Can anyone ever say, "Superman" on the show. Ever?

[Ben the Bear fan]

I saw the Legion episode like everyone else. I liked it. However, I'm surprised the Legion did not reference Clark Kent as Superman. Ever. I know Lightning Lad almost blurted it out, but why the hell not? Clark already know he's going to wear a cape and eventually fly.

Or is it some legal BS that DC Comics won't allow usage of the words, "Superman" to be blurted out in the show? Then, WHY????? Why can they use everything else, including the Superman symbol and virtually all the Superman characters and more....but not reference the usage of "Superman" on the show?

I'm disappointed that the Legion should have mentioned more about his future. They should have told him who he becomes and he ends up with. I'm also disappointed that Lois Lane wasn't in the episode. I would have loved how the Legion would have reacted/said to her.

I'm sorry, but, with the huge disappointment of the last Superman Returns movie, I'm even more wishing Smallville would work a deal with the fim side and do a "cross-over" to film to conclude his destiny as Superman using the same cast, especially with Tom Welling. Why the hell not? Star Trek did it. X-Files did it.

Thanks for ruining the Superman movie franchise, Bryan Singer. Nice job. Tool.

[elroyofkrypton]

Thanks for ruining the Superman movie franchise, Bryan Singer. Nice job. Tool.

No doubt. Singer thinks mimicry is creativity. I hope he never sets foot on another Superman set.

[Timester]

Thanks for ruining the Superman movie franchise, Bryan Singer. Nice job. Tool.

:confused:

Singer? Singer was the one that permited Lois on Smallville in the first place.

[ClarkyBoy14]

Probably either a DC restriction, or Smallville's producers just don't want that word said on the show yet.

I'm glad they didn't tell Clark all about his future though. It wouldn't be a very good idea to tell him who he ends up with and everything.

[davidbrenton]

It was more the writing and acting of Superman Returns that was horrible. Lois was miscast per near-nepotism with Kevin Spacey's influence while the plot was insanely stupid and boring. Superman's huge villain was a giant rock of kryptonite he merely carries away from earth? Come on.

But, to answer the threads question, yes, in the pilot, Lana says, "So, what are you Clark? Man or Superman?"

[ClarkyBoy14]

^Lower case "s." :p

[Alania]

But, to answer the threads question, yes, in the pilot, Lana says, "So, what are you Clark? Man or Superman?"

Oh, yeah, way back! But isn't Lois who comes up with the name? So we are gonna have to wait for her, in SV, then. Maybe when she gets the interview with him, she changes from superdude to the real thing.
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[bobsuncorp]

Oh, yeah, way back! But isn't Lois who comes up with the name? So we are gonna have to wait for her, in SV, then. Maybe when she gets the interview with him, she changes from superdude to the real thing.
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That is totally my opinion as well. It is canon that LOIS comes up with the name Superman. I actually think its one of the better aspects of their love story that she is the one who names him. And I've also always thought that the reason she comes up with the name is the huge S on his chest. So if that is the case then she cannot come up with the name until he puts on the tights, which means it will probably not happen until the end.

But still, I maintain that the first person to say the word Superman (referring to Clark) should be Lois.

[jimmyolsenblues]

okay but smallville pre-dates bryan singer's involvement...i think its more lawyers and studio execs then anything else...

[Iluvgreen]

It's because they didn't want to give too much away.

[alejandrita439]

i think it wouldnt be a good idea tell him ALL about him in the future :o

[Primal Slayer]

I doubt they cant say Superman on SV. I dont even think you can put those kinds of bans on a show. The producers just dont want to say it. And telling Clark that he will become Superman one day is a pretty big move.

[Tigergal05]

But, to answer the threads question, yes, in the pilot, Lana says, "So, what are you Clark? Man or Superman?"
That line could have easily been disguised as Lana referring to Nietzsche and 'the superman' (or Ubermensche). Since there is a double meaning, AlMiles probably figured that they could pull it off without getting into trouble from DC Comics and copyright issues.

[omegadirective]

If a time traveler from the future came back to tell you how your life works out, who you marry, how many kids you have, and everything else...

...what is the point of living that life?

The time traveler just told you and now you know exactly how everything happens. You would just go through the motions knowing you will win battles A B and C but eventually lose battle X, for example. Or you might do nothing and expect everything to work out by itself, because to the time traveler, it already happened. And there is the risk of you deciding you don't want this future and decide to ruin it for everyone by doing something incredibly idiotic.

Generally, if you look at any time-travel science fiction, the rule is generally "one does not mess with the past and does not give past people information about the future." If one did, one could possibly negatively affect the future.

[moviefan2k4]

Lex also used the phrase "behold the Superman" in one episode, while discussing classic literature with Dominic Sanatori.

[ForzaItalia]

Thanks for ruining the Superman movie franchise, Bryan Singer. Nice job. Tool.

I don't know who the bigger idiot is... Bryan Singer for writing Superman Returns, or WB for considering hiring him again to make a sequel.

[dru-zod2501]

I saw the Legion episode like everyone else. I liked it. However, I'm surprised the Legion did not reference Clark Kent as Superman. Ever. I know Lightning Lad almost blurted it out, but why the hell not? Clark already know he's going to wear a cape and eventually fly.
How and why on earth would he know anything about wearing a cape or a costume at this point? and how is he certain that he'll figure out flight? he hasn't seemed all that interested in learning for quite some time.


Or is it some legal BS that DC Comics won't allow usage of the words, "Superman" to be blurted out in the show? Then, WHY????? Why can they use everything else, including the Superman symbol and virtually all the Superman characters and more....but not reference the usage of "Superman" on the show?
simple simple. THey can use anything they want from the mythos cause its a "reinterpretation" of the mythos, yet they can't use the name Superman until Clark puts on the suit & Lois thinks it up.


I'm disappointed that the Legion should have mentioned more about his future. They should have told him who he becomes and he ends up with. I'm also disappointed that Lois Lane wasn't in the episode. I would have loved how the Legion would have reacted/said to her.
hello?! messing with history never ends well in any story! when have you ever heard it to be a good thing? there's absolutely no way of knowing if the events between Clark's present and the Legion's present would happen in the same way if he knew about it beforehand. For all we know, Clark learning about his future could result in the formation of the Legion of Supermonkeys instead of Superheroes.


I'm sorry, but, with the huge disappointment of the last Superman Returns movie, I'm even more wishing Smallville would work a deal with the fim side and do a "cross-over" to film to conclude his destiny as Superman using the same cast, especially with Tom Welling. Why the hell not? Star Trek did it. X-Files did it.

Thanks for ruining the Superman movie franchise, Bryan Singer. Nice job. Tool.
who are you really supposed to be mad at? Singer or Smallville??

[Steve-El]

Lana said it to Clark in the pilot: Man or Superman. And I don't remember which episodes Lex said it in, he said Supermen.

[alejandrita439]

but lana said: man or super man ... its different i think :o

[ForzaItalia]

In Season 2 Clark said to Martha "You're like Supermom." I think it was also Season 2 when Martha said to both Clark and Jonathan "Stop working so hard. You're not Supermen" (and no, I'm not confusing things with the scene from Spiderman). I also remember Aquaman called Clark "Superboy." And in Season 1's Leech Chloe wrote an article on Eric called "Superboy."

But the actual name "Superman" has only been used once, in the Pilot. And I don't think it ever should be used again, until the very last word of the final episode. That idea is from this fan fiction ending
http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88893

[bobsuncorp]

Generally, if you look at any time-travel science fiction, the rule is generally "one does not mess with the past and does not give past people information about the future." If one did, one could possibly negatively affect the future.

And the timeline would be SKEEEWED OFF!

[Jaderoyale]

Lol..

I somehow doubt Clarks meant to know thats he's Superman before he even knows himself.

[green_arrow_girl358]

it is a great sin to say "Superman" on SV

anyone who utters such a cursed word is struck away to the dungeon of luthor mansion only to be met by other totured souls who said this horrific word (lana, martha, AC, chloe and apparently Bryan singer cause everyone on this thread hates him)

The only way to be freed is to pay a large sum of money to the directors(past and present) and an even larger sum plus your right hand, firstborn, etc to DC.

Your final test will be to go to an unsupervised therapy session with Tina Greer, Sasha Woodman, Jodi Melville and lets throw in SV version of Perry White. The directors want to see if you'll make it out sane

[clarkdent]

Does everyone hate the "Superman Returns" movie? I happen to like it.

[Liquid-Prince]

It's just that the Legion doesn't want to him to know that he will name himself Superman. Ever heard of a time paradox?

[hanemg]

In the movies, LnC and modern comics it was Lois who named him. In pre-crisis days Clark named himself (along with his parents). As such, I don't know if it's so much a restriction or the fact that TPTB want Clark (or Lois) to come up with the name, not be told "This is what you'll call yourself".

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


Does everyone hate the "Superman Returns" movie? I happen to like it.

And yes, while it had some things I loved overall I do think Singer screwed up big time and wasted a wonderful opportunity. With all due respect to Christopher Reeve and everyone else involved with the original they should have kept as far away from that stuff as they could. And a kid?! Does Singer even realize that everytime a kid is introduced into an already established setting it's like putting on the leather jacket and preparing to jump over the shark?

[Ray Man]

The only thing I didn't like about Superman Returns is that Lex was the main baddie again, and that his (BS's) Lois Lane was married and had a kid. Which got me to thinking that his movie must've happened after Superman 4 cuz Lois only has the hots for Superman and isn't married w/child in the CR movies.

And like I said in another Thread, "Clark doesn't like being told about his destiny. He likes to make his own."

[TECHWON]

:confused:

Singer? Singer was the one that permited Lois on Smallville in the first place.

My beef with Superman Returns is the fact that it's a too long of a movie and i think they need to get away from Lex and or Zod as villians in the movies and use some of his better rouges gallery

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


The only thing I didn't like about Superman Returns is that Lex was the main baddie again, and that his (BS's) Lois Lane was married and had a kid. Which got me to thinking that his movie must've happened after Superman 4 cuz Lois only has the hots for Superman and isn't married w/child in the CR movies.

And like I said in another Thread, "Clark doesn't like being told about his destiny. He likes to make his own."


no actually the movie took place after Superman 2 because the studio didn't want to acknowledge the existence of Superman 3 & 4 because they were box office disasters

[SuperFan85]

but lana said: man or super man ... its different i think :o

Nah, she was in fact referring to Nietzsche's Superman, since Clark was carrying a book by him, to class.

----- Added 20 Minutes later -----


Does everyone hate the "Superman Returns" movie? I happen to like it.

I truly hate that film for many reasons. First of all, the film was being sold as not a reboot, but rather a sequel to Superman 2, but not Superman 4, since Superman 3 and 4 were not going to be acknowledged as part of the series in this context.

Second, you have the campy Lex Luthor returning, in a time, where in my opinion, comic book films were moving away from that type of villain and being geared towards coming off more realistic.

Third, Singer was basically trying to make a carbon copy of the original Richard Donner Superman film, to the point where the film could almost be considered not even homage, but just outright plagiarism. Lex Luthor having another real estate scheme? Another female assistant who betrays him? Rehashing the exact same jokes?

Fourth, the characters in the film could hardly be considered faithful interpretations of the characters in the comics in my opinion. Superman basically turns into Super Stalker and uses his X-Ray vision to spy and listen in on conversations between Lois and Richard in their home? Wtf? Kevin Spacey's Lex Luthor was just plain ridiculous. Maybe because I've come to see Michael Rosenbaum as the definitive Lex Luthor out of any representation, but Spacey's Lex Luthor just was not the character. I've always seen the character as someone, who is not out to kill "BILLIONS!" of people, but someone who is actually out to play the role as the hero of the world in his eyes and do things for the greater good in the name of humanity. And along the way, if certain people need to be killed that get in the way of that greater good, then the ends justifies the means in his eyes. That's an aspect of the character, that Smallville captured perfectly in my opinion.

Fifth, Brandon Routh just seemed more like a Superboy, than a Superman in my opinion. He was just too young looking, so that kind of annoyed me.

Btw, what the hell was with those constant weird looks between Lex Luthor and Kumar throughout the film. Very strange lol.

Anyway, I could probably write paragraphs and paragraphs of things that annoyed the hell out of me about the film, but this is a Smallville forum, not a Superman Returns bashing thread, so I'll stop now lol

[chessnuts]

Or is it some legal BS that DC Comics won't allow usage of the words, "Superman" to be blurted out in the show? Then, WHY????? Why can they use everything else, including the Superman symbol and virtually all the Superman characters and more....but not reference the usage of "Superman" on the show?

That 'superman' symbol is called the symbol for hte House of El (which is his Kryptonian family). So I don't see how it means that they should reference Superman already.

LOL, you don't have to be deeply involved in the storyline to know that the 'S' symbol isn't the English letter 's', as in abbreviated for 'Superman'. It's a Kryptonian symbol.

[wolverine316]

Does everyone hate the "Superman Returns" movie? I happen to like it.

Total garbage. May have ruined the franchise. But then the director Joel Schumaker(sorry if I spelled that wrong) nearly ruined Batman. But at least that franchise has been turned around completely.

[Timester]

My beef with Superman Returns is the fact that it's a too long of a movie and i think they need to get away from Lex and or Zod as villians in the movies and use some of his better rouges gallery

Before Singer took over, the plan was to make Lex a Kryptonian.

Lex. Kryptonian.

Smallville was permited to use Lois and the FOS WHEN Singer took over. That's what this thread is about after all. Singer was nothing but good for Smallville.

[SuperFan85]

He may of been nothing but good for Smallville, but ultimately was what killed Superman Returns. And I have nothing against him as a director. I actually think he's very good. X-Men 2 is one of my favorite comic book movies next to Dark Knight, Iron Man, and Spider-Man 2, it's just that he made some very bad decisions with the film, in terms of the story and characters, and what to do with the franchise. It should of just been a reboot to begin with instead of a continuation from Superman 2.

[Xanusus]

The reason why is likely due to DC restrictions on the name "superman" in direct reference to Clark. He doesn't exactly line up with the continuity.

[SuperFan85]

I hope he's called Superman at least once in the series finale.

[Timester]

He may of been nothing but good for Smallville, but ultimately was what killed Superman Returns. And I have nothing against him as a director. I actually think he's very good. X-Men 2 is one of my favorite comic book movies next to Dark Knight, Iron Man, and Spider-Man 2, it's just that he made some very bad decisions with the film, in terms of the story and characters, and what to do with the franchise. It should of just been a reboot to begin with instead of a continuation from Superman 2.

But this thread is not about what Singer did or did not to Superman.

[REebee52]

In defense of Superman Returns:

I've seen this debate for a while, on many different superman boards, so I'll put my thoughts here.
Superman Returns had many flaws:
First and foremost, it paid way too much attention to the older movies. This should have been a new beginning, a fresh start with new great ideas, but it wasn't. As someone said, it was a rehash, from beginning to end.
As for Lex Luthor, I thought Kevin Spacey did a fantastic job, and I didn't think he was too campy at all, especially compared to Hackman. But they wrote Lex Luthor in his old 'criminal mastermind' days, a version of Lex that's been outdated for twenty years. The wealthy, powerful, and respected Luthor is actually a frightening thought.
Of course the biggest problem with the entire movie, everybody knows it, Clark the Kryptonian and Lois the Human have a child.
I'm sorry, I know this is science fiction, but we can at least stick to the rules that different species can't interbreed.
In order to make sense of why so many aliens look like humans in DC universe, I determined that there was some controlling force that evolved these humanoids who were similar but obviously different. They might be 99% the same, but they're all different.
So to have this child it's like a chimp mating with a human. It just doesn't make sense. And let's even pretend it does... what do you do with this Superkid? It immediately writes you into a corner.
Also Lois Lane was poorly cast.
The film did have some positives. Brandon Routh did a fine job, and I thought the movie got a lot of him right, though I don't prefer the clumsy Clark. I didn't hate the crystal plot, it was a somewhat new idea. And some of the shots in the movie are incredible, so I give Singer credit for that.
The thing about the movie is that it was a good movie, but it was a poor Superman movie. The script was tight, the acting good, the directing good, the plot was that of a dramatic epic rather than action movie, and I didn't hate that like some others did. The film is respected rather than liked.
But what this should have been is a reboot, so now we wouldn't have to debate whether we should reboot or not. It should have been done, it could have had Luthor as the main villain, and now we could do something different. Unfortunately this didn't happen, and we're in a mess of crap.

And as to the original question, thank God Garth didn't call him Superman.
that is all.

[Ray Man]

My beef with Superman Returns is the fact that it's a too long of a movie and i think they need to get away from Lex and or Zod as villians in the movies and use some of his better rouges gallery

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----




no actually the movie took place after Superman 2 because the studio didn't want to acknowledge the existence of Superman 3 & 4 because they were box office disasters

I know it takes place after Superman 2, that's why I'm soo confused and upset! Wouldn't Lois and Superman having a kid change the timeline/mythos in SOME way???:confused::mad:

[mistaguitarmasta]

Yeah there are legal reasons behind the avoidance of saying "Superman." But also, its the Back to the Future effect. They can't tell him too much, or it might alter the timeline. If he KNOWS everything, that will influence him in ways it shouldn't.

[MrZeppo]

Before Singer took over, the plan was to make Lex a Kryptonian.

Lex. Kryptonian.

Smallville was permited to use Lois and the FOS WHEN Singer took over. That's what this thread is about after all. Singer was nothing but good for Smallville.

That was all Jon Peter's, the executive producer's, fault.

Jon Peter has ruined the Superman franchise. All those years of directors wanting to redo the franchise was hindered by him, because he had no flipping clue what he was talking about.

This guy got into the film biz because he was Barbara Streisand's hairdresser. This connection does not make him qualified to be a good movie producer IMHO.

When he brought Kevin Smith to write Superman before Singer got involved he didn't want Superman to be able to fly, he didn't want Superman to wear blue and red or a cape, he wanted the main villian to be Brainiac, he wanted Brainiac to fight polar bears in the Artic and wanted him to have a flamboyant robot sidekick. In the third act he wanted Superman to fight a giant robot spider, which was a stupid idea he ended up using in another movie, Wild Wild West.

Talk about HUGE disconnect.

If you don't believe me, look up Dinner with Kevin Smith on youtube. In an interview Peters even admits his fault in the inability to get a Superman movie out in the last decade.

At least Singer was able to make this movie. If it weren't for him the franchise would still be stuck in limbo, let's be honest. I'll admit the movie was lackluster for me, and I'm a huge Superman fan who can forgive almost anything.

Just my personal opinion.

1) While I respect Singer's decision to use the Reeve's movies as backstory, in retrospect I really think the story should have been rebooted.
2) I didn't like Kate Bosworth as Lois. She seemed so flat and depressing. The only interesting part about her performance was her reaction when Supes caught her plane and when he was going back to the kryptonite island in the end of the movie. She didn't keep me entralled. I also didn't care for the B story of Superman and Lois. It could have been done better.
3) NO super kid!! Why?? I hated this idea. I understand what they wanted to do, but I just didn't like it.

Regardless, I chose to look at Superman Returns in another way. It's out love note our thank you our honoring the Reeves storyline and wrapping that up in a nice tight bow. Now let's reboot the franchise already!


Going back to the OP's question...

Lana kind of made a joke about Clark being a Superman in the pilot but that doesn't count really. Chloe's made "Super" references in the past.

I'm actually glad they don't say "Superman" in the episode. I wouldn't want the Legion being the ones that said it.

The person who should first call Clark by the name "Superman" should be the same person who gives him that name, Lois. I would rather wait for her to name him, hopefully in "Infamous".

[Mr. Clark Kent27]

No way, the Legion should not have ever mentioned to Clark his name or about his tights. It would affect Clark's thinking.

[Ilidan]

"Superman" has been said on the show. Just not with reference to Clark.

In fact, it was said in the second act of the first episode that ever aired :P