depressing due to all the bashing.

I admit that i do not like Clana as a ship, but that is NOTHING to do with the fact that u favour Clois, like some people seem to assume. I used to like Clana during the earlier seasons. Its simply due to all the angst and heartbreak we were put through with their relationship and just when you think they'll all good and over, that closure is finally coming, we're hit with it again. Lana was meant to be Clarks high school love, high school ended 4 years ago, as should have Clana in all technicality.

[Timester]

How does one critize/hate the character without the actor being involved?

Easily, when the actor himself critize the character.

[Mickey_Bickey]

I just want to say that in no shape or form was the "Lana-Fu-Fang" posts meant to be malicious or degrading in any way to the actress KK. I have never posted anything intentionally malicious about any actor or actress. It was truly not meant to be mean spirited. It was based on an episode from S5 that even the producers said was laughable. They had a special commentary at the end of the S5 DVD set to emphasize that.

It was only intended to add humor and have a bit of fun. Charlie Chapman once said "A day without laughter was a day wasted", and that's how I live my life.

I apologize to anyone here who I offended. As for the ship bashing and fan baiting, I am glad to see this addressed.

As I said to Craig in a PM I sent him last night, I will do my part to be more considerate in this general forum. Thank you, and let's all enjoy the rest of the season.

[Becc]

post deleted

[Dustmite]

Jaderoyale---

How does one critize/hate the character without the actor being involved? I just dont understand that logic?

I'm a huge Allison Mack fan and I adore Chloe but I can criticize Chloe and her actions when I don't agree with them. I think Kristin Kreuk is a sweetheart but I dislike Lana. Disliking the character but liking the actor that portrays that character are two different things. I'm not saying people don't mix them up but to say that it's always that way is false.

[TheANIMAL (marcus)]

Well know, we wouldn't want to hurt the characters feelings, they are real people after all. :rolleyes:

[costas22]

post removed

[Jaderoyale]

I'm a huge Allison Mack fan and I adore Chloe but I can criticize Chloe and her actions when I don't agree with them. I think Kristin Kreuk is a sweetheart but I dislike Lana. Disliking the character but liking the actor that portrays that character are two different things. I'm not saying people don't mix them up but to say that it's always that way is false.

Thats exactly what i mean.
I adore Lois and Erica, but i can criticise Lois if i don't like something her character has done.

[RedKRules]

I agree, bash is one thing, criticise is another, one thing bring the character down and the another help the character to grow .... and get better :)

[Dustmite]

I agree, bash is one thing, criticise is another, one thing bring the character down and the another help the character to grow .... and get better :)

Exactly. Debate is one thing. Bashing is another.


Thats exactly what i mean.

I got that from your post :)

[costas22]

Hey guys does every show on TV create so many groups of passionate shipers?

[LovelyLoisLane]

I think the warning should include being against making veiled comments about shippers or fans of a certain character, because I've seen a lot of that and I think we are ALL adults enough to know when we are being snide.

Now this is just an example, but saying things like "Unlike some fans we actually like to have our character not be lightswitched and unlike some fans we won't except poor writing." or "Well, we like to see a couple that is good looking, since fans of *insert name here* are usually good looking themselves, unlike other kinds of shippers." I have seen far too many of these kinds of comments, and I usually try to report them to the mods, but the mods can't censure every single post or watch the forums like a hawk.

I think everyone needs to realise that while we all get passionate about the things we are interested in, and that includes Smallville, that it isn't necessary to take jabs at the people we disagree with. Either outright or veiled. You are talking about a fictional show and fictional characters, but the people you are talking about it with are NOT fictional. They have opinions and thoughts, and feelings all of their own.

Now I'm not Miss Polly Perfection, I know I've slipped up and said some things that aren't so nice when I get irritated. But I am certainly going to do my part and promise to try a little harder to be nicer, or hey, like the old adage goes "If you aren't going to say anything nice, don't say anything at all." Well if you feel the urge to cuss someone out, or insult them or anything unacceptable like that, then just refrain from commenting at all until you've cooled down. That usually works for me.

[actaeon]

Thanks for the reminder, Craig.

I came to this forum to get away from that kind of nastiness. I can deal with people being passionate, or snarky, or criticizing, or poking fun. But then there is outright bashing, which is over the line. Hatred and ugliness is just pointless, it gets boring real fast, it's not discussion. After a while it just makes the people who have something positive to say feel unwelcome and hounded.

I suppose there can be sort of a fine line between poking fun and bashing. That's where common sense comes into play.

[KSiteTV]

I think the warning should include being against making veiled comments about shippers or fans of a certain character, because I've seen a lot of that and I think we are ALL adults enough to know when we are being snide.

Veiled comments are, to me, just like baiting which would fall under the site rules. If it's ever encountered, report the posts and we'll take care of it.

I apologize to everyone who finds things to be uncomfortable here. NO ONE should feel chastised because they happen to like particular characters.

Unless you're Sheriff Nancy's biggest fan, and that's just sad. KIDDING! (I love Camille Mitchell) Seriously, let's all have some fun without kicking others down in the process. Even if it means thinking before you post - "would I like it if someone said this about my favorite character?" I'd definitely appreciate it.

[Kid Collins]

Having the site owner make a comment means a lot!

Thanks!!

[petitemimi]

Thanks for the reminder! The place has indeed become quite aggressive lately.

But if you try to cut down on bashing, may I suggest including the BDA? I don´t see a difference between calling Clark a BDA and calling Lana Lana-Fu or Chloe Chloogle. Worse, in Clark´s case the bashing is sanctioned by Kryptonsite itself, for in the character forum it says: "Clark Kent. The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!" It would set a good example to remove this. Bashing protection should not just apply to the girls but to every character. Thanks! :)

I totally agree with this and I think the same logic should apply to BDA, Nois and Lana Fu Fang.

[KSiteTV]

I know it ruffles feathers and the other mods probably are more for banning BDA too but I never saw what was so offensive about that one... especially when the "Spell" commentary had the actors saying how Tom would walk around the set going "Clark is so dumb!" BDA seems like something that points out how charming he is, just my opinion of course, whereas the other names usually involve bashing.

'Cause Clark is big... he has done some dumb things... and he is an alien... I don't know how it is a bash.

Oddly, that description for the Clark Kent character section has been up since the Character section was first launched... in 2003 or 2004, I think, and it's only been the past year that anyone's complained.

Clearly I don't want Tom/Clark fans to feel aggravated here, and they've got my PM address if they feel strongly about it... I just assure you that at least from my end, I think Big Dumb Alien is rather endearing, but, your mileage may vary. Ultimately, I want everyone to be happy here... though I know it's an often difficult task. Hopefully I was able to at least explain the BDA character description thing here.

[LovelyLoisLane]

Veiled comments are, to me, just like baiting which would fall under the site rules. If it's ever encountered, report the posts and we'll take care of it.


Unless you're Sheriff Nancy's biggest fan, and that's just sad. KIDDING!

I know, and I usually do, but I hate doing it all the time or feel like I'm a tattle tale.

Heh, well every character has their fans. :p

[petitemimi]

I'll risk presenting my point of view about this one last time. For me, big dumb alien means exactly what it says: that Clark is big, dumb and an alien. There's a world of diffference between being dumb and doing dumb things from time to time. Everybody is doing dumb things from time to time. And I certainly couldn't complain in 2004 since I'm here since 2007. If there are more Clark fans in here than before, I thought it was a good thing for this site and that an effort could be made. I really fail to see why Chloogle is so much more of an insult than big dumb alien.

[Tompouce]

Heh, well every character has their fans. :p
CLARK FOREVER:D
Craig, I have to say I am not here since a long time but I am always shocked when I read "BDA" for Clark though I feel a kind of fondness in it. Thanks for your explanation:)

[Sv.LoisLane]

Veiled comments are, to me, just like baiting which would fall under the site rules. If it's ever encountered, report the posts and we'll take care of it.

I apologize to everyone who finds things to be uncomfortable here. NO ONE should feel chastised because they happen to like particular characters.

Unless you're Sheriff Nancy's biggest fan, and that's just sad. KIDDING! (I love Camille Mitchell) Seriously, let's all have some fun without kicking others down in the process. Even if it means thinking before you post - "would I like it if someone said this about my favorite character?" I'd definitely appreciate it.

Thank you, Craig.

I definitely agree with this and with the original post. And, personally, I'd really appreciate if people would stop making fun not only of Lana in this case, but also of the "other" ships.

[SnowBird]

Thanks for the reminder! The place has indeed become quite aggressive lately.

But if you try to cut down on bashing, may I suggest including the BDA? I don´t see a difference between calling Clark a BDA and calling Lana Lana-Fu or Chloe Chloogle. Worse, in Clark´s case the bashing is sanctioned by Kryptonsite itself, for in the character forum it says: "Clark Kent. The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!" It would set a good example to remove this. Bashing protection should not just apply to the girls but to every character. Thanks! :)

Good point. Thanks for bringing this up. This particular name calling is offensive to this Clark fan.

[Vindellavon]

We can't use BDA anymore? :(

[Jaderoyale]

Thank you, Craig.

I definitely agree with this and with the original post. And, personally, I'd really appreciate if people would stop making fun not only of Lana in this case, but also of the "other" ships.

Thank heavens someone else has brought this up as well.
It seems that with Lana returning, its most notable that people are bashing Lana and going mad over the whole Clana.
But we've been Lana free for 10 episodes, yet people are still bashing other characters and ships. I just let it go over my head, but if Lana being bashed is going to be addressed, then so does Lois being bashed and Chloe.

----- Added 51 Seconds later -----


We can't use BDA anymore? :(

Nooooo that hasn't been said.
Someone posted earlier (I apologise that i can't remember who), that they found the term BDA offensive and Craig was explaining what the term came across as to him :)

[Vindellavon]

Nooooo that hasn't been said.
Someone posted earlier (I apologise that i can't remember who), that they found the term BDA offensive and Craig was explaining what the term came across as to him :)

Whew. Thanks luv, I don't know what I would've done if I found out BDA no longer made it's rounds. And yes, I understand the rest bashing, and 'tis does seem to be a good time to stop it.

[Dustmite]

I think there's a difference between expressing your dislike for a charcater and a ship and saying so and so sucks. Not everyone is going to like the same characters and there's bound to be discussion which is the point of a message board. As long as everyone follows the rules there's shouldn't be a problem. Reporting posts is the way to bring something to the mods attention.

I personally feel the Clana bashing was way over the top and I've seen nothing like it to compare to the other ships. If I was feeling uncomfortable reading it, I can only imagine what fans of Lana felt like. It can't be pleasant to be faced with a barrage of posts and icons that are quite offensive especially when you're in the minority.

[SnowBird]

Whew. Thanks luv, I don't know what I would've done if I found out BDAno longer made it's rounds. And yes, I understand the rest bashing, and 'tis does seem to be a good time to stop it.

Please tell me why BDA (Big Dumb Alien) is not bashing the Clark Kent character.

[llk6165]

Hey guys does every show on TV create so many groups of passionate shipers?


That's a good question. I have wondered if it is because of the TV show or the general Superman legend that has been goings since before most of us were born (including me :)). I also wonder if people are this passionate about other superhero legends. For example does anyone "ship" Spiderman and MJ? I'm trying to be lighthearted but make a point at the same time. For me this is an interesting psychological phenomona. I think it speaks to the impact the Superman Legend has had on our society. Human nature is fascinating. Now you have me curious. Are there any psycholoogist among us, that may have an opinion? And would that be a permissible topic strictly what about Supe evokes such powerful passions. I tried to explore this question with a poll about why you ship who you ship. As far as I have seen, the answers have been civilized and it is interesting to here they why behind someone's opinion. Way more than intended to say.:(

[TOMophilus]

Clearly I don't want Tom/Clark fans to feel aggravated here, and they've got my PM address if they feel strongly about it... I just assure you that at least from my end, I think Big Dumb Alien is rather endearing, but, your mileage may vary. Ultimately, I want everyone to be happy here... though I know it's an often difficult task. Hopefully I was able to at least explain the BDA character description thing here.
I understand your point. But fact is that in the majority of posts BDA has come to be used to bash Clark, not to express some cute or endearing feature of his alien origin.

I am all for a new anti-bashing policy, but such a policy should be consistent. That´s all I ask for. :)

[wolverine316]

Thanks Craig, It would be nice if you could add BDA to that list as well. I don't like it when posters constantly call Clark that. Chloogle seems harmless compared to this phrase.

[Timester]

Please tell me why BDA (Big Dumb Alien) is not bashing the Clark Kent character.

Isn't he big? Isn't he dumb some times? Isn't he an alien?

Like Craig said, I also never saw BDA as insulting to Clark, especially since it's been used since season 2 and people understood its meaning. I don't see any difference between "Clark is so dumb" or "Clark is so BDA", both are simply calling him dumb, that's all.

[Jedimaster_TTBaby]

Well Done Craig...it was getting a bit out of hand from all parties.

[Vindellavon]

Please tell me why BDA (Big Dumb Alien) is not bashing the Clark Kent character.

Nope. Just stating the fact that sometimes he just can't seem to get what's right in front of him.

[Timester]

I understand your point. But fact is that in the majority of posts BDA has come to be used to bash Clark, not to express some cute or endearing feature of his alien origin.

I am all for a new anti-bashing policy, but such a policy should be consistent. That´s all I ask for. :)

But when it's used to bash, you should report it. Now, if is to critizice something that Clark did, it's nothing insulting, IMO.

[llk6165]

We all have different sensitivity thresholds. For me, I am ok with name for the characters, because that has nothing to do with the actors. Professional actors understand that. They are not their characters. For them it is a job. However, I am not offended about stuss said when it comes to fictional characters, but that is just me. If others find it truly hurtful, then should we have a rule prohibiting use of nicknames for the characters? Just a suggestion.

[Timester]

Chloogle seems harmless compared to this phrase.

Chloogle has a different story behind it, since it was created especifically to bash Chloe's character. The same with Nois.

[Vindellavon]

Chloogle has a different story behind it, since it was created especifically to bash Chloe's character. The same with Nois.

I agree, these to have a history individually and tied behind them.

[petitemimi]

But when it's used to bash, you should report it. Now, if is to critizice something that Clark did, it's nothing insulting, IMO.

The generic term BDA refers to him as being constantly dumb and defines him on this site.

There's a difference with this defining term and saying "Clark was being dumb here", when it refers to one thing he has done, as opposed to being constantly dumb.

No one explained yet why Chloogle is bashing, when compared to BDA. Anyone care for an explaination?

[llk6165]

Some of you will probably think I am insenstivie, but Nois is considered offensive? I just interpreted it to mean a vote of no to the Clois ship, just with a bit of snark and creativity. Clois, by the way is the ship I sail..

[Alania]

What is Nois, exactly?? If it's an ugly word, don't bother!

[wolverine316]

But when it's used to bash, you should report it. Now, if is to critizice something that Clark did, it's nothing insulting, IMO.

Then there will be alot of reporting. The problem is most times the term is used to bash Clark. If Clark doesn't return someone's feelings he is a BDA. If Clark doesn't fly or don the suit he is a BDA. If Clark doesn't leave the farm he is a BDA, etc....... Whereas there is no phrase that has stuck for anyone else if they do something the posters disagree with. Why can't everyone take a vote on whether to use the term? Thanks.

[Black Panda]

For example does anyone "ship" Spiderman and MJ?

Well, the whole Gwen Stacy arc came about because the fans were raising the roof over killing her they were so mad. The people who wrote Spiderman thought Gwen was stale and they weren't bringing her back. However they capitalized on the controversy and found a way to bring her back and hammer the point home that she was really going to stay dead. That was the original Clone Saga.

But yeah, there were plenty of folks shipping MJ over Gwen too.

Still are. That would include me. There was a big long arc where they were seperated then reunited. Strazynski did it. I had issues with the magical retcon bits of Peter's origin, but I mostly enjoyed it and I loved the shippy stuff. Recently they broke apart MJ and Peter. I've stopped reading Spiderman, but I understand it was a huge issue for fans.

By the way, there is nothing wrong with shipping, or being invested in the romance storyline in this show. Writers count on shipping for a lot of interest in comics, TV, movies, even literature. Romance is no less a legitimate plot point than action, in my minds.

It's not shipping that's a problem, it's behaving in a civil fashion. People on music boards will flame you for having the wrong opinion on a band. People will go nuts over cat declawing. You want to watch yourself in any political or religious disagreement. It's not shipping that's the problem, it's perspective (not that I would know anything about perspective).

[Vindellavon]

What is Nois, exactly?? If it's an ugly word, don't bother!

In short, it's a term that bashes EdLois or SV!Lois. It's offensive to SV!Lois fans, just like Chloogle is offensive to Chloe fans. For further explanation, I sent you a PM. :)

[Jedimaster_TTBaby]

What is Chloogle...is it because she is smart :confused:

[Timester]

The generic term BDA refers to him as being constantly dumb and defines him on this site.

There's a difference with this defining term and saying "Clark was being dumb here", when it refers to one thing he has done, as opposed to being constantly dumb.

Wrong. BDA refers to him as "how dumb Clark can be sometimes".

I can speak for myself, because in the past I did used BDA to critizice Clark, but also defended Clark when BDA was being badly used.


I'm appalled that this needs so much explaining, and that no one explained yet why Chloogle is bashing, when compared to BDA.

Because Chloogle, just like Nois, were created for bashing. Nothing more. It's all about context.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Why can't everyone take a vote on whether to use the term?

Because this is not a democracy? :confused:

[petitemimi]

^^ It's supposed to be bashing, so I guess it doesn't mean that.

[Timester]

What is Chloogle...is it because she is smart :confused:

Chloogle means that Chloe is nothing more than Clark's Google. It was created for bashing.

[STFanatic]

I think Sheriff Nancy is Hot, there is just something about a woman with a gun :p

I have always liked the term "BDA", to me it is like a jibe at a younger brother.
How many times have you said something like "Gee, that was smart" or "Good going Einstein", those are just phrases used when kidding someone, not really intended to insult but as a way of a joke.

I am sure several of the names being used started out as a simple joke but then others began using them as an insult to where they were totally devoid of humor and took on a totally different meaning.

The main problem as I see it is that people take things either too serious or too far. If everyone agreed on everything, then there would be no need for a United Nations.

I really like Brussel Sprouts, but I understand there are some people who don't.
I would never bash someone because they don't, nor do I think less of them because of it.

I like Dr. Pepper, my wife likes Pepsi, but, I married her anyway.

[Dustmite]

It's not shipping that's the problem.

Agreed.

And it has been known to get quite nasty in other fandoms. Harry Potter and the whole Harry/ Hermione, Harry/Ginny saga was very hostile or so I've heard.

[Vindellavon]

What is Chloogle...is it because she is smart :confused:

'Tis more than that, luv. One nickname that offends a whole lot more that Chloe.

[petitemimi]

Wrong. BDA refers to him as "how dumb Clark can be sometimes".

I can speak for myself, because in the past I did used BDA to critizice Clark, but also defended Clark when BDA was being badly used.



Because Chloogle, just like Nois, were created for bashing. Nothing more. It's all about context.

Well, we both can say that the other is wrong until we're blue in the face, but I don't see an explaination in that; and I'm sorry that Clark fans can't seem to have consideration.

[Vindellavon]

Well, we both can say that the other is wrong until we're blue in the face, but I don't see an explaination in that.

I think you should take it up with Craig, luv. He ight be able to help. :)

[llk6165]

What about just no nicknames for characters, actors, or ships?

[fan of the man]

Craig,

Thanks, Smallville is a great show and everyone who has been part needs ourappreciation, for giving us a show that illustrates the life of a young Clark Kent.
I thank you for this website and this forum. and you are right we need to be more like Jonathan and Clark of Smallville "look for the best in people" It is a great show promote the show, don't bring the show down by critcizing the actors ,actresses and the writers who put forth great efforts year in and year out to give us the best production possible. Sometimes we need tough love to helps us do the right thing. Let start by giving KK "Lana Lane" our support by watching the next two episode and voicing our appreciation for her great job in playing the roll of Lana Lane the first Love of Clark Kent, on this forum and other forums.
I am not saying it wrong to voice your disagreement with the show,but keep it civil and not let it become personal, I am personally a Clois fan, but I don't dislike the clana ship, because it is part of the young Clark Kent's life, and I love the direction they have taking with Clana, no it not perfect, but it is their story, I know Lois will be his final and true love in the end. Let's enjoy the remaining 10 episodes and pray for a 9th season.

Kristin K. thanks for the eight years of doing a great job in protraying Lana Lane, I am one that will miss you, and hope you will come back for quest visit, if the show is allowed a 9th season.

Craig, thanks once again.

[Jaderoyale]

Thanks Craig, It would be nice if you could add BDA to that list as well. I don't like it when posters constantly call Clark that. Chloogle seems harmless compared to this phrase.

Oh Chloogle is completely offensive. I may be a bigger Lois fan than Chloe, but i like Chloe and i despise that phrase, its horrible.

[Timester]

Lana Lang.

[Jaderoyale]

What about just no nicknames for characters, actors, or ships?

Its not that.
The whole Lana-Fu-Fang thing started as a joke i'm guessing, but escalated into something so much worse.
There were icons etc etc, captions under names and so forth.
The whole "Lana Fu" part is a jibe at the marital arts that Lana does and i admit to mentioning the "kung fu" in my review but i didn't call it Lana Fu. The whole fang part is simply taken from Thirst, a largely disliked episode by many SV fans.

[Timester]

Craig,

Thanks, Smallville is a great show and everyone who has been part needs ourappreciation, for giving us a show that illustrates the life of a young Clark Kent.
I thank you for this website and this forum. and you are right we need to be more like Jonathan and Clark of Smallville "look for the best in people" It is a great show promote the show, don't bring the show down by critcizing the actors ,actresses and the writers who put forth great efforts year in and year out to give us the best production possible. Sometimes we need tough love to helps us do the right thing. Let start by giving KK "Lana Lane" our support by watching the next two episode and voicing our appreciation for her great job in playing the roll of Lana Lane the first Love of Clark Kent, on this forum and other forums.
I am not saying it wrong to voice your disagreement with the show,but keep it civil and not let it become personal, I am personally a Clois fan, but I don't dislike the clana ship, because it is part of the young Clark Kent's life, and I love the direction they have taking with Clana, no it not perfect, but it is their story, I know Lois will be his final and true love in the end. Let's enjoy the remaining 10 episodes and pray for a 9th season.

Kristin K. thanks for the eight years of doing a great job in protraying Lana Lane, I am one that will miss you, and hope you will come back for quest visit, if the show is allowed a 9th season.

Craig, thanks once again.

The thread isn't about actor bashing, but nicknames created to belittle and flame the character's fans.

[Jaderoyale]

Lana Lang.

Yeah, its Lang not Lane isn't it. :lol:
Careful that'll start a whole other war :eek:

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Agreed.

And it has been known to get quite nasty in other fandoms. Harry Potter and the whole Harry/ Hermione, Harry/Ginny saga was very hostile or so I've heard.

Tbh, as bad as its gotten on here with Lana lately, nothing can be as bad as the Harry/Hermione and Ron/Hermione saga i witnessed. And i'm thankful for that.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----


What is Chloogle...is it because she is smart :confused:

Sadly not.
Its meant to reference to how much Chloe helps Clark out by using the computer. Like a search engine. Its basically a take on the search engine "Google" but with Chloe added in context. And it is extremley offensive.

[Vindellavon]

Oh Chloogle is completely offensive. I may be a bigger Lois fan than Chloe, but i like Chloe and i despise that phrase, its horrible.

And totally demeaning to the character.


The thread isn't about actor bashing, but nicknames created to belittle and flame the character's fans.

Agreed. I highly doubt the actors give a hoot, it's a job to them, but for us the audience, we make what we make of the characters. I love all the actors and actresses on SV, but that doesn't mean I'm mandated to like their charactres as well.

[llk6165]

Its not that.
The whole Lana-Fu-Fang thing started as a joke i'm guessing, but escalated into something so much worse.
There were icons etc etc, captions under names and so forth.
The whole "Lana Fu" part is a jibe at the marital arts that Lana does and i admit to mentioning the "kung fu" in my review but i didn't call it Lana Fu. The whole fang part is simply taken from Thirst, a largely disliked episode by many SV fans.


I feel bad that phrase offended people. In martial arts, Kung Fu is one of the most revered disciplines. It never occurred to me that the use of the word Fu would be considered bashing, but rather I saw it being used in the context of what the character was doing and how the storyline played out - somewhat like a term of art. The word was used in context of the character and the blotline. To me it wasn't offense because it wasn't a personal attack on the actor or the fans. But again we all will have different opinions. The question will be how to resolve this so no one is offended.

[Cogito17]

Thank you for this.

Reading through these forums lately has been a little bit like walking into an elementary school playground with people treating characters like they have "cooties".

I won't say that shipping or supporting one character far above the rest is bad, but I will say that it seems like in doing so, it would become easy to interpret everything in the show solely through the lens of that specific fandom. Which can also villify characters or relationships that stand in the way, leading to some of these aforementioned nicknames.

[llk6165]

I must say, learning about these nicknames and how they affect people is enlightning. So this thread is probably good so we can come together to understand where our differences are. For me, I have not posted with the intent to offend, but apologize if that has been the effect. To be safe, I will not longer use nicknames to refer to a character or ship.

[TOMophilus]

Let me repeat it: it´s all about consistency. An anti-bashing policy simply cannot look like this:

1) It is forbidden to bash character A.
2) It is forbidden to bash character B.
3) It is allowed to bash character C.
4) It is forbidden to bash character D.

Using certain terms is of course a matter of context. BDA may be meant to be cute. Lana-Fu may be used to admire the character´s martial arts performance. Even Chloogle can be used in a positive sense, such as envying someone who can google so well like Chloe: "Geesh, I can´t find this: I wish I had Chloogle to help me!".

But this means you have to either submit every post to a context analysis (good luck with the ensuing discussion!), or you simply delete all posts containing bashing terms defined in a list somewhere. If the latter, BDA should be included. It´s just a matter of consistency.

[unfocused]

i guess a i have 2 behave now:)


Yeah me too.


i know me too

Same here... and I'm sorry.

So, Craig, are we getting a new character bashing rule to go along with our ship bashing rule? Because that would be great. It seems we have one for Lana now :)

[Jaderoyale]

I must say, learning about these nicknames and how they affect people is enlightning. So this thread is probably good so we can come together to understand where our differences are. For me, I have not posted with the intent to offend, but apologize if that has been the effect. To be safe, I will not longer use nicknames to refer to a character or ship.

I actually think theres a thread around that Craig started with all character nicknames and which ones are forbidden.

[llk6165]

A list would be great. I will look for it. This is a great forum, and its great to see we care about having this type of discussion.

[bychance]

Thank you.


What is Nois, exactly?? If it's an ugly word, don't bother!

Its what Erica Durance haters call Lois. Kind of like the people who don't like President Obama call him 'Nobama'. Its really stupid.

[geminis]

I think Sheriff Nancy is Hot, there is just something about a woman with a gun :p

I have always liked the term "BDA", to me it is like a jibe at a younger brother.
How many times have you said something like "Gee, that was smart" or "Good going Einstein", those are just phrases used when kidding someone, not really intended to insult but as a way of a joke.

I am sure several of the names being used started out as a simple joke but then others began using them as an insult to where they were totally devoid of humor and took on a totally different meaning.

The main problem as I see it is that people take things either too serious or too far. If everyone agreed on everything, then there would be no need for a United Nations.

I really like Brussel Sprouts, but I understand there are some people who don't.
I would never bash someone because they don't, nor do I think less of them because of it.

I like Dr. Pepper, my wife likes Pepsi, but, I married her anyway.

ITA.

Some names started as deliberately offensive, others did not. But things do get carried way too far; that's why it is so nice to have Craig and the league of Super-Mods. :D

I have to admit to a certain fondness for BDA; it's Clark, hello!! I'm sorry that some people consider it offensive; for me it is all in the context.

But we should all remember Aesclepius' motto: First, do no harm.

[Lis]

I know it ruffles feathers and the other mods probably are more for banning BDA too but I never saw what was so offensive about that one... especially when the "Spell" commentary had the actors saying how Tom would walk around the set going "Clark is so dumb!" BDA seems like something that points out how charming he is, just my opinion of course, whereas the other names usually involve bashing.

'Cause Clark is big... he has done some dumb things... and he is an alien... I don't know how it is a bash.

Oddly, that description for the Clark Kent character section has been up since the Character section was first launched... in 2003 or 2004, I think, and it's only been the past year that anyone's complained.

Clearly I don't want Tom/Clark fans to feel aggravated here, and they've got my PM address if they feel strongly about it... I just assure you that at least from my end, I think Big Dumb Alien is rather endearing, but, your mileage may vary. Ultimately, I want everyone to be happy here... though I know it's an often difficult task. Hopefully I was able to at least explain the BDA character description thing here.

Sorry Craig but I have to disagree! If you play some character and made a joke about it (and it was the only one time I heard Tom sad about Clark he is dumb and in „special“ situation), do you think it would be OK for any other were people saying some insulting things about this character too? I don’t think so. And it’s only my humble opinion, but I'm not convinced Tom thinks of Clark as BDA. I never get this „nickname“ for Clark. And I’m sure many people on KS don’t use this nickname as a joke (or a friendly nickname), but quite the contrary as an insult. And as a fan of Clark it offends me seeing someone saying about him he is dumb. Because I’m sorry, but I don’t think he is dumb! And he doesn’t deserve such an insulting nickname, ever!

[geminis]

Let me repeat it: it´s all about consistency. An anti-bashing policy simply cannot look like this:

1) It is forbidden to bash character A.
2) It is forbidden to bash character B.
3) It is allowed to bash character C.
4) It is forbidden to bash character D.

Using certain terms is of course a matter of context. BDA may be meant to be cute. Lana-Fu may be used to admire the character´s martial arts performance. Even Chloogle can be used in a positive sense, such as envying someone who can google so well like Chloe: "Geesh, I can´t find this: I wish I had Chloogle to help me!".

But this means you have to either submit every post to a context analysis (good luck with the ensuing discussion!), or you simply delete all posts containing bashing terms defined in a list somewhere. If the latter, BDA should be included. It´s just a matter of consistency.

Not only good luck with the discussion, but good luck to the moderators!

[Black Panda]

I actually think theres a thread around that Craig started with all character nicknames and which ones are forbidden.
Does it make me a bad person that I think that sounds like a fun thread?

You will NOT call Lex armadillo pants, or 'dillo. You will NOT end every post with "Lex is Sex" but you may reference wanting to scale the wall around his pants... Good times.

[STFanatic]

Sorry Craig but I have to disagree! If you play some character and made a joke about it (and it was the only one time I heard Tom sad about Clark he is dumb and in „special“ situation), do you think it would be OK for any other were people saying some insulting things about this character too? I don’t think so. And it’s only my humble opinion, but I'm not convinced Tom thinks of Clark as BDA. I never get this „nickname“ for Clark. And I’m sure many people on KS don’t use this nickname as a joke (or a friendly nickname), but quite the contrary as an insult. And as a fan of Clark it offended me seeing someone saying about him he is dumb. Because I’m sorry, but I don’t think he is dumb! And he doesn’t deserve such an insulting nickname, ever!

That is the point, if you see ANY name/nickname you feel is being used improperly, report it.

[Lis]

That is the point, if you see ANY name/nickname you feel is being used improperly, report it. OK, I got it. But I'm afraid the first thing I had to report would be the sentence written below name of Clark Kent on Smallville Characters thread (The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!).:o I know you probably didn't mean it in a wrong way (and you can tell I'm overreacting), but it makes me sad every time I see it. I can't help but hate this nickname. :\

[SnowBird]

I know it ruffles feathers and the other mods probably are more for banning BDA too but I never saw what was so offensive about that one... especially when the "Spell" commentary had the actors saying how Tom would walk around the set going "Clark is so dumb!" BDA seems like something that points out how charming he is, just my opinion of course, whereas the other names usually involve bashing.

'Cause Clark is big... he has done some dumb things... and he is an alien... I don't know how it is a bash.

Oddly, that description for the Clark Kent character section has been up since the Character section was first launched... in 2003 or 2004, I think, and it's only been the past year that anyone's complained.

Clearly I don't want Tom/Clark fans to feel aggravated here, and they've got my PM address if they feel strongly about it... I just assure you that at least from my end, I think Big Dumb Alien is rather endearing, but, your mileage may vary. Ultimately, I want everyone to be happy here... though I know it's an often difficult task. Hopefully I was able to at least explain the BDA character description thing here.

Thanks for your reply on this topic. When I first saw your description for Clark Kent in the character section, I was shocked. I thought to myself that Clark was certainly being put down and I couldn't imagine a site dedicated to Smallville and Clark Kent would do such a thing. You may have your reasons but it is hidden from most of the Smallville fans.

I'm sorry but I just don't see it your way. I have never seen any post where I thought Clark Kent being referred to as a "BDA" as endearing. I certainly don't find "BDA" charming. If someone is using "BDA" as an endearing name, it isn't coming across this way to me and I certainly can't read anyone's mind so that I know it isn't a put down by the poster. Clark is big and he is an alien but he is not dumb or stupid. He is young and still learning but his intellegence should never be in question. People are using "BDA" as bashing and it shouldn't be ignored especially if other character nicknames are being banned. Please consider including "BDA" in your list of nicknames that should not be used.

Respectfully, SnowBird

[unfocused]

Thanks Craig,

It is a big turnoff to come to a general fan site and in every thread certain posts are continually baited and belittled. The general SPOILER and SPEC threads should at least be a place where you can come and get news and discuss the episode and not have to be subjected to a lot of belittling by people who are not interested in the storyline.
I agree, and I feel every forum here should not be a place where people are afraid to view for the chance of coming across a bunch of bashing to their favorite characters. As MBrittan once said, "all this negativity is disrupting my enjoyment of KryptonSite."


Thank you for the message, the show is supposed to be fun and so many people are just downright horrible about it
QFT


I'll be on my best behaviour from now on! ;)

Seriously, we appreciate the reminder and I do find it off putting to go into a thread where there is bashing. There has been several posters who are posting less and less or leaving the board altogether due to too many negative comments about ships, characters and actors so cheers for the reminder Craig.
I have to agree with this. People do leave because they feel insulted and disrespected and a general uncomfort when they constantly see bashing of their favorite character. On the flip side, I have actually seen bashers leave because of all the positivity they sometimes see! I'm guilty of some of this, actually. I don't want people to leave, but I really have to support my favorite show, when someone is unjustly knocking it, right?


I know it ruffles feathers and the other mods probably are more for banning BDA too but I never saw what was so offensive about that one... especially when the "Spell" commentary had the actors saying how Tom would walk around the set going "Clark is so dumb!" BDA seems like something that points out how charming he is, just my opinion of course, whereas the other names usually involve bashing.

'Cause Clark is big... he has done some dumb things... and he is an alien... I don't know how it is a bash.

Oddly, that description for the Clark Kent character section has been up since the Character section was first launched... in 2003 or 2004, I think, and it's only been the past year that anyone's complained.

Clearly I don't want Tom/Clark fans to feel aggravated here, and they've got my PM address if they feel strongly about it... I just assure you that at least from my end, I think Big Dumb Alien is rather endearing, but, your mileage may vary. Ultimately, I want everyone to be happy here... though I know it's an often difficult task. Hopefully I was able to at least explain the BDA character description thing here.
Thanks for explaining the way you feel about the term. To be honest, Craig, seeing you accept the term hit me hard. But now that you said why you like the term, I can understand. And I don't disagree with you, I am sure the term was created as a lighthearted, endearing nickname for the character, but it's meaning has changed so often in discussions. People use it when they are angry with Clark, to express their frustration for him. And they use it often in that context. Honestly, I have never seen the term used in the context that you have described above (although I have been a frequent visitor here for only a few months so I wasn't around when the term was used in a more innocent context). But again, I fully understand that the term was made to poke fun at the character, but it is sometimes used as an insult as well. And this is why I feel that it should join the ban list along with Chloogle, Lana Fu, and Nois.


I'll risk presenting my point of view about this one last time. For me, big dumb alien means exactly what it says: that Clark is big, dumb and an alien. There's a world of diffference between being dumb and doing dumb things from time to time. Everybody is doing dumb things from time to time. And I certainly couldn't complain in 2004 since I'm here since 2007. If there are more Clark fans in here than before, I thought it was a good thing for this site and that an effort could be made. I really fail to see why Chloogle is so much more of an insult than big dumb alien.
I have to agree with everything you said here. I never realized the term was used on a board description, if I had noticed it, I would have definitely sent Craig a message about it long ago.

I also agree that everyone does dumb things once in a while. Even every character on Smallville. But if we call Chloe "Little Dumb Blond," it would be an insult to her fans, even though the character has made dumb mistakes before, and she is most certainly blond, and one of the shortest people in the show. "LDB" is actually a very cute name :lol: I certainly think so, but I do understand that others may not.


Good point. Thanks for bringing this up. This particular name calling is offensive to this Clark fan.
ITA. It offends me as well.


I understand your point. But fact is that in the majority of posts BDA has come to be used to bash Clark, not to express some cute or endearing feature of his alien origin.

I am all for a new anti-bashing policy, but such a policy should be consistent. That´s all I ask for. :)
I ask for the same. Everyone's feelings should be considered.


That is the point, if you see ANY name/nickname you feel is being used improperly, report it.
Thanks. Will do :)

P.S. If "BDA" continues to be accepted here, can I continue to use "LDB?" Since Chloe is short, has made dumb mistakes, and is blond. (I'm actually serious, I do think LDB is really cute)

[Timester]

And this is why I feel that it should join the ban list along with Chloogle, Lana Fu, and Nois.

The problem wasn't Lana Fu, but Lana Fu Fang.

Lana Fu, like BDA, appeared on season 2, after Lex trained her in self-defense. It was never used to bash the Lana character. Even the Lana fans used it.

[llk6165]

Out of name I've heard hear, after thinking about it and in particular what they mean, BDA is the worse for me. Not because of the D - because I figure that goes to something someone does, but for the A because that refers to his heritage. It seems I've heard that phrase elsewhere, and I don't know if it was on the show or in some fan fic.

Also, I want everyone's honest opinion on this question. Am I being oversensitive about the phrase "cat fight meow." I am positive it was not used with any bad or hurtful intent. I am not asking for the phrase to be banned or any warnings to go out.

However, the phrase relates to an idea that a martial arts fight or any contest between females is something of less sporting value than a martial arts fight or sporting event between too men. It is hitting close to home for me, and usually I am thick-skinned. So if you think I am over reacting I would truly like your honest opinion.

[unfocused]

The problem wasn't Lana Fu, but Lana Fu Fang.

Lana Fu, like BDA, appeared on season 2, after Lex trained her in self-defense. It was never used to bash the Lana character. Even the Lana fans used it.
Alright then, "Lana Fang Fu." But if it's used NOW to bash the character, shouldn't it be banned?

The term "Rule of Thumb" was created under what most consider today as a derogatory idea to women, yet it's meaning has changed and it is used and accepted as a completely different, non-derogatory idea today.

When meanings begin to be used out of context, they change. And as meanings change, rules for them change as well. It's great that 4 years ago we all had endearing terms for Clark and Lana, but today those terms are being used to degrade those characters and bait fans. The rules for those meanings should change along with them.

[Clana Kent]

http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116524

Shouldn't that thread get a lock? It's solely used to bash Lana :confused:

It's the "2001 things better than lana's return thread"... Really not cool... :(

[Dustmite]

http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116524

Shouldn't that thread get a lock? It's solely used to bash Lana :confused:

It's the "2001 things better than lana's return thread"... Really not cool... :(

If there was a thread named 2001 things better then Lois' return, would people like that? I'm guessing not so I think you raise a valid point.

[llk6165]

there's lots of threads like that for every character.

[RedKRules]

http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116524

Shouldn't that thread get a lock? It's solely used to bash Lana :confused:

It's the "2001 things better than lana's return thread"... Really not cool... :(

I totally agree with you, which is the reason I never posted there, because I found it as well really really bashing ...

[Clana Kent]

If there was a thread named 2001 things better then Lois' return, would people like that? I'm guessing not so I think you raise a valid point.
Thanks for the encouragement ;) Any mods around? :D

[lauraforever]

Thank you, Craig buddy.

[Clana Kent]

there's lots of threads like that for every character.
Never seen any of those :confused: At least not as clear as this one, since the bashing already starts with its title! :\

[SnowBird]

http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116524

Shouldn't that thread get a lock? It's solely used to bash Lana :confused:

It's the "2001 things better than lana's return thread"... Really not cool... :(

Wow, I haven't visited the above thread before but decided to take a look and it is really bad. I can see your point. I'm surprised it was allowed to go on. I'm with you on this one.

[Kreukie]

Not sure how I missed this thread yesterday, but I want to say THANK YOU. And seriously have to quote Dustmite:



I personally feel the Clana bashing was way over the top and I've seen nothing like it to compare to the other ships. If I was feeling uncomfortable reading it, I can only imagine what fans of Lana felt like. It can't be pleasant to be faced with a barrage of posts and icons that are quite offensive especially when you're in the minority.

We don't like it and there's only a handful of us who are brave enough to put up with it. Thank you pointing that out. :)

[Firebunny]

If "BDA" continues to be accepted here, can I continue to use "LDB?" Since Chloe is short, has made dumb mistakes, and is blond. (I'm actually serious, I do think LDB is really cute)
Actually, among some Chlark fans Chloe is called "Tiny Blonde" or "His Tiny Blonde." RepairmanBob started it and it often refers to Clark's protective feelings towards Chloe. So the fact that Chloe is little and blonde is sometimes celebrated.

I would think for "LDB" not to be considered bashing it would have to be used only when Chloe is acting dumb, (for instance, when she talks about how Jimmy is perfect). Otherwise, if it's used all the time it suggests that Chloe is dumb all the time.

I feel the same way about BDA. I consider myself a Clark fan and BDA doesn't bother me. (I also don't use it myself.) There are times when I see it used and it's most definitately a term of endearment. There are also times when it's more in reference to specific things Clark's done and not Clark himself (e.g., "Clark is such a BDA in Recruit.") Yes, it is also used to bash, but that has more to do with the context of the post than it does with the term BDA. Bashing is more than just name calling.


Anyway, I wanted to join in and thank Craig for starting this thread. I feel like the tone of K-site has changed over the past year. It was starting to feel like certain sections of Smallville fandom weren't welcome here anymore. At least that's the message I got and I wasn't participating as much as I used to. Hopefully the tone will switch back.

[Fallen One]

I really want to speak on this topic, but I don't know how far the rope goes. And I don't trust that I can do it without somebody, somewhere getting offended over it. I've been observing the entire convo though. Good post Craig and if there is a problem I hope this thread can help nip it in the bud some.

[unfocused]

Not sure how I missed this thread yesterday, but I want to say THANK YOU. And seriously have to quote Dustmite:



We don't like it and there's only a handful of us who are brave enough to put up with it. Thank you pointing that out. :)

This makes me wonder how much more traffic KryptonSite would have if certain fandoms were more accepted by our members.

[Vindellavon]

Its what Erica Durance haters call Lois. Kind of like the people who don't like President Obama call him 'Nobama'. Its really stupid.

I have to disagree. Not everyone who uses the term "Nois" hates Erica Durance. They don't like her Lois, just like many fans do not like the character of SV!Lana Lang but enjoy Kristin. I don't like SV!Lois, but I love ED. It's how the characters are written and what they interpret from them is whree the bash comes from, not the actors and actresses themselves. They're inn for the job, we're in for the entertainment.

[unfocused]

Actually, among some Chlark fans Chloe is called "Tiny Blonde" or "His Tiny Blonde." RepairmanBob started it and it often refers to Clark's protective feelings towards Chloe. So the fact that Chloe is little and blonde is sometimes celebrated.
But if everyone began celebrating how dumb Chloe could be, then it can offend her fans.


I would think for "LDB" not to be considered bashing it would have to be used only when Chloe is acting dumb, (for instance, when she talks about how Jimmy is perfect). Otherwise, if it's used all the time it suggests that Chloe is dumb all the time.

I feel the same way about BDA. I consider myself a Clark fan and BDA doesn't bother me. (I also don't use it myself.) There are times when I see it used and it's most definitately a term of endearment. There are also times when it's more in reference to specific things Clark's done and not Clark himself (e.g., "Clark is such a BDA in Recruit.") Yes, it is also used to bash, but that has more to do with the context of the post than it does with the term BDA. Bashing is more than just name calling.
I see your point, thanks. What are your thoughts on someone calling Clark a BDA today, over something he did years ago? Because when people use the term, they are usually referring to something he's done in the past, yet they are using the insult to describe his current mental state.

[disciples of zod]

i think that we all needed this. i can't tell you how many times i've seen other posters bashing "ships," as they're called. and i'm sorry, but i'm calling some ppl out b/c Chimmy and Clana are popular picks.

i will definitely be more respectable towards those who appreciate and enjoy what Clana was, but to be honest, i expect some to be nicer to those who like Chimmy, like me!

sorry, i know i sound harsh, but seriously. we're all pretty mature, i think :)

~K

[SVsleuth]

Thanks, Craig. I always appreciate your attempts to keep things civil here, especially in the way Clana/Lana fans are treated. Most Clana/Lana fans have taken their conversations & fanfics to a more friendly site. A few of us still pop in here occasionally, & I have had some civil discussions with several fans of other ships who know how to have a discussion without bashing. But mostly, I pop in, leave a message for PS3, & run away, because I really don't want to get into arguements with other fans. I like the News page & the spoliers page, so always check for your updates. But my time spent on K-Site is far less than it used to be, & that is the same for most Clana fans. Thanks for trying, Craig.

[unfocused]

i think that we all needed this. i can't tell you how many times i've seen other posters bashing "ships," as they're called. and i'm sorry, but i'm calling some ppl out b/c Chimmy and Clana are popular picks.

i will definitely be more respectable towards those who appreciate and enjoy what Clana was, but to be honest, i expect some to be nicer to those who like Chimmy, like me!

sorry, i know i sound harsh, but seriously. we're all pretty mature, i think :)

~K

I don't call myself a shipper, although I do enjoy discussing them. But I don't root for any particular relationship for any personal reasons. I root for Clois because that's how the story goes, and I want the story to be great when it comes to that relationship. But I don't call myself a shipper because I don't indulge in any ships for personal reasons, I just take it as PS3 gives it and I allow myself to enjoy it.

From an unbiased perspective, Chimmy has been the most consistent, adorable, and reliable ship in the history of Smallville, compared to all other ships.

[BadToad]

But if you try to cut down on bashing, may I suggest including the BDA? I don´t see a difference between calling Clark a BDA and calling Lana Lana-Fu or Chloe Chloogle. Worse, in Clark´s case the bashing is sanctioned by Kryptonsite itself, for in the character forum it says: "Clark Kent. The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!" It would set a good example to remove this. Bashing protection should not just apply to the girls but to every character. Thanks!

I'm going to echo this sentiment. I've tried to bring this subject up many times, and it seems to just get brushed off. I'm all for keeping derogatory names for the characters off the board. But it should be all or nothing, otherwise its just unfair. I have never had anyone explain to me why derogatory names for the female characteres are not allowed (except EDLois, for some reason), but its OK to do to Clark.

Just my 2 cents on the subject.


'Cause Clark is big... he has done some dumb things... and he is an alien... I don't know how it is a bash.

I respect your opinion Craig, but using that as a guide, calling Chloe "Chloogle" is also fairly accurate, yet its banned. Calling Lana "pink princess" could also be justified by the context of the show, and yet I'm not sure Lana fans would be fond of it.

I don't think you can apply one standard for one character, and another standard for other characters. I have honestly never, ever posted in the Clark character thread because the description for the forum is what it is. Its been my personal way of protesting. It does bother this Clark fan.

[LoveHurts38]

http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116524

Shouldn't that thread get a lock? It's solely used to bash Lana :confused:

It's the "2001 things better than lana's return thread"... Really not cool... :(

I saw the thread but, did not bother.

[WickedJenn]

This post of Craig's is so important.

I (and I'd guess the other mods as well) want for people of all different views and preferences to feel comfortable posting here.

We all know that not everyone will agree on everything, and there's a way to disagree with someone without flaming/insulting them and/or their opinion.

I've seen many a good discussion take place on here where even though there were differing viewpoints, people were respectful of each others' opinions. It's nice to see that people can disagree and still have a civilized discussion.

Everybody has their characters, 'ships, episodes, what have you that they like and don't like, but as I see it, there's a way to vocalize either side of that without causing arguments. An example of something I see fairly often is the term "haters" used for those who don't like a particular character/ship/episode, etc. I feel it an unnecessary term and just because posters don't like whatever it is, doesn't mean they're "haters", they just have an opposing viewpoint.

In any event, I hope this brings a bit of a refresh for the board.

Happy posting :)

[redkryptoniteisthebest]

I just hope this gets peoples' attention. Just because you don't like a character doesn't mean you should bash them to the extreme. Its not right, IMO.

[Wicked Lois]

What is Nois?

[petitemimi]

^^"Not Lois" for those who believes in the Chlois theory.

[Clana Kent]

I just went to "General Smallville Discussion" and I saw that the "2001 Things better than Lana's return"-thread has been moved... It's not even possible (for me) to access it anymore. :)
I guess we've been heard :D

[Wicked Lois]

I think the 2001 Things better than Lana's return"-thread is not a bash thread... since states an opinion. It's not like people call her name and say bad things. "The K-site is better than Lana's return". Anyway, I do agree that it might hurt someone who likes her. Anyway, it's impossible to please everyone. Saying I don't like Lana, I don't like Lois is not bashing.

And I just have to say this: People act like they don't bash other people here. And this goes to everyone, both ways: if you respect someone, someone will respect you back. But you can't pretend or fake it.

[Smallville6]

Thanks so much for posting this Craig- It really needed to be said!
I left Kryptonsite for awhile because I love all characters and dont think any ships are bad and got tired of the constant Lois bashing by soooo many people and chlark bashing by other Cloisers, and now it seems everyone bashes Lana/Clana. I hate it cause I love all of them :\

I'll have to agree though with everyone who thinks BDA is considered baching. I cant stand it when people use that term and even wosrt it's on the character description for Clark.

[unfocused]

I'm glad the admins and moderators are considering our opinions :) Now let's hope fans of other characters get the same treatment.

[Jill]

Agreed.

Thank you Craig.

[Storm45]

Thanks, Craig.

I'll add the terms ''Chloe's cousin'', ''Jimmy's wife'' and ''Lois cousin'' as bashing terms. These way of calling a character by her relationship with another character is not a way to state a fact. Its a way to belittle that character.

[pizzahead2490]

some terms are not meant for bashing in my opinion....

[unfocused]

That is very true. But some people still use some terms for bashing.

[wolverine316]

Oh Chloogle is completely offensive. I may be a bigger Lois fan than Chloe, but i like Chloe and i despise that phrase, its horrible.

I guess we can agree to disagree. We all have certain ideas or feelings on how terms are used. For me for the past several years Chloe was Clark's asset to anything on the world wide web so Chloogle kind of fits. I don't see how I offended Chloe with that statement. But calling Clark an idiot with "BDA" that is just difficult to swallow. Great conversation with the thread though.

[Vergon6]

Thanks, Craig.

I'll add the terms ''Chloe's cousin'', ''Jimmy's wife'' and ''Lois cousin'' as bashing terms. These way of calling a character by her relationship with another character is not a way to state a fact. Its a way to belittle that character.
I may get eggs thrown at me for this one, but along with these ones, I would like to add 'EDC' (meaning Erica Durance's character). I've seen this used on a specific thread to refer to Lois as if it's fate worse then death to refer to Lois by her name. No other characters are referred to with this nomenclature, so Lois should be no different.

[pizzahead2490]

choogle is like what? chole being smart... how is that offensive?

[Vergon6]

choogle is like what? chole being smart... how is that offensive?
It's meant as derogatory term to imply the Chloe's only function on the show is to be Clark's personal search engine. While it's true that she is used for exposition and Clark comes to her a lot, that is not her only function on the show. It is unfair to the character.

[Clana Kent]

Thanks so much for posting this Craig- It really needed to be said!
I left Kryptonsite for awhile because I love all characters and dont think any ships are bad and got tired of the constant Lois bashing by soooo many people and chlark bashing by other Cloisers, and now it seems everyone bashes Lana/Clana. I hate it cause I love all of them :\

I'll have to agree though with everyone who thinks BDA is considered baching. I cant stand it when people use that term and even wosrt it's on the character description for Clark.
At first, I liked all characters as well... But since people (mostly Cloisers (sorry for non-bashing Cloisers)) started bashing Lana and Clana, I started looking at Lois in another way. I admit that I actually started to hate her...

It's absurd that is could come this far! That people start hating characters, because other people start bashing your favorite characters... If this continues here during the following episodes Power and Requiem, I'm not sure if I'd be willing to stay here on these boards any longer. (Especially if Lana would return for the series finale. That would really make a lot of people angy I think..) It might be best if I just ignored the Lana-haters :( But it's just not that easy..

The worst thing about this is that people know that they're bashing, they know it's not allowed, they know they hate it is their favorite characters are bashed and still the continue...

I think I better go before I say something that might get me banned... :\ (No sarcasm or so intended ;))

[Supsfan]

I personally don't get the use of EDLois, it's sort of a tamer version of Nois but if somebody is in an episode thread and they taking about Lois, I am pretty sure most people will get the idea that you talking about the Lois Lane on Smallville. To put the ED in front of it is sort of insulting, unless you start putting initials infront of all the other comic book characters on the show(KKLana, TWClark, AAJimmy, MRLex, etc) when you post(that or actually mentioning more then one version of Lois in that post)

[Loisdragon]

I personally don't get the use of EDLois, it's sort of a tamer version of Nois but if somebody is in an episode thread and they taking about Lois, I am pretty sure most people will get the idea that you talking about the Lois Lane on Smallville. To put the ED in front of it is sort of insulting, unless you start putting initials infront of all the other comic book characters on the show(KKLana, TWClark, AAJimmy, MRLex, etc) when you post(that or actually mentioning more then one version of Lois in that post)
Agreed

[pizzahead2490]

we cant say BDA anymore?

[Vergon6]

I personally don't get the use of EDLois, it's sort of a tamer version of Nois but if somebody is in an episode thread and they taking about Lois, I am pretty sure most people will get the idea that you talking about the Lois Lane on Smallville. To put the ED in front of it is sort of insulting, unless you start putting initials infront of all the other comic book characters on the show(KKLana, TWClark, AAJimmy, MRLex, etc) when you post(that or actually mentioning more then one version of Lois in that post)
That's how I see it too. The context of discussing different Lois Lanes is needed to use the term EDLois in a non-derogatory way.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


we cant say BDA anymore?
Craig said that people are still allowed to use that term. I'm not going to. I think I used it once. But to each their own.

[Wicked Lois]

*rolling my eyes in the verge of going blind.

Does anyone know Mary Magdalena's story from the Bibble? Thanking Craig for the warning when some people should start looking at their own actions and stopping the bashing themselves?

The not bashing is a simple rule, and most of people seem to forget about it. Yes, it's remarkable to state that this is not cool. But please...

I do bash some charcaters sometimes, so I won't be hyprocrite to say that I am hurt because people bash my ship and whatever. And I don't think the bashing will stop because Craig's warning. Like every change of habit, you need some kind of educational campaign that would remind you that what you are doing it not ok - like the free to be green cw's campaign - otherwise the mods will have to erase every single thread and ban almost everyone here.

And take this as a tip, stop celebrating people getting posts erased or being banned and do your won stuff.

[ginevrakent]

I personally would prefer if everyone would stop calling Lois an alcoholic or a drunk. She's gotten drunk twice on the show (Recruit and Committed). I have studied substance abuse as a grad student in counseling. By any definition available, Lois is not an alcoholic. She also does not use alcohol as her only coping mechanism. She eats ice cream, talks to friends, or buries herself in work. So, I would appreciate it if we could avoid this particular derogatory term in the future.

[Kalista]

I think this thread is great but I hope it doesn't become a tool for any personal agendas.

[pizzahead2490]

all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth:rolleyes:

[Vergon6]

I personally would prefer if everyone would stop calling Lois an alcoholic or a drunk. She's gotten drunk twice on the show (Recruit and Committed). I have studied substance abuse as a grad student in counseling. By any definition available, Lois is not an alcoholic. She also does not use alcohol as her only coping mechanism. She eats ice cream, talks to friends, or buries herself in work. So, I would appreciate it if we could avoid this particular derogatory term in the future.
Yeah. I mean Lois can drink in excess but you don't hear about her either being drunk every night in each episode or going on drinking binges every weekend.

I'm actually taking a substance abuse class myself in grad school right now, and I have personal experience with family that are alcoholics.

----- Added 2 Minutes later -----


all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth:rolleyes:
1984 is my favorite book and I think that is overstating things a bit. Although we do have to be careful not to go too overboard.

[Dustmite]

I think the 2001 Things better than Lana's return"-thread is not a bash thread... since states an opinion.

Would you be fine with a 2001 Things better then Lois' s return thread?


all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth

You can still say what you like/dislike/want/don't want. This is still the most open place for fans of all characters on Smallville and the mods are only trying to ensure it stays that way.

[mistaguitarmasta]

Thanks Craig. This was much needed.

[Vergon6]

I was a bit surprised that 2001 Things Better thread was even created. I mean, I can understand people not liking that Lana was returning, but I thought that was a bit over the top to create a thread like that.

[pizzahead2490]

what some people consider offensive others do not

[petitemimi]

we cant say BDA anymore?

Unfortunately yes. It seems, from what I could understand, that the word dumb changes meaning depending on the context. It's also been suggested to report it if used in a bashing way; and that's what I'm going to do from now on.

[Dustmite]

what some people consider offensive others do not

And the rules state what is and what isn't so it's ultimately up to the mods.

[Wicked Lois]

Would you be fine with a 2001 Things better then Lois' s return thread?



You can still say what you like/dislike/want/don't want. This is still the most open place for fans of all characters on Smallville and the mods are only trying to ensure it stays that way.

You might think this is funny, but if its okay to have a Lana's one... =];) And just to state, that thread was watched really close.

[ginevrakent]

Would you be fine with a 2001 Things better then Lois' s return thread?

I hadn't heard of that thread about Lana until reading about it here. Now that I know it exists, I really don't like the idea precisely because I would find a similar thread for Lois hurtful. I think sometimes it would be better if we supported the character or ships we like by simply being positive about them, rather than going out of our way to attacking things we dislike. I think a little empathy goes along way, and hopefully this thread will open some eyes to its value.

[pizzahead2490]

You might think this is funny, but if its okay to have a Lana's one... =];) And just to state, that thread was watched really close.

it was watched really close by a mod and they didnt find it offensive until what now???? look what number its reached in that thread and how many pages has passed.

[KSiteTV]

The generic term BDA refers to him as being constantly dumb and defines him on this site.

There's a difference with this defining term and saying "Clark was being dumb here", when it refers to one thing he has done, as opposed to being constantly dumb.

No one explained yet why Chloogle is bashing, when compared to BDA. Anyone care for an explaination?

I made a whole post - maybe even two - explaining that this morning.

----- Added 38 Seconds later -----


Some of you will probably think I am insenstivie, but Nois is considered offensive? I just interpreted it to mean a vote of no to the Clois ship, just with a bit of snark and creativity. Clois, by the way is the ship I sail..

Nois bashes Erica Durance herself because it implies she is "not Lois."

[Timester]

all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth:rolleyes:

Eurasia as always been at war with Eastasia.

There is no such thing as Freedom of Speech on a private forum. Only the speech permitted by each forum rules. And honestly, K-Site is the most free Smallville forum around. So, don't try to twist this in your favor.

[pizzahead2490]

*rolling my eyes in the verge of going blind.


I do bash some charcaters sometimes, so I won't be hyprocrite to say that I am hurt because people bash my ship and whatever. And I don't think the bashing will stop because Craig's warning. Like every change of habit, you need some kind of educational campaign that would remind you that what you are doing it not ok - like the free to be green cw's campaign - otherwise the mods will have to erase every single thread and ban almost everyone here.

And take this as a tip, stop celebrating people getting posts erased or being banned and do your won stuff.

ITA

[Dustmite]

You might think this is funny, but if its okay to have a Lana's one... =];) And just to state, that thread was watched really close.

:\ I'm thinking a Lois one similar to that would get reported and closed down a lot sooner then the Lana one. I know if there was a Chloe one like that, I would have complained about it.

And if it was watched, it should have been closed because bashing of a character is against the rules at Ksite.


it was watched really close by a mod and they didnt find it offensive until what now???? look what number its reached in that thread and how many pages has passed.

And you don't think that's intimidating to people who actually like Lana. Just because it's popular doesn't make it right.


I hadn't heard of that thread about Lana until reading about it here. Now that I know it exists, I really don't like the idea precisely because I would find a similar thread for Lois hurtful. I think sometimes it would be better if we supported the character or ships we like by simply being positive about them, rather than going out of our way to attacking things we dislike. I think a little empathy goes along way, and hopefully this thread will open some eyes to its value.

Agreed.

[KSiteTV]

Let me repeat it: it´s all about consistency. An anti-bashing policy simply cannot look like this:

1) It is forbidden to bash character A.
2) It is forbidden to bash character B.
3) It is allowed to bash character C.
4) It is forbidden to bash character D.

Using certain terms is of course a matter of context. BDA may be meant to be cute. Lana-Fu may be used to admire the character´s martial arts performance. Even Chloogle can be used in a positive sense, such as envying someone who can google so well like Chloe: "Geesh, I can´t find this: I wish I had Chloogle to help me!".

But this means you have to either submit every post to a context analysis (good luck with the ensuing discussion!), or you simply delete all posts containing bashing terms defined in a list somewhere. If the latter, BDA should be included. It´s just a matter of consistency.

We also get to a point where oversensitivity gets ridiculous.

I guess I'm really uncomfortable with having to give up terms used from the very beginning that were never intended to bait some other fan group around here. It's like, too much censorship is too much. The names intended to bait other people are bad, whereas names like BDA or even The MB (for Lionel Luthor) are names that even the actors themselves would laugh and agree with.

I just seriously don't think BDA is anything but affectionate. But that's just my opinion, and I will listen to all opinions, I just don't happen to agree.

----- Added 44 Seconds later -----


Same here... and I'm sorry.

So, Craig, are we getting a new character bashing rule to go along with our ship bashing rule? Because that would be great. It seems we have one for Lana now :)

We've had unofficial name rules where people have gotten warnings for things like Nois, etc. for a while now.

[Jaderoyale]

Nois bashes Erica Durance herself because it implies she is "not Lois."

While we're on this bashing Erica Durance idea, i don't know how many people out there find EDLois offensive. But i do.
It can be used in completely different contexts. As implying her as simply Erica Durance as Lois or just a term to disregard her from all the other Lois actresses out there.
Yes, sometimes we get a MKLois (Margot Kidder) or THLois thrown in there occasionally, but not as much as the whole EDLois thing.

[KSiteTV]

OK, I got it. But I'm afraid the first thing I had to report would be the sentence written below name of Clark Kent on Smallville Characters thread (The Big Dumb Alien and future Superman. Talk about the character of Clark Kent here!).:o I know you probably didn't mean it in a wrong way (and you can tell I'm overreacting), but it makes me sad every time I see it. I can't help but hate this nickname. :\

And I feel a little hurt and slightly offended that something I set up on the site FIVE YEARS AGO ruffles your feathers. It's as if my own personal sense of humor on my own website is not welcome.

[pizzahead2490]

:\ I'm thinking a Lois one similar to that would get reported and closed down a lot sooner then the Lana one. I know if there was a Chloe one like that, I would have complained about it.




i do not think it was meant for bashing, it was mainly opinions about what we "think" would be better than her return. we were not gathered there to say how much we hate lana and have meetings about diff ways we can get rid off her it was just meant provide reason about another solution that would be better than her return. i am not denying tho that thread was meant for fun.

[Kalista]

We also get to a point where oversensitivity gets ridiculous.

I completely agree.

[Jaderoyale]

I keep trying to post and it won't let me :(


ETA; Okay it did.
I can't remember what i was trying to say now.



i do not think it was meant for bashing, it was mainly opinions about what we "think" would be better than her return. we were not gathered there to say how much we hate lana and have meetings about diff ways we can get rid off her it was just meant provide reason about another solution that would be better than her return. i am not denying tho that thread was meant for fun.

The whole problem here about the Lana return thread is, yes, it can be seen as offensive, but it was being watched closely by some of the moderators so things were not said that would offend people.
I do understand though how it can be percieved as wrong and i personally wouldn't like a thread entitled "2001 things better than Lois' return" - so i understand why people did not like that thread as a whole.

[KSiteTV]

Thanks, Craig.

I'll add the terms ''Chloe's cousin'', ''Jimmy's wife'' and ''Lois cousin'' as bashing terms. These way of calling a character by her relationship with another character is not a way to state a fact. Its a way to belittle that character.

If it's used in a way to belittle the character, it's bad, but again we're edging on the ridiculous to ban such terms. Since Lois is Chloe's cousin, Chloe is Lois's cousin, and yes, Chloe is Jimmy's wife. That's not going to change unless there is a divorce or an annulment or we find out they're not really cousins.

The point of the original post here was to get people to not bash or bait other posters. I don't want posters to feel they're walking on egg shells either if they happen to say "Chloe is Lois's cousin" or say they don't like something. My point was that people were purposely mocking for the sole reason of infuriating others. That's what needs to stop.

[Kalista]

And I feel a little hurt and slightly offended that something I set up on the site FIVE YEARS AGO ruffles your feathers. It's as if my own personal sense of humor on my own website is not welcome.


I've heard some say that if they knew Tom was okay with the term BDA, then they would be okay with it too. So, if he laughs about it, I don't see a problem with it either.

But as I mentioned earlier, I hope that people don't use this discussion a means to censor or squash any and all discussion of canon events on the show for personal reasons.

[KSiteTV]

all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth:rolleyes:

No, but you will get a forum warning for purposely being a jerk :)

[Timester]

i do not think it was meant for bashing, it was mainly opinions about what we "think" would be better than her return. we were not gathered there to say how much we hate lana and have meetings about diff ways we can get rid off her it was just meant provide reason about another solution that would be better than her return. i am not denying tho that thread was meant for fun.

It calls flame wars, being for fun or not.

This remind me one thing that Al Gough once said, that the idea of Level 33.1 was "too comic booky". It was the outrage on the day we got that interview (I was one of the top detractors of that statement) and 2 years later, that reintroduced Level 33.1 in the show, like they were forced to.

Al Gough might not wanted to insult the fans of the show with that (there was times he did), but he had the tact of a elephant on a china show. Which is the same has some titles or names around, used to belittle the fans, not the characters.

[Vergon6]

If it's used in a way to belittle the character, it's bad, but again we're edging on the ridiculous to ban such terms. Since Lois is Chloe's cousin, Chloe is Lois's cousin, and yes, Chloe is Jimmy's wife. That's not going to change unless there is a divorce or an annulment or we find out they're not really cousins.

The point of the original post here was to get people to not bash or bait other posters. I don't want posters to feel they're walking on egg shells either if they happen to say "Chloe is Lois's cousin" or say they don't like something. My point was that people were purposely mocking for the sole reason of infuriating others. That's what needs to stop.
That's true. So you can't outright ban those terms. But I will say that terms like Jimmy's wife and Lois' cousin were a misguided attempt by some posters to react to others intent on referring to Lois as anything but Lois (Nois, EDLois, EDC, Chloe's cousin). Two wrongs don't make a right of course.

[pizzahead2490]

It calls flame wars, being for fun or not.



your opinoin. not a war unless some one comes on to fight and no one did.

[unfocused]

all i know is i feel like ksite has become the book 1984 and FREEDOM of speech is becoming lesser and lesser. as i am sure my post will prob get deleted for speaking the truth:rolleyes:
This isn't about Freedom of Speech, it's about respecting people here.


what some people consider offensive others do not
So we should just neglect the offended group because some of us don't take offense? The point is that someone might use a term to be offending with it, regardless of the circumstances in which that term was developed. And a term with words such as "dumb" can be easily used to offend. "Chloogle" is offensive because it degrades Chloe's importance on this show, when she is obviously very important.


Unfortunately yes. It seems, from what I could understand, that the word dumb changes meaning depending on the context. It's also been suggested to report it if used in a bashing way; and that's what I'm going to do from now on.
I don't see how this is fair. I am still insulted by "BDA," even though "Nois" and "Lana Fu Fang" don't bother me (I'm still a fan of those characters to). And yet, those words are banned but the word that actually offends me is not...


it was watched really close by a mod and they didnt find it offensive until what now???? look what number its reached in that thread and how many pages has passed.
The moderators didn't find it offensive at all. BUT they found out, by this thread, that many members did in fact find it very offensive, and so closed it/ or deleted it. This is why the moderators encourage reporting. Because they may not see something as offending, yet others do. I am a huge fan of Fallen One, and I respect him a lot, but I did find that Lana thread offensive, so I never once opened it, even though I saw it there and saw how many posts it was getting.

Craig, it's clear that many members here find "BDA" offensive, along with many other terms. And I think it's unfair to our members to ban a term that offends a selected group, but not ban a different term that offends another selected group.

[Timester]

your opinoin. not a war unless some one comes on to fight and no one did.

It's not my opinion, it what happens, even when it's not on purpose. There are always people on the other side that doesn't like seeing their character being "bashed" without a real fundament. And some of those will defend the character.

[pizzahead2490]

i am not offended by BDA

[Vergon6]

I haven't been a very big fan of Lana in the past couple of years (but I wouldn't say that I hate the character), but I find the whole Lana Fu Fang offensive. Both because I think it's a childish term and I can empathize with Lana fans.

[THE"Lurker"]

Wow this fiesta is getting heated:cool:

[Timester]

I don't see how this is fair. I am still insulted by "BDA," even though "Nois" and "Lana Fu Fang" don't bother me (I'm still a fan of those characters to). And yet, those words are banned but the word that actually offends me is not...

Different backgrounds. "Nois" was created to insult Erica Durance, it means that she is "Not Lois".

"Lana Fu Fang" is the overboard example of a joke going extreme.

"BDA" Craig already explained. The term is old as Smallville itself.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


I haven't been a very big fan of Lana in the past couple of years (but I wouldn't say that I hate the character), but I find the whole Lana Fu Fang offensive. Both because I think it's a childish term and I can empathize with Lana fans.

To be honest, it were the Lana fans that came up with the "Lana Fu", 6 years ago. The "Fang" only appeared last thursday.

[Storm45]

That's true. So you can't outright ban those terms. But I will say that terms like Jimmy's wife and Lois' cousin were a misguided attempt by some posters to react to others intent on referring to Lois as anything but Lois (Nois, EDLois, EDC, Chloe's cousin). Two wrongs don't make a right of course.

That's what I meant. These terms are sometimes not used to state a fact. They are simply used to take jab at other posters. I've seen it and I don,t think I'm overreacting when I point this out. Of course, I'm not asking for total censure of those words. But it's obvious to me to see the difference between stating the fact and using this fact to attack.

Whatever, its at your discretion.

[BadToad]

I've heard some say that if they knew Tom was okay with the term BDA, then they would be okay with it too. So, if he laughs about it, I don't see a problem with it either.

OK, so if someone can ask Tom, and he says he's OK with it, then I will be too....

And what are the chances of that happening?

I honestly believe that it was originally meant as an affectionate term, and a fun joke. But unfortunately, that was then, and this is now, and I think the fandom isn't quite the same. Its a fandom that has a lot more rancor and hostility in it. And no one wants to see it being OK for their favorite character to be called a name, while other characters are given protection against that.

If Tom signs off on it? Great. But Tom isn't likely to be heard from anytime soon, and so its just a guess as to what he'd think. IMO

[battlecat403@yahoo.com]

In short, it's a term that bashes EdLois or SV!Lois. It's offensive to SV!Lois fans, just like Chloogle is offensive to Chloe fans. For further explanation, I sent you a PM.
This terms seems to be used frequently because it can be passed off as non-offensive. However, the majority of Lois fans despise the term. In fact, I've never met one fan that is okay with the term. The reason is that the term is never used appropriately. When it is used, other canon characters in the same posts do not receive the initials of the actors. Only Lois does. So you get something like this, "EDLois shouldn't be with Clark. He should be with Lana." That's just an example. But see, why is it necessary to have ED there when you do not have TWClark or KKLana?

It's a very subtle form of bashing, but it's bashing nonetheless.



Wrong. BDA refers to him as "how dumb Clark can be sometimes".
Yes, "sometimes" being the operative word. This is one of my favorite terms of endearment for Clark Kent and I think we are being overly sensitive if something like this gets banned. BDA has been primarily used as an affectionate term, and it's only occassionally misused when people get flared up and upset at Clark. But that doesn't mean we should ban the term.

Censoring a few terms is good, but please let's not go over board.

[Timester]

That's what I meant. These terms are sometimes not used to state a fact. They are simply used to take jab at other posters. I've seen it and I don,t think I'm overreacting when I point this out. I'm not aksking for total censure of those words. But it obvious to me to see the difference between stating the fact and using this fact to attack.

Whatever, its at your discretion.

We have to be honest and remind why such terms came to the play. Because some people simply refused to stop bashing Lois' name on the Chlois thread, even when the mods asked to.

But I do agree with Vergon6, two wrongs don't make a right of course.

[pizzahead2490]

.



Yes, "sometimes" being the operative word. This is one of my favorite terms of endearment for Clark Kent and I think we are being overly sensitive if something like this gets banned. BDA has been primarily used as an affectionate term, and it's only occassionally misused when people get flared up and upset at Clark. But that doesn't mean we should ban the term.

Censoring a few terms is good, but please let's not go over board.

ITA and its not like we call clark a BDA all the time. i assume most people who watch this show likes clark and when they say BDA its only cuz of something he did or did not do.

[Jaderoyale]

That's true. So you can't outright ban those terms. But I will say that terms like Jimmy's wife and Lois' cousin were a misguided attempt by some posters to react to others intent on referring to Lois as anything but Lois (Nois, EDLois, EDC, Chloe's cousin). Two wrongs don't make a right of course.

Thank heavens someone else has mentioned EDLois there.

[Storm45]

We have to be honest and remind why such terms came to the play. Because some people simply refused to stop bashing Lois' name on the Chlois thread, even when the mods asked to.

But I do agree with Vergon6, two wrongs don't make a right of course.

I know, I also pointed at the ''Lois cousin'' term to. But all this will likely continue, so I'll stop at that.

[Wicked Lois]

I used EDLois many times... as THLois...KBLois.... I never thought it was offensive... anyway... it really depends on the context.

[Jaderoyale]

OK, so if someone can ask Tom, and he says he's OK with it, then I will be too....

And what are the chances of that happening?

I honestly believe that it was originally meant as an affectionate term, and a fun joke. But unfortunately, that was then, and this is now, and I think the fandom isn't quite the same. Its a fandom that has a lot more rancor and hostility in it. And no one wants to see it being OK for their favorite character to be called a name, while other characters are given protection against that.

If Tom signs off on it? Great. But Tom isn't likely to be heard from anytime soon, and so its just a guess as to what he'd think. IMO

I think in the earlier seasons TW might have definetely agreed to Clark being called the BDA or such :)
Not so much now, as he's growing up.

But i agree with the majority. I'm not personally offended by the term BDA. Its just another one of those terms that can sadly be taken out of context within a post and be used as good AND bad.

[unfocused]

OK, so if someone can ask Tom, and he says he's OK with it, then I will be too....

And what are the chances of that happening?

I honestly believe that it was originally meant as an affectionate term, and a fun joke. But unfortunately, that was then, and this is now, and I think the fandom isn't quite the same. Its a fandom that has a lot more rancor and hostility in it. And no one wants to see it being OK for their favorite character to be called a name, while other characters are given protection against that.

If Tom signs off on it? Great. But Tom isn't likely to be heard from anytime soon, and so its just a guess as to what he'd think. IMO

I agree, of course. I am happy that the term was used endearingly years ago, and even today. But I've had it used on me in an insulting manner, directly to bait me and offend me. I was not here on KSite five years ago (most of us weren't), so I apologize for not seeing the humor in it. Although I do respect other people in that "BDA" does not offend them, I just can't say the same for myself.

[Jaderoyale]

I used EDLois many times... as THLois...KBLois.... I never thought it was offensive... anyway... it really depends on the context.

Its always the conext in which a phrase becomes offensive. In the beginning EDLois weas used to seperate Erica Durance from the other actresses who have played Lois.
But the term has been used badly and in topics of debate ever since.

[Kreukie]

Do you guys have examples of that being used as greatly as say BDA? Which I personally never cared for, I also don't like Lana Fu, something that meant to be used for fun was then turned around and used to make fun of Lana. I hardly if ever see Lana fans use to it be competely honest, after it got turned and tainted into something negative towards Lana.

[THE"Lurker"]

I know, I also pointed at the ''Lois cousin'' term to. But all this will likely continue, so I'll stop at that.

LoL thats SmallvillePolitics for ya:cool:

[pizzahead2490]

I used EDLois many times... as THLois...KBLois.... I never thought it was offensive... anyway... it really depends on the context.

i also thinks it depends on the way this is used. i use this term when i want to sat the diff or the similarites that the other actress who play lois. i do agree that some use this term only to make the fans offended but some do not. i honestly dont think the term should be banned all togeter.

it all depends on the context on which its used. and if its used in a negative way then maybe that poster should get a warning or soforth.

[Timester]

But i agree with the majority. I'm not personally offended by the term BDA. Its just another one of those terms that can sadly be taken out of context within a post and be used as good AND bad.

Yep. I do cringe when I see "Clark is a BDA for not being with insert female character here". But when Clark really does a dumb thing? I call him BDA myself, and not in a offensive way.

I called Lionel MB all the time and I consider "Bastard" worst than "Dumb" myself.

Which is completelly different than the other terms, which were created with the sole purposes of bashing in the first place.

[ledzepfan23]

what does MB stand for in regards to lionel?

[Timester]

Do you guys have examples of that being used as greatly as say BDA? Which I personally never cared for, I also don't like Lana Fu, something that meant to be used for fun was then turned around and used to make fun of Lana. I hardly if ever see Lana fans use to it be competely honest, after it got turned and tainted into something negative towards Lana.

Keyword: after.

Which was just this week. Before? It was a fun way of telling Lana was fighting. Do you remember about the "Isobel doing the Lana-Fu"?

----- Added 30 Seconds later -----


what does MB stand for in regards to lionel?

Magnificent Bastard.

[Jaderoyale]

Yep. I do cringe when I see "Clark is a BDA for not <insert female character here>". But when Clark really does a dumb thing? I call him BDA myself, and not in a offensive way.

I called Lionel MB and the time and I consider "Bastard" worst than "Dumb" myself.

Which is completelly different than the other terms, which were created with the sole purposes of bashing in the first place.

Exactly. I always used the term MB. Basically because it was "Magnificent Bastard", referring to Lionel as magnificent etc etc, but yes the term "Bastard" is much worse than "Dumb". But in a sense the term MB was never used in a different context as BDA is.

To be totally honest it all depends on what fan groups of a certain character find offensive and what we can all agree on. Which is pointless, because with that happening we probably wouldn't have shipper names or anything :\

[cksidekick]

You can still say what you like/dislike/want/don't want. This is still the most open place for fans of all characters on Smallville and the mods are only trying to ensure it stays that way.

and it's the rules that are enforced around here that make such an open and welcoming place possible...


There is no such thing as Freedom of Speech on a private forum. Only the speech permitted by each forum rules. And honestly, K-Site is the most free Smallville forum around.

just wanted to post that statement again...




We also get to a point where oversensitivity gets ridiculous.

I just seriously don't think BDA is anything but affectionate. But that's just my opinion, and I will listen to all opinions, I just don't happen to agree.



i agree...i like to think that most anyone around here who decides to get really petty about this sort of thing would eventualy find themselves getting warned or banned for one reason or another anyway...when a "movement" starts affecting a group of fans at this sort of level, IMO, you handle it in exactly the way it has been handled...


This isn't about Freedom of Speech, it's about respecting people here.


So we should just neglect the offended group because some of us don't take offense? The point is that someone might use a term to be offending with it, regardless of the circumstances in which that term was developed. And a term with words such as "dumb" can be easily used to offend. "Chloogle" is offensive because it degrades Chloe's importance on this show, when she is obviously very important.


I don't see how this is fair. I am still insulted by "BDA," even though "Nois" and "Lana Fu Fang" don't bother me (I'm still a fan of those characters to). And yet, those words are banned but the word that actually offends me is not...


The moderators didn't find it offensive at all. BUT they found out, by this thread, that many members did in fact find it very offensive, and so closed it/ or deleted it. This is why the moderators encourage reporting. Because they may not see something as offending, yet others do. I am a huge fan of Fallen One, and I respect him a lot, but I did find that Lana thread offensive, so I never once opened it, even though I saw it there and saw how many posts it was getting.

Craig, it's clear that many members here find "BDA" offensive, along with many other terms. And I think it's unfair to our members to ban a term that offends a selected group, but not ban a different term that offends another selected group.


i don't mind any of these terms...i could use BDA and really mean that, ïn general, Clark is a BDA...but i'm as big a Clark fan as anyone...i can also bash the character severely without ever typing one of the forbidden words on a list...

as i stated above, i think anyone actualy posting in order to be offensive to a particular fan group are likely to run head first into a Mod anyway...when it comes to a group who started out in fun, or in malice, a public announcement to cease and decist should be sufficient, at least for anyone who actualy cares about the atmosphere, reputation, or downright hospitality of this webside...JMO...:)

[Timester]

Exactly. I always used the term MB. Basically because it was "Magnificent Bastard", referring to Lionel as magnificent etc etc, but yes the term "Bastard" is much worse than "Dumb". But in a sense the term MB was never used in a different context as BDA is.

To be totally honest it all depends on what fan groups of a certain character find offensive and what we can all agree on. Which is pointless, because with that happening we probably wouldn't have shipper names or anything :\

It's all about abuse and sensitivity.

I called Lana "Lana Small" for years, yet people understood that it wasn't for bashing, but to critizice the way AlMiles wrote her.

[pizzahead2490]

To be totally honest it all depends on what fan groups of a certain character find offensive and what we can all agree on. Which is pointless, because with that happening we probably wouldn't have shipper names or anything :\

i agree with that.

just like i said earlier that some people may find one thing offensive and another may not even if they are looking at the same way a word is used in a certain context. which one will you listen to?

[lana 9]

thanks you craig

[pizzahead2490]

some people may think one thing is bashing and another may not.

[battlecat403@yahoo.com]

I don't think I've ever read the term EDLois being used here, actually, who uses that besides members over at TWoP?
It's interesting you say that because someone just used the term in the spoilers thread today and a member just posted that he/she got offended by the use of it:

Link: http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=118804&page=5

I tend to visit general forums and websites and I have never seen the term "EDLois" being used appropriately, meaning that it is never paired up with terms like: TWClark or KKLana. Thus, even if the intent isn't there, it comes off as derogatory towards the actress because it is saying that she is not the real Lois Lane, which by all accounts she is.



Do you guys have examples of that being used as greatly as say BDA? Which I personally never cared for, I also don't like Lana Fu, something that meant to be used for fun was then turned around and used to make fun of Lana.
I'm a new member here so I don't know about the prevalence of any terms, but why does that matter? Even if people rarely use "Choogle" it's still bashing. Same for Nois, Hois, EdLois, etc.

[Wicked Lois]

I am not even ask whats Hois means...

[Black Panda]

But as I mentioned earlier and I hope that people don't use this discussion a means to censor or squash any and all discussion of canon events on the show for personal reasons.
Yeah, don't hope too hard.

Here is the thing, to quibble about names for characters misses the point. Complaining about the show seems legitimate expression to me. Remember Simpson's Comic Book Guy, "Worst Cosmic Wars Ever! I will only see it 3 more times today." It's what fans do. That includes complaining about characters. What is very uncool is attacking people for having opinions opposed to yourself. "I'm offended by" some piece of trivia is over used as an excuse to bully people who express opinions one doesn't want to hear, in my opinion. Meanwhile absolutely vicious and insulting posts persist. Look at the forest, not the trees in what we rules we make.

It's not sensible to make a petty rule just because it's easy. The point is that hostile and aggressive posting should be addressed, and that's a matter of enforcing rules that already exist.

[Hopefulsuicide]

can someone distinguish to me what the difference is between bashing and simply expressing a widely agreed opinion...

i mean i were to say that i believe that Chloe is used by Clark as an efficient internet tool like google is too most people, is that bashing... or is it simply the shorter version of chloogle that is bashing

if i were to say that i believe clark is a large and unintelligent alien being then is that bashing or is it simply the term BDA that is bashing

i see a lot of post that i consider bashing, but i think using shortened terms for opinions that arent exactly bashing is fair play...

[tibbit78]

I'm sorry if I offended everyone on the 2001 Better Things Than Lana return. I was wrong, and wasn't thinking right. This was all my fault and it won't happen again. I'm quitting posting on Kryptonsite!

[Vergon6]

I have only seen EDLois being used appropriately when people are debating which Lois Lane they prefer. There would be people saying they prefer EDLois or MKLois or KBLois, etc.

It's used frequently a particular thread in the spoiler and speculation forum to avoid calling Lois as Lois.

[ColdPlay3r]

some people may think one thing is bashing and another may not.
some people dont know comedy
some people are quickly to assume/judge on one word of a post rather than reading the whole post and understanding the context, then they get upset/offended

then 'open' threads like this get created which only cause more confusion and every1 has a go at it

[skully]

some people may think one thing is bashing and another may not.It's what Craig thinks that matters, and I'm more than happy with his current ruling.

[Kalista]

Yeah, don't hope too hard.


Well, Erica is not Lois, which would be handy to remember. The term really refers to Lois not being Iconic Lois though. That's about the writing of the character. It's not a personal attack on the actress. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to this complaint if I felt it was anything more than a straw dog strategy to complain about people having a different opinion.

Here is the thing, to quibble about names for characters misses the point. Complaining about the show seems legitimate expression to me. Remember Simpson's Comic Book Guy, "Worst Cosmic Wars Ever! I will only see it 3 more times today." It's what fans do. That includes complaining about characters. What is very uncool is attacking people for having opinions opposed to yourself. "I'm offended by" some piece of trivia is over used as an excuse to bully people who express opinions one doesn't want to hear, in my opinion. Meanwhile absolutely vicious and insulting posts persist. Look at the forest, not the trees.

*applauds*

[Hopefulsuicide]

how is a shortened version of Erica Durance's Lois, in any way offensive... how is the use of the first letter of each of those words offensive? surely it is the words around that shortening that make it offensive...

[Timester]

Well, Erica is not Lois, which would be handy to remember. The term really refers to Lois not being Iconic Lois though. That's about the writing of the character. It's not a personal attack on the actress. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to this complaint if I felt it was anything more than a straw dog strategy to complain about people having a different opinion.

What's the name Erica's credit has? Yep, Lois Lane.

Therefore, "Nois" is bashing Erica, just to rise the importance of other actress on the show, there is no other way to read it.

And lets avoid the Chlois talk in here, since has nothing to do with thread.

[jimmyolsenblues]

it is very hard to give a clear definition as to what is bashing and what is a rule breaker....
i think we all know in our posting history clear rule breakers...clear trolls...clear "bad" posters....and i know the mods are truly trying their best to identify them....

other posts are harder to determine...maybe they are a break..maybe they are not....

i think its important to realize everyone is entitled to their own opinion as so long it does not break the rules of service.....

if you feel someone broke a rule...report them...

I just want you guys to know the Mods are trying to the best job possible.....
Its not as easy as it seems to play referee...

[Vergon6]

Well, Erica is not Lois, which would be handy to remember. The term really refers to Lois not being Iconic Lois though. That's about the writing of the character. It's not a personal attack on the actress. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to this complaint if I felt it was anything more than a straw dog strategy to complain about people having a different opinion.

I think Craig's point is that is insulting to Erica because it's implying that her character is just some sort of red herring. I could be wrong. No one is suggesting that Erica is literally Lois. But she does play Lois Lane.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


What's the name Erica's credit has? Yep, Lois Lane.

Therefore, "Nois" is bashing Erica, just to rise the importance of other actress on the show, there is no other way to read it.

And lets avoid the Chlois talk in here, since has nothing to do with thread.
But I agree. We aren't here to debate the merits of the Chlois theory.

[Timester]

how is a shortened version of Erica Durance's Lois, in any way offensive... how is the use of the first letter of each of those words offensive? surely it is the words around that shortening that make it offensive...

Do you call Clark TWClark or Lana KKLana? Why Lois has to be called EDLois then (I know the "why")?

[Storm45]

I'll admit that I've never been offended by the term Chloogle. I didn't see it as a way to bash nor it is a way to entirely define Chloe's character. But a way to describe what Chloe does sometimes, I think Chloe said something about being a personal Google. So I thought it started from here. But reading the posts here I understand that it can be offensive.

[Kalista]

Therefore, "Nois" is bashing Erica, just to rise the importance of other actress on the show, there is no other way to read it.




And lets avoid the Chlois talk in here, since has nothing to do with thread.


That was an explanation as to why some use the term EDLois so it is relevant to this discussion.

[pizzahead2490]

is stating the fact bashing?

[Timester]

I'll admit that I've never been offended by the term Chloogle. I didn't see it as a way to bash nor it is a way to entirely define Chloe's character. But a way to describe what Chloe does sometimes, I think Chloe said something about being a personal Google. So I thought it started from here. But reading the posts here I understand that it can be offensive.

It was used for bashing.

[THE"Lurker"]

some people dont know comedy
some people are quickly to assume/judge on one word of a post rather than reading the whole post and understanding the context, then they get upset/offended

then 'open' threads like this get created which only cause more confusion and every1 has a go at it

Which is why the name calling will insist, despite everyones debating in here:cool:

[ginevrakent]

Why do some people use the term EDLois when they are not distinguishing between other actresses who have played the character?

What other reason could there be for using the term?

[pizzahead2490]

Do you call Clark TWClark or Lana KKLana? Why Lois has to be called EDLois then (I know the "why")?

it all depends on the way its used. i am a fan of erica durance version of playing lois lane and i say EDlois. it all depends on what context it is said. and i dont think the word in its self is offensive. AT ALL

[Kalista]

it all depends on the way its used. i am a fan of erica durance version of playing lois lane and i say EDlois. it all depends on what context it is said. and i dont think the word in its self is offensive. AT ALL


Exactly because it literally means Erica Durance's Lois.

[Timester]

That was an explanation as to why some use the term EDLois so it is relevant to this discussion.

And, yet again, unless there is someone credited as "Lois Lane" on the show, it is pure bashing, explanation or not.

I don't care if you like the character or not, but we all know the backgrounds of those nicknames, so there is no actually need for explanations.

[ginevrakent]

Exactly because it literally means Erica Durance's Lois.

It should only ever be used to distinguish between different actresses who have played the character. On a Smallville forum in which other versions of Lois Lane are not being discussed, it is not necessary to make such a distinction. It is implied that we are talking about Lois as played by ED.

----- Added 36 Seconds later -----


That was an explanation as to why some use the term EDLois so it is relevant to this discussion.

Chlois is a theory, just like it's a theory of some (not me) that Chloe will die by the end of the series. Having a theory seems to be a weak reason for using a nickname that offends people. Some don't like the idea of Chloe dying, including me, so it would be offensive to make up a nickname like Chleath (Chloe/Death) or Chlead (Chloe/Dead) or ChloeDOA (Chloe: Dead On Arrival) to illustrate a belief in a theory that she won't make it out of the series alive.

Chlois is not an excuse for the use of EDLois when not comparing Erica to other actresses playing Lois Lane, IMHO.

Okay, sorry for the Chlois talk. Had to get that out of my system.

[Black Panda]

I think Craig's point is that is insulting to Erica because it's implying that her character is just some sort of red herring.
So what? I believe that to be true, and will do so and express that opinion if the term is banned or not. How does that reflect on my opinion of her acting or her as a person?

Further, isn't the opinion that someone's acting is bad relevant to what one thinks about a show? Why should having a negative opinion about acting be any more off limits than having a negative opinion about the writers.

Should I raise "The Idiots in Charge" or the "Promo Monkeys" as off limit terms? It shouldn't be about enforcing PC terms. It should be about encouraging diversity of opinion.

[Timester]

it all depends on the way its used. i am a fan of erica durance version of playing lois lane and i say EDlois. it all depends on what context it is said. and i dont think the word in its self is offensive. AT ALL

Exactly, the context.

But you really want to know what is the context that is always used? To prove the Chlois theory. That, in same magical way, Lois is not Lois, therefore she has to be EDLois because she is not Lois. Sometimes, is even compared EDLois to "AMLois".

Is not that bashing the actress?

But enough with the Chlois politicizing of this thread.

[Kalista]

And, yet again, unless there is someone credited as "Lois Lane" on the show, it is pure bashing, explanation or not.

Again, that is personal opinion about a term that is permitted. And whether some like it or not the Chlois theory does exist and there needs to be a way to distinguish between the characters considering the fact that there is a difference of opinion as to which character is the real Lois Lane.

Sorry, it's not bashing.

----- Added 44 Seconds later -----



Is not that bashing the actress?


No, because it involves the characters and has nothing to do with the actresses.

[Hopefulsuicide]

Do you call Clark TWClark or Lana KKLana? Why Lois has to be called EDLois then (I know the "why")?

on threads about which interpretation of Lois is better, yes i would call Smallville Clark TWClark... why wouldnt I?!

[Timester]

Should I raise "The Idiots in Charge" or the "Promo Monkeys" as off limit terms? It shouldn't be about enforcing PC terms. It should be about encouraging diversity of opinion.

TIIC isn't used in years. You might be confusing with some place else.

[pizzahead2490]

i went on the chlois thread about twice in my life time and i was not paying attenshion to any thing they say. and when i use the term EDlois its only cuz i want to stae the diff between the diff lois that played the chracter. i also say THlois and MKlois, is that offensive?

[Kalista]

Why should having a negative opinion about acting be any more off limits than having a negative opinion about the writers.

Should I raise "The Idiots in Charge" or the "Promo Monkeys" as off limit terms? It shouldn't be about enforcing PC terms. It should be about encouraging diversity of opinion.

Exactly. PS3 have been receiving some harsh criticism lately.

[ginevrakent]

So what? I believe that to be true.

Yet some believe it to be true that Chloe is nothing more than Clark's Google search engine (I don't feel this way), but the term "Chloogle" is seen as offensive, nonetheless.

When it comes to offending people, what you believe and feel about a term doesn't really matter. It's how it affects other people; hence why the term is offensive. It's kind of hard to offend yourself.

[Hopefulsuicide]

And, yet again, unless there is someone credited as "Lois Lane" on the show, it is pure bashing, explanation or not.

I don't care if you like the character or not, but we all know the backgrounds of those nicknames, so there is no actually need for explanations.

of course you need to explain... i think most people use EDLois for two reasons 1. because they are distinguishing between other interpretations and 2. because they believe in chlois... neither of which i find bashing...

... i dont see how calling her erica durances lois can be called bashing... she IS erica durances lois!