Did Your Heart Break For Lois??

[geminis]

First of all I love Smallville. I enjoy watching all of the characters and I have favorites. I can't for the life of me understand why people have to bash a fictional character like they were real. I wonder sometimes if the storyline is close to something that has actually happened to a person that causes such a strong reaction. Could it be attributed to youth and the lack of actually experiencing life, love and disappointments. I am really baffled with the hate that is posted. With that said, I am constantly on the defensive and I have thought that I would stay away because it is hard to see your favorite character bashed constantly. I haven't come to that yet, but I can actually see it coming if things don't change. I have two months to let my blood pressure get back to normal and time will tell if I leave or stay after we have another episode to debate.

I'm with you. I have also enjoyed watching all of the characters (some more than others, admittedly) and have my favorites. And I hope you stay because you have been a cool voice of reason on the boards. I don't think it is necessarily youth, though, or a lack of experience, it is mostly due to unthinking passion.

Back to Lois: she was sad therefore I was sad, but she's going to come back stronger than ever and committed to work. And that makes me happy.

[Sweetie]

yeah, a couple good scenes between lana and lois about clark would be good, get some final resolution to 8 years of drama that should have ended a while ago

See,that one of the many differences between Lois & Lana.Lois gives him all the space & the time he needs to make his finale decision,she trusts him enough to go away until his choice is made.Lana would have never done that in the same situation.It was always a lack of trust between Clana that was their main problem...she never have enough fait in Clark to let the issues of his secret go or when they had a break up,take more time to think carefully.No,she always came back to try again and again without thinking about their mistake they made.Look,even if he had told her his secret sooner,she is still keeping secrets from him and far more dangerous than CK's secret ever was.

[Doomsday911]

I felt for her

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Thankyou so much for your kind words :D

I really shouldn't only point out my disappointment with how Lois has been portrayed as I've had major issues with how Clark and Lana has been written as well. I guess it was just that I loved THLois so much, and also I was quite young when Lois and Clark first aired so I really idolized TH's Lois.

Cannot tell you how refreshing it is to see a calm conversation about this!!! THANK YOU.

And I see some of the Lois bashing comments that tend to fly around have been addressed too so it's plain there are comments made by haters on both sides that have made things worse. I for one would LOVE to see it done with.

I think the thing with Smallville's Lois is just exactly what you've said Becc. We need to remember that things badly written for one character can be balanced against badly written things for another. I'm a Lois fan who HATED the Grois storyline WITH A VENGEANCE. And even though I don't see it as sordid as some of the more vicious haters do, I still think it was pointless. It didn't add anything to anyones storyline. I feel the same way about the witches plot from season four frankly.

Also with the TH, MK, NN, etc Lois' this is a problem Smallville Lois will always have that Chloe never will. ED stepped into shoes that had been filled many, many times before and people will always have a Lois they consider to be 'their' Lois. Twenty years from now another actress will have the same problem on a TV Show. (Not so much for the reboot of the movie franchise cos lets face facts whatever they do with that can't really get any WORSE :p) So we can love Chloe and follow her story and debate what's happened to her but we never have to compare her to previous Chloe's, whereas to some, no matter what Lois does on Smallville it won't make a difference if they already have a previous incarnation of Lois they like better. I think that's another part of the reason why I get so miffed when she's referred to as EDLois outside of this kind of a conversation or the Chlois debate.

Love her or hate her, she now has her place as a Lois Lane and you've gotta respect ANYONE who takes that on. Same for TW as Clark Kent - and no-one ever seems to call him TWClark in a conversation where there aren't other Clark Kent's... :rolleyes:

----- Added 7 Minutes later -----


The truth is all characters of this show have flaws , and make mistakes ....

Absolutely!

[kryptonaidxh]

:(Yes I felt sorry for Lois, and the way she went alone to take care of Jimmy, Clark shouldn´t have left her alone, because Lois is his real soulmate and future love partner, she´s his legendary love wrtitten for him. I disgusted his clana obsession in that moment where Lois needed support company, specially from Clark.

[Storm45]

No. I don't feel sorry for her. I know how its gonna end between her and Clark and it all be all right.
I felt more sorry for Jimmy who started the day all happy for his weddding to ending up being ripped apart by a monster.

[DontCha]

its funny, I really dont feel all that sorry for her.

Its very strange. I think its a mixture of knowing that they are going to be together anyway and just the overall feeling of that last scene.

That last scene to me just read: "let it wait till the time is right." And it was almost as if it was a silent agreement between the two characters. But that doesnt mean is not making their hearts ache, because it is.

[CaptainObvious]

I didn't feel sorry for her and I still don't see any chemistry between them. She's always so degrading to him. I know that's her character and their relationship is inevitable but it just seems forced. Even though another Clana relationship is probably not in the future, you can't deny the connection the minute they look at each other. Let's hope Lana gets an interesting story line about finding Lex

[DontCha]

its also why shes his soulmate in the comics.other media, she keeps him on his toes^

[old guy]

Having always been a chlarker, I would have figured my response to Lois would have been "tough ti**ies, that's life". But I felt bad for Lois, and I think it is a direct correlation to the improvement ED has made in playing her character this season. I was a chlarker between I always saw a real chemistry between the two characters. I never sensed that prior to this season between ED and TW. Yes, I know the characters end up together down the road, but I could never imagine that between "this" Lois and TW's Clark.

But this season, Erica is making me a believer. I see a chemistry between Lois and Clark that was missing before. I can now buy that these two will get together because they were meant to be together. I don't know if its due to ED's growth as an actress or because of the direction PS3 have taken this - probably a combination of the two. But yeah, I felt sad for Lois whereas I was frankly fairly numb as far as having any emotional connection to Smallville's Lois.

And I wouldn't bust Clark's unbreakable chops for hurting Lois in this episode. I don't get the sense at all that he did this intentionally. He was completely caught off-guard with Lana's sudden arrival. Gladly, I think he now realizes that clana is dead and will be able to move on. But he will have to be able to leap tall buildings in a single bound to leap over the wall that Lois is building around her heart.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Yes, it's another long post from me :o Skip/skim or read at will ;)


Suggesting Clark is a guy who would just use a woman as a warm body, especially a woman that he knows has feelings for him, is a huge insult to Clark. Not to the poor woman.


Exactly! And whether or not I love, like, or don't like a female character he becomes romantically involved with on the show the bottom line for me is whether or not there are mutual feelings there, whether or not it adds something to his journey and whether or not it's a healthy relationship for BOTH of them. It's Clark's story FIRST. And yes, I'm a Lois Lane fan too but that's not just because I love Smallville's Lois or because I'm a mythos gal, it's because to me a big part of the Superman story IS the love story between Clark Kent and Lois Lane. Superman to me is a symbol of hope. And if there's anything in the world that symbolizes hope more than love then I don't know what it is quite frankly. Love for fellow human beings, love for the planet we live on, love for animals etc etc etc - yes I know I'm on my soapbox here but I strongly believe this. If it wasn't for love, then we as a race would have fallen a long time ago. It's love and the capacity to good because of it that makes us special and that is a core part of the Superman story for me. He sees that in humans and fights for the greater good because of it. To me he learns a lot about human love through his relationship with Lois Lane. And Lois Lane is return shows us that everyone can be loved, even by someone we perceive as 'out of reach' or 'better' than we are. Clark Kent loves Lois Lane regardless of her many flaws and that's something a lot of people tend to forget or become blinkered about imo. And I think Smallville has played on this aspect with Lois, showing her making mistakes, showing her as flawed, but showing her as vulnerable and as in need of love and the feeling of being 'needed' as everyone else is. THAT strikes a chord in me. And seeing how vulnerable Clark can be on Smallville emotionally and how much he really needs to be needed makes me want him to have someone special who fills that void. I love Clark. I don't want him to be alone.

When Jonathan died and Martha left, Clark lost a huge chunk of the emotional support he had in his life. It's something we all have to face up to as we get older and lose our parents. There is no lonelier feeling than that loss. That's where having someone by your side can help fill the void. In Smallville Clark's parents also understood better than ANYONE the need he had to be 'normal'/human. Up until Chloe's memories were taken away Lois Lane was the only one left who was close to him that tapped into that need in him. She doesn't know what he can do. She treats him as a normal guy - teases him, pushes him, argues with him, gets him to bite back - and no-one else does that on the same level as she does. Because everyone who knows what he can do can't tease him the same way because they know he has all these superpowers so it becomes very tongue-in-cheek and isn't anywhere near as amusing for him as it is with Lois simply because Lois doesn't know so he always has the upper hand on her - they push him not just because they think he can do more but because they think he can do more than any other person on the planet and he should take on that responsibility (even if he doesn't feel he's ready yet) - and yes they can get him to bite back but often they will then lecture him or quote from his Kryptonian father or point out the mistakes he's made that have had huge consequences, again, because they KNOW. Lois doesn't. So with her he's just Clark - a guy she has come to think of as special because of who he is and not WHAT he is. Chloe felt that way too before she knew, but the minute she did know their relationship changed and by then the moment for romantic love to be mutual had passed - Clark was still with Lana while Chloe moved on to Jimmy.

Up until Chloe's memories were altered, Clark could talk to Lois about something and through their discussion could be given a very simple solution to something he was dealing with. And there have been times when we've seen the surprise on his face because of it. She doesn't look at the bigger picture, she sees what she sees and says what she thinks. And sometimes that's exactly what Clark needs. Sometimes the simple solution is the answer. It's why I'm glad there has been a Lois Lane on Smallville since season four. And if you think about it, it was good timing, cos by then his relationship with Chloe was changing due to her learning his secret. So Lois filled a void in his life by being the only one of his peers to treat him as the normal guy he had wanted to be for most of his life.

All the relationships on the show have added to his journey in one or another and been part of his learning experiences. And that's as it should be. It's Clark's story. If they don't add something they're a waste of screentime IMO.


Also, on the Lana front, whether you ship Clois, or whether you ship Chlark, or Clex, or Cliver, or whatever...wasn't the general idea that Clark would have to move past his feelings for Lana first? That would be a requirement regardless, right? I don't think there can be any denying that Lana has come first here. She's the first love, undisputed. Whoever you ship, whoever you champion, they will be coming up after her. But that shouldn't make them unworthy, or a 2nd choice, or not a real, deep love for Clark.


ITA. And I think the line Oliver delivered to Lois in Bride about moving on and the actual moment you do is very apt for Clark with Lana. Clark may have told himself he has moved on, Lana has now told him she has, but until we see HIM make that realization in an unambiguous way the relationship isn't truly over and the debates will go on and on and on. I honestly think this is a big part of why his feelings for Lois haven't been openly explored. They sold us on the Lana for seven years with varying degrees and at times lack of success. That can't be resolved in ten episodes when Lana is missing for nine of them.

BUT and it's a big but here, regardless of whether or not Lana has an outside reason to have left the way she did and if she still does have the kind of feelings for him that make her want to be with him if it wasn't for x, y and z, if CLARK makes the decision not to fight to keep the relationship this time then people have to accept that is that. This is the guy that continued pursuing her when she was a married, supposedly pregnant woman (a storyline this Superman/Clark Kent fan hated with the same loathing as she did the absentee father storyline in SR btw). He continued fighting to save the relationship after she'd stolen money from Lex, after she lied to him about her Isis Foundation work, after she slept with Bizarro. Yes, he blamed himself for everything bad that had happened to her too but the fact is he still FOUGHT FOR HER. So if he let's the relationship go now it's a HUGE DECISION and shows a big change, especially considering everything they've been through. A pro-active, mature Clark who has come so far in so many ways this season wouldn't be afraid to continue fighting for the relationship he wanted that much imo. Especially considering how much he fought in the past. So once we see the decision made it's MADE.

Anyone who comes after her isn't by any means a second choice. She'll be the woman he has feelings for and who he makes the decision to BE WITH. And IMO at this point it will be a much more mature relationship than we have seen in the past. He has experience behind him now, good and bad, and any relationship he enters into from here on in should benefit from that.


I personally don't think Clark will just settle. I just don't think Clark is that shallow, or inconsiderate. I don't think he's a user. When Clark allows himself to love again, it will be just as real as what he had with Lana. JMO


ITA. And that's the way it should be. He is neither shallow or inconsiderate and he's been shown that way. What I think he has been in the past and rightly so considering what age he was supposed to be, is naive. Part of his problem with Lana was what Lana accused him of in a barn scene once - he had a picture of her as someone she wasn't. She made decisions both good and bad as everyone does - and those experiences changed her from the innocent girl-next-door figure. But Clark's perception of her remained the same. I think everyone is guilty of this at some time or another in their life, especially when 'blinded' by love. He doesn't know the real Lana, from what we were shown in Bride, he still doesn't. And how can he know if she's the one for him to spend the rest of his life with if he doesn't know her faults and all? We're not talking small things here either - like what she's like when she has a horrible cold, or when she doesn't shave her legs or when she has monster PMT. We're talking about a woman who would KILL to protect him, who has been shown to be vengeful, who will do whatever she needs to do to survive no matter what line it crosses. That doesn't make her the villain of the piece, but what it does is it goes against many of the core values that Clark Kent holds dear. No matter what the Luthors have done in the past he still told Oliver 'you can't punish the son for the sins of the father'. This to me is a key reason why Lana isn't the right woman for Clark. Now if she confessed all those things, I don't doubt Clark would forgive her and partly blame himself for everything but she would then have to CHANGE and the pattern of behavior would have to stop. And we're not seeing this. That means that the problems continue to exist in the long term and quite simply, they aren't right for each other.

And without starting a war by comparing one character to another and making the point without doing any bashing - IF Clark decides to enter into a romantic relationship with Lois Lane he knows it will be with someone who is what she is; faults and all - simply because they have got to know each other without romantic complications. One of the most hated things about Lois Lane is the fact she is 'in your face blunt' and lately people have been upset about her being so vulnerable. There are no back doors with Lois. Clark has seen the one thing she tried to hide most and that was her vulnerability. There are a great many things about Lois Lane Clark Kent finds annoying and irritating and infuriating. But he knows her. And the more he learns along the way, the more he understands that they aren't that different when it comes to the things that matter. She wouldn't let him kill Alicia's murderer - something he would never have forgiven himself for. Even though her upbringing was so different to his she values family - at the end of Bride they had the shared bond of their love for Chloe; it was 'I promise we'll get her back' and ' what if we don't?' and he has seen her fight to protect her sister, even when her sister has gone off the tracks. Being loved and needed and left behind are things that scare Lois - as they do Clark. In Plastique, thanks to Clark's help, she sees uncovering the truth as more important than the front page byline - again something that matters to Clark. So for all her flaws, and all the things he doesn't like about her there are just as many things they have in common and just as many things that balance each other out. And that to me is a healthier relationship for Clark. If all those things weren't there then I would still remain skeptical and would prefer them NOT to get involved. Same thing in reverse for Lois - if I didn't think Clark was good for her and that he has things she needs too then it wouldn't be healthy for her. But we've already been shown that her friendship with Clark has been a positive. Heck, being in a friendship with Clark has a positive effect on pretty much everyone in one way or another - there isn't a character on the show he has interacted with that hasn't either benefited from knowing him or been shown to be lacking because of him. Again - as it should be.


Nicely said. And can I add that my heart broke for Clark when he realized Lana was with Jason, and later on when he saw Lana kissing Lex. It broke for Lex when he found out Lana was stalling his proposal, but would've said "yes" without hesitating to Clark (and yes, I know Lex was up to no good). IMO, I think I've been able to feel heartbroken for all the characters on SV at one point or another, though I'm most partial to Clark, and I haven't always liked all the characters.


Well said. The most frustrating thing for me with Lana has been the inconsistencies. Watching Clark and Lana together, particularly the last couple of seasons has been frustrating. And not just because I'm a mythos gal or a Lois Lane fan or because I don't like Lana. It's because we've been shown time and time and time again no matter what they try they just don't work together. I don't see a strong enough foundation for life long love. I see more heartache to come because the things that matter most to Clark aren't shared by Lana. And that's a recipe for long term disaster. The second Lana sought comfort from Lex there was no looking back. She will never be the same again, and even knowing Clark and knowing what he believes in, her experiences with the Luthors have led her to take on some of their thinking (though obviously on a much lesser level). And instead of each testing experience bringing Clark and Lana closer, even when they survived them, they haven't been shown to bring them closer together. In fact if anything it has driven them further apart as they both do what they believe is right to try and stop those things from happening again. No matter what they have tried, it hasn't worked. So it DID take guts for Lana to leave when she did. Clark now needs to come to the same realization. It's that whole letting go of the past and embracing the future thing that he talked about in the barn in Odyssey. Lana is the last part of that step. Everything that follows after that isn't a compromise or a second choice or less than it could have been, it's a conscious decision on Clark's behalf.



I'm primarily a Clark fan, and I think he gets a ridiculous amount of scorn heaped on him. But then again, I'm sensitive to that. Personally, I think I've seen far more Lois fans trying to be fair to Chloe then I've seen the reverse. Its actually what caused me to start speaking up more and more for Lois. My feelings for Lois, Chloe and Lana don't actually vary too drastically. Its all about Clark for me.

So, in my longwinded way, I'm just trying to say that it always seems worse (at least on K-Site), when your favorite character is the one being attacked.


Yep. And being unable to discuss that character or any character on their own merit without it becoming a competition that turns nasty is incredibly frustrating. People can discuss all of the characters and compare their journeys and state their opinions without a scorecard being kept. The thing that bugs me with Clark is that every time an episode airs we have very few IF ANY threads on the board for that episode just to discuss Clark and what he did. Unless it's another character's interaction with him he hardly gets a mention. Now in one way that means he enters almost every discussion because every other character has to interact with him in order to be there - what with it being HIS JOURNEY and all. But unless I'm missing it there are very few threads that look into how he's feeling or progressing or the problems he has without a few dozen people coming out to post about how that's because Lana, Chloe or Lois would be better romantically with him/are better friends etc etc etc and then the focus changes. So I can completely understand a person not being interested in 'ships'. Me, I look at everything from the POV of Clark's journey and the effect it has on him and part of that is the relationships he has with the other characters, including romantically. If it isn't there as part of his journey, whether it's a character,a storyline or an arc then I have much less interest in it and could care less frankly. If it's a character, storyline or arc that reflects BADLY on him then I get upset.



Really, if you loathe the guy so much, why the heck would you want him for "your girl", whoever she may be? If he sucks so much, then consider yourself lucky "your girl" doesn't end up stuck with him.


I honestly couldn't agree with this more if I tried. And I think it's part of my reaction and why I was initially so upset with him after watching Bride. Because my initial reaction was that not so much as looking back at Lois when Lana arrived showed a lack of respect for her feelings and that to me isn't Clark. With a few days to breathe and a little more clarity, I understand it better BUT it isn't something I would like to see continuing. He has learned his lesson with Chloe. There was this amazing girl right in front of him who was loyal and loved him and no matter how many times she tried to show him how she felt he never saw it. It took the letter in Instinct for him to have full realization of how deep her feelings ran. He had that very discussion with Lois. On the first viewing of Bride I thought - have you learned NOTHING?! We're not even talking years ago here, we're talking a matter of weeks! And two seconds after being less than inch away from kissing Lois you can't even glance over your shoulder to see where she's gone? Or shoot her an apologetic glance? Or seem awkward about it?! It bugged me big time. Because right that second it felt like regression.

After a few days I can understand it better. I don't agree with it, but I understand it. At the same time I look at how Lois wore her heart on her sleeve and as a Lois fan too I say enough is enough. She has done the self-respecting thing and stepped back and away and I'm proud of her for that even though it broke my heart for her. She then prioritized and went where she was needed. No melodrama, or emotional blackmail or getting caught in the middle of a complicated relationship and therefore avoiding added pain for herself and added guilt for Clark.

What I really want to see during the episodes Lois is gone is the focus being ENTIRELY on Clark. My wish list includes a lack of regression, a clear decision when it comes to Lana, and continued progression towards taking on the mantle of the Superhero. When Lois comes back I then want to SEE how HE feels. The time for clunky anvils and other people pushing them together is done - if the show is pursuing the line of Lois as Clark's romantic relationship then we need to be SHOWN that. I'm all for comic moments and banter and obstacles being thrown in the way and a roller-coaster of a chase as his Superhero journey continues but this should be a much more mature relationship without the pining and woes of the past. Part of falling in love is the HAPPINESS that comes with it. And those moments of happiness with Lana were all too brief. So smiling Clark this season has been a HUGE bonus. I'd like to see more of that as the season progresses. If I want dark and deep 100% of the time I can stick with Batman. And frankly after everything Clark has been through I think the guy deserves those moments of happiness to balance out everything else!

[Tatiana]

:(Yes I felt sorry for Lois, and the way she went alone to take care of Jimmy, Clark shouldn´t have left her alone, because Lois is his real soulmate and future love partner, she´s his legendary love wrtitten for him. I disgusted his clana obsession in that moment where Lois needed support company, specially from Clark.


I don't think Clark stayed for Lana, if Clark would have left then who would save Chloe, I doubt Lois would forgive Clark for leaving Chloe in the hands of such a monster like Doomsday, remember Clark still doesn't know the fortress has been taken over. Plus he doesn't know she is his soulmate yet and I doubt you know anybody that meets someone and just says "hey you're my soulmate" that's something you have to go thru and experience to really know that your love, true love

[cloisthelegendbegins]

When Lois first came onto SV one of the things I really liked was her relationship with her cousin Chloe. I don't know why the posters on this board can't see that in the show these 2 characters are like sisters and as fans of both characters or one or the other in particular we shouldn't be promoting this hatred.

Well said Becc!!!

I've always loved the Chlo-Lo and with there being so little 'family' dynamic in the show now I think it's REALLY important. It p!$$es me off royally when there are scenes written that show either of them being uncaring for the other. I loved seeing the scene with them at Isis in Committed - the same in the barn in Bride. And a shared love for Chloe is something Clark and Lois have in common too so all this if you love one girl you can't love the other because they're in competition cr&p really bugs me. If Chloe ended up romantically with Clark I strongly believe as a Lois fan that Lois would have remained close to BOTH of them. From what I see and read a great many Chloe fans who ship romantic Chlark don't seem to feel the same about Lois and Clark ending up together romantically and Chloe remaining close to BOTH of them. So all that Chlo-Lo love and history is given up for a man?! How sad would that be??? It's one thing if it's a man your family disapproves of, but that's not the case here.

----- Added 1 Hours and 13 Minutes later -----

I'm gonna break down your post a little to answer if that's okay Clana4Life. A lot of these questions I've commented on in my massively long War And Peace length post in answer to BadToad but I'm working my way through all the posts I've missed and you bring up some of the points I'd mentioned so I just wanted to answer so you didn't think I was ignoring you ;)


I think the more mature Clark would fight for her, but it's pretty hard to hang in there when the object of your desire keeps saying "no, no, no."



With 7 seasons of him constantly pursuing her, it almost seems implausible that he would suddenly give up now. He didn't even give up when she was married.



But Closithelegendbegins, how much "choice" does Clark have if Lana says "no."

Okay first up - I'm Annie :) Less typing ;)

I see exactly what you're saying, but I've broken your post down like this cos I think you've pretty much answered for me. ITA the more mature Clark would fight for her and he has been shown to fight for her time and time again - as you say and as I said in the really long post - even when she was married. So the fact he is more mature now added to his determination to fight for her in the past even if it meant crossing lines should mean that her saying 'no' isn't an obstacle at all. Being married to someone else and supposedly pregnant with that man's child at the time should have been an even bigger barrier than being told 'maybe Lana Lang and Clark Kent weren't meant to end up together'. So we have to ask what is different this time if he let's her go... After all WE know she's only there for four episodes, WE know there's a time limit - Clark DOESN'T. So going by what we've been shown in the past and how much they loved each other, if he didn't know it was over or wanted to try again or was determined to fight for her, wouldn't we see it happening?

That's my point. We can't say if it wasn't for KK leaving the show they would be together because in the world of Smallville there IS no KK. There's Lana Lang. So if we see Clark Kent making the decision not to fight for her, to let her go and leave the relationship in the past and we then see him moving on we have to accept that. If we accept it then we can't say ANYONE he ends up with in the future is his second choice, because he made the decision to leave his relationship with Lana in the past and he made the decision to pursue a relationship with someone else. If he then stays in the new relationship and it works and they live 'happily ever after' then that makes THAT relationship the RIGHT relationship for him. Does it mean he didn't love Lana? In my opinion no, of course it doesn't. But as the saying goes, sometimes love ain't enough. And if there's one thing we've been shown time and time again on Smallville, it's that no matter how they tried, Lana and Clark's relationship didn't work. Love wasn't enough.

That makes it incredibly sad for both of them but it doesn't make Clark's future love second best. If that was the case then no-one would ever recover from their first love. And speaking as a single gal who lost her first love I find that a VERY depressing thought. :(


The ultimate test of Clark making a decision would be if Lana said she wanted to try again and then Clark had to make the decision as to whether he does or doesn't. But to have the ball in Lana's court means that we'll never truly know what he would have decided on who he would have chosen. We only know that he "respects" her decision. After all, Lana said a lot of things about why the break up was good when she was in the barn loft - Clark said nothing. I don't know that he agrees with her. I enjoyed your post.

I agree. And that's what we need to wait for in the next few episodes with Lana in them. Cos again - Clark doesn't know she's there for a limited appearance. Neither does Lana. Because they're fictional characters. So if she wanted to try again and he wanted to try again then there's nothing stopping them from doing that. We WILL truly know who Clark has chosen because we'll see it onscreen. I totally agree that Lana said a lot about the break up being good when she was in the loft. I also agree that it took guts to make that decision (even if the DVD Dear John was a bit questionable - but we'll see how that one plays out). And I agree Clark said nothing so he hasn't told us how he feels about the break up being for the best. The way he asked 'It's that simple?' shows us he still has questions and doubts - this is the guy that went after her again and again and again even when she was with someone else after all. Right now there's still a lot of pain from the break-up - that was obvious with both of them.

I think there's still more to talk about. I honestly think it will be confronted. And I do think we'll see Clark make his decision. But by not fighting for her the way he always has and by moving on he's already making a decision. Personally I'm waiting for the 'talk'.

But if it's over then it's not over because he wasn't given a choice this time (like at the end of season seven with the DVD) and it's not done because he knows she's left the Smallville universe and is only making a guest appearance. By the very fact Lana has returned the ball IS back in Clark's court. He never respected her decision in the past when she tried to let him go, and often that was at times when he was unsure how she felt about him. This time he knows and if it's what he WANTS then he'll fight for it.

Last time Lana made the decision for both of them she faked her death and left. When she returned it was her decision too. They tried to make the relationship work, things didn't go well no matter how they tried. Then Lana left again - her decision. And she's come back again - her decision. And told him she was right to leave no matter how hard it was for her - her decision.

This time it's all about Clark. It has to be.



Yeah, a lot of people say that Lois is the TRUE love of Clark's life. I don't think so - at least I don't agree with the "true" part. It makes his other loves seem somehow inferior. I think people can have TWO great loves of their life - maybe more. Loving one doesn't have to diminish the love of the other.

Yeah I think the expression 'true love' is open to a lot of interpretation. I think speaking as a Superman fan it comes from the fact that Lois Lane does indeed BECOME Clark Kent's true love. Right now on Smallville he doesn't know that and isn't feeling what Lois is feeling. To me the 'true love' part comes from the fact that the relationship WILL work in the long term. They will weather all the storms and come through all the trials and stand by each other and still be as in love as they were when they first fell for each other. THAT to me is true love and the difference between the 'right one' and 'the one that got way'.

To take it into the area of romanticism if it's 'meant to be' then it works - if it doesn't then all the love in the world can't make it work. I don't think the fact that loving Lois Lane for the rest of his life means that Clark Kent didn't love Lana Lang for a good portion of his life - in any variation of the mythos OR in Smallville. I don't think it makes Lana someone he will ever forget. But true love to me stands the test of time and grows and becomes more of a bond between two people the longer they stay together. Do a boy and a girl who share first love during their early life feel less of a bond in their early years than the man and woman who are married for forty or fifty or sixty years? Yes, I think they do. Because what they experience and share over time bonds them together in a way nothing else can or that bonds them to anyone else in the same way. At least I like to hope that's how it is... :o

Some people will say that makes the first love less that the love that lasts. And maybe in a way it does. But without the experience of first love how can Clark Kent know what is true love when it comes along? The big difference will be that true love lasts. It also waits. But I'll stop now before I break into song :rolleyes: Already in my mind I can hear the lyrics: Sometimes we cry, sometimes we sigh, and that is why, both you and I, know truuueeee love waaaiitsss....

I'll be bringing out the violins next. :o

And soulmates is a whole other discussion and again people will disagree on what it means so I won't go there ;)

Will be interested to hear your opinion on all this. Great points!!!

----- Added 1 Hours and 14 Minutes later -----


I'm not gonna quote because I'm too lazy. But, Intuition says that people may root for EITHER Lois or Chloe with Clark, but like them both as characters. I think people often try to list things against another character to support their thesis that one character should be with Clark and not another.

But, they can still enjoy both characters.

Well said!

----- Added 1 Hours and 41 Minutes later -----


no sorry didnt break my heart-they were settin her up to take the fall. lois fans should be ticked the way they have written her as mooning over clark like that...That is not Lois Lane. i mean we could see snippets her and there but wow...i think that she taking Clark's place as the BDA moper...i think we will see an about face(no pun intended when she comes back and shell take him to task-i hope)
just to clarify this isnt character bashing its writer bashing and there is a difference
and sorry that has nothing to do with being a chloe fan either
besides doesnt she get her man in the end?

First up I think comparing Lois 'mooning over' Clark to the 'mooning' Clark has done in the past is a bit of an exaggeration. If Lois does it for all of season eight and into (a possible) season nine then I think her fans will be severely ticked off. And then some.

A statement like 'This is not Lois Lane' is kinda open to interpretation. In this incarnation it has been established that Lois Lane is very vulnerable when it comes to deep emotions. She has a tough outer wall it's not easy to get past. She doesn't make friends easily and the people she loves she is loyal to like a proverbial 'pit bull'. That's very Lois Lane right there. Then we add in the Lois Lane trait of not intending to fall in love with Clark Kent and the fact that on Smallville she had her heart broken with Oliver. So I think the amount of vulnerability shown is relative to her characterization, her storyline so far and how much she feels for Clark. When she allowed that vulnerability to show and people encouraged her to take a chance, what happened? Heartbreak on a whole new scale. Basically the very thing she feared and because she feels so much it hurts like hell.

So I completely agree there will be an about face when she comes back. It's completely in line with the way her character has been portrayed. If she comes back wearing her heart on her sleeve to the same degree after this experience THEN I'll start to get mad. And THEN she'll be further away from my idea of Lois Lane. I'm keen to see the relationship turned on it's head and I think we need to see how Clark feels for it to be believable. Half the fun of a relationship like Lizzie and Darcy or Lois Lane and Clark Kent is the dance they do around each other. So the thought of that happening on Smallville makes me very excited for the future - even if we don't see them together at the very end.

----- Added 1 Hours and 52 Minutes later -----


I felt more sorry for Jimmy who started the day all happy for his weddding to ending up being ripped apart by a monster.

I think it was a pretty heavy duty episode for all the characters.

Jimmy and Chloe's wedding day ruined. Jimmy savaged and in bad shape. Chloe kidnapped by Doomsday and taken over by Brainiac. Oliver on a vendetta to kill Lex. Lana coming back to face the man she left behind. Lois putting her heart 'out there' and having it crushed. And Clark - poor Clark :( - not only did he have to face the woman who broke his heart with no warning and she came back at the very moment he was taking a tentative step into a new relationship but a monster then gatecrashed the wedding he'd promised would be perfect for his best friend, people were hurt all around him when he could do nothing to stop it, and now his best friend has been kidnapped and he doesn't know where she is...

And then of course there was poor video guy... no-one 'rang his bell' before he got squoodged. Now THAT was tragic!

----- Added 1 Hours and 55 Minutes later -----


Having always been a chlarker, I would have figured my response to Lois would have been "tough ti**ies, that's life". But I felt bad for Lois, and I think it is a direct correlation to the improvement ED has made in playing her character this season. I was a chlarker between I always saw a real chemistry between the two characters. I never sensed that prior to this season between ED and TW. Yes, I know the characters end up together down the road, but I could never imagine that between "this" Lois and TW's Clark.

But this season, Erica is making me a believer. I see a chemistry between Lois and Clark that was missing before. I can now buy that these two will get together because they were meant to be together. I don't know if its due to ED's growth as an actress or because of the direction PS3 have taken this - probably a combination of the two. But yeah, I felt sad for Lois whereas I was frankly fairly numb as far as having any emotional connection to Smallville's Lois.

And I wouldn't bust Clark's unbreakable chops for hurting Lois in this episode. I don't get the sense at all that he did this intentionally. He was completely caught off-guard with Lana's sudden arrival. Gladly, I think he now realizes that clana is dead and will be able to move on. But he will have to be able to leap tall buildings in a single bound to leap over the wall that Lois is building around her heart.

Just had to say GREAT POST. :D

[Clana4Life]

Yes, it's another long post from me :o Skip/skim or read at will ;)

Clark may have told himself he has moved on, Lana has now told him she has, but until we see HIM make that realization in an unambiguous way the relationship isn't truly over and the debates will go on and on and on. I honestly think this is a big part of why his feelings for Lois haven't been openly explored. They sold us on the Lana for seven years with varying degrees and at times lack of success. That can't be resolved in ten episodes when Lana is missing for nine of them.

BUT and it's a big but here, regardless of whether or not Lana has an outside reason to have left the way she did and if she still does have the kind of feelings for him that make her want to be with him if it wasn't for x, y and z, if CLARK makes the decision not to fight to keep the relationship this time then people have to accept that is that. This is the guy that continued pursuing her when she was a married, supposedly pregnant woman (a storyline this Superman/Clark Kent fan hated with the same loathing as she did the absentee father storyline in SR btw). He continued fighting to save the relationship after she'd stolen money from Lex, after she lied to him about her Isis Foundation work, after she slept with Bizarro. Yes, he blamed himself for everything bad that had happened to her too but the fact is he still FOUGHT FOR HER. So if he let's the relationship go now it's a HUGE DECISION and shows a big change, especially considering everything they've been through. A pro-active, mature Clark who has come so far in so many ways this season wouldn't be afraid to continue fighting for the relationship he wanted that much imo. Especially considering how much he fought in the past. So once we see the decision made it's MADE.

Anyone who comes after her isn't by any means a second choice. She'll be the woman he has feelings for and who he makes the decision to BE WITH. And IMO at this point it will be a much more mature relationship than we have seen in the past. He has experience behind him now, good and bad, and any relationship he enters into from here on in should benefit from that.



ITA. And that's the way it should be. He is neither shallow or inconsiderate and he's been shown that way. What I think he has been in the past and rightly so considering what age he was supposed to be, is naive. Part of his problem with Lana was what Lana accused him of in a barn scene once - he had a picture of her as someone she wasn't. She made decisions both good and bad as everyone does - and those experiences changed her from the innocent girl-next-door figure. But Clark's perception of her remained the same. I think everyone is guilty of this at some time or another in their life, especially when 'blinded' by love. He doesn't know the real Lana, from what we were shown in Bride, he still doesn't. And how can he know if she's the one for him to spend the rest of his life with if he doesn't know her faults and all? We're not talking small things here either - like what she's like when she has a horrible cold, or when she doesn't shave her legs or when she has monster PMT. We're talking about a woman who would KILL to protect him, who has been shown to be vengeful, who will do whatever she needs to do to survive no matter what line it crosses. That doesn't make her the villain of the piece, but what it does is it goes against many of the core values that Clark Kent holds dear. No matter what the Luthors have done in the past he still told Oliver 'you can't punish the son for the sins of the father'. This to me is a key reason why Lana isn't the right woman for Clark. Now if she confessed all those things, I don't doubt Clark would forgive her and partly blame himself for everything but she would then have to CHANGE and the pattern of behavior would have to stop. And we're not seeing this. That means that the problems continue to exist in the long term and quite simply, they aren't right for each other.



Annie :), I agree that it would be huge decision if Clark decided of his own accord not to pursue the relationship. He essentially has four episodes to do this. I think the "light switch" will be hit again, because I don't see him all of sudden deciding this given his interaction with her in Bride. Perhaps if KK stayed around for more than five eps they could do this in a realistic manner. It probably will happen, but it will feel rushed - at least for me. :)


As for Lana punishing the son for the sins of the father of vice versa, I think her aim was to punish them both for their individual sins - Lex for what he did to her and Lionel for threatening to kill Clark. But we have seen Lana change her behavior. You are right in that Clark could never be with a person bent on revenge, but she has changed. We've seen that on multiple episodes. She first discussed this with Lionel telling him that she wasn't going to lie anymore and that she needed to be the type of person Clark can love again. And we hear the same thing out of Lana's mouth when talking to Oliver about being like Clark. She even encouraged Oliver to be above trying to kill Lex. So what we have is a Lana who has made mistakes, but one who has also learned and changed as a result. Clark knows all about what Lana has done, so I don't understand your argument about her needing to confess to Clark. Maybe I misunderstood. He knows the good, bad and ugly. Given the fact that she has changed (and Lois notwithstanding) why wouldn't she be right for Clark at this point? I don't feel like we are left with a good reason. Clark doesn't know that Lois is his iconic love, so it just makes me wonder.

About true love -- I don't know how to break posts up like you. :) I pretty much agree with you said, I was just thinking that some times things happen to cause love to go amiss. I think of death for instance. Two people who are in love and right and it works out and one dies. Well, after time the one living moves on and marries another and loves them just as deeply. I think both could be considered "true love." I think it's the "true" that gives me pause. Given that I've seen how much he loves Lana, it's hard to say that he'll love someone else more. I've no doubt that he will love Lois deeply, equally so. I realize that that relationship will endure, but even so, can we say that he loved one more than the other? I often think that's what is meant when people add the "true" before the love. Your thoughts?

[Becc]

I think saying the 'majority of' is a little unfair to both Chloe and Lois fans. But yes, seeing your post after another similar post shows that this thing goes both ways. So if those of us caught in the middle could try and show a little more respect both ways it would help not only us but the K-Site moderators too imo.

See, I'm a BSG fan too and I have a friend who is a Mod there and a work colleague in real life and we spend LOADS of time talking about it on MSNMessenger but after my experience here I will NEVER join the online community no matter how much she tries to persuade me. Hell, we spent an afternoon in London a year ago tramping around Hammersmith talking pictures of her below signs for the Spollo cos she's such a Jamie Bamber fan :lol:

TBH I don't see the bashing MORE on one side or the other when it comes to 'shipping'. It's the same handful everytime. I'm just tired of it is all. And I'll say so whenever I see it now. Same for Lana fans who bash Chloe or more likely Lois. Or for anyone who constantly bashes Clark. I think we can discuss the characters in a thread set up to discuss that character WITHOUT having to compare them detrimentally to another character. And let's face facts - it's always a competition between the three girls, isn't it? Which makes everyone think it's about shipping.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

ETA: That should read Apollo - not Spollo. Stoopid editing key on my comp STILL not working :(

That's for replying. I guess maybe I was being a little sensitive. -perhaps I have to take a step back and try to watch the show without peoples negative comments ringing in my ears.

And yay for another BSG fan, I can't wait for that show to come backon, and I love Apollo too.

----- Added 7 Minutes later -----


Well said Becc!!!

I've always loved the Chlo-Lo and with there being so little 'family' dynamic in the show now I think it's REALLY important. It p!$$es me off royally when there are scenes written that show either of them being uncaring for the other. I loved seeing the scene with them at Isis in Committed - the same in the barn in Bride. And a shared love for Chloe is something Clark and Lois have in common too so all this if you love one girl you can't love the other because they're in competition cr&p really bugs me. If Chloe ended up romantically with Clark I strongly believe as a Lois fan that Lois would have remained close to BOTH of them. From what I see and read a great many Chloe fans who ship romantic Chlark don't seem to feel the same about Lois and Clark ending up together romantically and Chloe remaining close to BOTH of them. So all that Chlo-Lo love and history is given up for a man?! How sad would that be??? It's one thing if it's a man your family disapproves of, but that's not the case here.



I completely agree cloisthelegendbegins.

[davidbrenton]

OMG. I'm way to lazy to read this page. Is someone taking cliff's notes?

[EternalTwilight]

OMG. I'm way to lazy to read this page. Is someone taking cliff's notes?

:rotfl:

I'm browsing other threads while this one slows down so I can read it later.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

I agree that it would be huge decision if Clark decided of his own accord not to pursue the relationship. However, it's hard to pursue a relationship when one of the two continues to say, "no, it's over" repeatedly.

Again - honestly - call me Annie. Less typing and everyone who knows me after a post or two does :)

I would agree with you if she hadn't said no in the past and he ignored it and if we weren't looking at one conversation in Bride. Right now we're talking about one 'no,it's over' in relation to a couple that have a long history of ignoring the rejection from one or the other of them. We're not talking about repeatedly. And it's not a case of them not knowing how they feel at this point. In the DVD Lana made it clear it wasn't that she didn't love him. Didn't she say she would love him forever? Or that he had no idea how much she loved him? Clark is the guy who continued to fight for her when she told him it was over and she married someone else. So unless he has doubts of his own at this point then I don't see why he would accept that one rejection in Bride - especially when season eight has seen him as more confident and pro-active than ever before.


Her being in another country is another impediment. I think the real test would be if she said she wanted to try again and he said NO. He essentially has four episodes to do this. I think the "light switch" will be hit again, because I don't see him all of sudden deciding this given his interaction with her in Bride. Perhaps if KK stayed around for more than five eps they could do this in a realistic manner.

Yes, being in another country is another impediment - but again been there, done that. Only difference is last time she came back from China and made it plain from the get go that she wanted to be with him. Her decision to come back, her decision to make a go of things - Clark's decision to make a go of things. This time again, her decision to come back, her decision whether or not to stay - this time she has said no once and Clark hasn't had a chance yet to make a decision of his own. Going by past history, one 'no, it's over' wouldn't be an impediment to him. And again, Clark doesn't know she's only there for a four episode visit after this. Right now we know he has other things on his mind.

But Clark making the decision to accept the 'no' this time and not to fight for her is no more of a lightswitch in five episodes of season eight than it was for him to forgive her for faking her own death, stealing money from Lex, trying to kill Lex, sleeping with Bizarro and keeping Isis secrets from him during nine episodes in season seven (Fierce to Siren inclusive). None of the things that happened in season seven stopped him from fighting to keep their relationship alive, so why would one 'no' in one episode of a five episode arc stop him from fighting again? His interaction with her suggested acceptance, I agree. But he doesn't know the real reason why she left anymore than we do (if it's different from the DVD) and he doesn't know what she's been doing ever since she left anymore than we do. If she tells him she has been working to protect him then knowing how deeply he felt for her and taking into consideration all he did to fight for her in the past don't you think knowing that and adding it to the fact he knows she loves him he wouldn't be prepared to let her go? Again - he doesn't know she's only got five episodes. He got over the Bizarro thing in one episode, her trying to kill Lex when she had his superpowers in less than one. Smallville isn't famous for taking time to deal with things in what everyone considers a realistic manner. And considering how much they packed into nine episodes before the writers strike last year I think there's plenty of time for us to see it's his decision and not just hers.


As for Lana punishing the son for the sins of the father of vice versa, I think her aim was to punish them both for their individual sins - Lex for what he did to her and Lionel for threatening to kill Clark. But we have seen Lana change her behavior. You are right in that Clark could never be with a person bent on revenge, but she has changed. We've seen that on multiple episodes. She first discussed this with Lionel telling him that she wasn't going to lie anymore and that she needed to be the type of person Clark can love again. And we hear the same thing out of Lana's mouth when talking to Oliver about being like Clark. She even encouraged Oliver to be above trying to kill Lex. So what we have is a Lana who has made mistakes, but one who has also learned and changed as a result. Clark knows all about what Lana has done, so I don't understand your argument about her needing to confess to Clark. He knows the good, bad and ugly. Given the fact that she has changed (and Lois notwithstanding) why wouldn't she be right for Clark at this point?

Actually there's some stuff I agree with you in here. Except it's out of order a little timeline wise.

She said to Lionel she needed to be the type of person Clark could love BEFORE she tried to kill Lex when she had Clark's superpowers. This was also while she continued to lie about Isis. The Bizarro arc was resolved with Clark telling Lana he wanted to fight for their relationship in Siren and for three episodes we saw less of them onscreen but we knew they were getting along and working on their relationship and all was well then in Veritas Brainiac took her over. Lionel was dead an episode later and the next time we saw Lana was in the DVD goodbye in the series finale.

Now we have her back in Bride and Clark is as unaware of what she's been doing as we are. BUT she has been doing something cos we saw her in Cuba and we saw the text message she received. ITA with what you're saying about the Oliver conversation . But I'm going by past behavior. What she said to Lionel about lying and being more like the person Clark could love was canceled out when she continued lying to Clark about Isis and tried to kill Lex - showing she hadn't changed. She told Oliver everyone should be more like Clark - now we wait and see what she's been up to in Cuba and see if she's been putting that into practice. I really hope she has. I think after everything both Lana AND Clark deserve to be at peace with the decisions they make and are able to go on with their lives without constantly looking back.

----- Added 24 Minutes later -----


About true love -- I don't know how to break posts up like you. :) I pretty much agree with you said, I was just thinking that some times things happen to cause love to go amiss. I think of death for instance. Two people who are in love and right and it works out and one dies. Well, after time the one living moves on and marries another and loves them just as deeply. I think both could be considered "true love." I think it's the "true" that gives me pause. Given that I've seen how much he loves Lana, it's hard to say that he'll love someone else more. I've no doubt that he will love Lois deeply, equally so. I realize that that relationship will endure, but even so, can we say that he loved one more than the other? I often think that's what is meant when people add the "true" before the love. Your thoughts?

Can I just say I LOVE this discussion!!! Calm discussion back and forth about characters without digs and arguments?! It's K-Site HEAVEN :D THIS is exactly what I thought I'd find here when I signed up. You have renewed my faith ;)

That's a great example of another perspective on true love - you're right. I completely get what you're saying. And it's the fact there are different ways of looking it that makes it so difficult to define. But then if love was simple, eh?

Maybe it's the long term potential of the relationship that makes me look at it differently with Lana and Lois. Nothing can take away from the way Lana and Clark have felt about each other over the past seven seasons of Smallville, but it wasn't exactly a relationship that worked for either of them (Clark blames himself for the majority of that but Lana did make decisions on her own that didn't work out well either). I hope you won't take offense by me saying that. In your example of loving someone and them dying and then the person left behind loving again both relationships have to have worked for them to be considered 'true' love is I guess where I would stand on it. If the first relationship didn't work, the death of that person can elevate it to something it maybe wasn't. There's a lot more to a relationship working than love. BUT if that first relationship had worked and they had been a great match and the relationship was healthy for both of them then indeed that could be classified as 'true love' and 'true love lost'. Then even if the next relationship worked, they matched and it was healthy it could never be more than what came before. The same in reverse - first one worked, they matched, healthy and second didn't then the second could never live up to the first.

In this case Clark and Lana have been through SO MUCH and yet it still hasn't worked. If it had neither one of them would have felt the need to leave or would have needed the guts to make that decision. So for whatever reason people choose to single out - it just didn't work. So that to me was no less love, but it wasn't as 'true' a love as the one that holds people together no matter what. I think that's where the line is. We have yet to see that on Smallville with Lois and Clark either way - we might never see it. But the people who refer to it as 'true love' know it's a love that has weathered many, many, many things in varying incarnations of the Superman/Clark Kent story. Not been proven on the big screen so much, granted. But in comic book mythology they're happily married and still passionately in love - the relationship has worked - hence it's a 'truer love' than the love affairs that didn't work with other people.

Does that make sense?

[davidbrenton]

Whoa. And the next chapter of the novel continues.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

That's for replying. I guess maybe I was being a little sensitive. -perhaps I have to take a step back and try to watch the show without peoples negative comments ringing in my ears.

Anytime Becc! And we can ALL get a little too sensitive at times. It's a credit to the show that we feel that way about the characters we love. And we all have to take that step back sometimes for that exact reason. I had to. I even took a break from K-Site for a few weeks to cool down when it was really getting to me. I'm much calmer now - and meeting people like you and Clana4Life and being able to talk calmly about the show we love makes me glad I didn't give up. :) I just wish more people could find middle ground. We're all here because of the show after all...


And yay for another BSG fan, I can't wait for that show to come backon, and I love Apollo too.

Same here! And I watched the original series when it was shown on repeats so I came to this version of BSG with the same kind of skepticism I did when I started watching Smallville. I just didn't see how new versions of things I already loved could possibly measure up to the originals. But BSG is AMAZING. And I LOVE Smallville. So any new versions of pre-existing stories I trip across after this I'll go into with a more open mind ;) I think BSG has actually helped me accept even more that so long as a story makes sense and it holds my attention and I can get attached to the characters then I'm fine with a different version of the original. But then I'm a mythos fan who has no problem whatsoever with original Smallville characters being part of Clark Kent's journey and adding to it. Mind you - if they'd made Lois Lane A MAN.... :mad:



I completely agree cloisthelegendbegins.

It's Annie ;)

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


OMG. I'm way to lazy to read this page. Is someone taking cliff's notes?

:rotfl:

Believe me, when I find people who can discuss things without it starting world war three it's WORTH discussing things in depth ;) It's like finding the genie in the lamp and getting three wishes. You take your time. You appreciate the momentary magic. You don't WASTE IT.

Because tomorrow I might be answering hate posts with nothing more than:

:rolleyes:

[MrZeppo]

I've been really thinking about this and I really like this new take on the Lois and Clark storyline.

Here's the thing. Sometimes canon can suck. I always loved the story of Superman and Lois Lane, but we've seen that. Over and over and over. Most of the time the Lois Lane people here are complaining about seeing is a Lois that has been portrayed already.

Let's be honest here. Part of the downside of the saga of the classic Lois and Clark storyline was Lois loved Superman and didn't give Clark Kent a second look. I've heard many explanations, Superman's obvious power, his inherent good being an inspiration, while Clark appeared weak and timid, but part of it seemed almost... groupie-ish, you know? And Clark, obviously knowing the real situation was always bothered by it. And this is the only flaw in the Superman story, because it makes Lois appear very shallow.

Seriously, think about it. The comics, as much as I am a fan, always portrayed Lois very close to Superman, the disguise, and being indifferent to Clark, the man. Is that really what anyone wants to see again? Their relationship, while called a friendship, really didn't seem like it until recent years in the comics when Clark wooed Lois and later revealed who he really was to her.

Yes, Lois wasn't a part of Clark's life in the classic story. But this isn't the classic story. And they really humanize and updated the characters in a way that you have never seen before. For a new era. What Smallville did for me was give their story a bigger history, firmly established a friendship, which I think MANY past incarnations don't do for them. The way Erica portrays Lois, with the backstory that they have established, makes her believable as a character. I like that she can be vulnerable and has insecurities. I will admit, I felt bad for Lois in Bride. Just like I used to feel bad for Chloe when she used to have feelings for Clark.

I like how they have had 4 years to establish a begrudging friendship, admiration, and fondness for each other. I think it's funny how when the show started it was hard to picture them together because of their hostility for each other, but now I can't wait for it to happen. People may deny it, but they have been slowly building to this. I like that Lois is falling for Clark now, before Superman becomes public, because he is a good man, and that is the quality I do want to see in Lois. I don't want her to be dumb and blind as she's been portrayed so many times in the past. Plus their chemistry really works sometimes (sometimes it's awkward, but I think it's designed to feel like that given their history.), I've noticed that over the years Clark will smile in a way towards Lois in a way he doesn't really give anyone. I like that she challenges him and I believe that as much as she may need him, he really does need her now.

I think in the end, the realization will come to Clark as it comes to so many of us. It will be the moment when he realizes who he really can't live without.

[davidbrenton]

Believe me, when I find people who can discuss things without it starting world war three it's WORTH discussing things in depth ;) It's like finding the genie in the lamp and getting three wishes. You take your time. You appreciate the momentary magic. You don't WASTE IT.

Because tomorrow I might be answering hate posts with nothing more than:

:rolleyes:

Oh man. Now I wanna read it. But, I'm too tired. I'm going to sleep and then read it tomorrow at work. I'll post my thoughts and I promise not to fight. Good night.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

I've been really thinking about this and I really like this new take on the Lois and Clark storyline.

Here's the thing. Sometimes canon can suck. I always loved the story of Superman and Lois Lane, but we've seen that. Over and over and over. Most of the time the Lois Lane people here are complaining about seeing is a Lois that has been portrayed already.

Let's be honest here. Part of the downside of the saga of the classic Lois and Clark storyline was Lois loved Superman and didn't give Clark Kent a second look. I've heard many explanations, Superman's obvious power, his inherent good being an inspiration, while Clark appeared weak and timid, but part of it seemed almost... groupie-ish, you know? And Clark, obviously knowing the real situation was always bothered by it. And this is the only flaw in the Superman story, because it makes Lois appear very shallow.

Seriously, think about it. The comics, as much as I am a fan, always portrayed Lois very close to Superman, the disguise, and being indifferent to Clark, the man. Is that really what anyone wants to see again? Their relationship, while called a friendship, really didn't seem like it until recent years in the comics when Clark wooed Lois and later revealed who he really was to her.

Yes, Lois wasn't a part of Clark's life in the classic story. But this isn't the classic story. And they really humanize and updated the characters in a way that you have never seen before. For a new era. What Smallville did for me was give their story a bigger history, firmly established a friendship, which I think MANY past incarnations don't do for them. The way Erica portrays Lois, with the backstory that they have established, makes her believable as a character. I like that she can be vulnerable and has insecurities. I will admit, I felt bad for Lois in Bride. Just like I used to feel bad for Chloe when she used to have feelings for Clark.

I like how they have had 4 years to establish a begrudging friendship, admiration, and fondness for each other. I think it's funny how when the show started it was hard to picture them together because of their hostility for each other, but now I can't wait for it to happen. People may deny it, but they have been slowly building to this. I like that Lois is falling for Clark now, before Superman becomes public, because he is a good man, and that is the quality I do want to see in Lois. I don't want her to be dumb and blind as she's been portrayed so many times in the past. Plus their chemistry really works sometimes (sometimes it's awkward, but I think it's designed to feel like that given their history.), I've noticed that over the years Clark will smile in a way towards Lois in a way he doesn't really give anyone. I like that she challenges him and I believe that as much as she may need him, he really does need her now.

I think in the end, the realization will come to Clark as it comes to so many of us. It will be the moment when he realizes who he really can't live without.

You've pretty much said the majority of things that I feel - particularly about the depth of characterization on the show. It makes it more 'real' and 'relevant' to modern day viewers imo. Because in the comics, in the dated movies of the seventies and in the recent film that followed on from those dated movies and in the LnC: TNAoS TV Show there has always been that 'parody' element to the Superman story and it's characters. There's no real depth to them - particularly the villains. It's understandable that with a limited time frame in a film and limited space in a comic book that we don't get to delve into the characters to any great degree - not without sacrificing action. Smallville is the first show to delve deep. Because they've been on the air for so long they've had time to show that depth to the characters and Lex Luthor for example is probably the best Lex Luthor I have ever seen ANYWHERE. I can see MRLex as a fitting adversary for Superman and there's no way in hell his master plan would involve real estate! To me Lex is a reinventing on a par with what was done with some of the villains in the new Batman franchise. The movie reboot of Superman could learn a LOT from Smallville imo.

Because I think a big part of moving the Superman story into another generation is by shaking it up the same way Batman was shook up. And for me that means characters I care about. In SR Lois Lane was a weak shadow of the Lois Lane I love. Superman was too god-like and detached for me. Clark Kent was a mere shadow of the Clark Kent we have learned to love on Smallville. The things that will attach me to characters onscreen are the things I understand from real life: fear, pain, indecision, confusion, determination, doubt, love, heartache, loss, laughter, emotional vulnerability and so on and so on and so on. There's no reason why these can't be included in story. If they're not then the characters are flat. Smallville has shown all those things in the characters and more.

It's made me care enough about the characters to tune in week after week for years and I would never have gotten emotionally attached to any of them or cared about their journey if the pattern hadn't been broken and the story re-told in a completely new way.

GREAT POST! :D

[Clana4Life]

Again - honestly - call me Annie. Less typing and everyone who knows me after a post or two does :)


Actually there's some stuff I agree with you in here. Except it's out of order a little timeline wise.

She said to Lionel she needed to be the type of person Clark could love BEFORE she tried to kill Lex when she had Clark's superpowers. This was also while she continued to lie about Isis. The Bizarro arc was resolved with Clark telling Lana he wanted to fight for their relationship in Siren and for three episodes we saw less of them onscreen but we knew they were getting along and working on their relationship and all was well then in Veritas Brainiac took her over. Lionel was dead an episode later and the next time we saw Lana was in the DVD goodbye in the series finale.

Now we have her back in Bride and Clark is as unaware of what she's been doing as we are. BUT she has been doing something cos we saw her in Cuba and we saw the text message she received. ITA with what you're saying about the Oliver conversation . But I'm going by past behavior. What she said to Lionel about lying and being more like the person Clark could love was canceled out when she continued lying to Clark about Isis and tried to kill Lex - showing she hadn't changed. She told Oliver everyone should be more like Clark - now we wait and see what she's been up to in Cuba and see if she's been putting that into practice. I really hope she has. I think after everything both Lana AND Clark deserve to be at peace with the decisions they make and are able to go on with their lives without constantly looking back.



Annie, maybe I have it wrong. I've been re-watching Season 7 with my sister to catch her up. She's been out of the country and hasn't seen the show in a year, but we've been watching everything in order. This has been recent. I just double checked too to make sure. Lana tried to kill Lex in Wrath. That was before Persona (where Bizarro is destroyed). The next episode after Persona is Siren and in that episode Lionel tries to blackmail Lana into helping him find out if Lex killed Grant/Julian. Lana fesses up to Clark about it, they have a bit of an argument. Then Lana goes to see Lionel later on in that epi and tells him there will be no more lies between her and Clark and that Clark knows everything now. She ends the convo by saying she needs to be the type of person Clark can love again. At the end of that episode Lana is about to leave and Clark stops her by saying he didn't want to give up on them yet, and so she stays. The next episode is Fracture followed by Hero. Lana doesn't try to do anything to Lex or Lionel from her last conversation with Lionel on. She actually doesn't do anything after Wrath really. Post Siren, they don't have much interaction, but they seem to be fine in offscreen land until Brainiac comes along. I said all of that to say that I think her "turning a new leaf" is legitimate and her conversation with Oliver further proves that for me. Check me on this to make sure I'm right about the order or I can PM you and tell you the site I visited to get the order of the eps.

I agree with what you said about true love. I would love to be able to call Clana true love. But I think given the way things will end and his enduring relationship with Lois, I'll just have to settle for a very strong, persevering first love that endured about a decade. I must admit that's longer than the typical first love lasts, so I'll be content with that. :)

Hey Annie, I'm glad you're enjoying posting and reading the threads again!

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Annie, maybe I have it wrong. I've been re-watching Season 7 with my sister to catch her up. She's been out of the country and hasn't seen the show in a year, but we've been watching everything in order. This has been recent. I just double checked too to make sure. Lana tried to kill Lex in Wrath. That was before Persona (where Bizarro is destroyed). The next episode after Persona is Siren and in that episode Lionel tries to blackmail Lana into helping him find out if Lex killed Grant/Julian. Lana fesses up to Clark about it, they have a bit of an argument. Then Lana goes to see Lionel later on in that epi and tells him there will be no more lies between her and Clark and that Clark knows everything now. She ends the convo by saying she needs to be the type of person Clark can love again. At the end of that episode Lana is about to leave and Clark stops her by saying he didn't want to give up on them yet, and so she stays. The next episode is Fracture followed by Hero. Lana doesn't try to do anything to Lex or Lionel from her last conversation with Lionel on. She actually doesn't do anything after Wrath really. Post Siren, they don't have much interaction, but they seem to be fine in offscreen land until Brainiac comes along. I said all of that to say that I think her "turning a new leaf" is legitimate and her conversation with Oliver further proves that for me. Check me on this to make sure I'm right about the order or I can PM you and tell you the site I visited to get the order of the eps.


Ha! You made me go look! And you're absolutely right. She does go back to Lionel and say that:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUesCh_lHbo

I stand, well actually that's a lie, I sit corrected :o

I've got that scene mixed up with an earlier scene in Action when Lionel confronts Lana after he escapes from the cabin she had him held hostage in. So I apologize!

What I was trying to show was a pattern of behavior. Earlier in the season we had Cure where Clark tells Lana that Lex claimed she stole $10 million from him. Lana says the money was a divorce settlement that she intends to use to help meteor-infected people. And when Clark looks doubtful Lana hugs him and says she'd never hide anything from him. Then she's seen entering an abandoned building where one room is full of high-tech surveillance equipment she's using to spy on Lex.

So she lied.

Then in Action We find out Lana is paying Marilyn to keep Lionel captive. And we have the Lionel/Lana scene that I had mixed up with the scene you're referring to:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwMLGvnWpkE

Two episodes later we have Wrath where she tries to kill Lex. Then we have Persona three episodes later where she's sleeping with Bizarro then Siren where we have your Lionel/Lana scene and she says there won't be secrets between her and Clark.

So yes, between Siren and Bride she could well have held true to that and changed. One small thing still though - have we seen her tell Clark about holding Lionel hostage? And going by her previous behavior and how strained her relationship was with Clark in Siren (when she told Clark that it 'was easier telling the phantom things because he was more affectionate and understanding' - OUCH!), would she have told him about the dead woman Lionel was trying to blackmail her with if Lionel hadn't tried to use it as leverage? The first one I haven't seen happening - so if you have let me know ;) And the second is open to interpretation.

I'd love if she has in fact changed, the doubt I have would be based on past behavior and the fact she's already keeping secrets from him again as hinted by her being in Cuba and the text message she received. But that one I'll have to wait and see played out...

Like I've said, after all they've been through it would be great to see their relationship end on a better note, with closure for both of them so that neither one has to keep looking back. I'm just wary at this point.

I agree with what you said about true love. I would love to be able to call Clana true love. But I think given the way things will end and his enduring relationship with Lois, I'll just have to settle for a very strong, persevering first love that endured about a decade. I must admit that's longer than the typical first love lasts, so I'll be content with that. :)

Absolutely to the bolded part! How many of us would have battled through what they battled through? I would like to say I would fight for the relationship that long, but the truth is I doubt I would have knowing me. I think the tragedy of Lana and Clark is that love wasn't enough. There's a lot of us who would like to believe it is, but the truth is it isn't. It's way more complicated than that.


Annie, I'm glad you're enjoying posting and reading the threads again!

Thanks Jana! It's posters like you the make it fun to be here talking about the show we love :)

And I know this has kinda been off topic for the thread but it's been a really interesting discussion so I hope no-one minds it being here :o

[jimmyolsenblues]

i felt for lois...she really loves clark now and the pain of rejection was clearly on her face.
nicely acted moment for erica

[LCforever]

OMG. I'm way to lazy to read this page. Is someone taking cliff's notes?

ITA. I'm gonna need a nice iced tea and sofa to read all this. Still, I'm happy that people are responding to it all.

I believe too that Clark needs to figure out his feelings before there is a full blown romance with Lois. (let's hope it starts S9!!) Lois does deserve it. She deserves Superman!!

[Guidron]

In the words of Keanu Reeves: 'Woah!'

There is a LOT of reading material on this page (especially since I view it at max posts at a time) Annie, Jana (hope neither mind first names), it's awesome to see a deep CIVIL conversation occurring in a Lois themed thread. Both of you have made some excellent points and I wish I had the time and energy at the moment to join in. I don't however (silly work gets in the way :P) so I'll just leave it with an 'I pretty much agree with everything said' and a kudos to civilized conversation!

[ticker]

Since the poll is closed I'll add +1 for Yes! I was practically bawling my eyes out!!

I mean Clark, what were you thinking?!?!

[Bane]

My heart didn't break for Lois, but it was sad that she didn't get a chance to express herself, even after all the mayhem was over. She'll get her chance soon, though.

[justme_007]

Yeah, he pretty much forgot her the moment Lana walked in. To me that says a lot. I dunno, maybe Lois should take a second look at Oliver again. He was all sweet and listening to her at the wedding. Clark on other hand was in "Lana-mode": running to save Lana first - staying at the hospital with Lana until she said "go", asking Lana if it was so easy for her to leave him. It doesn't really seem like he's moved on. It just makes it feel like Lois is second choice only because Lana doesn't want to try again. But the ball seems to be in Lana's court. For that reason, I do feel sorry for Lois. It doesn't feel good to know that you can only be noticed by the guy you secretly love only when his ex is not around. :(

Lois is the second choice :\ i felt sorry for her.... but i have to admit that i also laught. that was so embarrasing. she is so in love with him, and he forgot the almost kiss as if nothing has happened..... :rotfl: it has to be so painful for lois. she made a better match with oliver no doubt.... :cool: i was starting to like the clois ship but after this clark´s behaviour .... i just laught ... have to be honest.

[melissan02]

Lois is the second choice :\ i felt sorry for her.... but i have to admit that i also laught. that was so embarrasing. she is so in love with him, and he forgot the almost kiss as if nothing has happened..... :rotfl: it has to be so painful for lois. she made a better match with oliver no doubt.... :cool: i was starting to like the clois ship but after this clark´s behaviour .... i just laught ... have to be honest.

Whatev!?! Puhlease!! :rolleyes:
Lois isn't second choice. What Lana and Clark had obviously wasn't the real thing.

Like many who have first loves in our lives, we don't later choose to marry someone else thinking that they're "second" choice. Instead, we look back at the relationship we had that didn't work out and learn from our mistakes to move on to the REAL thing.
Which in this case is...Lois and Clark/Superman!!;)

As a huge CLOISer, I was glad the episode turned out the way it did with Clois. She'll be back as the resolute Lois we all know;)....and Clark...well-- just you wait for his demeanor upon her return. ;) It will blissfully show!! ;)

And clearly by then...(heck, even now!!:p) ....Lana will be the relationship of the past...that didn't work out...and (in her words, mind you!)..."wasn't meant to be!" :pheeheeheehee
Now that's what makes me laugh!!:lol:

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

No!!!!!! She made a massive deal out of it. No matter who walked in, anybody that Clark hadn't seen for months, he would have stopped. Just because it was Lana, Lois created in her head that Clark still loves her. Its total rubbish.


If Pete Ross, Martha, Lex, Milton Fines, the Green Arrow, Bart, MM or even Shelby had of entered he would have stoppped and turned round. Lois just sees Lana and thinks Clark is in love with her.


Its not like he went over to her and smacked her one on the lips. Total over reaction, Clark would have thought more of her if she went over and said hello. Total primma donna.

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----

It was because she was no longer the centre of Clarks attention, someone not Lana, had stolen her away from him. I even think if Martha had of walked in and Clark had of said "high Mum" and went to say hello, Lois still would have stormed out

----- Added 10 Minutes later -----

I'll bet a tenner the next poster is a ......

[Jade4813]

If Pete Ross, Martha, Lex, Milton Fines, the Green Arrow, Bart, MM or even Shelby had of entered he would have stoppped and turned round. Lois just sees Lana and thinks Clark is in love with her.

...

It had nothing to do with Lana, or him not kissing her. It was because she was no longer the centre of Clarks attention. If Clark had of went to talk to one of the above and left her there she would have stormed off in a hump. Lana had nothing to do with it.

:rolleyes:

You don't think her assumption that Clark was still in love with Lana wasn't warranted at all? Well, let's see... as far as she knows, her last few encounters with Clark regarding the Lana situation...

* She held him while he cried over Lana leaving him.
* He's mentioned having watched Lana's breakup video "more than once."
* She knows he's been in love with Lana for ages (certainly while she's been on the show).
* As of last year, she was referring to Clark and Lana as the "perfect couple" and Clark wasn't protesting.
* When she mentioned him being on his own, he got quiet, which she called the "missing Lana blues" - and AGAIN he didn't protest.

Yup. It's just totally insane for her to think that Clark still has feelings for Lana. Really jumping the gun there. Absolutely just being huffy for the sake of being huffy. It wasn't at all based off the fact that, you know, as far as she knows because of what he's both said and not said, he actually still is in love with Lana.

:rolleyes:

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


It was because she was no longer the centre of Clarks attention, someone not Lana, had stolen her away from him. I even think if Martha had of walked in and Clark had of said "high Mum" and went to say hello, Lois still would have stormed out

Your speculation is interesting, but I bet she would have, you know, hugged Martha or something.


I'll bet a tenner the next poster is a ......

I probably won you your tenner. On the other hand, if statements are made that are so obviously fallacious that they beg comment...I suppose it's only to be expected that people comment.

[Kevin24]

I agree that Clark would have reacted the same way if it had anybody else he hasn't seen in a long time. Lois reaction is understandable because of the history between Clark & Lana. It is pretty safe to assume that Clark may still have lingering feelings for her deep inside.

Clark needs closure because things ended abruptly and he never had a say in it at all. They just need to hash things out since Lana is the one who is pulling away. She is the one saying it was for the best. In my opinion, Clark has to say these things and realize they aren't meant to be. We still have no idea what he thinks of her return because Lana is the only one who was talking on the matter.

Do I think Lana was BSing? Hell yeah I do!

She most likely saw Clark almost kiss Lois so she must assume that he has moved on already. Her act on the loft was all a front to show that she is all good with what is going on.

Anyway, Did my heart break for Lois? Yeah it did.

[Kalista]

I'll bet a tenner the next poster is a ......

:lol:

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

:rolleyes:

You don't think her assumption that Clark was still in love with Lana wasn't warranted at all? Well, let's see... as far as she knows, her last few encounters with Clark regarding the Lana situation...


obviously fallacious

Well first, this is just the typical reaction of a girl when her now boyfriend runs into his ex. They think hes still in love with them. If he was he would be with her. If Clark still loved Lana he wouldn't be hanging round with Lois, he would literally stuck to Lana. Lois doesn't give herself enough credit. Plus she didn't even hang around to see what he did. The fact that she didn't even go and welcome Lana shows me that her hatred lies with Lana, not the fact that Clark turned around to notice her, and remember Lois turned around to see Lana just as quick as Clark.

Obviously fallacious. The confidence! Just becasuse you know that Clark will finally end up with Lois doesn't mean you know everything!

[davidbrenton]

[QUOTE=Kevin24;4197312]It is pretty safe to assume that Clark may still have lingering feelings for (Lana) deep inside. We still have no idea what he thinks of her return because Lana is the only one who was talking on the matter.

Do I think Lana was BSing? Hell yeah I do!

She most likely saw Clark almost kiss Lois so she must assume that he has moved on already. Her act on the loft was all a front to show that she is all good with what is going on.

QUOTE]

Agreed. If you pause as Clark moves his head away, Lana is staring right at them. It would be cool if when Lana's reveal comes out (True motives, etc.) we can see a flashback from her perspective on that scene. Doubt they'll do it though.

Yeah, Lana still wants Clark. It's scene in EVERY stinking reaction shot she gives to close a scene. Can't they come up with something else for her to do?

[Jade4813]

Well first, this is just the typical reaction of a girl when her now boyfriend runs into his ex. They think hes still in love with them. If he was he would be with her. If Clark still loved Lana he wouldn't be hanging round with Lois, he would literally stuck to Lana. Lois doesn't give herself enough credit. Plus she didn't even hang around to see what he did. The fact that she didn't even go and welcome Lana shows me that her hatred lies with Lana, not the fact that Clark turned around to notice her, and remember Lois turned around to see Lana just as quick as Clark.

Obviously fallacious. The confidence! Just becasuse you know that Clark will finally end up with Lois doesn't mean you know everything!

:lol: I think that either you're a more admirable man than...a number of people I've known in my life, or you've just never really been in Lois's situation.

It's not quite accurate to say that the reasonable assumption would be - for a girl in Lois's situation - that Clark wasn't still stuck on Lana because he wasn't "stuck to" Lana. Perhaps if Clark had broken it off, but Clark didn't and Lois knew that. Lana made a rather unilateral decree and left Clark via videotape. I don't know a self-respecting man who'd have walked up to Lana and frenched her right off after that, but I've known plenty of men who have been dumped - without their say-so - who might have hung around other women and tried to move on but were very clearly stuck on their ex.

As far as Lois not giving herself enough credit...well, to an extent, I see what you mean, but I still think you're wrong. This isn't a situation where Clark has professed his feelings to Lois and then Lana returns and Lois makes an assumption. Clark hasn't been very obvious about his feelings on the show - even large portions of the audience are demanding to know where he stands. If we don't know, then I doubt a character knows better. So it's not like Lois is in the position of, "He says he loves me, but I don't know." She's in the position of, "He's been hung up on his ex for ages and I don't know how he feels for me...or for her entirely...so maybe absence is the better part of valor here."

Having been in a situation somewhat similar (only I actually had the protestations of love...before the ex came back into the picture...and my boyfriend turned and called me by her name...), I can tell you that this is a situation which is always somewhat messy. It's definitely a two-person party, or at least it should be. So under no circumstances do I see anything wrong with Lois removing herself from the situation at that time. Clark and Lana obviously did need to talk - Lois undoubtedly had plenty of reasons to believe so. She'd seen that Lana broke up with Clark via video, she saw Clark cry, and she knew he'd not immediately moved on. Any reasonable person would assume that Clark probably had a thing or two to get out into the open. And even if he didn't need privacy to do it, trying to figure out how to deal with your ex's re-emergence into your life while your girlfriend (possible new girlfriend/girl you kind of like/or whatever you think Lois should assume herself to be at this point) is standing right next to you is awkward to say the least and would make an already-awkward situation downright painful for all parties.

I also don't think Lois hates Lana, but let's face it. They never showed Lois and Lana as the best of friends. I think it would have been downright strange if Lois had gone up to Lana and been exuberantly hugging her like Chloe did. Other than their first meeting and a one time one-on-one talk about Lex, I can't remember ever seeing Lois and Lana hang out or talk without another person there. Can you? They hardly struck me as the best of friends - or even particularly good friends. Or, hell, even really friends at all. So Lois racing to hug Lana would probably have wigged Lana out at that moment. I know it would have caused more than a few people on these boards to probably start asking, "When did Lana and Lois become such good friends? In Offscreenville? Is Lana borrowing Lois's pants too?"

And of course I know everything! I'm me! Hel-lo! ;)

But, no, I do think it's a fallacious comment to say that Lois should have known or assumed Clark was over Lana. In fact, I think the weight of the evidence goes the other direction in a less-than-close contest. And my knowledge that Clark ends up with Lois doesn't have anything to do with it, because if that's all I was basing it off of, I would have agreed with you. :)

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

:lol: I think that either you're a more admirable man than...a number of people I've known in my life, or you've just never really been in Lois's situation.

I grossly prefer and agree, LOL, with the former.



Lana made a rather unilateral decree and left Clark via videotape. I don't know a self-respecting man who'd have walked up to Lana and frenched her right off after that, but I've known plenty of men who have been dumped - without their say-so - who might have hung around other women and tried to move on but were very clearly stuck on their ex.

How did Lois not know that he went up to Lana and gave her ****?. Lois disappeared and ASSUMED too quickly for my liking. She should have slid into the background and watched from afar and then could really judge Smallville. She cant judge him because she didn't know how he reacted. I think Clark acted quite well around Lana, other than the loft, and if Lois had of scen their initial encounter, she might have respected him more.



As far as Lois not giving herself enough credit...well, to an extent, I see what you mean, but I still think you're wrong.

What, I put that part in specifically for you, to make you not feel so bad. You even diasagree with compliments. AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH, I give up, because I now realise I can never win. (Although a compliment didn't go unnoticed in another thread, thank you anne)




I also don't think Lois hates Lana

Yeah right, pull my other leg!!


And of course I know everything! I'm me! Hel-lo! ;)

I'm beginning to realise that, disagree with this woman at your peril!!!!!!


And my knowledge that Clark ends up with Lois doesn't have anything to do with it, because if that's all I was basing it off of, I would have agreed with you. :)

Oh I dream and long for that day. (Two smily faces)

[All about Clark]

If Clark was still in love with Lana there were 2 things that would have ocurred. He would have ran up to her and hugged her after Chloe and he wouldn't have come to Lois and stayed there to talk at the hospital.

So I think Lois' exit is more of let Clark and Lana wrap stuff up and I don't need to be here and I'll leave to lick my wounds or whatever that expression is. That time apart from Clark at this point in time is best for both of them.

I did feel sorry for Lois that she let Lana's return get to her, but I think deep down she knows Clark is into her and that Lana did the dumping so she probably hasn't changed her mind. You know absense makes the heart grow fonder is what Lois is hoping for.

Everything fit in that Lois really did need to be there for her family, what's left of her family and used that excuse to get away. She'll be stronger when she returns and Clark will be missing her. Win-win she hopes.

[Jade4813]

I grossly prefer and agree, LOL, with the former.

:lol: I assume!


How did Lois not know that he went up to Lana and gave her ****?. Lois disappeared and ASSUMED too quickly for my liking. She should have slid into the background and watched from afar and then could really judge Smallville. She cant judge him because she didn't know how he reacted. I think Clark acted quite well around Lana, other than the loft, and if Lois had of scen their initial encounter, she might have respected him more.

I think Lois assumed that there were things left unsaid that needed to be said. I think she had plenty of reason to believe such. And whether those things were going to be good or going to be bad, I know I for one wouldn't want to stick around and watch. It's like watching your friend's parents fight. It's just uncomfortable. And I'm all for saying that good manners, IMO, would dictate me vamoosing to let them address their situation on their own time.

I also don't know that watching him at that moment would give her the best indication of what his feelings are at that time. I know there have been one or two times I've been confronted with an ex and my first reaction was "oh, man...I've missed you. Maybe we should give it another shot." And then, then minutes later, I'm thinking, "Oh, yeah. This is why we didn't work out. Get away from me. Do it now. Before I set you on fire."

Of course, I don't think Clark knows how he feels. But his immediate reaction may not be how he feels about Lana. Only after he works out those things that were left unspoken do I think that he will know. I think, and this is just my opinion, but I tend to think that when you've been left the way he was left - without the ability to talk about it, to confront it, to ask questions, or to have any sort of say at all - and you're left with all of these unanswered questions and things left unsaid, it's natural for you to still have that feeling left behind of something unfinished between you and the ex. And it's hard, with all that there, to know if there are actually feelings left behind or if it's just the weight of things left unsaid. Until you actually work past that, it's hard to tell what your feelings towards that person are.

In any event, Clark's first meeting with Lana was going to be uncomfortable at best and painful at worst. There's no way getting around it for the parties involved, but the third person to the party does have a way to avoid being subjected to that. That option is to walk away and let them deal with it in private. Lois did so, and I don't blame her.


What, I put that part in specifically for you, to make you not feel so bad. You even diasagree with compliments. AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH, I give up, because I now realise I can never win. (Although a compliment didn't go unnoticed in another thread, thank you anne)

Well, I'm apparently just modest. *cough* Er...or I like to keep you on your toes? :lol:

I didn't take it as an insult or anything. I just didn't think Lois giving herself credit or not was as much of an issue. ;)


Yeah right, pull my other leg!!

:lol: No, seriously, I don't. I think she should, because I certainly hate Lana so I always am amazed when everyone doesn't agree with me. ;) But I don't think she hates Lana. If you think about it, her comments about Lana have almost always been positive. She's said that Lana is cool and too much for Clark to handle. She had glowing praise for her when the two of them met. *sigh* She's said that Clark and Lana were the perfect couple. She's offered to be Lana's shoulder or sounding board. This season, she's told Clark he had to look outside his wheelhouse of "pretty and damsel-in-distressy" and she called Lana vanilla. So I don't think she's building a shrine to Lana in her basement (for once, a character is spared having to do that). And since she thinks of Lana as "vanilla" I don't think she has the highest opinion of Lana. But hate her?

If she hated her, I think she'd make comments about how she never saw what Clark saw in Lana. She'd comment about how Lana never deserved him. She'd tell him he was better off. She hasn't made those kinds of comments, so I have a hard time buying that she hates Lana. Alas, I don't think hating Lana is allowed on Smallville. Nobody ever has.


I'm beginning to realise that, disagree with this woman at your peril!!!!!!

En guarde! :p


Oh I dream and long for that day. (Two smily faces)

Well, to paraphrase Lois's "take an ex lax and get over it..." I say in all humor, "Take an Ambien and keep dreaming!"

:lol: Okay, in all seriousness...perish the thought, the day may one day come! Just...not today! ;)

Okay, maybe that wasn't in all seriousness..... *whistles and walks away*

[LCforever]

I agree with the posters that say that it wasn't until "Bride" that Clark started to ACTIVELY show interest in Lois. Remember, HE was the one to initiate the dance.

This means his feelings are growing but he doesn't know fully how he feels.

Now that Lana is back in the picture (for the time being), he's going to have to sort through his past feelings for Lana and get closure.

My heart breaks for Lois but I'm hoping our Superman will pull through and sweep her off her feet (and fly her off into the sunset!!)

[Clana4Life]

So yes, between Siren and Bride she could well have held true to that and changed. One small thing still though - have we seen her tell Clark about holding Lionel hostage? And going by her previous behavior and how strained her relationship was with Clark in Siren (when she told Clark that it 'was easier telling the phantom things because he was more affectionate and understanding' - OUCH!), would she have told him about the dead woman Lionel was trying to blackmail her with if Lionel hadn't tried to use it as leverage? The first one I haven't seen happening - so if you have let me know ;) And the second is open to interpretation.

I'd love if she has in fact changed, the doubt I have would be based on past behavior and the fact she's already keeping secrets from him again as hinted by her being in Cuba and the text message she received. But that one I'll have to wait and see played out...



Hey Annie, I hope you're still visiting this thread. No, I don't remember Lana ever telling Clark that she held Lionel hostage, but Lionel told Clark and Clark confronted Lana with that at the end of Wrath. She admitted it and said she wasn't going to apologize for protecting the man she loved. So I believe that was discussed and Clark seemingly forgave her for that, Lionel too, as there is an episode later on in Season 7 where Lionel is at the breakfast table with Lana where she is pouring him orange juice or coffee and Clark walks in. I can't remember if it was Hero, but I'm going back through all of the episodes, so I'll know shortly. :) I just remember that.
As for the woman that she was keeping in Isis. Hmm, that's a bit harder. I don't know that she would have told him unless Clark had behaved like Bizarro - very supportive and understanding. Should she have told Clark? Lana was helping meteor-infected people. She said that she held the woman in that room because she couldn't have her endangering her other Isis patients. I guess she could have told Clark about it, but I don't think she had to. I kind of feel that this had to do with her job and Clark doesn't have to know the ends and outs of that or the condition of every patient. Until Bizarro told her, she didn't really know that this was an alien/Brainiac-infected/kryptonian-speaking woman. And Chloe was rather protective and secretive about her patients when she was having those meetings with the meteor-infected.

I do think she has a secret, but since the relationship is actually over, I don't think Clark is actually entitled to know her secrets anymore. He may not feel that way, though. :)

On another note, I liked what you said about the Superman movies actually taking a lesson from the Batman movies. I think it would be so great to see a darker Superman movie with a more Smallville-type Lex Luthor. What a change that would be.

And to keep this on thread :)....Yes, I felt a bit sorry for Lois, but I feel more sorry for Lana and Clark. Lana because she will ultimately be the one left out in the end - loving Clark from afar, I think. And I feel sorry for Clark because he is still seemingly in pain over the break-up with Lana and the fact that she seems A-okay with that.

[MrZeppo]

My heart didn't break for Lois, but it was sad that she didn't get a chance to express herself, even after all the mayhem was over. She'll get her chance soon, though.

Blah, soon... We probably won't be seeing Lois till February or March. :( I'll be honest, I'll miss seeing Lois and Clark's interaction. I've actually come to really enjoy their rapport since the end of S7 until now.

I will admit, being a Clark-fan, I was so pissed at him. I understand where he is coming from though. Yes, he pretty much ignored Lois. But really he was in shock. His first love, the person he wanted to be with since he was a boy, just walked into the door. All those old questions pop back up. Because while Lana has had some closure having made the decision to leave Clark, he has had none, only questions. Some of which he got answered up in his loft.

Regardless, I don't think his feelings for Lois have evolved quite to the point where he wants to admit where he feels about her. But he feels something, because he was going in for that kiss, and I don't think our Clark would do that so flippantly because of their past friendship and working relationship. He's a better man than that. But I was disappointed they didn't get to address it in any way. Given Chloe's abduction though, the circumstances warranted that "they" be put on hold until things settle down.

But damn, I wished they could have talked about it. That would have been some good TV. :)

[chloefanforever2007]

I felt sorry for her, Clark is not over Lana, and I didn´t expect him to be, but that scene was cold for Lois !

[LCforever]

But damn, I wished they could have talked about it. That would have been some good TV. :)

ITA! They ALWAYS talk about things. Even if it's more one sided (ex. Clark pushing the lie detector question in the elevator in "Committed")

I understand that they have more things to deal w/ because of Chloe and DD but... man... why did they have to play "Don't Take Your Love Away from Me" and do a slow mo on Lois walking out...

......just kills me!!

[A Dawg]

Meh, dont care for this version of Clois... and plus.. Lois is just going to hook up with the next guest star anyways.

I really do hate how they made her the show's "bicycle," even if she is one of the hottests Lois's ever!

[Jade4813]

I really do hate how they made her the show's "bicycle," even if she is one of the hottests Lois's ever!

:lol: If you look at the number of people Lois has dated on the show and the number of people Lana's dated on the show, Lana is still very obviously in the lead. Town bicycle? I think someone other than Lois better deserves that moniker. :lol:

[DestinyAw8s]

:lol: If you look at the number of people Lois has dated on the show and the number of people Lana's dated on the show, Lana is still very obviously in the lead. Town bicycle? I think someone other than Lois better deserves that moniker. :lol:
Yep! And she's back, with training wheels, too.

[kal-el_Girl]

I felt her pain, I've been in that exact situation and it feels like you just want to die, poor lois =(
Clark wake up and forget about evil lana once and for all!

[fuchsiaRose]

:lol: If you look at the number of people Lois has dated on the show and the number of people Lana's dated on the show, Lana is still very obviously in the lead. Town bicycle? I think someone other than Lois better deserves that moniker. :lol:

So then Lana is the town bicycle. :lol: I can live with that! :p

[umm]

I felt her pain, I've been in that exact situation and it feels like you just want to die, poor lois =(Clark wake up and forget about evil Lana once and for all!

I admit, I am not a fan of forcing Clois this early on us, cos I think that's an after Smallville-years thing to be developed, bit no one deserves to be treated this way, and Lois has done nothing to deserve it! Clark is a big doofus who doesn't think before acting, and he is once again proving how pathetic he truly is when it comes to Lana! I mean besides hurting Lois, he also ignored Jimmy's life-critical condition, kidnapped Chloe in the arms of an alien homocidal madman who is obsessed with her! I mean everytime Lana pops in the town, Clark goes stupid, moronic and pathetic, and one can't really blame Lana for this either, as much as one would like to, cos no one is forcing Clark to act this way, but himself!

[abbaspice1]

I admit, I am not a fan of forcing Clois this early on us, cos I think that's an after Smallville-years thing to be developed, bit no one deserves to be treated this way, and Lois has done nothing to deserve it! Clark is a big doofus who doesn't think before acting, and he is once again proving how pathetic he truly is when it comes to Lana! I mean besides hurting Lois, he also ignored Jimmy's life-critical condition, kidnapped Chloe in the arms of an alien homocidal madman who is obsessed with her! I mean everytime Lana pops in the town, Clark goes stupid, moronic and pathetic, and one can't really blame Lana for this either, as much as one would like to, cos no one is forcing Clark to act this way, but himself!


True that!

I'm wonder if Lana has some type of kryptonite-affect on Clark's brain.

[Kalista]

he also ignored Jimmy's life-critical condition, kidnapped Chloe in the arms of an alien homocidal madman who is obsessed with her! I mean everytime Lana pops in the town, Clark goes stupid, moronic and pathetic, and one can't really blame Lana for this either, as much as one would like to, cos no one is forcing Clark to act this way, but himself!

Clark didn't ignore Jimmy's condition or Chloe's kidnapping. When he went to see Lana in the hospital he told Lana that Oliver had been using his satellites to locate where DD may have taken Chloe. He was already actively looking for Chloe before he went to see Lana. Also, when Clark went stopped to talk to edlois in the hallway, he told her that the doctors were able to stabilize Jimmy which indicates that he checked on Jimmy's status as well before checking on Lana. I think his response is quite different from what we have witnessed in previous seasons.

[Bizarrolover]

Originally Posted by umm http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4203025#post4203025)
he also ignored Jimmy's life-critical condition, kidnapped Chloe in the arms of an alien homocidal madman who is obsessed with her! I mean everytime Lana pops in the town, Clark goes stupid, moronic and pathetic, and one can't really blame Lana for this either, as much as one would like to, cos no one is forcing Clark to act this way, but himself!


let's be fair with Clark and not blame Lana for everything he does or doesn't do. Clark was at the hospital not only checking on Lana, but on all the other people that were injured at HIS HOUSE. He probably had a very long chat with the police before that, too. Oliver was already tracking DD with his web of satellites and there was nothing he could do for Jimmy save take notice of his condition. he did the right thing, IMO.

[wolverine316]

Here is my take on the ep. Clark has feelings for Lois. They went for the kiss and he saw Lana. It is not his love for Lana that stopped the kiss but the painful memories rushing back of Lana dumping him and cowardly leaving a Dear John video. He deserved some type of closure, a conversation "is it that easy?" just a reasoning of her abrupt departure. Posters talk about him rushing to Lana in the middle of the melee. I don't remember a part of the barn falling on anyone else if it had he would have run to them to help. Before he saw Lana at the hospital room he already mentioned that Ollie used his sattelites to find Chloe.

It gets kind of annoying when shippers ignore how some scenes actually played out because of their rose colored glasses. I by no means am a Clana fan the sooner they get a proper closure which I am sure will happen in the next few eps the better.

[geminis]

Here is my take on the ep. Clark has feelings for Lois. They went for the kiss and he saw Lana. It is not his love for Lana that stopped the kiss but the painful memories rushing back of Lana dumping him and cowardly leaving a Dear John video. He deserved some type of closure, a conversation "is it that easy?" just a reasoning of her abrupt departure. Posters talk about him rushing to Lana in the middle of the melee. I don't remember a part of the barn falling on anyone else if it had he would have run to them to help. Before he saw Lana at the hospital room he already mentioned that Ollie used his sattelites to find Chloe.

It gets kind of annoying when shippers ignore how some scenes actually played out because of their rose colored glasses. I by no means am a Clana fan the sooner they get a proper closure which I am sure will happen in the next few eps the better.

This shipper has to agree with you. But also, my heart still breaks for Lois and also for Clark. He seems to constantly get dumped on. The heartbreak continues, but not for too much longer.

[Kid Collins]

What I don't get is HOW Lois could even think that speech Clark was saying was about her!

She believed that Clark loved her the moment he saw her? That's BS. In Blank when Clark's memory was totally wiped out, he saw Lana and fell love at first sight all over again. Lois who?

Talk about being self absorbed.

And Lois did hang out with Lana. She took Lana to a kegger party in Season 5. I'm surprised no one is saying anything about Lois going after Clark since she used to be friends with Lana. Remember her advise to Lana in Reckoning about Clark? Don't even get me started that she knew Chloe her cousin was crazy about Clark.....

So no I don't feel sorry for Lois. Every character in this show gets a kick in the a$$ especially in the love department. What makes her so special? :rolleyes:

[BadToad]

I'm surprised no one is saying anything about Lois going after Clark since she used to be friends with Lana.

What does that have to do with anything? Lana dumped Clark via a videotape, and she's been gone for months. Lois remembers this well, as she was the one that comforted Clark when Lana dumped him. Clark does not belong to Lana, and when you break up with someone, you no longer have any claim on their heart, nor who they date. God knows Lana loved to throw that in Clark's face whenever she moved on to someone else.

Lana left! And IMO, Lois owes her absolutely nothing. At all. And any feelings that Lois might have for Clark, is between her and Clark. Not Lana who let. Not Chloe who is marrying another man. Neither one of those women owns Clark. Clark is a single guy at the moment.

[LCforever]

What I don't get is HOW Lois could even think that speech Clark was saying was about her!

She believed that Clark loved her the moment he saw her? That's BS. In Blank when Clark's memory was totally wiped out, he saw Lana and fell love at first sight all over again. Lois who?
What makes her so special? :rolleyes:

Well, sometimes when you're in the moment, you hear what you want to hear, and Lois really wanted to hear Clark say that he liked her so when he read the vows, she believed that he was talking to her! This can easily happen.

FYI, Lois Lane is special, especially to Clark Kent. Yes, everyone has their share of heart breaks but, when you have an iconic history, it's even more poignant when you watch comics' most iconic couple fall out of place (yet again).

My heart broke for her and is in need of aide! I don't know how I can bear 8 weeks without Clois!! :(

[EternalTwilight]

And Lois did hang out with Lana. She took Lana to a kegger party in Season 5. I'm surprised no one is saying anything about Lois going after Clark since she used to be friends with Lana. Remember her advise to Lana in Reckoning about Clark? Don't even get me started that she knew Chloe her cousin was crazy about Clark.....

Lana and Chloe are close friends. They both fell for and pursued the same guy. But let's face it, Lois is going to be picked apart no matter what she does, right? :rolleyes:

[zHeN_zHeN]

Lana and Chloe are close friends. They both fell for and pursued the same guy. But let's face it, Lois is going to be picked apart no matter what she does, right? :rolleyes:
Right. But, it seems that all three women pretty much get "picked apart" for every little thing. :\ I would say the men on SV have it easy! :p

[Jade4813]

Lana and Chloe are close friends. They both fell for and pursued the same guy. But let's face it, Lois is going to be picked apart no matter what she does, right? :rolleyes:

:lol: True. It does certainly put all that talk about how "Lois is so terrible because she's got feeling for Clark when she knew Chloe used to love him!" into rather different perspective. ALMOST everything Chloe's done in the romance department with Clark has happened while Chloe's been good friends with Lana, to the point of putting Lana on her family tree. And Lana actually dated, slept with, was "engaged" to Clark, etc. But Chloe has a greater "claim" on Clark because she had feelings for him that weren't reciprocated in that way (or at least at the time) at any point where they actually dated - but for one date where Clark left Chloe on the dance floor.

I'm just not one of those people who thinks that Clark has been branded somewhere on those lovely buttocks of his with the initials of every girl who has ever had feelings for him, and that there's some sort of order of seniority with who "wins" him first if she wants him, and if she doesn't want him, she still gets to lay claim to him if she decides he doesn't want to let him date anyone else.

If Clark asked Lois to date and Chloe told Lois she wished she wouldn't, Lois probably would refuse to date Clark out of consideration for Chloe's feelings. I'm not guaranteeing that would happen, but that's just my speculation on what would happen. Since Chloe's married to another man now, I don't think my speculation would ever come to pass because a girl who's married to one man can hardly lay some sort of "claim" to another man, like he's her personal property. Whether Chloe would have extended the same consideration to Lana, had Clark ever told Chloe he was willing to give it a go? I don't know, but I wouldn't have been surprised if she hadn't. This is also not likely to see the light of day, so it's mere speculation.

But I do have to say that the assertion that Lois and Lana were such "great friends" that Lois should feel bad for having feelings for Clark when she knew Lana cared for him...? Doesn't fly with me.

For one thing, as BadToad pointed out, Lana left. And, generally speaking, even if invisible property rights on exes existed, I don't think the leaver gets to decide who the leavee can or cannot have feelings for. If you voluntarily leave your "property," you lose all rights to it. That brand gets magically wiped off of Clark's tuckus.

And, at any rate, I can't pretend like Lana and Lois were shown to be that great of friends. I think they were in scenes together maybe a half-dozen times. Only one or two of those happened one-on-one. We never saw or heard reference to them getting together to hang out, without Chloe or Clark there, but just because they loved each other's company. We never saw them on the phone together to lead credibility to the idea that they're hanging out a lot in Offscreenville. No, Lois and Lana don't seem to hate each other, but it's not like we've seen anything like a real friendship be developed between them. Personally, I think that was probably intentional on the parts of TPTB, given who these women are and who they will one day be.

Anyway, nobody has any "claim" on Clark; he's nobody else's property - it's not like he has to run to Lana or Chloe to ask them if it's okay if he dates someone. While Lana and Clark dated in the past, they aren't dating now. She left, and he (started to, at least) moved on. I don't remember Lana running to Clark to ask for his permission when it came to dating Jason or Lex (who was a former good friend and present enemy of Clark's). I don't see why anyone would expect him to run to her to ask for her permission when it comes to moving on and dating Lois. And I really don't see why Clark would be expected to run to Chloe for permission, given that they weren't even an item the way that Clark and Lana were.

Clark and Lois are adults. If they want to date, they will and have every right to do so (provided neither is in an actual relationship at the time with anyone else). If they want to mention the change in their relationship to a friend or loved one to minimize the surprise, they can certainly do so, but neither Lana nor Chloe (nor anyone else, including Ollie or, hell, even Martha) have the right to say that Lois and/or Clark are not allowed to date each other - or anyone else, for that matter. We aren't "owned" by our exes, our friends, or even our family (certainly not at the ripe age of 21-22, where Clark and Lois are at, roughly).

[Bizarrolover]

Originally Posted by Kid Collins http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4204142#post4204142)
And Lois did hang out with Lana. She took Lana to a kegger party in Season 5. I'm surprised no one is saying anything about Lois going after Clark since she used to be friends with Lana. Remember her advise to Lana in Reckoning about Clark? Don't even get me started that she knew Chloe her cousin was crazy about Clark.....


Lois and Lana weren't good friends, just had a friendly acquaintance and hung out with the same people. They just talked a couple of times and Lois gave Lana sound advice when Lana needed.

It's a bit unfair to say that Lois should profess any kind of loyalty towards Lana when she was the one who stayed to pick up the pieces when Lana left and broke Clark's heart. Lois was the one who comforted him when he cried his grief, who gave him the application to his new job and took him under her wing so he wouldn't be labelled 'flannel man' at work. She helped him to move on and she did this because she is a good person, because she cares about Clark, not because she was expecting him to hook up with her. Her feelings for him had grown recently, she certainly wants something else with Clark, but she was generous enough to step out of his way and allow him to close his issues with Lana before opening her heart to him.


I'm just not one of those people who thinks that Clark has been branded somewhere on those lovely buttocks of his with the initials of every girl who has ever had feelings for him, and that there's some sort of order of seniority with who "wins" him first if she wants him, and if she doesn't want him, she still gets to lay claim to him if she decides he doesn't want to let him date anyone else.


Jade4813, nice imaginary there. I would like to brand my initials on Clark's lovely buttocks. ;)

[tmack09]

Didn't Lois say something along the lines of that she wanted to "be wanted" or "Feel Wanted" or that she "was wanted" ??? :lol: when she was talking to Ollie in reference to Clark??

Ok, I don't hate Lois...I like all the female characters to be honest, (Lana just seems to come first in my book, when you put them in order)...

anyway...Lois said something or other like the "Wanted" lines above...and this left a nasty taste in my mouth. It was almost as if she pulled a "Lex", *when Clark dumped Lana and Lex came through to pick up the pieces and swooped Lana off her feet (poor thing)*. It seemed like Lois had a currently failed attempt at the same thing! And while her actions may have been positive ones, and not really trying to get anything in return, the lines that came out her mouth just made me go "oh well...stop crying, dust urself off and move on for now"

My heart couldn't really be broken for her...something about it was just off balance, as if she swooped in on purpose on some level...i donno. just my opinion :cool:

[davidbrenton]

Didn't Lois say something along the lines of that she wanted to "be wanted" or "Feel Wanted" or that she "was wanted" ??? :lol: when she was talking to Ollie in reference to Clark??

Ok, I don't hate Lois...I like all the female characters to be honest, (Lana just seems to come first in my book, when you put them in order)...

anyway...Lois said something or other like the "Wanted" lines above...and this left a nasty taste in my mouth. It was almost as if she pulled a "Lex", *when Clark dumped Lana and Lex came through to pick up the pieces and swooped Lana off her feet (poor thing)*. It seemed like Lois had a currently failed attempt at the same thing! And while her actions may have been positive ones, and not really trying to get anything in return, the lines that came out her mouth just made me go "oh well...stop crying, dust urself off and move on for now"

My heart couldn't really be broken for her...something about it was just off balance, as if she swooped in on purpose on some level...i donno. just my opinion :cool:

She actually said, "I thought, just for a moment...that somebody needed me." I don't see a problem with her expressing her desire to feel needed. Secondly, it was all happening at that moment, and she was processing it right there. She will pick herself up and dust herself off. That's, after all, what makes her so special to Clark.

I don't understand your response at all. "It's as if she swooped in on purpose on some level." What do you mean "swooped in"? She is Lois Lane. Superman's destiny. To say she swooped in feels like a slap in the face to the entire legend.

[Bizarrolover]

Didn't Lois say something along the lines of that she wanted to "be wanted" or "Feel Wanted" or that she "was wanted" ??? :lol: when she was talking to Ollie in reference to Clark??

No, she said that she thought, for once, that someone needed her. That line also struck me because, for someone who is always there for everyone, Lois thinks no one needs her. But she dusted that off rather quickly, just a two minute chat with Ollie and she was out of the picture.

[A Dawg]

Lana didn't sleep with everyone she dated on the show. And Lois is always being flirty with the new male leads. Aquaman, Green Arrow, Clark on Red K, Lex's cloned brother, and I'm sure I am missing a few. As far as i know Lana has only been with Lex and Clark. Bicycle means everyone gets a ride. :)

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


So then Lana is the town bicycle. :lol: I can live with that! :p

You have to go all the way for bicycle status. Lana has been with a lot of guys, but only had sex with 2 of em. Lois, on the other hand, has "done" almost every male guest star since she was introduced. I am not hating on Lois though, just the writers that keep putting her in those positions.

[Jade4813]

Lana didn't sleep with everyone she dated on the show. And Lois is always being flirty with the new male leads. Aquaman, Green Arrow, Clark on Red K, Lex's cloned brother, and I'm sure I am missing a few. As far as i know Lana has only been with Lex and Clark. Bicycle means everyone gets a ride. :)

I never said that Lana has slept with everyone she dated on the show. And I'm well-informed into the meaning of the term "bicycle" when it comes to being a word used to imply that a girl is a sl**.

Incidentally, saying someone's a bicycle usually refers to the number of people they've slept with, not the number of people they've flirted with. And flirtation is not sex. It's not even close.

The point is that, per show canon, we know the following.

LOIS HAS DATED/"BEEN FLIRTY" WITH:

* A.C.
* Ollie
* Grant
* Clark on Red K (If you want to call being drugged "being flirty" which I think is just a tad disingenuous)

LANA HAS DATED/BEEN FLIRTY WITH:

* Whitney
* Clark
* Jason
* That guy from "Magnetic"
* That guy from...what was it..."Dichotic"? JTT's character.
* Adam
* Lex

LOIS HAS SLEPT WITH:

* Ollie (though there's contradictory canon on this, I'll say that she did)
* Presumably Grant, though this is unconfirmed and thus speculative

LANA HAS SLEPT WITH:

* Clark
* Lex
* Bizarro

It's not like Lois has this long list that's far and above beyond other girls on the show that calling her the show's "bicycle" is warranted. And, in fact, much of Lois's list is speculative - she never said she slept with Grant; Chloe just assumed she had. She also said in one episode that her relationship with Ollie was "all interruptus and no coitus" which means she didn't have sex with him and then later she said that she and he had been "spooning beneath the sheets." So I'm willing to believe she slept with Ollie, though they certainly aren't clear on that issue.

Whereas with Lana, there's absolutely no doubt. Every time they want us to know she's had sex, they give us either a shot of her the morning after or some lovely mid-sex shot of her in Lex's brain while she's in the middle of the act.

[amalie]

Lana didn't sleep with everyone she dated on the show. And Lois is always being flirty with the new male leads. Aquaman, Green Arrow, Clark on Red K, Lex's cloned brother, and I'm sure I am missing a few. As far as i know Lana has only been with Lex and Clark. Bicycle means everyone gets a ride. :)

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----



You have to go all the way for bicycle status. Lana has been with a lot of guys, but only had sex with 2 of em. Lois, on the other hand, has "done" almost every male guest star since she was introduced. I am not hating on Lois though, just the writers that keep putting her in those positions.

Did Lois sleep with Oliver? I can't remember, they always seemed to get interrupted by the Green Arrow situation. Then there's Grant. She's about even with Lana really unless you count Bizarro

[TheANIMAL (marcus)]

Right. But, it seems that all three women pretty much get "picked apart" for every little thing. :\ I would say the men on SV have it easy! :p

There is only one real man left on the show proper.

[Jade4813]

You have to go all the way for bicycle status. Lana has been with a lot of guys, but only had sex with 2 of em. Lois, on the other hand, has "done" almost every male guest star since she was introduced. I am not hating on Lois though, just the writers that keep putting her in those positions.

Uh...no. Again, I must point out that she didn't. There wasn't even the slightest hint that she slept with A.C. She kissed him, yes, but kissing isn't sex. We have good reason to believe that she slept with Ollie - her boyfriend at the time - and it's arguable whether she slept with Grant since neither party involved confirmed or denied and there was no scene of them doing anything more than kissing each other.

Even if she had, that's two people. Which at the very least matches Lana, and Lana's in the lead if you count that she technically slept with Bizarro.

And talk about a girl that's been put with every male guest star in the show! :lol: There's actually a debate that Lois has been placed as the love interest for the male guest stars more often than Lana? The girl who even had female guest stars lusting after her? I find that funny.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Did Lois sleep with Oliver? I can't remember, they always seemed to get interrupted by the Green Arrow situation. Then there's Grant. She's about even with Lana really unless you count Bizarro

As I pointed out above, there's contradictory statements when it comes to Lois's relationship with Ollie. In..."Justice" I think, she said it was all coitus and no interruptus. And then in "Siren" she said that he should have told her he was the Green Arrow at some point when they were spooning between the sheets. So...*shrugs* It's contradictory. I'm willing to believe they did, but I think someone could argue that they didn't, just because it was contradictory and hasn't been confirmed.

[Bizarrolover]

Jade4813, it was the other way around. Lois told Ollie that their relationship was all interruptus and no coitus, that he was always running off when things were beginning to get interesting, and that she liked to become interested, a lot. Those were her words. So, I guess, sex (or the lack of it) was becoming a problem between Ollie and Lois.

I think Lois had sex with Oliver, maybe not as frequently as she would have liked, but I'm not sure she got that far with Grant. They dated very briefly. Besides those two guys, Lois didn't have any other boyfriends in the series, save for a couple of kisses she exchanged with AC and with Clark, while she was drugged by the red K lipstick. So there's only two guys in four years, quite normal for a woman in her twenties.


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Lana didn't sleep with everyone she dated on the show. And Lois is always being flirty with the new male leads. Aquaman, Green Arrow, Clark on Red K, Lex's cloned brother, and I'm sure I am missing a few. As far as i know Lana has only been with Lex and Clark. Bicycle means everyone gets a ride. :)

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----



You have to go all the way for bicycle status. Lana has been with a lot of guys, but only had sex with 2 of em. Lois, on the other hand, has "done" almost every male guest star since she was introduced. I am not hating on Lois though, just the writers that keep putting her in those positions.
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Lana dated Whitney when she was only fifteen, so it would have been very inappropriate if she slept with him. And ilegal, I guess. Her next serious boyfriend was Jason. They lived together under the same roof and it's hard to believe that a young, passionate couple that was sharing a small one bed aparment weren't doing it. But, despite being posessed by an evil witch and having a gorgeous boyfriend, Lana maintained her virtue intact. Then came Clark and Lex followed a few months later. I'm not counting Bizzy because Lana thought she was sleeping with Clark.

So I guess Lana and Lois are even, they both slept with only two guys along the series. I don't think it's wrong, it's pretty standard for people their age. The only female of this show that can be considered virtuous is Chloe, who lost her virginity to the guy she finally married (although she was too young when that happened), and didn't sleep with anyone else in between.

[Jade4813]

Jade4813, it was the other way around. Lois told Ollie that their relationship was all interruptus and no coitus, that he was always running off when things were beginning to get interesting, and that she liked to become interested, a lot. Those were her words. So, I guess, sex (or the lack of it) was becoming a problem between Ollie and Lois.

Yeah, I knew that, but I mistyped. :lol:


I think Lois had sex with Oliver, maybe not as frequently as she would have liked, but I'm not sure she got that far with Grant. They dated very briefly. Besides those two guys, Lois didn't have any other boyfriends in the series, save for a couple of kisses she exchanged with AC and with Clark, while she was drugged by the red K lipstick. So there's only two guys in four years, quite normal for a woman in her twenties.

I would agree.

[LCforever]

All I have to say is Lana had sex with LEX! ewww!

Hello, no matter how you want to put it, she did it. I just want to shoot pellets at people who keep holding this candle for Lana because she is no saint. She can say she loves Clark all she wants but she loved & slept with Lex Luthor of all people.

Come on!

[fuchsiaRose]

Lana has been with a lot of guys, but only had sex with 2 of em. Lois, on the other hand, has "done" almost every male guest star since she was introduced. I am not hating on Lois though, just the writers that keep putting her in those positions.
This is baseless bashing. Seriously, where is your evidence?

Oh right, there isn't any!



This is what we know about Lois Lane:

Lois dated AC and they only kissed.

Lois dated Oliver and they may or may not have slept together. It's argued that it was obvious they had a sexual relationship but at the same time Lois can be quoted in saying that as soon as things get interesting with Ollie he disappears. So, this is NOT concrete.

Lois dated Grant and again, there is NO proof that they slept together. They had a very heated relationship, but that's it.


So even IF she slept with Oliver and Grant (which I don't believe she did, though I wish she would have!--I mean, come on! Hot single lady with hot single men! What's the problem?) it is not a reason to EXAGGERATE her record and accuse her of doing every male guest star! That is just a ridiculous accusation!



Now on the other hand, Lana has a dated a LOT more than Lois.

But it would be a waste of time to go there because it's only important that she HAS slept with MORE guys (and THINGS) than Lois:

1) Clark Kent
2) Lex Luthor (many, many times--some of them onscreen like in fracture--shudders)
3) Bizarro

These are UNDENIABLE; and there is also the Jensen Ankles character who can be ARGUED that she slept with, even if she tells Clark she didn't. I mean, come on! She lived with him, they were constantly sucking face, she was his jailbait, and did I mention that she was constantly naked around the man? Yeah, I'm sure they kept it innocent? Lol. But you see, we don't add this to the pile of men Lana did because there is no CONCRETE proof. Similarly, there is no concrete proof that Lois Lane had sex with either Oliver or Grant. And no amount of wishful thinking on the part of bashers will make it real.


So looking at those stats, the only person who should be ashamed of her track record is Ms. Nasty! And not for the amount of men (or THINGS) she's been with (because lets NOT be sexists here, she is a single beautiful woman--as is Lois Lane) but rather because of the TYPE of men or things she has shared 66.66 percent of her sex life with: Lex and a phantom! See the number itself? 666666 <--devil's number! :lol:

I mean come on!!!! I don't care IF Grant was a clone! It's far worse to sleep with Lex and then on top (pun intended) of that bizarro!!!


That is just plain ol' nasty!


Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!!!


*throws up in mouth*

----- Added 8 Minutes later -----


All I have to say is Lana had sex with LEX! ewww!

Hello, no matter how you want to put it, she did it. I just want to shoot pellets at people who keep holding this candle for Lana because she is no saint. She can say she loves Clark all she wants but she loved & slept with Lex Luthor of all people.

Come on!

Lana has done the magical combo of Lex and Bizarro!

Yeah, I'd rather be Lois with a clone than do (quite literally) THAT combo! *shudders*


And with that track record, I'd tell Chloe to keep Doomsday away from her! Lana might be tempted to bed with the enemy AGAIN!!! :lol:

[Pixelate]

I haven't followed smallville for a while but I will give Lois a break. I don't hate Lana or anything of that sort. My view is, okay, they both slept with one person. That's alright it happens. They've both slept with two people, okay that becomes a factor and could possibly begin to define the person that they both are. Three or four, then I begin to to question certain aspects of their character.

What tickles me the wrong way, is lana's often 'prim and proper' attitude yet she's not that different from the rest underneath it all. You can appreciate the fact that Lois is out there, outgoing, sometimes brash and sarcastic. That is lois, you know what you are getting, even if she is 'fronting' or pretending. .... So three or four... is reasonably forgivable.. Maybe I simply don't like Lana's secretive and manipulative nature..she has too many things to hide, not to mention obsessive..blah blah blah..

I did feel kind of sad for lois, discounting all that has been in the past, she simply also wants someone to love and need her... Putting it back into smallvile context ...hmm.. I will still feel for her, I'll have to admit I'm a 'lois and clark' superman mythos fan.

LoL, that probably makes Chloe a saint... and I think she seriously did have the best chemistry with Clark, but Lois is catching on pretty well.

[fuchsiaRose]

As I pointed out above, there's contradictory statements when it comes to Lois's relationship with Ollie. In..."Justice" I think, she said it was all coitus and no interruptus. And then in "Siren" she said that he should have told her he was the Green Arrow at some point when they were spooning between the sheets. So...*shrugs* It's contradictory. I'm willing to believe they did, but I think someone could argue that they didn't, just because it was contradictory and hasn't been confirmed.
Yeah, that would be ME. I'd argue that Lois and Oliver didn't have sex because that there is PROOF to support that side of the argument.

And I think the quote is actually, "all interruptus and no coitus." Just off the top of my head...



Anyhoo, I do not believe that Lois Lane slept with Oliver. Why? Listed below are the only two quotes ever to reference an intimate relationship between the two. Read them:

all interruptus and no coitus - this is a VERY clear statement. No coitus! No sex! This could not be more literal or obvious!

spooning between the sheets - this on the other hand is NOT a very clear statement at all. Since when does spooning between sheets equate sex? It's not concrete enough and at the most it's up to interpretation. This cannot serve as proof because it is not concrete. It's extremely subjective. Even two cloisers, myself and Jade do not agree.

Evidence is something that a character confirms or that we actually see. Neither Lois or Oliver have EVER confirmed that they slept with one another. And quite the opposite (see first quote) Lois HAS actually confirmed that there was no coitus! No sex!

So again, as much as bashers WANT Lois to have slept with Oliver, she didn't!

No coitus, guys. Sorry!

[Sv.LoisLane]

I can't believe that we went from "Did your heart break for Lois" to "Which girl has 'done' more men?". The answer to that is simple: Lana. We SAW her sleeping with Clark, Lex and Bizzarro. We NEVER SAW Lois doing that on screen. So assuming that she had sex with Oliver is just... assumption. But I have to admit that I too think she had, they were in a relationship afterall. But that makes Lois 1, Lana 3.
Wes was her first kiss. AC was a one-episode thing and they've never done more than kissing. Graham the same, without the kissing. Grant was in more episodes, but all they did was kissing too.
Lana has 'done' (Clark, Lex, Bizzarro) and kissed (I only remember Whitney, Ian, Seth, Tina, Adam, Jason, Abigail, Lex, Clark, Bizzarro) more men and women! than Lois.


All I have to say is Lana had sex with LEX! ewww!

Hello, no matter how you want to put it, she did it. I just want to shoot pellets at people who keep holding this candle for Lana because she is no saint. She can say she loves Clark all she wants but she loved & slept with Lex Luthor of all people.

Come on!

The first time they had sex, it was Lana's idea (after the charity ball). When Clark was in Lex's mind he saw the two of them having sex. And she was on top looking like she was enjoying it! Yup, poor girl... she was forced to do all that because she was emotionally depressed :lol::rolleyes:

[fuchsiaRose]

I haven't followed smallville for a while but I will give Lois a break. I don't hate Lana or anything of that sort. My view is, okay, they both slept with one person. That's alright it happens. They've both slept with two people, okay that becomes a factor and could possibly begin to define the person that they both are. Three or four, then I begin to to question certain aspects of their character.

Both Lana Lang and Lois Lane are young beautiful women. Why must they immediately be scrutinized for the number of people they sleep with when the same standard would NOT apply to Clark Kent, Lex Luthor or Oliver Queen.

What if Lana had slept with six guys? What if Lois had slept with ten guys? Who decides how many guys is too many? And how can a number alone be enough to affect the way a person character is reflected?


Think about this:

Lana sleeps with 10 guys on the same day.
Lois sleeps with 10 guys in the span of 4 years.

Would you subject both women to the same critique of character? I'd hope not!

And just another example:

Lana sleeps with 5 guys over the course of 4 years.
Lois sleeps with 5 guys over the course of 4 years.
Oliver Queen sleeps with 5 women over the course of 1 year.
Lex Luthor sleeps with 5 women over the course of 5 months.

All are young, single and subjectively attractive. My question below:

Who do you think would get the bad rap? The men or the women?


Food for thought.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----



Lana has 'done' (Clark, Lex, Bizzarro) and kissed (I only remember Whitney, Ian, Seth, Tina, Adam, Jason, Abigail, Lex, Clark, Bizzarro) more men and women! than Lois.
Holy moly! Can we sticky this and reference bashers to it every time they say something like "Lois Lane has done every male guest star on Smallville!" :rolleyes:

[Pixelate]

Both Lana Lang and Lois Lane are young beautiful women. Why must they immediately be scrutinized for the number of people they sleep with when the same standard would NOT apply to Clark Kent, Lex Luthor or Oliver Queen.

What if Lana had slept with six guys? What if Lois had slept with ten guys? Who decides how many guys is too many? And how can a number alone be enough to affect the way a person character is reflected?


Think about this:

Lana sleeps with 10 guys on the same day.
Lois sleeps with 10 guys in the span of 4 years.

Would you subject both women to the same critique of character? I'd hope not!

And just another example:

Lana sleeps with 5 guys over the course of 4 years.
Lois sleeps with 5 guys over the course of 4 years.
Oliver Queen sleeps with 5 women over the course of 1 year.
Lex Luthor sleeps with 5 women over the course of 5 months.

All are young, single and subjectively attractive. My question below:

Who do you think would get the bad rap? The men or the women?


Food for thought.


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Name="TOC Heading"/> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:"Cambria Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:1; mso-generic-font-family:roman; mso-font-format:other; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:0 0 0 0 0 0;} @font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:0; mso-generic-font-family:swiss; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:-1610611985 1073750139 0 0 159 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-unhide:no; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; margin-top:0in; margin-right:0in; margin-bottom:10.0pt; margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:Calibri; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; 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mso-para-margin-right:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> Nothing really counts for real since they are actors and fictional characters. This may just get silly, but here goes:p…
Looking at the factors at play in a Smallville world, there must be some differentiation. So yeah, my view of any moral or amoral activities applies equally to both male and female. But, there are shades of gray..or varying degrees of questionable sexual character.

Who really takes the cake amongst the females (excusing the kryptonite infected love sick ones)… Tess!:).
Tess has the money power resources (freedom of choice :rolleyes:), and she knows how to deliberately use her femme fatale looks to ‘scratch an itch’.. That says it all, she’s in it for selfish gains and doesn’t give a care about what you think.
Lana , has been with supermen, Bizzaro, Clark – that counts for more than just a man, plus the rich powerful Lex, she has been in the stratospheric leagues of men:rotfl:. Even her ‘run of the mill’ male friends were reasonably above average. Females, now, at the point you are really having your cake and eating it too!.. ‘Aliens’ ‘Human males’ and ‘females’.!, plus she always has some agenda on her mind…
Lois, on the other hand, works with situation as it presents itself, be it the person who saves her (A C), or be that cool dude she happens to be investigating, or say that Clark co worker thing… at least her hearts really in it… without all the extraneous baggage.. She is too prone to flirtatious, playful behavior with men..

Chloe was saintly, till she was corrupted- of all the things in the world, by a Kryptonian AI. And then she ditches the perfect Jimmy for an alien beast with very little intellectual reasoning and affinity for romance except for its own fear of the pain of death. That is going straight for the deep end:lol:!
She’s comes in last cause , I know it’s brainiac’s fault, he is an amoral AI;).

For the males, Lex is a male carbon copy of Tess. So he comes tops. But he does seem to think that going for non-( ‘muffin peddler’ –lois) and intriguing powerful women makes him somehow saintly. Nope!:rolleyes:
Ollie, what can I say.. he is a cute guy, simple. He has power and money too. Well someone is bound to throw themselves at him now and then. He likes to have fun, so yeah, why not. But that means he comes next.
Now Clark, boy is he lucky:p I’m not including Kryptonite infused binges…otherwise his red kryptonite self alone places him right next to Lex, and above Lana. But regular Clark comes in last. He is a good natured farm boy, and mistaken indulgence will probably still benefit whoever he is involved with. C'mon ,Clark always saves the day;)!
So we have Lex > Tess >Lana> Ollie > Lois > Chloe >= Clark .. fair assessment for a smallville society. You see, I’m not biased at all:lol:, am I?.

In Smallville everyone seems to do what is necessary, when the situation arrives or requires it unless there is something really holding you back. The question is, Is it a moral or amoral something.

[Sv.LoisLane]

^ I agree with the most of your post. But Chloe was no saint. She had her good amount of guys too and she lost her virginity at young age.

[Bizarrolover]

Chloe didn't have many guys, just Jimmy. She lost her virginity to Jimmy in between season 1 and 2 (very young) and didn't date seriously anyone else until Jimmy reappeared in season 6. She went on a date with Ian (clone guy) and kissed (once) Justin before he tried to impale her with farm implements. So, though she started very early, she only slept with the guy that would finally become her husband.

[Jade4813]

I think we should probably move off the question of how many people are having sex with other people and move onto the topic at hand, which is whether our hearts broke for Lois. Unless our hearts are breaking for Lois because we don't know whether she's had sex with Ollie, I'd much rather we move off this topic now.

So, yes, my heart broke for Lois. It was a moving scene, and Lois played it extremely well. And yes, I love Lois, but I think it would be possible to find the scene moving even if I didn't. There have been scenes throughout the show that made me feel bad for Lana or for Chloe.

This was a very, very well-done scene, and I do think it shows how far ED has come since joining the show. I'm looking forward to her return after the hiatus!

[eas]

Having always been a chlarker, I would have figured my response to Lois would have been "tough ti**ies, that's life". But I felt bad for Lois, and I think it is a direct correlation to the improvement ED has made in playing her character this season. I was a chlarker between I always saw a real chemistry between the two characters. I never sensed that prior to this season between ED and TW. Yes, I know the characters end up together down the road, but I could never imagine that between "this" Lois and TW's Clark.

But this season, Erica is making me a believer. I see a chemistry between Lois and Clark that was missing before. I can now buy that these two will get together because they were meant to be together. I don't know if its due to ED's growth as an actress or because of the direction PS3 have taken this - probably a combination of the two. But yeah, I felt sad for Lois whereas I was frankly fairly numb as far as having any emotional connection to Smallville's Lois.

And I wouldn't bust Clark's unbreakable chops for hurting Lois in this episode. I don't get the sense at all that he did this intentionally. He was completely caught off-guard with Lana's sudden arrival. Gladly, I think he now realizes that clana is dead and will be able to move on. But he will have to be able to leap tall buildings in a single bound to leap over the wall that Lois is building around her heart.

This is a great post. I totally agree. As I've said before, ED's acting was a bit choppy in early seasons. She's been fantastic, though, this season & she's been working with tough material.

I felt sorry for her character in this episode, but I was a bit irked, as well. We have seen Lois falling for Clark gradually this season (even admitting under the threat of torture) but this was venturing into pining territory.

The thing that concerns me is that I feel that "SV" doesn't know how to write romance without angst. And, to me, the first 10 episodes were a set-up for angst on Lois's part. And, then, when she comes back, it'll be Clark's turn.

And I don't like that. One of the best things about the Clark/Lois relationship is that it's light and funny. There's almost a part of me that wishes they'd remain in the "friends" territory, if the alternative is a ton of angst.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----


ITA. And I think the line Oliver delivered to Lois in Bride about moving on and the actual moment you do is very apt for Clark with Lana. Clark may have told himself he has moved on, Lana has now told him she has, but until we see HIM make that realization in an unambiguous way the relationship isn't truly over and the debates will go on and on and on. I honestly think this is a big part of why his feelings for Lois haven't been openly explored. They sold us on the Lana for seven years with varying degrees and at times lack of success. That can't be resolved in ten episodes when Lana is missing for nine of them.

BUT and it's a big but here, regardless of whether or not Lana has an outside reason to have left the way she did and if she still does have the kind of feelings for him that make her want to be with him if it wasn't for x, y and z, if CLARK makes the decision not to fight to keep the relationship this time then people have to accept that is that. This is the guy that continued pursuing her when she was a married, supposedly pregnant woman (a storyline this Superman/Clark Kent fan hated with the same loathing as she did the absentee father storyline in SR btw). He continued fighting to save the relationship after she'd stolen money from Lex, after she lied to him about her Isis Foundation work, after she slept with Bizarro. Yes, he blamed himself for everything bad that had happened to her too but the fact is he still FOUGHT FOR HER. So if he let's the relationship go now it's a HUGE DECISION and shows a big change, especially considering everything they've been through. A pro-active, mature Clark who has come so far in so many ways this season wouldn't be afraid to continue fighting for the relationship he wanted that much imo. Especially considering how much he fought in the past. So once we see the decision made it's MADE.

Wow... that WAS a long post. (Suddenly, I don't feel so bad about my epic posts.) LOL

I'm quoting this part, because this really summed it up for me. Just like in the Lollie ship, there was the moment where they TOLD themselves it was over ("Siren") and then there was the moment where it ACTUALLY was over. (For Lois, that was "Toxic" and for Ollie, it was "Bride".)

At the end of S7, both Clark and Lana told themselves it was over & now they need the moment where it actually is. Personally, I think that moment has already come and gone for Clark... when he looked down at Chimmy & smiled. I think that it meant something that this was his reaction to Lana's comment about "Clark Kent and Lana Lang will never be"... And, then, I saw this followed-up by his smile & nod when Lana told him that he couldn't do anything more for her at the hospital.

Now Lana? I'm not sure... I have no clue what's going on with her. I don't think she'll ever be over Clark. I think the best we can hope for, from her, is that she accepts that Clark is over her and moves on. I do hope, though, that they handle the arc in a way that doesn't make Clark look bad. That, in an effort to make Lana's exit more dignified, they have Clark mouth some things to make her feel better that makes his feelings for her ambigious. That will only detract from Clark's character, imo.

----- Added 19 Minutes later -----


About true love -- I don't know how to break posts up like you. :) I pretty much agree with you said, I was just thinking that some times things happen to cause love to go amiss. I think of death for instance. Two people who are in love and right and it works out and one dies. Well, after time the one living moves on and marries another and loves them just as deeply. I think both could be considered "true love." I think it's the "true" that gives me pause. Given that I've seen how much he loves Lana, it's hard to say that he'll love someone else more. I've no doubt that he will love Lois deeply, equally so. I realize that that relationship will endure, but even so, can we say that he loved one more than the other? I often think that's what is meant when people add the "true" before the love. Your thoughts?

That's an excellent point. I would say that this does become hard -- and you can't really quantify it. I think that love is something that cannot be measured.

For example, I have more than one child. Before I had my daughter, I honestly thought that I couldn't love another human being more than I loved my son. He was my first born and my only child for 6 years. When I was pregnant, I would even become emotional and worried that I wouldn't love my 2nd child as much.

But then I had her -- and, man, it was like my life became complete when she was born. It was like a piece of puzzle was handed to me that I didn't even realize was missing until I had it in my hands. And, if pressed, I couldn't tell you - who do I love more? Which love is greater?

That is not say that I love them both equally. Mothers frequently tell their children this - that they love them equally. But they don't. We love our children differently, but with equal depth.

I think it's the same when you have romantic relationships. You can love each one for different reasons and with the same depth. I think the reasons that Clark will love Lois deeply will be very different than the reasons he loved Lana.

I have to say, though -- if someone that watches "SV" ends the series run with thinking that the love of Clark's life was Lana Lang, I wouldn't blame them. "SV" has set up Clana to be some sort of epic romance type of a thing. For me, personally, I didn't buy it. I always felt it was a bit superficial and immature... but that's just me. Shipper bias comes in... and, therefore, I look at Clark/Lois & see "true" love... a Clana fan will look at Lana/Clark and see "true" love... and, in a way, both will be correct. Right?

----- Added 27 Minutes later -----


There's no real depth to them - particularly the villains. It's understandable that with a limited time frame in a film and limited space in a comic book that we don't get to delve into the characters to any great degree - not without sacrificing action. Smallville is the first show to delve deep. Because they've been on the air for so long they've had time to show that depth to the characters and Lex Luthor for example is probably the best Lex Luthor I have ever seen ANYWHERE. I can see MRLex as a fitting adversary for Superman and there's no way in hell his master plan would involve real estate! To me Lex is a reinventing on a par with what was done with some of the villains in the new Batman franchise. The movie reboot of Superman could learn a LOT from Smallville imo.

Well said. But I do disagree with one small thing: "Justice League Unlimted" and "S:TAS" had a very awesome Lex Luthor, as well. In fact, I always saw MR's Lex Luthor growing up to that Lex Luthor. (Similarly, I always ED's Lois Lane growing up to be THAT Lois Lane.)

And LMAO at the "real estate" line... I know!!! I hate that about the movies!! What is WRONG with the writers?

----- Added 30 Minutes later -----


And to keep this on thread :)....Yes, I felt a bit sorry for Lois, but I feel more sorry for Lana and Clark. Lana because she will ultimately be the one left out in the end - loving Clark from afar, I think. And I feel sorry for Clark because he is still seemingly in pain over the break-up with Lana and the fact that she seems A-okay with that.

Fair enough... that makes sense to me.

[Lazy Boy]

Nope, the whole scene was too cheesy for my liking.

[DestinyAw8s]

I have to disagree about the angsty part. My heart did break for Lois Lane, but to truly feel deeply for a character or characters, we need to actually feel and see their emotions onscreen. To understand the depth of love that will come to be between the power couple, we need to see it played out to a lesser degree. This is probably the only time we will see this side of Lois Lane on the show, but in future episodes, no matter what she says or does, we will always know that she has those kind of feelings for the bumbling tadpole. Besides that, they are not totally in love right now. Far from it. We don't even know how Clark really feels at this point. We've only see it from Lois' side, and I think TPTB have portrayed it beautifully, as well as the actress herself. Only think, if Lois is this devastated for none other than Clark Kent while only just beginning to recognize her feelings, does that not show how utterly and completely she loves him in the future? To me it does, and I'm excited that we are finally getting a small glimpse of how boundless and eternal their love will become. Because let's face it, Lois Lane is a HUGE part of Clark Kent/Superman's life. We may never get to see the culmination of this love match on SV, but we can get a very small taste of what makes it so deep and abiding. This has never been portrayed in live action that I can recall, and I want to see it! I have never bought the love-at-first-sight gig from Clark/Superman. There HAD to be something more.

I don't believe that TPTB are kicking us in the teeth or anything so mean. What they are doing is trying to SHOW us something, but we have to be open to the possibilities to see it. Also, there is no Cloisana that I can see. Thank God! That only exists in Lois' head and will probably be used in the future as a tiny roadblock.

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm excited as hell to see where they go from here. I will put my trust in PS3, because they seem to know what needs to be done to bring it home for all of us.

You GO, PS3! You're putting your heart into this venture and it shows! I'm loving every minute of it! Even Lana's return.:eek: Something I could have never said before this season.

[eas]

I have to disagree about the angsty part. My heart did break for Lois Lane, but to truly feel deeply for a character or characters, we need to actually feel and see their emotions onscreen. To understand the depth of love that will come to be between the power couple, we need to see it played out to a lesser degree.

This is probably the only time we will see this side of Lois Lane on the show, but in future episodes, no matter what she says or does, we will always know that she has those kind of feelings for the bumbling tadpole. Besides that, they are not totally in love right now. Far from it. We don't even know how Clark really feels at this point. We've only see it from Lois' side, and I think TPTB have portrayed it beautifully, as well as the actress herself.

Only think, if Lois is this devastated for none other than Clark Kent while only just beginning to recognize her feelings, does that not show how utterly and completely she loves him in the future? To me it does, and I'm excited that we are finally getting a small glimpse of how boundless and eternal their love will become. Because let's face it, Lois Lane is a HUGE part of Clark Kent/Superman's life.

We may never get to see the culmination of this love match on SV, but we can get a very small taste of what makes it so deep and abiding. This has never been portrayed in live action that I can recall, and I want to see it! I have never bought the love-at-first-sight gig from Clark/Superman. There HAD to be something more.

I agree that it's nice to get this insight into the Clark/Lois romance... a twist on canon. The "love at first sight" ship sailed for these two a long time ago, and so it makes sense that PS3 have to show why there is such a depth of love between them that these two will be married in the future.

HOWEVER... I still have issues with the way they've handled it, in terms of having them take turns. First Lois falls hard. Then, Clark. When Clark falls hard, where will Lois be & will her walls be up again? If so, why? Sheesh....

I said this on a different thread, but I'll say it again here. If Clana was the victim of "secrets and lies", then Clois will be the victim of "bad timing".

And I'm not so sure that I'm happy about that.

[LCforever]

i found some youtube vids for your heartbreaking pleasure....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtPG0Q_-59E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YMjEnXox-E