Fortress of Doom & Possible Plothole

[xrayvision]

I wanted to bring this up. In Solitude, we saw that Brainiac was destroyed by merely touching the Fortress crystals, which is why he needed Clark to insert the black crystal from the black ship form of himself. In Oracle, Lionel's touch simply destroyed Brainiac because Lionel had the FOS coding alive in him. I don't think it makes sense for Brainiac to be able to cover the Fortress of Solitude like he did. From what I saw in the episode, I'm guessing Brainiac used the Fortress & its matter & crystals to replicate himself from a bunch of small drops and cover the entire FOS.

But it still doesn't make sense how he can survive contact with the Fortress without being destroyed and cover the entire FOS to turn it into the Fortress of Doom (if that's what they will call it). The only explanation I can think of is that Brainiac has learned how to adapt and protect himself from the FOS' anti-Brainiac defenses. I would like it if this turns out to be the case. I just want it to be explained because it's a complete 180 from what's been established.

I'm also hoping that before Clark ousts Brainiac from the Fortress, he takes a chunk of it and rebuilds his ship form. I would really love it if the final time we see Brainiac on the show, he is back to his ship form and is forced to leave Earth thanks to Clark and goes to find Kandor like Kara.

[razta]

Good point(s).. Maybe Brainiac was able to get round the FOS defences in "liquid" form and also maybe when he was with Dax-Ur he got a few codes from him.

[kaam]

razta, that's a good point. When he hacked into Dax-ur's mind, he could easily have gained knowledge to any backdoors and was able to hack into the fortress. Other theory, some people are talking about is the fact that Jor-el was trying to release Brainiac from Chloe and while doing so, his defenses were weakened by it temporarily and Brainiac was able to attack.

Now this is all after he had hacked into Dax-ur's mind, and I think it covers the plot hole because he has more knowledge. So when Jor-el tried to release him from Chloe, he couldn't, but rather Brainiac escaped and took over the fortress. This also covers the fact that Jor-el warned Clark about Brainiac's unpredictability.

[SUPERMANUSA]

If he gained unknown knowledge from Dax-ur, then why didn't he just go and take it over afterwards. He didn't have to go through the hoops like he did. Unless the information he got from Dax-ur was what is below. Here's the reason as I see it.

Brainiac knew that he had to be released from Chloe by means of Clark/Jor-El. He knew that he'd be absorbed by the FOS (info gained by Dax-ur) when released from Chloe (which is what happened when he dripped out of her ear). Then he was able to gain access to the FOS and manipulate it to take control. I don't think he multiplied or anything because he is data, as is the FOS. He just reprogrammed the FOS so he could gain control.

[KEakaCK]

Remember that the crystal took Clark and Lois to the Phantom Zone in Bloodline..So, my thinking is that this could be a replica of the actual crystal or manipulated is some way by the individual who stole the crystal from Tess and then sent it to
Clark, and that's how Brainiac was able to suppress the fortress like that.
That whole plotline seems suspicious to me...Makes me wonder if Clark had a point when he told Kara that he couldn't trust to use the crystal.

[kaam]

Another good point, KEakaCK. This might be part of the whole Crystal storyline, which now has so many twists.

Let's say, Brainiac was able to reprogram the Crystal that sent Clark/Lois to the PZ. Why didn't he program it so that he would know when Clark rebuild the fortress? just like he knew when Clark used Dax-ur's beacon, Brainiac heard the ringing in his head (similar to what Clark would hear from the octagonal disk when Jor-el wanted to contact him). This sort of nullifies the theory that Brainiac would reprogram the Crystal using Chloe, I mean why send Clark to the Phantom Zone when he can simply wait for Clark to rebuild the Fortress. Brainiac would have wanted to gain his trust, not push him away, just like he did in Solitude.

Now on the other hand, if Jor-el reprogrammed the Crystal and the storyline is somehow a continuity of Vertias, then its a whole different thing. Nonetheless, just like I said earlier, Brainiac's storyline is more twisted than ever and I guess it might be some sort of a 'Grand Stand' or a 'Last Hurrah' and he is part of more than just one storyline.

KEakaCK, do you run a site that posts screencaps of episodes? I have it bookmarked and your username is the title of the site, so I figured it was yours!

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

Remember that the crystal took Clark and Lois to the Phantom Zone in Bloodline..So, my thinking is that this could be a replica of the actual crystal or manipulated is some way by the individual who stole the crystal from Tess and then sent it to
Clark, and that's how Brainiac was able to suppress the fortress like that.
That whole plotline seems suspicious to me...Makes me wonder if Clark had a point when he told Kara that he couldn't trust to use the crystal.

I agree, maybe lex or somebody modified the crystal, don't ask me how, to allow Brainiac to infiltrate the FOS. Is it just me or does the latest crystal look more blue than the original crystal that built the FOS??

[optinox]

As intelligent as brainiac his, he's mostly known for his relentlessness and constant plots/plans. Brainiac needs a constructed FOS in order to carry out his plans. Clarks or Kara's, he needs the kryptonian FOS to release zod and rebuild a new krypton on earth with general zod. He couldn't infect it the other times by himself because Jor-El's AI probably has an anti kryptonian defense mechanism that would detect threats, intruders. He went to Dax-ur to suck out his knowledge on how to fix himself when he was hurt. This would make sense that he acquired more kryptonian knowledge about the fortress, and other things.

Jor-El said there could be consequences in helping Chloe and brainiac is unpredictable. Plus brainiac has never entered or been in the fortress as a small puddle of liquid...maybe he planned this and knew clark would take chloe to Jor-El, enough liquid brainiac that infected chloe was able to infect the Jor-El AI, while Jor-El was busy healing chloe, taking over in a vulnerable moment seems like a brainiac move. Since brainiac is a supercomputer, he was able to infect the fortress and take over, i think he changed it into a DD fortress, this will give a beacon signal....it just seemed like faora said he still hasn't fully evolved, and we see davis invulnerable to metal in human form, and now in "Bride" he appears to look like the real DD, so unless brainiac does something to speed up the evolving process by luring David/DD into the fortress, then i'm not sure how this will all fit in.

[oldblackmagick]

^^^It's davis by the way:p i knew who you meant but for a minute i was like oh what if david did go there....what there's no david on Smallville:p

[Kevin24]

I have to agree with what has been said. Since the crystal transported Clark and Lois to the phantom zone that means that someone or something reprogrammed the crystal to do that because it wouldn't do that before.

As someone has said, why send Clark to the Phantom Zone? I think there are two reasons for doing that. To get Clark out of the way so he could build the fortress himself to free Zod or he hoped that Zod would be released when Clark tried to come back from the Zone

I think the second option was way to much of a wild card because Brainiac had no way of knowing if Clark would even survive long enough to get a chance to open the portal.

I don't think it could be the first option either because I believe Clark is the only one who can form the fortress unless the crystal was reprogrammed so that he could form it which I doubt.

So maybe his first plan was having Clark accidentally free Zod and since that didn't work his second plan was to get Clark to heal Chloe using the fortress? So was the reprogrammed crystal what allowed him to take over the fortress?

For all that to happen that means Chloe as Brainiac stole the crystal from Tess and reprogrammed it to send Clark to the phantom zone and as a back up plan allowed it so he could take it over without being hurt by the fortress.

[Mars Investigations]

Also remember that Jor-El was distracted by sorting out Chloe's memories.

[Kevin24]

Yeah, he was distracted even Clark didn't notice that nasty ooze coming out of Chloe's ear. It slithered over to the crystals while Clark and Jor-el focused on Chloe and started to converse with him while Brainiac slithered away like a snake.

[oldblackmagick]

^^^No slithering...he was absorbed into the fortress which is how he evaded being hurt and then he slithered around on the crystal console to infect it all replicating over and over to infect it fully.

[kaam]

It just occurred to me, that Jor-el might be in 'happy' mode after that father-son moment :D He was so overjoyed that he forgot about Brainiac's threat. :lol:

[SUPERMANUSA]

I agree, maybe lex or somebody modified the crystal, don't ask me how, to allow Brainiac to infiltrate the FOS. Is it just me or does the latest crystal look more blue than the original crystal that built the FOS??

The crystal was modified by (most likely Brainiac) so that Clark would be sent to the Phantom Zone, Yes. But is was so that Fedora could escape and find her child, Doomsday. It didn't have anything to do with the FOS itself.

[kaam]

smUSA, we are not sure exactly if Brainiac DID indeed steal the crystal. And how would Brainiac know that Faora would escape/be released?

btw, its Faora; not Fedora! lol. isn't Fedora some sort of operating system? :D

[xrayvision]

If he gained unknown knowledge from Dax-ur, then why didn't he just go and take it over afterwards. He didn't have to go through the hoops like he did. Unless the information he got from Dax-ur was what is below. Here's the reason as I see it.

Brainiac knew that he had to be released from Chloe by means of Clark/Jor-El. He knew that he'd be absorbed by the FOS (info gained by Dax-ur) when released from Chloe (which is what happened when he dripped out of her ear). Then he was able to gain access to the FOS and manipulate it to take control. I don't think he multiplied or anything because he is data, as is the FOS. He just reprogrammed the FOS so he could gain control.

He can't be just data because he exists in a physical form as the black ooze. And we saw just a few drops of black ooze expanding to a size big enough to cover the entire FOS.

Don't forget, Brainiac is/was Milton Fine & is/was the black ship itself (the main portion of Brainiac, as Jor-El told Clark in Vessel IIRC). So he does have a physical existence. His material allow the data/programming that compose him to flow through and is just like the FOS. So I'm thinking he expanded his ooze form by feeding off the FOS.

[Liquid-Prince]

Brainiac didn't get destroyed from just touching the fortress, he got stabbed onto a crystal. This time he went from the inside and hacked his way in.

[SUPERMANUSA]

smUSA, we are not sure exactly if Brainiac DID indeed steal the crystal. And how would Brainiac know that Faora would escape/be released?

btw, its Faora; not Fedora! lol. isn't Fedora some sort of operating system? :D:lol: :lol:
Not sure, but that is what happened after all.
No disputing that.



----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


He can't be just data because he exists in a physical form as the black ooze. And we saw just a few drops of black ooze expanding to a size big enough to cover the entire FOS.

Don't forget, Brainiac is/was Milton Fine & is/was the black ship itself (the main portion of Brainiac, as Jor-El told Clark in Vessel IIRC). So he does have a physical existence. His material allow the data/programming that compose him to flow through and is just like the FOS. So I'm thinking he expanded his ooze form by feeding off the FOS.Not if he is considered organic.

http://www.computerpoweruser.com/editorial/article.asp?article=articles%2Farchive%2Fc0410%2F0 3c10%2F03c10.asp

The fact that organic computers make themselves is one small testament to their incredible power.

[xrayvision]

For all that to happen that means Chloe as Brainiac stole the crystal from Tess and reprogrammed it to send Clark to the phantom zone and as a back up plan allowed it so he could take it over without being hurt by the fortress.

This is what I've been saying, to an extent. I know Chloe has been slipping in & out of spells where Brainiac is completely controlling her. They even said it in Abyss (they said something like, "you had another Brainiac blackout"). We even saw Chloe's mind being warped by Brainiac. Who knows what he did all those weeks that they didn't show us Chloe's perspective. I'm certain Chloe as Brainiac reprogrammed the crystal to send Clark to the Phantom Zone so he could get him out of the way. Then once Clark was out of the way, he would take over Chloe and use her knowledge & his own knowledge to get close to Davis and speed up his transformation process while also getting Davis to recreate the FOS so Brainiac could take it over.

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


Brainiac didn't get destroyed from just touching the fortress, he got stabbed onto a crystal. This time he went from the inside and hacked his way in.

He did get stabbed in Solitude, but the main question is why even bother to trick Clark if he could have inserted the black crystal himself? My feeling is that any contact whatsoever with the FOS destroys him. But he must have figured out a way to withstand his former vulnerability. It's funny because that would make Brainiac like Doomsday in a way (invulnerable to his prior vulnerability).

[6-Super-Man -5]

Good point(s).. Maybe Brainiac was able to get round the FOS defences in "liquid" form and also maybe when he was with Dax-Ur he got a few codes from him.

Maybe.

[xrayvision]

:lol: :lol:
Not if he is considered organic.

http://www.computerpoweruser.com/editorial/article.asp?article=articles%2Farchive%2Fc0410%2F0 3c10%2F03c10.asp

The fact that organic computers make themselves is one small testament to their incredible power.

By organic, I'm assuming you mean carbon-based, since that's what organic traditionally means. Do you mean his programming is carbon based and that his data is like some sort of supercomplicated DNA that allows him to assume a humanoid form?

You made a pretty interesting post. I've always considered SV's Brainiac as being made of some sort of metal. But now I'm starting to think he is made of a biometallic alloy. I think the material he's made of consists of carbon & other elements that compose a typical Kryptonian's highly dense tissue along with a very strong Kryptonian metal that allows him to make protrusions & other weapons of his skin. Therefore, the Black ship form of Brainiac is also made of a biometallic alloy.

Also, don't forget that Brainiac's main form was the black ship, and that when he had that form, he was more powerful & dangerous than he was once that ship form of his disappeared. I'm starting to think that the ship form had a central brain that was able to create more humanoid copies by synthesizing bodies out of its own mass as we saw (which is why the Zod symbol underneath it was not initially seen but later noticed by Lex).

I think before Brainiac is ousted from the fortress, he will synthesize another Black Ship from the FOS' material and then will leave Earth in search for Kandor as Brainiac does in the comics.

[Khyla]

Great thread! I'm wondering if the crystal was corrupted in some way, and am amazed that Clark could put his faith in it so blindly. He told CHloe how he was afraid she was going to put her trust in the wrong person, yet he turns around and puts his trust in a crystal that zapped him into the Phantom Zone! Who stole the crystal? Who sent it to him in the mail?

And why did the AI in the Fortress say "this creature you call Brainiac..." as if it never heard the word before?????

[ChronX4]

And why did the AI in the Fortress say "this creature you call Brainiac..." as if it never heard the word before?????

The AI usually reffered to him by his full name....which I can't remember :confused:.

My theory is that the FoS wasn't expecting a Brainiac takeover, before it actually prepared itself to impale him so I don't think any trace of him was left to take it over, but this time it was just a surprise attack.

[devilneedsaride]

btw, its Faora; not Fedora! lol. isn't Fedora some sort of operating system? :D

It's a kind of hat, actually.

[SUPERMANUSA]

By organic, I'm assuming you mean carbon-based, since that's what organic traditionally means. Do you mean his programming is carbon based and that his data is like some sort of supercomplicated DNA that allows him to assume a humanoid form?

You made a pretty interesting post.

I guess that's what I mean. If it means that there must be a material used as it's basis. What you said about the metals and all sounds right. And thanks. :lol:

[SUPERMANUSA]

Quote:
<table border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset ;"> Originally Posted by kaam http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4173263#post4173263)
btw, its Faora; not Fedora! lol. isn't Fedora some sort of operating system? :D
</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
It's a kind of hat, actually.

kaam is also right. It is an operating system for computers. Linux/Red Hat

[dimefan90]

jor el hadnt finished automatic updates after being re-installed

[al821]

No service pack 1