Turning point to Clark's progression? (A thank you to the Producers).

[theotherJane]

Finally accepts Jor-El, realizes he doesn't need Chloe's help anymore... What do you think?

[Razzle]

Yeah nice progression to the entire Clark/Jor-El relationship but kinda dropped the ball with the entire Chloe mindwipe.

[haydenclaireheroes]

i hate it!!!

[unfocused]

I love it. Especially the Chloe mind wipe.

[4Clana]

Finally accepts Jor-El, realizes he doesn't need Chloe's help anymore... What do you think?
IA, his double identity is suppose to come into play this season anyway. The less people know the better. I'm all for it!

[Blue Orange NY]

Why are people hating the whole mind wipe Chloe, it's the only way....how do you expect him when he finally becomes Superman....everyone who knows or remembers needs to be wiped....I agree with it, I have no problems with it besides Chloe isn't really in the mythos'
only in SV


Yeah nice progression to the entire Clark/Jor-El relationship but kinda dropped the ball with the entire Chloe mindwipe.

[Fallen One]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

[wallyK]

Well, I liked Chloe's special friendship with Clark all these years. But, yes, it is past time for Clark to move on and become Superman. Finally, we are getting it this year.

[Mar-El]

Cedric, as much as some fans on this board might not agree with what you just wrote, I do wholeheartedly.

Very nicely put. And I second (or third :p) it.

THANK YOU PS3. :D

[Blue Orange NY]

well said, yes thank you PS3 and we're just getting started

[4Clana]

I totally agree, it's a great step in the right direction! :D I'm all for it.

[Smallville6]

Thank you for writing this!
Although I loved the Chlark friendship and am mad she doesnt know his secret, IT'S NOT HIS FAULT! Everyone's blaming Clark, where it was a SACRIFICE on his part to protect her! That's a real superman.

[Deana]

Finally some truth. Bravo!

Maybe Chloe will go back to journalism or maybe she will find her wings somewhere else in life. Clark stepped up to the plate tonight. I saw Superman. Color me impressed.

[minerva73]

WHY AM I AGREEING WITH YOU SO MUCH TONIGHT, Fallen One (as if I haven't before, but you're making so many awesome comments tonight :lol:)?

It was okay when it started, but it got to the point where it was insatiable last season and it annoyed me. That actually made me glad that Lana didn't pressure Clark after she knew about his secret last season. I guess we'll have to hear more horrible lies in the upcoming weeks if he's hiding his secret, but it's for a good cause.

[Aloof]

I'm glad Clark is moving more towards Superman, but that doesn't mean I'm happy about the whole Chloe ordeal. :|

[unfocused]

I agree with the first post.

[LuckyLois]

It was Brianiac who took her memories, not Clark. I am also happy with the way Clark is stepping up and I have always loved Chloe, but this year espcially have felt she was being somewhat condescending to Clark, perhaps because she was infected by Brianiac. Hopefully things will continue to move in the right path and SV can continue or end on a terrific note!

[susangail]

Why are people hating the whole mind wipe Chloe, it's the only way....how do you expect him when he finally becomes Superman....everyone who knows or remembers needs to be wiped....I agree with it, I have no problems with it besides Chloe isn't really in the mythos'
only in SV

It's actually bothering me more than I thought it would, even though I was pretty sure it would happen. With Lois ramping up, mindwipe Chloe has no purpose at this point.

[Carolina87]

I won't lie i've been posting everywhere how pissed off i am at this whole Chloe memoryswipe thing n how im hoping that PS3 will take it all back; :\

But after reading what you wrote Cedric i guess u can say that i've seen the light ;). Your absolutetly right Clark cannot be the Hero we all know with Chloe by his side. Once again PS3 you guys r amazing keep up the great work!!!

n like you said BRING ON THE REST OF THE SEASON!!!! :D

[christian_kryptonian]

It upset me and made me sad, but it is somewhat necessary and the positive son/father relationship made up for it with me. I was truly heartbroken when I heard Jor-El crying out... "My Son. My Son!"

[christian_kryptonian]

Praise God!

[jqedward]

Why doesn't Brainiac just friggin' die already. He is beyond annoying to me at this point. I just wonder how this is all going to come together with Tess/Doomsday/Brainiac. Are they all going to triple team Clark or what? Will the JLA return with Kara to aid him?

[psyko69]

Totally agree with this.

Clark made a strong sacrifice but now both Clark and Chloe can move on to pursue their own destinies without Chloe having to be a constant fallback for Clark.

[Fallen One]

WHY AM I AGREEING WITH YOU SO MUCH TONIGHT, Fallen One (as if I haven't before, but you're making so many awesome comments tonight :lol:)?

Because I'm made of a bag of 100 individual tiny pieces of awesomness, James!:lol:

PS3 did something tonight I never would have thought we'd get. That takes guts. No matter how we feel about it, we all have to at least admit that what they did tonight took an insane amount of courage to do. Al/Miles would have NEVER done the things PS3 have done this season!

[theotherJane]

All I can say is, get ready for a whole lot of "Lightswitch" coming your way, Cedric.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Cedric.

You da man! ;)

[eas]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

Hhhmm... for the most part, this episode bored me & I saw it as a filler. But when you put it that way -- yeah, I guess it did have some redeeming qualities! :)

He was VERY Superman today, wasn't he?

Another thing that PS3 corrected was the use of Jor-el/FoS. It's like they listened to all the whining and griping we've been doing about it over the years.

[colibri]

OK, you've made me look at this differently. I know that in order for Clark to be Superman certain things have to start happening. I agree that Chloe couldn't know his secret. What has me bothered is how he did it. I suppose if you look at it as if Braniac was the one that mind wiped her and Clark only left out certain info for her protection it's a bit better but I still don't know.

But I agree the way this season is going she had to lose the knowledge. He's the one that has to make the decisions as to who knows his secret.

[SVsleuth]

I loved the Clark/Jor-El interaction.

One thing is bothering me though. They have Clark SAYING that he's learned to save others & not just his family & friends, but his choices are not really different in this episode. I saw this episode as paralleling Reckoning in a lot of ways.

Reckoning: Lana dies. Clark asks Jor-El to fix it. Jor-El says there IS a way, but the consequences could be unexpected. Clark hardly considers the possible consequences & chooses to save Lana. Result: Jonathan dies, & Lana ends up living a life from hell.

Abyss: Chloe is all but dead, as herself. Clark asks Jor-El to fix it. Jor-El says there IS a way, but considering it involves Brainiac, the consequences could be unpredictable. Clark makes the same choice: save his loved one. Result: Brainiac infects the Fortress & the whole world will be endangered.

HOW does this show that Clark has made progess? Clark acts the same way. Chloe told him that she knew he'd do that, that's why she didn't want to tell him.

The only difference I see is that the choice Clark made about Chloe's memories he did because he really believes it is best for HER, whereas bringing Lana back was done for HIMSELF, not for Lana. He made a personal sacrifice, because he believes it to be in Chloe's best interest.

Another thing that's bugging me is that Clark still acts as if it is knowing his secret that places others in harm's way. But, the reality is that being friends with Clark puts them in harm's way, whether they know the secret or not. Case in Point: Lois being zapped to the PZ & being taken over by Faora. The villains will make use of his friends and loved ones - like Brainiac did with Lana & Chloe - & would have done the same whether they were in on the secret or not. This leaves Clark with the only way to protect his friends and family is to be alone & not have any relationships. That's absurd! I guess that's why we need villains who are only after Superman & have no clue that Clark Kent is Kal-El. But it seems a little late to achieve that.

[susangail]

I disagree with the method used to achieve the result, Cedric. I would have preferred that they killed her off in a meaningful way. What purpose does Chloe serve now? Zip.

[DontCha]

I agree with you friend! I was having doubts but you've just made me realize

it was originally a VIOLATION of clark's privacy it should be HIS choice to tell people his secret.

[harryandginnyfanatic]

Great first post.

[Deana]

IMO, it was a turning point for Clark. I certainly saw the Clark Kent that I have fangirled for years before Smallville highjacked his image and took it hostage for all it was worth.


It's actually bothering me more than I thought it would, even though I was pretty sure it would happen. With Lois ramping up, mindwipe Chloe has no purpose at this point. No purpose? She could, I don't know, renew her interest in journalism. I don't understand why people think there is only room for one female alpha dog reporter in Smallville. There can be two even dare I say it three. I am hoping that when Clark leaves to train or whatever that Lois and Chloe become partners at the Daily Planet.

Chloe could be Clark's best friend like she was before she found out the secret.

Chloe, after learning the secret, became Clark's computer who spat out some heroic lines that were reserved for the Kents before they went bye-bye. She wasn't herself for a long time but instead of acknowledging that the writers handled Chloe learning the secret badly, we get this Lois interest in journalism is to blame for Chloe's downfall as a character.

The sky is the limit for Chloe now and if she does learn Clark's secret again, I hope the storyline is written better.

[Kschreck]

I am beginning to wonder if they are planning to not have Chloe be a part of season 9 and are just setting the events in motion and are preparing for Chloe to move on in the story (getting married, no longer helping Clark with Krypton stuff, etc). Keep in mind that Chloe was almost not going to do season 8. So if she isn't planning on being in season 9 then this would explain some of the stuff going on.

I think Clark will become closer to Lois later this season and into season 9. I will miss Chloe a lot but they may be keeping it a secret about her not signing on to do a ninth season or I could be totally wrong about everything.

[eas]

Because I'm made of a bag of 100 individual tiny pieces of awesomness, James!:lol:

PS3 did something tonight I never would have thought we'd get. That takes guts. No matter how we feel about it, we all have to at least admit that what they did tonight took an insane amount of courage to do. Al/Miles would have NEVER done the things PS3 have done this season!

Yeah, that's certainly true.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


I disagree with the method used to achieve the result, Cedric. I would have preferred that they killed her off in a meaningful way. What purpose does Chloe serve now? Zip.

Well, she is a character in her own right. With her own arcs and her own stuff going on. She existed before she knew Clark's secret and they've made a pro-active attempt to have her develop her own storyline outside of being his sidekick.

The argument could be made that this is even better for Chloe - to not know his secret.

[OneShotClois]

I totally agree with you Cedric.

[theartist27]

This episode was pretty boring in my opinion. However, the fact that Chloe no longer knows Clark's secret slightly redeemed the episode. This is something I've wanted to happen for years. I've never wanted anyone to know Clark's secret, well, except for future Justice Leaguers. Now, can someone erase the secret from Lana's memory as well? ;)

[Kalista]

Someone once asked me, "Why do we all look the same to you?" This is why.

[minerva73]

it was originally a VIOLATION of clark's privacy it should be HIS choice to tell people his secret.

I agree, but I disagree too. :o Clark was willing to tell Chloe his secret which is why he told her he was from Krypton and he told her about all of that stuff in the hospital in Arrival. Sure she found out some of it by herself, but for the most part, he let her in on a lot of things. That being said, Clark originally hadn't intended on telling her (at least not like he intended on telling Lana in episodes like Calling and Promise), but he told her some of it for the most part.


Because I'm made of a bag of 100 individual tiny pieces of awesomness, James!:lol:

PS3 did something tonight I never would have thought we'd get. That takes guts. No matter how we feel about it, we all have to at least admit that what they did tonight took an insane amount of courage to do. Al/Miles would have NEVER done the things PS3 have done this season!

Only 100 pieces? :eek: It's soooooo much more. :D

But on a serious note, I agree. I was on the border about it when I read about it from the spoilers, but they handled it really well. Clark showed the right amount of compassion for Chloe and they showed Chloe feeling happy afterwards which showed that it really worked.

[Storm45]

am beginning to wonder if they are planning to not have Chloe be a part of season 9 and are just setting the events in motion and are preparing for Chloe to move on in the story (getting married, no longer helping Clark with Krypton stuff, etc). Keep in mind that Chloe was almost not going to do season 8. So if she isn't planning on being in season 9 then this would explain some of the stuff going on.


No its one step closer to Clois.

Joking , I'm not a Cloiser

Anyway, part of me agrees with the first post because I do think that Chloe knowing the secret and the way they played up their relationship since then damaged the characters of Clark and Chloe.
But part of me still looks upon the past 4 years of crappy characterizations: 4 years was too much. What a waste.

[DontCha]

I agree, but I disagree too. :o Clark was willing to tell Chloe his secret which is why he told her he was from Krypton and he told her about all of that stuff in the hospital in Arrival. Sure she found out some of it by herself, but for the most part, he let her in on a lot of things. That being said, Clark originally hadn't intended on telling her (at least not like he intended on telling Lana in episodes like Calling and Promise), but he told her some of it for the most part.


but the thing is he wasnt willing to tell chloe, at all, it was only after she said she knew that he started telling her things

Otherwise he never would have done.

[susangail]

With all due respect, Chloe didn't have much purpose in S8 to begin with. As much as I liked her in previous seasons, the character has no dramatic purpose left. She's just one more female in Clark's life that he needs to tiptoe around. What's interesting about that? They should write her out, one way or the other. Not hobble her like this.

How can they be best friends? He can no longer confide in her.

[Fallen One]

Oh Sana, don't get me wrong- the episode still sucked. It was every bit of what I thought it would be.

But I have found my guilding light in the fog of suckness.

Bring on the claims of lightswitching. Its only opinion afterall. And we all have them. I know that what happened tonight was controversial, but I also see this positive in it.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Someone once asked me, "Why do we all look the same to you?" This is why.

LOL, I don't even know what this means. But thanks! I'm too happy tonight to think badly of anything.

[minerva73]

but the thing is he wasnt willing to tell chloe, at all, it was only after she said she knew that he started telling her things

Otherwise he never would have done.

Agreed (which is why I compared it to the part where I said he was willing to tell Lana unlike Chloe).

But the deeper that Clark got into these problems, he probably would've had to tell her regardless. Chloe went into the caves unknowingly in Commencement and landed in the Arctic in Arrival. Clark could've continued to lie to her after they came out and went to the hospital in the Yukon (if Chloe didn't know part of Clark's secret), but he trusted her and let her know.


Now, can someone erase the secret from Lana's memory as well? ;)

The secret didn't transform Lana like it did to Chloe IMO. Chloe became obsessed with Clark and barely gave him any breathing room when it came to his secret. Lana on the other hand let Clark do what he needed to do concerning his secret like go to the Fortress without constantly warning him (Blue) or telling him that his father was bad even though numerous months passed after he did something bad. Lana and Lionel only told Clark about Jor-El not being trusted in Hero which was a few weeks getting to a month after he trapped Clark in ice whereas Chloe did it months after Jor-El set the Fortress to self-destruct even though she had no clue why it happened. At least Lana knew that nothing good came out of trapping Clark in ice while Chloe didn't know why Jor-El needed to shut the Fortress down.

And IMO, this sets Lana even closer to gaining that confidant-esque character that she's been in some versions of the comics (not sure of which era, though).

[lillie_poo_pod]

*snort*

I'm sure that this is only a temporary thing and that she'll be "in the know" again.

[Deana]

With all due respect, Chloe didn't have much purpose in S8 to begin with. As much as I liked her in previous seasons, the character has no dramatic purpose left. She's just one more female in Clark's life that he needs to tiptoe around. What's interesting about that? They should write her out, one way or the other. Not hobble her like this.

How can they be best friends? He can no longer confide in her.So I didn't watch before Season 4 so they weren't best friends at all? He has Oliver and the league to tell his super human tales of woe to.

I bet it will be more interesting then watching plot device Chloe and her magic computer friend solve or half-solve Clark's problems for him. I found that whole plot a big pile of crap that was finally flushed and Chloe is finally free to have her own storylines which hopefully includes dumping Jimmy.

[Jade4813]

I don't know, Cedric. I agree with you to an extent, but I still can't fully get behind it.

I think Chloe's knowing the secret screwed up both Clark and Chloe. I think Clark doesn't need Chloe to be his brain or to push him to be Superman. I think it could be good if not knowing Clark's secret gives Chloe back her passion - something she hasn't had for years. and I think that it was an incredibly brave thing PS3 did tonight.

But...I don't know...having Clark take away her memories like that, against her wishes.

Yeah, Clark didn't volunteer to have her in on the secret, but Chloe didn't volunteer to forget it, either.

Back when the spoilers came out, I wondered if this would happen and I fervently hoped it wouldn't happen the way it did. I could be fine with Chloe not knowing the secret any longer. She's hardly my favorite character, and when she learned the secret was when she went downhill with me. So under some circumstances, I could say, "Well, this is going to be interesting..."

But, still...I can't quite get past that they had Clark do it against her will when she TOLD him she didn't want to forget.

Yeah, his secret has been a burden on her, so I could understand it if she wanted to forget. But she didn't. And I can't help but think of the multitude of memories I have that are frankly painful to remember. But still, as utterly agonizing as some of those memories are, if someone came into my mind and took them from me without so much as a by-your-leave, I wouldn't be cool with that. I'd be livid.

And I don't think it's terribly Supermanly. That's just me. It's not that I don't see it was a sacrifice on his part. I recognize that it was.

But that doesn't mean that it wasn't wrong. I can't help but feel that Clark deciding for Chloe that she didn't need to remember his secret was just plain wrong. If she'd agreed - even if she hadn't wanted to do it - that would be one thing. But this way...? I just hate that they did this, honestly.

[DontCha]

*snort*

I'm sure that this is only a temporary thing and that she'll be "in the know" again.



Chloe: a non mythos character knowing the secret for so long was quite possibly the biggest loose end EVER created in Smallville history. One that should have been tied up years ago..it was a huge mess that needed to be tidied away before he could become superman and they've done it.

thank god clark has no crutch and as a bonus its one less thing Chloe has on Lois

now as it stands in season 8:

Lois and clark are technically closer than Clark and Chloe are.

im happy about that

[susangail]

Sorry, I just don't see it. This is Clark's season of becoming a hero, so he will move on without her.

[eas]

Oh Sana, don't get me wrong- the episode still sucked. It was every bit of what I thought it would be.

But I have found my guilding light in the fog of suckness.

Bring on the claims of lightswitching. Its only opinion afterall. And we all have them. I know that what happened tonight was controversial, but I also see this positive in it.

LOL... well, good. I'm glad that your happiness didn't cloud your taste. This was the worst episode of the season. The weakest link.

But, yeah, I see what you're saying. To be honest, I don't really feel strongly about this one way or the other. I'm OK with the wipe (we'll see how long it lasts) and I would have been OK without one.

I'm willing to wait this one out and see where this particular arc leads. I guess, to have a better idea, we'd need spoilers on what Chloe is doing post-"Bride" and they're not giving that to us.

[Deana]

Well, I would love to see her learn the secret again but this time . . . he tells her and she does not learn in such a shady way. She also is just a friend instead of stepping into a role that was a ridiculous plot-device nightmare.

[Jade4813]

LOL... well, good. I'm glad that your happiness didn't cloud your taste. This was the worst episode of the season. The weakest link.

:lol: And now I'm hearing what's-her-name in my head.

"Abyss, you ARE the weakest link! Goodbye!"

[eas]

Someone once asked me, "Why do we all look the same to you?" This is why.

Everyone has different opinions on here, though. Not everyone is agreeing with each other... case in point: Jade. She doesn't agree with the premise of this thread.

While I get what Cedric is saying, I'm not deliriously happy about this, to tell you the truth. I'm adopting a wait and see attitude.

So, yes, we all have a difference of opinion.

Kind of like how I'm sure that not ALL Chlarkers hated "Committed" and they didn't flood the message board with rants about how it was the worst episode of "SV" of all time. I'm sure that not ALL Chlarkers looked alike, right?

Let's all try to be fair to each other.... we all love different aspects of this show.... let's let folks enjoy or rant about whatever they want.

For my part, I understand why Chlark/Chloe fans are upset about this... I always have. And - to be honest - I'm curious to see how PS3 is going to get around the plot-holes. It's FOUR years.... it's a doozy of a situation they've put themselves in.

[theotherJane]

:lol: And now I'm hearing what's-her-name in my head.

"Abyss, you ARE the weakest link! Goodbye!"

Anne Robinson? That is funny because I was totally thinking of the same thing. :rotfl:

[eas]

:lol: And now I'm hearing what's-her-name in my head.

"Abyss, you ARE the weakest link! Goodbye!"

:lol:

Ah, if only that lady was around and she could just remove this episode from the roster. That would be nice. LOL

[THE"Lurker"]

I get the sense this thread needs a poll,

Did you like the Chloe mindwipe idea?
Yesh, I didnt like her knowing anyways
Hell No, He needs someone to confide in

[Québec]

I totally agree with Fallen One.

I'm glad they're (finally) bringing Clark closer to being Superman.

[susangail]

Based on what I've seen on the other threads, I'm thinking strong feelings in both camps ;)

[Storm45]

Chloe: a non mythos character knowing the secret for so long was quite possibly the biggest loose end EVER created in Smallville history. One that should have been tied up years ago..it was a huge mess that needed to be tidied away before he could become superman and they've done it.

thank god clark has no crutch and as a bonus its one less thing Chloe has on Lois

now as it stands in season 8:

Lois and clark are technically closer than Clark and Chloe are.

im happy about that

Chloe not being part of the mythos isn't a problem, IMO. I frankly don't see how it would pose a problem for the future. She's a friend of Cl;ark and she knows the secret. Lana did in the comics. Pete did in the comics. I can see Chloe knowing it. My thos or not it doesn'ty matter.
The matter was how they wrote the characters.

You have Lex Luthor who was best friend with Clark for a couple of years and discovered the secret last season. It seems to me to be quite a bigger loose ends.

[SnowBird]

Very well said Cedric. It was very sad for Clark but also it is for the best so Chloe can have a life. It was a selfless sacrifice that only one who loves his best friend could make.

[amberdawn]

Good post Cedric. *claps*

[Fallen One]

Thanks Snowbird.

Thanks Amber, I really like your music.

[superman07]

I agree with everything you've written Cedric. It was completely Clark's choice, and although Chloe and Clark's relationship was great with the secret. If it disappears now then I guess it wouldn't have been that special.

IMO It gives Clark the chance to grow more as Superman and maybe we can see Chloe go back to some of the things that made her great like reporting.

[mrw66855]

Cedric you are so right. It is his choice who he tells. It was his choice to come and tell us, He is Superman. You are right. I told he forgot about that she was forced to know Clark's secret (even though she kept it.) It was a crutch, and with lana there. He really had no reason to in brace his destiny. Also, in my opinion, those who think that it was wrong for Clark to do that. I am a little disappointed that it will hurt their friendship. However, I tell them to remember, that it was Chloe, who caused this to happen to her, and Clark was saving her from her mistake. If you guys remember Clark tried to tell her she needed help, but she did not listen and because of her not listening to him. Their friendship is paying the ultimate price, Clark was correcting her mistake. Nice points Cedric, and I hope your review will come soon.

[SteveS]

Chloe not being part of the mythos isn't a problem, IMO. I frankly don't see how it would pose a problem for the future. She's a friend of Cl;ark and she knows the secret. Lana did in the comics. Pete did in the comics. I can see Chloe knowing it. My thos or not it doesn'ty matter.
The matter was how they wrote the characters.

You have Lex Luthor who was best friend with Clark for a couple of years and discovered the secret last season. It seems to me to be quite a bigger loose ends.

Of course not, Chloe has been the best character on Smallville for years, with a bond with ClarkMan that lois would kill for. (oh, by the way, lois was not mentioned or missed in tonight's episode, that is because this was a serious episode and not comic filler)

Since I don't really believe there is a happily ever after in Chloe's future with little Jimmy (though I liked him tonight), I think Chloe's powers are intact and she can re-learn ClarkMan's secret again. (it might take lois 50 more years to do so):D

[DontCha]

actually the majority was filler steve, the only important thing to the overall plot was Chloe losing her memory

and may I ask..did you see the promo? :D

Chloe now has one less thing on Lois

she doesnt know his secret and it will remain that way. That was the ONLY thing that made her closer to clark than Lois

now as things stand, Lois is closer to clark's heart so much so he's actually considering TELLING her his secret something he as NEVER done with chloe. He had his privacy violated by chloe learning it..it was not his choice to tell her.

That particular sacred trust belongs to his soulmate and lord knows that aint Sullivan the non mytho blondie

[puppiesnkittens]

I have to chime in here. Clark was Superman tonight. Completely selfless and ready to embrace his destiny. I freaking loved this episode! This season has almost undone all the damage from the years that Almiles were in charge. Finally someone gets it! Bring on more. This season just keeps getting better. I am even curious how they will wrap up Lana's story. Never thought I would say that but with PS3 I am learning to have some faith in the show. :eek:

[Animation]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rude. Very rude. Also, I could not disagree with your post more. As a non-mythos character, and with tv and movie versions being parallel visions, there is no more reason to remove her knowledge than to keep it. I'm fine with her loss of knowledge, but it could certainly fit either way.

Lewis

[double L]

(oh, by the way, lois was not mentioned or missed in tonight's episode, that is because this was a serious episode and not comic filler)
:lol:
This episode was completly a filler, until next week's. You should know by now, any episode without Lois Lane, is a filler.

[SteveS]

You are letting your wishes and fantasies be posted as a fact again, he ain't telling lois nothing in Smallville, her brain can't comprehend it. Lana will be appearing next week and lois will be left out, like she was tonight. Unmourned, unmissed, unimportant, unmentioned.

For a good lois episode, a oxymoron if there is one, you need lightweight, poorly written comedy, this episode was almost a drama.

There is no such thing as a soulmate, it is a fantasy of those to be multi-divorced in the future. Lois Lane will be a girlfriend someday, however, it will never be on Smallville. Maybe some L&C re-runs.

[DontCha]

I just ADORE how Clark implied that Lois had gotten so close that he would consider telling her his secret and letting her have the knowledge

And one episode later he rips the secret away from Chloe. Sorry I cant help but snort.

Thats enough for me, to let me know just WHO clark feels closer to, and in SMALLVILLE I might add.

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----

Its funny steve because Lana is ONLY back for 5 episodes out of 22 which strongly indicates that she is NOT that important to the overall plot of this season. All it is, is closure and Im glad Lois is not there because it would actually just complicate the matter of cold hard closure

Lois will be back after this. And in every episode I think. And we will get the unfinished business of that possibly interrupted KISS WHICH btw clark was not forced into like he has been every time with Chloe

he's as much leaning into her as she him.

has no feelings?

ok

[lovinredkclark]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.


while i agree with most of what you said, actually all but one part. deciding to carry the burden alone. he has the JL who know who he is. so although his will have to cover his tracks with most people at least he will still have some outlet.

everything else you said about clark use chloe as a crutch, i completly agree.
clark DOES NOT need chloe and tonight he proved that he is moving in the direction that he should be.

imo this is the best season of smallville (so far). thank you ps3.

[SteveS]

And lois will be missing from a number of episodes the remainder of the season and still is only a part-time player. Not really an A player in the series after all these contrived years!

Merry Christmas to all! And Happy Thanksgiving.

[DontCha]

she's mising from the 5 with lana thats all thats been confirmed theres still 9 more after these 5 and Im certain she'll be in the majority of them. Lana will not, its closure thats all and will most likely propell Clois into the stratosphere much like maxima's little interruption did :) but this time all the realizations will be on Clark's part not Lois' She's already had hers.

Its also interesting that they are halting Smallville for a month or so and Erica is currently filming a movie whilst these 5 lana episodes are being shot and she'll probably be shoting it for longer than that

hmmm..a months wait.. waiting for her to have some time off maybe so that she can come back and be in all the episodes because she is essential to them?? rather than shoot them without her?

[Iolanthe]

Originally posted by SteveS:
(Oh, by the way, Lois was not mentioned or missed in tonight's episod. That is because this was a serious episode and not comic filler.)


Lois will be left out, like she was tonight. Unmourned, unmissed, unimportant, unmentioned.

For a good Lois episode, a oxymoron if there is one, you need lightweight, poorly written comedy. This episode was almost a drama.

Tee-hee! I agree!

I'm not going to get into the whole Chloe vs Lois thing but so far Clark has been much closer to Chloe and their relationship is much deeper.

When Clark excised Chloe's memories, he removed episodes where she saved his life, parts where he saved hers, where they argued about the proper use of his powers, where they saved the world together.

If Clark were to remove Lois' memories of him, she'd only lose the sight of him nude in a cornfield. Their relationship is superficial.

[double L]

And lois will be missing from a number of episodes the remainder of the season and still is only a part-time player.

Don't worry, In the episodes that actually matter, not like tonight's filler. Lois will be there, and will be right there with Clark.;)

[Super EJ]

OK Ok Ok ok. Sorry about the whole "Ok" ordeal but after watching this episode it made me feel like if i drank four cups of Cuban coffee which is really strong stuff.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

I don't suppose there's any chance of this not turning into a shipper war and instead remaining focussed on Clark's SUPERMAN progression????

No?

Thought not.

[puppiesnkittens]

^^ Amen. Clark's progression is sooooo worthy of discussion.

[Super EJ]

This is all I have to say, " NA NA NA NA, Hey Hey Hey, GOODNIGHT!!" JOP WELL DONE PS3!!!!!! WOOOO!!!! x)

[hyped4lnc]

I hope Clark tells Lana about the mindwipe before Lana mention something to Chloe about Clark's secret.

[Jade4813]

I don't suppose there's any chance of this not turning into a shipper war and instead remaining focussed on Clark's SUPERMAN progression????

No?

Thought not.

It was a nice dream while it lasted, neh? ;)

I just hope that the writers end up having a very, very good reason for this. And if Chloe ends up getting her memories back, I'd be curious to know what her reaction will be. I'd be furious, personally, and I'd have a hard time getting over it, even though it was for the best of intentions. But I can be kind of hardheaded like that.

I wonder if she'd get them back and find out that she actually was happier without them. That would be interesting. If she gets them back and is ticked off, though, I hope it's not one of those "this episode they're on the outs; next episode, things will be fine." Though PS3 has been better about that this year.

[minerva73]

I hope Clark tells Lana about the mindwipe before Lana mention something to Chloe about Clark's secret.

That's a good point. With Lana and Chloe hugging in Bride, I'm guessing they'll be pretty close in the upcoming episodes. So if she gets the chance to ask Chloe about the secret, then that could really make Chloe start suspecting something. Then Chloe may start sneaking around and trying to find out about Clark's secret which could put Clark back in the same position he was in Identity with Chloe getting so deep in situations that humans can't handle.

[DontCha]

Tee-hee! I agree!

I'm not going to get into the whole Chloe vs Lois thing but so far Clark has been much closer to Chloe and their relationship is much deeper.

I would have said that was true...right up until about the end of season 7: Siren to be exact. Since then clark and Lois are the ones who were growing closer romantically and up until now Chloe knowing the secret was the only thing that made her closer to clark than Lois is.

She now doesnt have that and she doesnt have Clark discoverig his feelings for her. This is all happening for Lois, not Chloe.

More importantly. in season 8, currently we have clark implying that he'd lke Lois to know his secret and he agrees that its because he's let her so close, one episode later he makes the choice to take it away from chloe. It speaks volumes about who is actually closest to clark kents heart.

He's now been given the choice for Chloe to know or not to know and he chose for her not to know. there you have it. If Chloe was the love of his life, he would have chosen for her to know, Instead, it appears he's starting to feel Lois fits those shoes.

When it comes to the person he believes to be the ONE he tells them. When chloe learned the secret it wasnt through trust, It wasnt clark's choice it was a violation of his privacy and in contrast Clark is actually considering letting Lois know his secret. huge difference.



If Clark were to remove Lois' memories of him, she'd only lose the sight of him nude in a cornfield. Their relationship is superficial.

Again, clark also said earlier that he WANTS lois to know his secet, Next episode he chose to tear it away from chloe. It speaks volumes about who is actually closer to clark's heart;)

[Animation]

I don't suppose there's any chance of this not turning into a shipper war and instead remaining focussed on Clark's SUPERMAN progression????

No?

Thought not.

Absolutely no problem.

On the one hand, Clark's action is very much in line with Superman. He is arrogant and plays god with others and he decides what is best for them. That is progress towards being how Superman is often depicted in the comics. On the other hand, he violated a friend's trust and has convinced himself it is for her own good, and not his. That is a moral failing, one that seriously hampers his progress towards being Superman, and is supposedly against everything Superman should stand for.

So, right now, he seems to be batting 1 for 2.

I guess we'll see how the story continues.

Lewis

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


When chloe learned the secret it wasnt through trust, it was a violation of his privacy and in contrast Clark is actually considering letting Lois know his secret. huge difference.

Of course, Chloe wasn't the one who violated his privacy. So, it isn't right of him to violate her even more sacred mental privacy. 2 wrongs don't make a right. I have to wonder why he doesn't just whip out the heat vision and start performing lobotomies like his Justice Lords alternate did? He did it for people's own good, after all!

Lewis

[Mr.Magic]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

I disagree.
If you think that way we would have to erase the memories of his power from almost 70 people, none of which Clark told his secret.

All this episode did was bore me and regress Clark to Pussyboy.

[DontCha]

Chloe didnt violate his privacy but clark kent has EVERY RIGHT to CHOOSE who knows his deepest secrets, and he had no choice with chloe, it was a violation and NOW he was given the choice that was ROBBED from him.

And the most important thing of all about this Episode is that Clark Kent actually chose for her to NOT to know the secret. He chose for her NOT to be the one who's closest to him She is not the love of his life, she is not the one...meanwhile he's considering how Lois is the right person to tell his secret to and why? because she is the one and he senses it.

It also shows us that all these years, its something that clark has never actually wanted when it comes to chloe. It was forced upon him, he never had the choice well now he does and he gave it up in a heartbeat.

[Animation]

EVERY RIGHT to CHOOSE who knows his deepest secrets

No he doesn't. Nobody has such rights, except that they can get away with them because nobody else can stop them. It is a mental violation, pure and simple. Might does not make right.

If anything, this de-rails Clark's path to being Superman. I mean, when he read the names of the Meteor Infected on Chloe's list, and told her he crossed the line, apparently he was just lying to avoid an argument, because mindwiping someone "for their own good" and "because it wasn't their right to know" is so far over the line that it is disturbing. He doesn't have the moral character now to be Superman. It is not OK for him to violate someone's mind. Of course, he constantly ignores rules when he deems it for the best. However, this "playing god" mentality has mostly only been a flaw for Superman when written by writers who more or less hate him, like Frank Miller.

Lewis

[harryandginnyfanatic]

I would hope that in future Clark will take more care in who he reveals his secret to.

[Storm45]

It reminds me of Reckoning where Clark didn't want Lana to die and decided to go back in time before she knew the secret and asked hert o marry him.

Instead his father died.

Things in life doesn't always go as you want. You can't control everything.
A part of growing up is to deal with this fact.

[HeartChakraBabe]

*snorts* Yeah, they're finally making Clark become Superman, but they didn't have to mind-wipe Chloe to do it. I am honest-to-god considering dropping the show, for what they just did. I LOVED the Chloe-knowing-Clark's-secret dynamic, and they just ripped that away from me. U-N-F-O-R-G-I-V-A-B-L-E!!!!!!!!!!! I want to punch something right now. Preferably Clark, with kryptonite in my fist.

[DontCha]

No he doesn't. Nobody has such rights, except that they can get away with them because nobody else can stop them. It is a mental violation, pure and simple. Might does not make right.

IMO he does, say you have a very deep secret that can hurt people and hurt you if other people know it you have every right to be the one who lets people know about it, It was not chloe's fault that she found out, but her finding out robbed clark of that choice,he now gets the choice and the audience find out once and for all that he'd rather not have chloe know his secret, he was forced into it, and obviously never felt as if she was the right one to be so close to.


If anything, this de-rails Clark's path to being Superman. I mean, when he read the names of the Meteor Infected on Chloe's list, and told her he crossed the line, apparently he was just lying to avoid an argument, because mindwiping someone "for their own good" and "because it wasn't their right to know" is so far over the line that it is disturbing. He doesn't have the moral character now to be Superman. It is not OK for him to violate someone's mind. Of course, he constantly ignores rules when he deems it for the best. However, this "playing god" mentality has mostly only been a flaw for Superman when written by writers who more or less hate him, like Frank Miller.

Lewis

i do agree with you to some extent, but it was actually a very supermanish thing to do, in order to protect her he took away HIS burden. Thats all. nothing else, but the one thing about him that could kill her.

[pjack]

well I just think they willl have a lot of continuity and plot hole issues. I don't mind her not knowing, but how will they explain things like Isys foundation or everything they have been through up to this point.
How will she continue to be the JLA'S side kick/watch tower? She won't be able to d that.
So does she still know green arrows secret? Aquamans? Cyborg? Barts? I mean that seems like that will be hard to get around since it revolved around knowing CK's secret. They can just go around it and not have her around when they are now but that will seem lame and obvious.

Clark did seem more SuperManly and it was nice to see the response in the fortress as to not blame and keep having him argue with Jor'el.

Well they were doing good so we will see how it plays out.

[DontCha]

I would hope that in future Clark will take more care in who he reveals his secret to.


yes, his soulmate for one.

[Animation]

i do agree with you to some extent, but it was actually a very supermanish thing to do, in order to protect her he took away HIS burden. Thats all. nothing else, but the one thing about him that could kill her.

Well, I appreciate that you at least seem sympathetic. To me, she is equally at risk either way. I guess we can just agree to disagree, perhaps. :)

Lewis

[pjack]

No he doesn't. Nobody has such rights, except that they can get away with them because nobody else can stop them. It is a mental violation, pure and simple. Might does not make right.

If anything, this de-rails Clark's path to being Superman. I mean, when he read the names of the Meteor Infected on Chloe's list, and told her he crossed the line, apparently he was just lying to avoid an argument, because mindwiping someone "for their own good" and "because it wasn't their right to know" is so far over the line that it is disturbing. He doesn't have the moral character now to be Superman. It is not OK for him to violate someone's mind. Of course, he constantly ignores rules when he deems it for the best. However, this "playing god" mentality has mostly only been a flaw for Superman when written by writers who more or less hate him, like Frank Miller.

Lewis

I disagree with this too. He made a decision that has caused so much harm to Chloe over the years that he wanted her to have a normal life. BRANIAC already took her memories so he had nothing to do with that. He didn't have to restore her memories period but that would be wrong and not becoming of a best friend. I believe it was to make her life happy and move on with Jimmy so that she isn't constantly worrying about him which she did ALL the time.

Also in Chris Reeves movies, he did the same thing so what is the difference? When he kissed Lois to make her forget about his identity. That didn't take anything away from him. So I don't buy the argument.

[dimeo782002]

yep thats right evryone can squee now clark is superman now just because chloe no longer knows his secret congratulations .

me personally don't see the point . this did not need to be done. well i can see people are happy with this so i guess i will move on but just because he mind wipes chloe does not make him superman . but for some they will be throwing a party over this . me on the other hand if chloe's memories are not given back by episode 12 this show smallville is over for me and i have been on baord since day 1 but it is not worth it anymore.

by the way chloe specifically told clark it made her life better knowing his secret she had no regrets. there fore if the show were on the other foot chloe never would have allowed this.

[Storm45]

well I just think they willl have a lot of continuity and plot hole issues. I don't mind her not knowing, but how will they explain things like Isys foundation or everything they have been through up to this point.
How will she continue to be the JLA'S side kick/watch tower? She won't be able to d that.
So does she still know green arrows secret? Aquamans? Cyborg? Barts? I mean that seems like that will be hard to get around since it revolved around knowing CK's secret. They can just go around it and not have her around when they are now but that will seem lame and obvious.

Clark did seem more SuperManly and it was nice to see the response in the fortress as to not blame and keep having him argue with Jor'el.

Well they were doing good so we will see how it plays out.


I also wonder how she'll remember why she's been fired from the Daily Planet. She might not even remember her converstaions with Tess Mercer and why she must be wary of her.

[DontCha]

Well, I appreciate that you at least seem sympathetic. To me, she is equally at risk either way. I guess we can just agree to disagree, perhaps. :)

Lewis


i feel very bad for chloe because she went through a hell of a lot of crap protecting his secret and it was all for nothing but all this pain she went through/is going through seems to be the reason clark feels he has to now remove it.

Its not particularly fair for him to do this to her but it wasnt fair that he didnt get the choice to tell her or not either.

[Theshadow129x]

at some point clark will get regressed. lana returns after all. and so when she does Clark will be less of himself and we will see things go back to season 6 status for a few weeks. but this was a step in the right direction. loved the episode.

[Jade4813]

Also in Chris Reeves movies, he did the same thing so what is the difference? When he kissed Lois to make her forget about his identity. That didn't take anything away from him. So I don't buy the argument.

Well, it's all in how you look at it, I suppose. But I will say that I've known a number of people who did think it was wrong in the Superman movies and did think it took away from his character. It's not called the "Super Roofie Kiss" for nothing! :lol:

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Absolutely no problem.

On the one hand, Clark's action is very much in line with Superman. He is arrogant and plays god with others and he decides what is best for them. That is progress towards being how Superman is often depicted in the comics. On the other hand, he violated a friend's trust and has convinced himself it is for her own good, and not his. That is a moral failing, one that seriously hampers his progress towards being Superman, and is supposedly against everything Superman should stand for.

So, right now, he seems to be batting 1 for 2.

I guess we'll see how the story continues.

Lewis


THANK YOU LEWIS!!! Finally!!!!!!!

Yes I totally agree that this is a Supermanly problem - and one that taps into that 'making the decisions of a god' element Superman is constantly battling with in the comic books. Still happens - I remember one storyline where even Wonder Woman was outraged by something he had done. The fact is Superman/Clark Kent's entire life will be filled with moral dilemmas and he has to learn from them along the way. Some will be clearly right, some will be in the gray area and he'll beat himself up about it. And I really think this one will be the latter. Taking on the responsibilities and the role is no easy task and this season in particular Clark is learning that and rather than running away and bouncing a ball against the barn wall he is confronting them head on. Which is AMAZING to see!

He was already partly questioning his decision about Chloe by the end of the episode when he said to Jor-El 'Guess I'm just starting to realize how much I actually lost' and his father answered 'You made a difficult choice, I am proud of you Kal-El'. That shows him MAKING the tougher decisions and his father realizing what a HUGE step forwards that is for him. Again part of the learning process for Clark and whether or not it backfires on him later will be part of that learning curve too.

This is the kind of turning point that for me ranks right up there with deciding to save people he doesn't know and considering a secret disguise - maybe even higher - because he's making much bigger decisions than he ever had to before. And yet it stays true to his core character because everything Clark Kent does he does with the best intentions in mind and in this situation he has come out of a long run of watching the people he cares about suffer/have their lives change drastically because of him. He believes he is being selfless and self-sacrificing for the good of others - again a Supermanly trait - whether we think it's right or wrong...

So this was a HUGE decision for our Clark Kent and a VERY BIG STEP towards Superman :D

Plus I think we gotta remember this whole 'remove his secret from someone's memory' isn't exactly NEW. In Superman Returns they picked up the story line where he made Lois Lane forget she discovered his secret/he gave up his powers/they did the horizontal mambo in the fortress in Superman II. And look how well THAT decision turned out for him!!! :rolleyes: Pregnant Lois when he disappeared off for years on end... we have to assume she hadn't a clue how she got that way... then she has this wheezy kid who can suddenly throw pianos across the poop deck and PING the penny drops...

Similar premise, similar moral dilemma, similar 'selfless act'. All very Superman from varying forms of media.

[Super EJ]

You know what! To me Clark is already Superman!! I mean all he needs is the costume but everything else he already has. He's got the fame for saving people. The villains. Powers and look. except he doesnt know how to fly yet. But still, he's already Superman. So why bother say he isnt when he already is. lol

[Jade4813]

Its not particularly fair for him to do this to her but it wasnt fair that he didnt get the choice to tell her or not either.

Well, no. But life isn't fair. (As William Gold...man (?) said in his intro to "The Princess Bride" - "We tell our children that life is fair. Not only is that a lie, its a cruel lie." To paraphrase.)

Clark has the right to decide who he will tell his secret to. And he has the right to ask those people he trusts to be worthy of his trust. He has a right to be angry with them if they betray his confidence.

He doesn't have the right to decide who knows his secret. To me, there's a difference. If a person finds out about Clark's secret - even if he's as careful about protecting it as he can be - he doesn't have the right to go into their minds and wipe it clean. I've got a very Professor X feeling on this issue. :lol:

The thought occurs to me, though. Until Chloe remembers Clark's secret - or discovers it again...I wonder if she'll start getting KOed a lot more often.

[ginnyfan]

Wow! I never thought about things that way Cedric. It is interesting that Clark had no choice in Chloe learning his secret. And now that he has the chance to erase his secret from her mind... he takes that chance. The problem here is that Chloe's still in danger. He needs to realize that some people choose dangerous jobs. If Chloe continues to act as Watchtower for the Justice League she's going to be in danger... perhaps from Aliens and... *shrug* there's nothing Clark can do about it.


yep thats right evryone can squee now clark is superman now just because chloe no longer knows his secret congratulations .

me personally don't see the point . this did not need to be done. well i can see people are happy with this so i guess i will move on but just because he mind wipes chloe does not make him superman . but for some they will be throwing a party over this . me on the other hand if chloe's memories are not given back by episode 12 this show smallville is over for me and i have been on baord since day 1 but it is not worth it anymore.

by the way chloe specifically told clark it made her life better knowing his secret she had no regrets. there fore if the show were on the other foot chloe never would have allowed this.

I agree. Well I don't feel as strongly as you do, but I feel that Chloe and Clark were on their way to creating more boundaries in their friendship without a mind wipe. The end of "Abyss" reminded me of Chloe's friend date with Clark in "Identity." Chloe was starting to feel out the ways she could still hang out with Clark as his BFF without romantic hopes and without working for him to solve mysteries. It would have... meant more if Clark had found a way to take Oliver's advice regarding Chloe, WITHOUT violating Chloe's wishes. How arrogant of him. Remove Brainiac sure! But... *sigh* Her speech about knowing his ability was so beautiful. *shakes head*

I can understand why he did it. But... he's so DENSE! It's like Chloe's talking and Clark's just not listening sometimes. "I hate ham sandwiches! I hate ham sandwiches! I don't like ham and cheese!" "Here's your ham and cheese sandwich Chloe."

*slaps forehead*

[LuckyLois]

I think espcially after his conversation with Oliver, that he was afraid for Chloe and felt this was the only way to protect her. Chloe was not backing down and was starting to live a secretive life around Jimmy as well. She lied to Jimmy just the week before in Identity and I think it was all starting to take it's toll on Clark. he could see the pain in Jimmy's eyes when Chloe lied. His secret is a burden, Oliver reminded him, he felt her life was in danger, he did it out of love not cowardice.

One of my favorite episodes was Blank, so I am curious to see how this plays out.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Well, it's all in how you look at it, I suppose. But I will say that I've known a number of people who did think it was wrong in the Superman movies and did think it took away from his character. It's not called the "Super Roofie Kiss" for nothing! :lol:

:lol: Now cos you know I love you I know you'll understand me debating this whether or not I agree/disagree with what he's done... right??? *wobbles lower lip*

If you've been a good girl and read through my longer post you'll have an idea what I think already ;):\ BUT I'll add that isn't his naivety in some of the decisions he makes with the best intentions at heart a big part of Superman too??? And we're still dealing with a YOUNG Clark Kent here - one that doesn't have the same experience as the man who has been Superman and all that entails... Think big blue boy scout and all that :) And good ole Kansas boy. And the fact we all know way too well how many mistakes he's made on his way to being the man in the silly red sheet ;)

And I still stand by the we may not agree with it. But it's a massive moral decision like one that Superman has to make time and time again and it's always done with the best intentions in mind. Time will tell if it works out the way he hoped it would...

[harryandginnyfanatic]

by the way chloe specifically told clark it made her life better knowing his secret she had no regrets.

She doesn't regret losing her job, her mother, her freedom, her life?

Girl was infected with Brainiac. She wasn't thinking clearly.

[SpeedDemon77]

Do any of you really believe that, after mind-wiping Chloe in order to spare her from danger of knowing his secret, Clark will actually let Lois in on it....purposely?

Dream on.

Not on this show. Up until the time when Clark re-emerges into the world as Superman, it's Lois Lane who is one of those left in the dark about his true identity and constantly investigating and digging to find out who the world's mysterious 'saviour' is. Her comment in "Identity" already set that up--vowing to investigate until she gets the TRUE story about the mystery superhero.

He might consider telling her....just like he did Lana for the first few seasons, but there's no way he's going to actually tell her of his own free will. It's just not time for that yet.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

You know what! To me Clark is already Superman!! I mean all he needs is the costume but everything else he already has. He's got the fame for saving people. The villains. Powers and look. except he doesnt know how to fly yet. But still, he's already Superman. So why bother say he isnt when he already is. lol

Ahh but this one depends on whether you're on the 'Clark is the person/Superman is the disguise' bench :D In which case he's NOT Superman yet. He hasn't worn a disguise and openly rescued people without hiding and he hasn't been dubbed Superman by Lois Lane soooooo..... ;)

[Jade4813]

:lol: Now cos you know I love you I know you'll understand me debating this whether or not I agree/disagree with what he's done... right??? *wobbles lower lip*

NO LOVE FOR YOU! :p Aw...stop with the eyes, really! I...I will not cave! I...I...aw, shucks. Get over here, you! *hugs*


If you've been a good girl and read through my longer post you'll have an idea what I think already ;):\ BUT I'll add that isn't his naivety in some of the decisions he makes with the best intentions at heart a big part of Superman too??? And we're still dealing with a YOUNG Clark Kent here - one that doesn't have the same experience as the man who has been Superman and all that entails... Think big blue boy scout and all that :) And good ole Kansas boy. And the fact we all know way too well how many mistakes he's made on his way to being the man in the silly red sheet ;)

And I still stand by the we may not agree with it. But it's a massive moral decision like one that Superman has to make time and time again and it's always done with the best intentions in mind. Time will tell if it works out the way he hoped it would...

I see both sides of the issue here. It was a big decision he had to make. And like I said in another thread, sometimes there are no "right" answers. Still, though...doesn't mean this wasn't still wrong. ;)

[ginnyfan]

I see both sides of the issue here. It was a big decision he had to make. And like I said in another thread, sometimes there are no "right" answers. Still, though...doesn't mean this wasn't still wrong. ;)

He certainly made the decision with good intentions. *sigh*

[chlarked_foever89]

Yes I agree, but he didn;t have to take ALL her memories away the writers could have found a better way of doing it.

[Jade4813]

He certainly made the decision with good intentions. *sigh*

He did indeed. Ironically, though, they say that the road to hell is paved with those very things. *sigh*

I admit, though...as much as I don't agree with what they did in this episode, I can't say that I'm not intrigued to know what they're going to do next. I may not like it. But I gotta admit that I'm curious.

So I suppose in a sense, they've done their jobs!

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Not on this show. Up until the time when Clark re-emerges into the world as Superman, it's Lois Lane who is one of those left in the dark about his true identity and constantly investigating and digging to find out who the world's mysterious 'saviour' is. Her comment in "Hero" already set that up--vowing to investigate until she gets the TRUE story about the mystery superhero.

He might consider telling her....just like he did Lana for the first few seasons, but there's no way he's going to actually tell her of his own free will. It's just not time for that yet.

I'm on the fence about this. In recent spoilers from, I think it was Kirstin at E!??? she said something about Clark revealing his secret identity to the world... Now IF and I repeat IF this filters through into eppy spoilers from Craig then sticking to the mythos there's only one way that will happen. And if it DOES then we're going much further down the line than a lot of us thought we might go...

So a year ago I'd have agreed with you and said not on this show. But after everything we've got so far this year and the possibility of a ninth season I'm just not so sure anymore. Fact remains in comic book lore he does choose to tell her and in last weeks episode the possibility was set up by Kara's conversation in the barn. It was foreshadowing. Whether or not it was mythos foreshadowing in general or show foreshadowing remains to be seen...

ETA: I should add that in the comics he doesn't tell her til AFTER her asks her to marry him and they get engaged which imo is MORALLY QUESTIONABLE yet again. When you think about it the history of how Clark Kent/Superman has been written has questionable decisions wherever you look...

[curiosity]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

I totally agree. Chloe was in way too much danger with both Brainiac and Doomsday both after her because she Clark's best friend. It's like they're trying to take down Clark by destroying his best friend.

The only thing is, there might be more to the story, we don't know yet. I can't say anymore since this isn't the spoiler forum.

It does make the show a lot more like Superman with no one knowing his secret right now. I guess Lana still knows it, though.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Yes I agree, but he didn;t have to take ALL her memories away the writers could have found a better way of doing it.

As could the writers on Superman II and Superman Returns. Though obviously the SR's team could have had waaaayyyyyy more rocks put in their sack before THEY were thrown in the river...

I don't think that the PS3 can be condemned until we see where it takes us down the line...

Like I've said we may not agree with what Clark did, but I get what they were doing.

[pjack]

yep thats right evryone can squee now clark is superman now just because chloe no longer knows his secret congratulations .

me personally don't see the point . this did not need to be done. well i can see people are happy with this so i guess i will move on but just because he mind wipes chloe does not make him superman . but for some they will be throwing a party over this . me on the other hand if chloe's memories are not given back by episode 12 this show smallville is over for me and i have been on baord since day 1 but it is not worth it anymore.

by the way chloe specifically told clark it made her life better knowing his secret she had no regrets. there fore if the show were on the other foot chloe never would have allowed this.

Thats a little extreme. She was just fine the first 4 years she didn't know his secret. He couldn't really move on and do things on his own with her being a side kick. Super didn't really have a side kick and very few knew his secret.
So to say its over for you seems a bit extreme. i don't think it will make the show bad. There are many things that happened I didn't personally like but the show continued and is better this year

----- Added 3 Minutes later -----


Well, it's all in how you look at it, I suppose. But I will say that I've known a number of people who did think it was wrong in the Superman movies and did think it took away from his character. It's not called the "Super Roofie Kiss" for nothing! :lol:

Perhaps but oh well. What's done is done huh? lol

[wolverine316]

I am happy and content this happened. Clark doesn't need Chloe anymore.

[SpeedDemon77]

I'm on the fence about this. In recent spoilers from, I think it was Kirstin at E!??? she said something about Clark revealing his secret identity to the world... Now IF and I repeat IF this filters through into eppy spoilers from Craig then sticking to the mythos there's only one way that will happen. And if it DOES then we're going much further down the line than a lot of us thought we might go...


I'm not saying whether this 'spoiler' is accurate or not. But if you'll notice how it's worded...very pointedly. There's a lot more hidden detail in the context of that one line than people may fleetingly take from it. The past few episodes have been leading up to Clark's burgeoning need for a 'secret identity'. Doesn't mean that he reveals precisely who or what the Clark Kent THEY presently know really is. Right? :)

[curiosity]

As could the writers on Superman II and Superman Returns. Though obviously the SR's team could have had waaaayyyyyy more rocks put in their sack before THEY were thrown in the river...

I don't think that the PS3 can be condemned until we see where it takes us down the line...

Like I've said we may not agree with what Clark did, but I get what they were doing.

Clark didn't take any of her memories away. He just didn't give them all back, and what he didn't give back was something that was taken from him without his permission a few years ago.

[Supes4Ever]

For the first time in a very long time I agree with a poster, and it is Fallen One. Thank you for your post.

Let me just say...wow. There are few episodes that have made me feel emotional when watching Smallville, "Reckoning" ranking the highest, before tonight. "Abyss" was a rollercoaster, and like any rollercoaster worth half it's salt I came out saying simply one word...wow.

I can understand a lot of people are upset about Clark's actions tonight, and to be honest I understand a lot of the point of views (other then the "rape" comments. Can we cut that out please? That is not a word to be throwing around so casually, and really doesn't belong in context). Once again, Chloe's ordeal was heartbreaking. She was being thrown for a loop, and it was destroying her. Stuck in the middle is the one person that could fix everything, Clark, who was scared to do it. You could see it in his face, and in his actions. Chloe's emotional and mental state was tearing him apart. You could imagine all the things flashing through his mind- losing his father, losing Pete, losing Lana, watching Lex fall from his friend to his soul-less enemy, and all the near world-ending moments; and you could see Clark was torn as to what to do. When Jor-El asked him for his final statement on the memory issue, he hesitated. But in the end he did what he needed to do, what he didn't WANT to do.

That is Superman. He makes the choices, and carries the burdens that no one else can carry. He pushed people away, Lois included, in the comics for so many years because he was afraid that they would be hurt. Afraid that asking them to stand with him through all the battles that would come would tear them apart. In the end though, Superman knows that he has to be the one to make the choice, and accept the outcome of what will happen. There are many times in the comics where Batman has asked Clark why he would do it, why he could do it, and each time Batman comes out with more respect for him. He will make the choice that will tear himself apart each and every time, if it will save one life, and he will accept his fault when he is wrong.

That is what Clark did tonight. He saved Chloe's life, in a higher level. Brainiac was and always is unpredictable, and he was destroying her. He couldn't allow that to happen, and now he will pay for it. How much is yet to be determined, but he will pay a heavy price because that is what happens when he messes with fate. On a story based level, the writers did one thing that previous writers seemed hesitant to do- Cut the ties that were binding Clark to Smallville in more ways then one. With Lana's arc coming up, this will more then likely give Clark final closure over the trials with Lana. The last step then was to take away Chloe's presence in Clark's life as his confidante. As long as Chloe remained locked at his side, Clark would never be able to accept the destiny laid out before him and move on from Smallville, because some part of him will always bring him back to the old days. With his determination now that he WILL play a role as an active figure, as a figure of hope for the people of Metropolis, he needed a clean slate to start with. Now that only Lana; who will leave again as she always has to another place and time; and Martha; his mother he takes care of and remains his attachment to his humanity; and Ollie and the Martian Manhunter; who will serve as his closest colleagues in the Justice League remain as the only people to know his secret, his mission can begin.

It doesn't mean that this beginning didn't come with a price, and an emotional one at that.

[pjack]

Clark didn't take any of her memories away. He just didn't give them all back, and what he didn't give back was something that was taken from him without his permission a few years ago.

Exactly.. as I mentioned it was Brainiac so why all the blame.

[cloisthelegendbegins]

I'm not saying whether this 'spoiler' is accurate or not. But if you'll notice how it's worded...very pointedly. There's a lot more hidden detail in the context of that one line than people may fleetingly take from it. The past few episodes have been leading up to Clark's burgeoning need for a 'secret identity'. Doesn't mean that he reveals precisely who or what the Clark Kent THEY presently know really is. Right? :)

But it's not Clark Kent we're talking about, it's the 'secret identity'. Now whether that means going public in a disguise or doing an interview from the shadows or whatever else it still takes a massive step towards Superman in Smallville. And that does move the goalposts. You see what I'm saying? There's a ton of things I'd have said would never happen on Smallville right up to the end of season seven, just as many I wished had NEVER happened :p But season eight has gone up at least three gears and the majority of people are more than happy with that. Did we think we'd see Clark at the Daily Planet or the majority of the show set in Metropolis? (both things people still debate are right/wrong) Fact is the new show runners are taking chances and it's paying off for them when it comes to Clark's progression towards the mythos of Superman.

So I'm still gonna sit on the fence :)

[jaksfreak91]

I think erasing Chloe's memory was a right choice made by Clark (well erase only memories related to Clark's secret), because Clark has to move forward into his destiny alone, and Chloe was kind of roots holder, but I felt sad too, because all those years she knew her secret made her an importante character in the series, If she wouldn't knew Clark's secret, she would be unnecesary to the series and she would be dropped out.
Maybe by the season or SERIES finale, Chloe will remember Clark's secret unexpectedly and she will save it from Doomsday or anyone else.
I think this is the last season for Chloe (well maybe for everyone If this is the last season XD).

[SUPERMANUSA]

I'm posting this everywhere. I love how they start each episode with a recap as if they were mini premiers and I think this was one of the best episodes EVER!!!


Thank you New Executive Producers! GREAT JOB!!!

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Clark didn't take any of her memories away. He just didn't give them all back, and what he didn't give back was something that was taken from him without his permission a few years ago.

That's true of Superman II and the follow on into SR's as well - Lois wasn't given a choice about what was taken away and only part of her memories were...

I understand what people are saying about it not being his decision to tell Chloe (the same for Pete and Lana when you think about it - tho with Pete he wanted to once he knew there was a chance he might find out and he then went against his parents advice and it back-fired - and with Lana he struggled and struggled and struggled some more about whether to tell/not tell... ad nausea :p)

With Chloe I agree it was a decision forced on him, not made completely voluntarily. However - he didn't have to tell her as much as he did when he did and he continued to share more and more as he went along no matter what effect it had on the both of them. I personally feel that he wasn't mature enough at that point to make a 'damage control decision' and not sharing his secret with his closest friends/family had been difficult for him. Plus he trusted her and she'd already proven she could keep the secret by doing it as long as she had. The fact is that the longer she knew it the more adverse effect it had on her life from his POV. Bring it all to a head with the Brainiac influence and where it led to and he made a HUGE and much more mature decision that was incredibly difficult but he did it because he felt it was right. Now she's able to enter a marriage with the man she loves with no heavy secrets between them - that's what Clark strongly believes and certainly it would make for a more healthy marriage than the one they WERE entering into...

Big Supermanly-type decision. And now we wait to see whether or not it has a back-lash down the line the way many of Superman's decisions often do...

[dotsie23]

I liked this episode and I'm looking forward to seeing Doomsday in all his horrifying glory in Bride!!

[Storm45]

Seriously, people. More than often truths comes out without permissions. Its life! Should we tweaked into other peoples minds each time a revelation is made?

[gemini]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

I agree, it was a great episode!
Now that Chloe dosn't remember Clark's secret, and that she will certainly return to journalism we can have CHLOIS!!!!!
YES !!!!!
:p:D:lol:

[OMEGA SAM87]

Maybe Doomsday will kill Chloe, for not loving him!

That could be the spark that ignites Clark/Superman's hatred for Doomsday.

Then maybe both Clark and Davis will embrace their respective destinies!

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Seriously, people. More than often truths comes out without permissions. Its life! Should we tweaked into other peoples minds each time a revelation is made?

Yes. But not every revelation leads to the kind of danger knowing Clark Kent's secret does. It's a huge burden and Clark knows that all too well, especially considering everything that has happened to the people he loves along the way (particularly with this latest Brainiac arc). We're not talking about 'ordinary life' here - the closest to it in real life would be people who are involved in the lives of secret servicemen or Navy SEALS or the SAS. Every one of those people who live a dangerous lifestyle that may endanger others has to make difficult and what may be life or death decisions for others. Then we magnify that with the dangers Clark Kent super powered Kryptonian with enemies he hasn't even met yet has and the danger is magnified a few million times. Again I'm not saying it's right or wrong when he makes a decision like this but it's EXACTLY what Superman has to do on an all too regular basis. He then has to live with that decision or face up to the repercussions and learn from his mistakes.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


That could be the spark that ignites Clark/Superman's hatred for Doomsday.

Cos the fact he goes around sqoodging people for fun isn't enough reason for Clark to go up against him... obviously... :p

[Jade4813]

Cos the fact he goes around sqoodging people for fun isn't enough reason for Clark to go up against him... obviously... :p

First of all, can I say how much the word "sqoodging" made me laugh?

Secondly, I think we've had enough Clark/Bad Guy battles over a girl. :lol: Enough is enough! Can't they just battle because...you know...one of them doesn't believe in bathing in the blood of the innocents while the other thinks it's a rolicking good time?

[SUPERMANUSA]

Maybe Doomsday will kill Chloe, for not loving him!

That could be the spark that ignites Clark/Superman's hatred for Doomsday.

Then maybe both Clark and Davis will embrace their respective destinies!

Yikes! That sounds realistically eerie!
Could that be why Brainiac got Chloe and Doomsday to meet?
So Davis would flip out because he is "not loved" again? :lol: :eek: :confused: :) :D ;)
I think you are right!

It's going to be like King Kong and the girl, only Superman saves the day! :lol: :lol:

[BkWurm1]

they showed Chloe feeling happy afterwards which showed that it really worked.

Yes people who are lobotimized often do appear happier, but they are no longer the same person they once were.

Chloe was loosing her memories because she was infected by Brainiac...because she was helping Clark before and he repays her help by only partially fixing the problem he had a hand in causing? How is that just?

This isn't like someone finding out and forgetting a minute later. This is 4 years of her life that he tampered with. Four years of experiences that shaped her as a person and now all that has vanished.

Clark convinced himself he was doing it for her own saftey, I think his premise if flawed since now she still is a target and just doesn't know why not to mention maybe just not letting her in on the big fights in the future and poof, that problem goes away, but my point it that he by no means fails to restore her knowledge about his secret as a way to take back control of who knew his secret. He considers her not knowing a loss, one he is only beginng to comprehend. Clark is not pumping his fist or rejoicing.

Clark risked everything to save Chloe by taking a chance on the crystal. That is Supermanly. Forcing his will on her mind and taking away any chance of Chloe being a sum of her experiences (robbing her of the pride in knowing she made a difference to the world), that is Superdickery of the best/worst kind.

It is not a question of destiny, it is a question of fact and Chloe doesn't even know who she is...a savior of the world. The fact is that this Chloe Sullivan is no longer the same person who has been on the show the last 7 years.

But the show is not over.;)

[MeKa]

he by no means fails to restore her knowledge about his secret as a way to take back control of who knew his secret. He considers her not knowing a loss, one he is only beginng to comprehend. Clark is not pumping his fist or rejoicing.

But the show is not over.;)

Absolutely. Chloe knowing his secret saved his life countless times, something he alludes to in the FOS just before the memory wipe. Clark might not have wanted Chloe to learn of his secret but he's aware of what she's done for him since and it's his belief that she'll be better off not knowing. If Chloe's memory is restored, it's like she's returned to him. After all, he just let her go...

[cloisthelegendbegins]

Yes people who are lobotimized often do appear happier, but they are no longer the same person they once were.


I understand that people are upset by this but I'm gonna point out a few things. She wasn't lobotomized. Still walking, talking, in charge of her bodily functions, is able to feed herself and doesn't need drool wiped off her chin. Neither was she 'mind raped'. I have a problem with something as horrific as rape being equated with what was done in the show. She had her memories ALTERED.



Chloe was loosing her memories because she was infected by Brainiac...because she was helping Clark before and he repays her help by only partially fixing the problem he had a hand in causing? How is that just?


Yes. And he had a 'hand in causing it' because she was close to him and everyone close to him is immediately placed in harms way. Knowing that will cause him heartbreak his whole life and cause him to make decisions that aren't cut and dried. But keep in mind that since Toxic he has been TRYING to help her and she kept ignoring the problem and refusing help despite knowing everything Brainiac had done in the past. It took her to be having her ENTIRE LIFE erased before she accepted she needed help. So she has to accept some responsibility for how far it went in the same way that Clark will have to learn to live with and/or face the repercussions of what he has done.


This isn't like someone finding out and forgetting a minute later. This is 4 years of her life that he tampered with. Four years of experiences that shaped her as a person and now all that has vanished.


I don't think anyone disagrees with this. I certainly don't. But neither do I think that Clark didn't know it when he made the decision he did. Which only adds to how big a decision it was and puts it up there into the realms of the HUGE moral dilemmas Superman will always face.


Clark convinced himself he was doing it for her own saftey, I think his premise if flawed since now she still is a target and just doesn't know why not to mention maybe just not letting her in on the big fights in the future and poof, that problem goes away, but my point it that he by no means fails to restore her knowledge about his secret as a way to take back control of who knew his secret. He considers her not knowing a loss, one he is only beginng to comprehend. Clark is not pumping his fist or rejoicing.


He did. It was a selfless act for someone he cares very deeply about from his POV. HE doesn't know she's still a target. And this could be a huge part of the backlash that comes his way. Again something Superman has to face up to on many, many occasions. But yes, by the very fact he fails to restore her knowledge of his secret he IS taking control of who does/doesn't know it. In this case it just happens to be Chloe.



Clark risked everything to save Chloe by taking a chance on the crystal. That is Supermanly. Forcing his will on her mind and taking away any chance of Chloe being a sum of her experiences (robbing her of the pride in knowing she made a difference to the world), that is Superdickery of the best/worst kind.


So risking everything to save someone IS Supermanly but making a difficult moral decision to protect them ISN'T??? There's no win-win in there as demonstrated by Brainiac taking over the fortress at the end. Now we have to wait and see what the backlash is from the decision he made with Chloe. Superman TAKES CHANCES if he thinks for a moment it will SAVE A LIFE. Clark Kent is LEARNING THIS. The good, the bad and the ugly of it...



It is not a question of destiny, it is a question of fact and Chloe doesn't even know who she is...a savior of the world. The fact is that this Chloe Sullivan is no longer the same person who has been on the show the last 7 years.


Nope it is a question of destiny I'm afraid. Because these are the kinds of huge moral dilemmas Clark Kent/Superman will ALWAYS have to face. Some he will get right, some he will get wrong, some he will torture himself over for years, some he will have to deal with the repercussions of and THAT is his destiny as a 'god amongst men'.

Chloe has helped Clark and many others when it comes to many difficult situations. Clark knows that, a few others know that. Did she ever seek glory from it or recognition? Nope, cos none of them ever do. She is selfless from that POV. Just as Clark believed he was when he gave up his closest confident to try and keep her out of harms way. We may not agree with what he did but he did it because he felt it was the right thing to do. Now we wait to see if time will prove him right...

Because you're right. The show isn't over ;)

[harryandginnyfanatic]

I agree, it was a great episode!
Now that Chloe dosn't remember Clark's secret, and that she will certainly return to journalism

Chloe may have forgotten Clark's secret, but she hasn't forgotten why she hates anything connected to Lex and she hasn't forgotten why she took over Isis.

Besides, her desk at the Daily Planet was filled a long time ago by an intern who got promoted.

No point in her going back where she clearly doesn't belong. ;)

["Lois I Never Lie"]

This is what I’ve been waiting for and I agree 100% with Cedric. We needed someone to step up and steer this titanic of a disaster away from the ice berg and Im really happy to see that the folks who are now at the helm not only respect the mythology but seem to embrace it the way that we do. This is something I always felt was missing from those other 2 ejits that I wont mention by name as way of penance for what they did to Clark etc. No more do we have to put up with piny whinny Clark and I’ve got a real personality problem Jor-El. Im now looking forward to seeing how this all plays out and once again have butterflies in my stomach while waiting for the week to pass. Congratulations PS3 for if you keep this up we may actually have another season or 2. Its been a long time coming but as always “Great things come to those who wait”

[Cromartiefan]

*Yawn* another mindwipe, and it takes away the most interesting aspect of Chloe to boot. Still, at least this is one of the least lazy mindwipes in Smallville's history.

[davidbrenton]

Fantastic Superman episode. It was a very powerful and deep choice he made regarding Chloe and I feel a little uncomfortable, a little sad, and very impressed the show is making such leaps.

Very interesting. And finally, we got over the "is my dad evil crap".

[AgentChaos]

I can't agree with the OP. While Clark's intentions may be seen as noble, by removing Chloe's knowledge of all things Krypton, all he's done is put her in greater danger than before. She might not be seeking danger out, but beings like Brainiac and Doomsday are still going to go after Clark and anyone close to him. Only this time she won't be able to protect herself from them as well as she could have.

IMO this decision is going to come back to haunt Clark big time.

Now, as for Clark's decision to keep the truth about him away from Chloe, it was in no way, shape, or form worthy of the future Man of Steel. It's debatable whether or not he wanted to tell her prior to Arrival (his line about wanting to tell her many times could be seen as placating her), and he could have let Chloe continue to believe he was meteor-infected, but he didn't.

Chloe even said that knowing his secret changed her life for the better despite the sacrifices she's had to make. But he ignored her wishes and let Jor-El screw around with her mind out of badly misguided intentions.

Now is this going to stick? I highly doubt it, not if TPTB don't want to alienate most of the Chloe fans. I think by the end of Legion, when Brainiac and Chloe are finally separated, the lost memories will be restored.

[Chlois Supporter]

What I find really funny, is the idea that people think they're going to keep it this way. Really, in what freakish way would they keep her in the dark? They took her knowledge of his secret away, yes. Do you honestly in your hearts believe thats going to stick? Do I believe they did so for a reason, yes. Do I believe Chloe's going to learn the truth again. Yes. They're not going to just delete four years of character progression and let it go. Clark and Chloe's deep friendship, stems from the fact that she knew his secret. Thats what deepened that friendship, they're not going to erase that and let it stick.

[Seeya'round Smallville]

I have to preface this with the fact that I didn't watch the episode, but I can see both sides. On one hand for Clark to make a choice about someone else's memories is wrong. On the other hand, Chloe's knowledge of the secret was obtained without Clark's permission due to Alicia. It's not like this is the first time Clark's had some huge choice to make, and it's not the first time you could feel he was way right or way wrong and probably be justified either way.

I personally think letting Chloe know the secret ended up being one of the worst decisions the show ever made. It made them lazy. Chloe was their go-to for every plot point imaginable whenever they got stuck and after awhile it bordered on parody it was sometimes so ridiculous. Instead of having Clark learn himself or having other characters fill different roles, they just used Chloe to the point of overuse. Yes, she'd always had a crush on Clark, but by Season 7 with being so wrapped up in his secret and some of the over the top things she would say about him it was borderline creepy. Almost like Chloe who was on the Krypto-ade in "Devoted" wasn't far off from how she was by the end of S7. It was unhealthy for him and for her, all the other things in her life - her job, her boyfriend, her cousin - all secondary to being Clark's sidekick. Wherever you come down on the right/wrong issue of Clark's decision, maybe Chloe can actually get back to being her own character now and not just be the writer's crutch of how to get out of every unbelievable situation.

[TheAmazingApe]

Chloe may have forgotten Clark's secret, but she hasn't forgotten why she hates anything connected to Lex and she hasn't forgotten why she took over Isis.

Besides, her desk at the Daily Planet was filled a long time ago by an intern who got promoted.

No point in her going back where she clearly doesn't belong.

Chloe being at Isis and, indeed, many events over the last few years, have been so closely piggybacking on Chlark and their scoobying, that I can't see how she can explain them without knowing about Clark's secret.

Furthermore, she wouldn't have been fired from the Daily Planet if not for helping Clark, so (taking Clark's secret away) she really does belong there if you go by the fact that the only reason Chloe let her "torch burn out" was for the sake of helping Clark and keeping his secret.

Chloe was obsessed with TDP from almost birth. You take that away and take Clark's secret (the reason she let go of her dream) away and you are left with a shell.

Chloe is a shell without all the things that pushed her all these years. What is the point of her existence now? Mrs. Jimmy Olsen? Hell fo a destiny for the girl most instrumental in this show for so many years.

I don't see how anyone is okay with this.

[Fallen One]

The scoobying is dead, at least when it comes to aliens or anything that Clark doesn't want Chloe to know about. I'm sure he'll pick her mind about other things though, but she won't get the real answers from him. Dead are the lectures that comes with said scoobying too.

And I say good riddence. Won't miss em.

The push toward Superman has been a thing of beauty all season long. This was a leap toward his goal, but its not the final one. As Jor-El said, his trials have matured him and he has progressed. Next comes another leap. Lana. Once he takes that leap, then there will nothing that can stand in his way. But his dependence on Chloe, and his fixation with Lana had to be dealt with. They are achor weights to his destiny. They hold him down.

I can't say enough about how proud I am of Clark and the respect that producers are paying to him this season. He walks differently, his posture is straighten, he has a swagger about him, a stoic confidence. He speaks with authority.

He's almost there, he's almost there. And he'll need to be ALL the way if he is to defeat Doomsday this season. But if the producers continue on their path, he'll be ready.

[Bizarrolover]

Wow, Cedric, great post.

[skully]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.Nice work and well said, Cedric.

[Mickey_Bickey]

Cedric, I'm a believer!! You have the gift of persuasion!! The transformation is phenominal with Clark this season. His strength is exciting to watch. I just hope we still see this side of him with Lana next week!:rolleyes:

[Bizarrolover]

Also, let's not forget that Chloe was also forced into learning Clark's secret by Alicia. Back in season 3 (or 4, I can't remember), she and Clark agreed that she would stop looking into his life. That is a decision they made together. She accepted the fact that he was different, promised she would leave it like that and hoped that one day he would feel comfortable enough to tell her. But he never did and Alicia forced her into a secret that was starting to destroy her life.

[stenochick]

Now if PS3 can just fgure out a way to get Lex and Lana to forget the secret. I know Lana knows the secret in the mythos, but if Chloe is worthy of a mindwipe, then Lana definitely needs one.

Also, if there is a way for Lois and Jimmy to not recognize that CK is Superman, that would help too.

[wallyK]

You don't have to wipe out Chloe's memory of Clark's secret for Clark to become Superman. And the fact is, Chloe has been helping and encouraging Clark all these years, and that is a part of the show, and cannot be undone. That is this show's interpretation of Superman, a very reluctant guy who has to be pushed by his friends.

I also suspect that Chloe's memories of Clark's secret will magically return in the 'Legion' episode when the Brainiac issue is apparently resolved (never say never again with Brainiac). Somebody needs to be Clark's confidant, because this show is about Clark's emotional development. It's either going to be Chloe or the Martain Manhunter. A less likely alternative is that Lois inadvertently helps Clark with his journey to becoming Superman. She gives him general advice, not knowing how it really helps him.

[kris10]

actually the majority was filler steve, the only important thing to the overall plot was Chloe losing her memory

and may I ask..did you see the promo? :D

Chloe now has one less thing on Lois

she doesnt know his secret and it will remain that way. That was the ONLY thing that made her closer to clark than Lois

now as things stand, Lois is closer to clark's heart so much so he's actually considering TELLING her his secret something he as NEVER done with chloe. He had his privacy violated by chloe learning it..it was not his choice to tell her.

That particular sacred trust belongs to his soulmate and lord knows that aint Sullivan the non mytho blondie


1st of all she didnt VIOLATE his secret she was forced to watch by ALICIA. so lets not confuse that issue

[eas]

I would have said that was true...right up until about the end of season 7: Siren to be exact. Since then clark and Lois are the ones who were growing closer romantically and up until now Chloe knowing the secret was the only thing that made her closer to clark than Lois is.

She now doesnt have that and she doesnt have Clark discoverig his feelings for her. This is all happening for Lois, not Chloe.

More importantly. in season 8, currently we have clark implying that he'd lke Lois to know his secret and he agrees that its because he's let her so close, one episode later he makes the choice to take it away from chloe. It speaks volumes about who is actually closest to clark kents heart.

He's now been given the choice for Chloe to know or not to know and he chose for her not to know. there you have it. If Chloe was the love of his life, he would have chosen for her to know, Instead, it appears he's starting to feel Lois fits those shoes.

When it comes to the person he believes to be the ONE he tells them. When chloe learned the secret it wasnt through trust, It wasnt clark's choice it was a violation of his privacy and in contrast Clark is actually considering letting Lois know his secret. huge difference.

I agree that this mind-wipe has made it so that Lois and Chloe are actually more on an equal footing in terms of Clark than before. Although, I don't think that this was the reasoning behind PS3's decision to go this route.

And I am quite puzzled by the fact that Clark believes that Lois *not* knowing his secret may hurt her & with Chloe he thinks that Chloe *knowing* his secret will hurt her.

The only way that this scenario works is if Clark distances himself from Chloe. I mean - if he's hanging with Chloe as much as before and having her research stuff for him & bringing her into his investigations, then he'll be putting her danger, just as he is Lois. (Although, I would argue that Lois puts herself in danger, with no help from Clark, and he needs to realize this.)

Anyway, my point is that I think this episode was almost a "good-bye" to the Chlark friendship of old... Clark wasn't just deciding to remove his secret from Chloe's memory. He was making an active decision to remove her from that aspect of his life completely.

I guess, conversely, he's realized that he can't remove Lois from that aspect of his life, even if he tried. The question is: why? Because he loves her? Because he can't stand to not be around her? Or because it's just the nature of their friendship and working relationship that Lois will always be around and in the middle of things?

We'll have to see how PS3 explore this now that it turns out that Lana is the only one who knows his secret. Who knows, they may even have Chloe have her memories returned at some point.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


1st of all she didnt VIOLATE his secret she was forced to watch by ALICIA. so lets not confuse that issue

Yes, I agree. I was wondering about that myself -- that everyone feels that Chloe somehow 'tricked' Clark into telling her. That was actually Lana who did that.

Chloe found out becase ALICIA betrayed him. And, honestly, I think she proved herself admirably after she learned the secret. One of my favorite Chlark episodes is "Blank"... the way she protected him - even from himself.

He may not have wanted her to know the secret, but even Clark can't deny that she handled his secret well and honorably.

[ZODisGOD]

This was a mindwipe done right. Thank you to PS3. They never cease to amaze.
I hope Chloe doesn't get her Clark=Superman memories back. What would be the point of this episode?

[eas]

Now if PS3 can just fgure out a way to get Lex and Lana to forget the secret. I know Lana knows the secret in the mythos, but if Chloe is worthy of a mindwipe, then Lana definitely needs one.

Well, if we're going by canon, then Lana doesn't need a mind-wipe. She was a huge part of Superman's past and a lot of different versions of Superman explore his friendship with Lana Lang... even after he marries Lois Lane. In fact, I think that this was one of the major reasons that Chloe GOT the mind-wipe: It benefits Lana's character and she gets to step into her iconic role of his high school sweetheart/secret keeper.

[iamfez]

And I am quite puzzled by the fact that Clark believes that Lois *not* knowing his secret may hurt her & with Chloe he thinks that Chloe *knowing* his secret will hurt her.

I've been thinking about that. Lois continued to still be Lois though after she learned Clark's secret didn't she? She was still living her life even though she shared her life with Clark, unlike Chloe who in the end like Oliver said, was living Clark's.

Because of knowing Clark's secret Chloe was losing everything that makes her Chloe Sullivan. Whereas Lois maintained everything that made her Lois Lane, if you get what I mean?

It was sad to see it happen though. I haven't to admit I was a bit gutted that Chloe's memories of Clark's secret have been erased. But, I'm interested in seeing what happens from here.

As for who could be Clark's confident now? Even though he doesn't take anything to do with the Kryptonian stuff, I'd like to see Clark sometimes talking with Oliver. Besides Chloe, Oliver has been the main one for pushing Clark towards stepping up and becoming who he was destined to become. But, I also like the idea of Lois helping Clark without even knowing it :lol:

[DontCha]

1st of all she didnt VIOLATE his secret she was forced to watch by ALICIA. so lets not confuse that issue

She didnt do it but her still finding out was a violation of clark's mind clark didnt want it. He was just forced to go along with it, now he was given the choice and he took it back.

[BIGBLUE1]

yes thank you producers bring us our man of steel

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

They're not going to just delete four years of character progression and let it go.

I know, if they do, they are sort of saying to Chlarkers, see all those things you watched for four years, they actually didn't happen, you're all imagining it. Another dig in the gut for Chlarkers, as if they havn't got enough harsh teatment. Wasn't there another tv programme (I think it was DALLAS) that wiped a person out of somebodies mind and totally ruined a character plot.

Help me out here guys

[DontCha]

whhoah what was with that Dr with the terrible fake british accent? jeese

anyway, during dark thursday it sisnt seem to matter much that she coukdnt remember clark's secret..

[kris10]

She didnt do it but her still finding out was a violation of clark's mind clark didnt want it. He was just forced to go along with it, now he was given the choice and he took it back.

uhh violate means the person did it intentionally:rolleyes:

[BadaBingBadaBoomsday]

whhoah what was with that Dr with the terrible fake british accent? jeese


Hahaha, I heard it too and thought, what accent is he trying to put on. I thought it was English then thought twice because it was sooo bad.:lol:

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----

It sounded a mix of British, Irish and Australian all rolled into one.

[geminis]

Cedric, you always express yourself well, and very entertainingly.

While I have mixed emotions about Clark asking Jor-El to purposefully remove those aspects of Chloe's life which affect him directly, I can't blame him. Up to now, no one of his friends who knows his secret learned it with his complete approval.

Pete, Chloe, and Lana all learned about his powers without his say so. Clark, being the hero, wasn't going to lie to them. And everyone who knows his secret has been affected in one way or another, and none of them in a good way. Pete, (discovered by accident) was jealous and chose to leave to protect him because he couldn't handle the responsability. Lana, the rollercoaster ride, (discovered by her own trickery) who chose to leave him AFTER he willingly told her his secret "to protect him and stop blocking him from his destiny". Hey, Lana knows she's a blockade and unable to stand by Clark's side; she doesn't see that she could HELP Clark by staying with him. Somebody else *cough Lois cough* will. Then, there's Chloe, (discovered by Alicia's betrayal) who has been hurt like Lana for her knowledge, but is still the best friend and stays by his side. Makes sense that Clark would protect her, and Oliver was pointing something out that I'm sure Clark already knew. He has regrets, but he also isn't going to beat himself up too much for his decision. Jor-El's approval and Clark finally calling Jor-El Father in this episode was just more proof that he really is making some monumental steps towards Superman status.

So thank you PS3! Thanks to those little bits this episode wasn't a waste of my struggles to stay awake.

[SinoSupermanfromSD]

Dude, season 8 has the show heading where I wished it started heading 3-4 seasons ago. Really could have done without the Jason Teague, witches, and all of the post-high school Lana Lang story arcs.

Random thought about the problem of Clark having no glasses... I wonder if the glasses he'll wear in the future are some sort of Kryptonian tech "mask" that causes earthlings to forget what he looks like after he takes 'em off or somehow prevents them from putting two to two together... since it seems so easy for Kryptonians to mess with human memory.

Overall, I just love what they've done with the Superman mythos... it's been giving the shot of freshness in the arm to the mythos that I feel the latest movie failed to do...

Here's to the "Smallville" continuity becoming the new Superman film reboot! (Although I don't think it's likely...)

[SUPERMANUSA]

It would have been NICE to have seen ALICIA'S facial expression in Chloe's flashback!

[Bizarrolover]

Part of the flashback was reshot because it didn't happen that way, Alicia and Chloe were hiding behind some bushes or something, with Alicia's hand resting on Chloe's shoulder. I guess they wanted exclude Alicia from that memory to emphazise Chloe's relationship with Clark.

[Silent Kal]

Fallen One, right you are, sir. Well-spoken and true.

[Fat Elvis 007]

She didnt do it but her still finding out was a violation of clark's mind clark didnt want it. He was just forced to go along with it, now he was given the choice and he took it back.

That does not give Clark the right to LITERALLY violate Chloe's mind. Yes, we all would like to keep our secrets. But if my best friend has known my secret for four years and it's been an integral part of her life, shaping most of the defining events in her life ever since, I am not going to take that away from her against her will. That is a violation of human rights and no true hero would EVER behave this way. That was what "Identity Crisis" was all about. The Justice League felt terrible over erasing people's minds, and those were villains, for God's sake! To do it to your best friend is a totally different matter and it's much, much worse.

PS3 should never write again.

[SUPERMANUSA]

Part of the flashback was reshot because it didn't happen that way, Alicia and Chloe were hiding behind some bushes or something, with Alicia's hand resting on Chloe's shoulder. I guess they wanted exclude Alicia from that memory to emphazise Chloe's relationship with Clark.

They did an excellent job I thought! It was also very interesting and in depth when they flashed way back to their pre-teen years and showed us something we've never seen/heard before. A memory that Chloe had of Clark that started all of Chloe's feelings for Clark. That was awesome!!

[AndiGirl]

I'm sorry...but if Clark needs to remove Chloe from his life to become superman, then he isnt superman at all.

She's one person...who apparently holds the fate of a hero in her hands?

Clark was well on his way to becoming superman without removing chloe from his life. This season has proven that.I understand that some feel she serves as a crutch...and thats all.

But for those of us who have invested 8 years into a character to only watch her being mind raped, arent as thrilled.

I'm a bit grumpy....I just watched the episode! :lol:

I think it's beyond stupid that Chloe cant share a part in the superman journey just because she isnt apart of the mythos. So if she was Lana Lang and serving this purpose to Clark it would be ok? People just dont like that it's "Chloe Sullivan" and not Lana Lang playing this role. :\

[Iluvgreen]

I'm lovin this season so much, but they didn't need to make Chloe forget...

[Jade4813]

I confess that today I find myself at a loss.

I can't possibly imagine that they'll continue to have Chloe in the dark about Clark's secret. She'll have to remember it at some point, right? Otherwise...and I hate to sound like this...what's the point in her character at this stage of the game? She's Clark's friend, but he can't talk to her about...oh...80% of what's going on with him. She's no longer a reporter and he is, so unlike in the past, her role will not be to serve as that link to journalism for him. Unlike in the early seasons as well, she's not going to be providing romantic angst for him - not when she's getting maried to Jimmy and Clark and Lois are moving closer.

For the past several years, her role was to be Clark's secret-keeper. She was the lens through which the audience got to see how Clark was feeling about his powers. As characters left the show, she was also the character to fill in - for example, to offer him maternal advice.

If Lana was on the show full-time, I'd say that they were going to have HER fill that role now and...still, I'd be at a loss as to what Chloe's "purpose" on the show would be. That Lana isn't doesn't clarify matters for me.

I honestly cannot fathom what they would do with Chloe's character unless they give her back her knowledge of Clark's secret. Short of killing her off, of course, but a) I don't think they're going to do that, and b) I don't see why they'd have to wipe her mind first if they did.

So at this point, I just can't see her not figuring out the secret again.

Which makes the entire point of "Abyss" moot, doesn't it?

[SUPERMANUSA]

Maybe "Abyss" referred to Chloe loosing her memories rapidly. The other side of the plot was to show us Clark's separation of emotion and responsibility to humans/earth.

[joel_welling93]

Hmmmm... I just think Clark should have done it in a different way... I mean it doesn't hurt if Chloe knows his secret but gives him space to fulfill his destiny right?? I mean she is getting married..... I dont think she will be able to find the time to aid Clark anymore with Jimmy and all that....

So I think Clark shouldnt have wiped her memory, but just simply allow himself to be independent and not ask assistance from Chloe when he needs to solve things, that should be done on his own... Plus, years of building up Chloe's character, her purpose and relationships she had with other characters on Smallville, would be gone......

I think that both Chloe and Clark should realize that he's destiny is far greater than hers, but also know that she did have a small contribution to the man he will become someday..... Just like the purpose of other characters in Clark's life.........

[nk_84]

Now Clark can step up and be a man! This is the episode that will changes Clark and his destiny for the better.

Chloe was getting annoying. This episode was fantastic! It created a bond between Clark and Jor-el unlike before. And it's putting the Superman staple onto Smallville, showing us viewers that Clark Kent is finally accepting who he is going to become.

Now just get him flying darn it!!:lol:

NK.

[Timester]

I honestly cannot fathom what they would do with Chloe's character unless they give her back her knowledge of Clark's secret. Short of killing her off, of course, but a) I don't think they're going to do that, and b) I don't see why they'd have to wipe her mind first if they did.

Isn't that actually a good thing? A chance to develop Chloe without just being Clark's sidekick/google? Now they have the opportunity for it. Honestly, the best Chloe yet was season 3 Chloe and she was independent of Clark.

[Jade4813]

Isn't that actually a good thing? A chance to develop Chloe without just being Clark's sidekick/google? Now they have the opportunity for it. Honestly, the best Chloe yet was season 3 Chloe and she was independent of Clark.

I'm not saying it isn't. I just don't know what they're going to do with her.

I'm wondering what they're going to do for the second half of the season, particularly with her character. With Brainiac gone and Doomsday missing for a span of episodes, it seems, I'm wondering what she'll be doing other than being Mrs. James Olsen.

[Storm45]

Isn't that actually a good thing? A chance to develop Chloe without just being Clark's sidekick/google? Now they have the opportunity for it. Honestly, the best Chloe yet was season 3 Chloe and she was independent of Clark.

I agree with you but I also understand what Jade4813 means(Correct me IF I'm wrong). Before being only Clark's google, she was a reporter (in HS). That's what made her involved in the storylines.
But they took that part of Chloe's character away also.

[27CDruid]

That does not give Clark the right to LITERALLY violate Chloe's mind.
PS3 should never write again.

No Clark did NOT literally violate her mind. Chloe lost all memories. Clark chose to tell Jor not to reinstate the ones with him in it. Not a huge difference but a sutle one. Its the difference with Batman when he says, "Im not going to kill you, but i dont have to save you."

PS3 should never right again? These men have trained for this profession for a large portion of their lives and you suddenly dictate that they should be banned? They chose the Superman mythos over Alison Mack. Simple as that! A hard choice to make as she is a fantastic actress but it was needed.

[Jade4813]

I agree with you but I also understand what Jade4813 means(Corect me IF I'm wrong). Before being only Clark's google, she was a reporter (in HS). That's what made her involved in the storylines.
But they took that part of Chloe's character away also.

So if she's not into investigating and if she doesn't know Clark's secret what will motivate Chloe to get involved in the storylines?

Thank you! I knew I wasn't expressing my thoughts on that well! You explained perfectly! :D

[Timester]

I agree with you but I also understand what Jade4813 means(Corect me IF I'm wrong). Before being only Clark's google, she was a reporter (in HS). That's what made her involved in the storylines.
But they took that part of Chloe's character away also.

So if she's not into investigating and if she doesn't know Clark's secret what will motivate Chloe to get involved in the storylines?

What stops her becoming something else? Honestly, now the road is open for her character. Also, she is still at Isis. She didn't lost that.

What she lost was her definition by Clark's secret. That's it. She is still she same Chloe, minus Clark's secret.

[MetroGirl06]

Finally, Clarky can grow some brain cells of his own. :D

[Storm45]

What stops her becoming something else? Honestly, now the road is open for her character. Also, she is still at Isis. She didn't lost that.

What she lost was her definition by Clark's secret. That's it. She is still she same Chloe, minus Clark's secret.

She also lost her definition pre-season 4 which was a reporter.
So if she's not into investigating and if she doesn't know Clark's secret what will motivate Chloe to get involved in the storylines?
She's a meteor freak and she wants to help other people like her, but its not enough. There much more stuff going on in the series.
What worked when she was an investigative journalist is that her interests were broader than FOTW storylines.

I'm just curious to know what else she can do.


Thank you! I knew I wasn't expressing my thoughts on that well! You explained perfectly!

I thought you expressed it very well. ;)

[Jade4813]

What stops her becoming something else? Honestly, now the road is open for her character. Also, she is still at Isis. She didn't lost that.

What she lost was her definition by Clark's secret. That's it. She is still she same Chloe, minus Clark's secret.

Okay, but...again, what's to get her involved in the storyline?

It's not going to be her reporting on it. She's not a reporter any longer.

It's not going to be through Clark's secret. She doesn't know it.

It's not going to be through Clark discussing the situation with her. That'll likely be hard to do without her knowing his secret.

It's not going to be as his romantic love interest. Not with her marrying Jimmy and Clark and Lois getting closer.

It's probably not going to be as the MF counselor, since the villains this season aren't really MFs.

And I really doubt it'll be to act as Clark's brain and Google, even without her knowing his secret.

So what's going to get her involved in the story line?

[redRound]

It's going to be interesting to see how Clark handles things in the future. Maybe this means Jimmy becomes more of a friend.

[Timester]

So what's going to get her involved in the story line?

Something else. That's the good thing about, they can come with something new for Chloe now. Now let see if they are good writers.

I mean, Sylar is a villain on Heroes, this season he has been an anti-hero and a good one. It all depends how good the writers are.

[Bizarrolover]

So what's going to get her involved in the story line?

Clark will need to restore her memories for some reason and things will go back to what they were. But in the meantime, I'm having a great time speculating with what will happen!

[psyko69]

Yes, much like Angel I think the memories may well come back. That is irrelevant however. This episode served a greater purpose: to vastly develop Clark towards Superman. The last four years were not a loss. Far from it. The show is not The Chloe Sullivan Hour, as much as some would like. This served Clark wonderfully.

To copy/past to save some typing:



Look, her loss of memory vastly benefited Clark's character and his growth into Superman. It was very touching the way he made the sacrifice of solace for her so that she could live her life to the fullest. She has done nothing but be a crutch to Clark and that is no good. Definitely not her fault but still. It resonates well with the Angel episode Home. In both cases the sacrifice is made out of love and for the loved ones greater good.

Its not like Clark did it to be a d!ck. He did it because he cares. Its what makes him Superman. His acceptance of solitude is a huge burden but he would rather be alone than put others in danger and make them suffer.

Clark had every reason to do what he did.

-Pete left after being tortured for the second time due to Clark's secret, came back and was tortured again.
-Jonathan died.
-Lionel was murdered for his loyalty.

Clark cares too much to let Chloe continue to suffer when she is defenseless and he sees the full breadth of the danger she suffers due to her knowledge of the truth.

Clark knew Chloe was a great ally and acknowledged this. This allows her to be free of his burden and not have to stick her nose in Clark's dangerous world and suffer because of it.

Chloe is still great. It is a very refreshing dynamic to have Chloe simply be Clark's friend and not spend every waking moment trying to research him. She has a lot of great stuff on the go and Allison is very capable in making her real. Give it a shot.

Remember, as everyone always says, this show is about Clark. This season and this episode truly make that real. Clark grows by leaps and bounds in 45 minutes and it can only do him good.

Its a sacrifice. Thats how it was portrayed. That was the feeling behind the scene and thats what it was.

Superman forgoes his solace so that others may find happiness.

Clark's greatest sacrifice.



Clark gave up a lot, but Chloe's character is still intact and in no way ruined. This episode served Clark wonderfully and did loads for his character.

Al/Miles may have crapped on her were they to do this, but this is why PS3 are masters of their craft. Chloe is well intact and has storylines that actually don't revolve around Clark. "O, Brave new world", there is much to see yet. Give her new angle a shot.

Let it play out. See whats in store for Chloe first before jumping to conclusions.

We all know whats in store for Clark and this episode served that end wonderfully.

[faz]

First of all, great thread, and great job to PS3 for the direction they're taking.

On that note, I'm pretty certain that Chloe will get those memories back, or at least be back in the loop sooner or later, with or without those memories. But in the meantime, Clark will be able to do his own thing without relying on Chloe to do everything for him like she has in the past, and that may make all the difference in the world for her character when she finally does relearn the truth about Clark, although I think she'll be pretty pissed when she realizes what Clark did. I don't mind that she lost the memories, and I wouldn't have minded if she didn't, but at least this way we're going to see a more Supermanly CK since he's not leaning on people to do all the heavy lifting for him. Problem-solving definitely isn't one of Clark's stronger qualities, although it's definitely gotten better this season, but this way maybe he'll move even further from being a BDA and actually be more like the Superman we know.

[ClarksGal]

Chloe is still here, and Clark will not forget what a great friend she is. Chloe's future is now wide open and unencumbered. And, there is always a possibility that maybe a future episode will involve her memory returning to her, and then she'll really let Clark have it, won't she? :)

[psyko69]

Chloe is still here, and Clark will not forget what a great friend she is. Chloe's future is now wide open and unencumbered. And, there is always a possibility that maybe a future episode will involve her memory returning to her, and then she'll really let Clark have it, won't she? :)

I doubt she would. Clark was very honourable in what he did. She might not like it, but she'd understand.

If only more people around here had seen Angel. Connor wasn't pissed, he understood.

[HalJordan4184]

Clark did violate Chloe's mind. He intentionally stopped her from remembering something, because he didn't want her to, and it was against HER wishes. She chose to keep remembering. Why does Clark get to choose what people know and don't know. If I don't want someone to know me, do I have the right to give them a labotomy, so they forget? THat's pretty much what Clark did. He didn't want Chloe to know, so he simply had Jor-El completely erase that part of her mind and memories.

[Tompouce]

I agree with Cedric but I wonder like Jade what Chloe can become...I don't know if she has lost memories about Clark's abilities forever...

[psyko69]

Clark did violate Chloe's mind. He intentionally stopped her from remembering something, because he didn't want her to, and it was against HER wishes. She chose to keep remembering. Why does Clark get to choose what people know and don't know. If I don't want someone to know me, do I have the right to give them a labotomy, so they forget? THat's pretty much what Clark did. He didn't want Chloe to know, so he simply had Jor-El completely erase that part of her mind and memories.

Everyone keeps forgetting the "Why" behind that.

[eas]

Part of the flashback was reshot because it didn't happen that way, Alicia and Chloe were hiding behind some bushes or something, with Alicia's hand resting on Chloe's shoulder. I guess they wanted exclude Alicia from that memory to emphazise Chloe's relationship with Clark.

They had to exclude Alicia, because they would have needed that actress' permission to use her in the scene.

----- Added 4 Minutes later -----


I'm sorry...but if Clark needs to remove Chloe from his life to become superman, then he isnt superman at all.

She's one person...who apparently holds the fate of a hero in her hands?

Clark was well on his way to becoming superman without removing chloe from his life. This season has proven that.I understand that some feel she serves as a crutch...and thats all.

But for those of us who have invested 8 years into a character to only watch her being mind raped, arent as thrilled.

I'm a bit grumpy....I just watched the episode! :lol:

I think it's beyond stupid that Chloe cant share a part in the superman journey just because she isnt apart of the mythos. So if she was Lana Lang and serving this purpose to Clark it would be ok? People just dont like that it's "Chloe Sullivan" and not Lana Lang playing this role. :\

Those are some really good points.

I guess, to answer your question, it *does* make a difference to PS3 whether the role is filled by a girl named "Lana Lang" or "Chloe Sullivan". Or maybe it matters to the WB/DC. Who knows? Maybe it's even something random like the new Superman movie has Lana as a key character or something. We have no idea what goes into their decisions when they go into the "canon" issues.

I definitely think that if this wipe sticks, it was done for Lana's sake.

And, yes, it does suck for those who are fans of Chloe's character & have watched her over the years. I understand why you're upset.

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----


If only more people around here had seen Angel. Connor wasn't pissed, he understood.

Yeah, I remember that. He did understand - he was grateful.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----


I'm not saying it isn't. I just don't know what they're going to do with her.

I'm wondering what they're going to do for the second half of the season, particularly with her character. With Brainiac gone and Doomsday missing for a span of episodes, it seems, I'm wondering what she'll be doing other than being Mrs. James Olsen.

If they're good writers then they'll figure something out. (As people kept telling us that they were when we decided that it was a bad idea to make Lois go *poof* for 4 episodes.)

If PS3 are as good as everyone is saying they are in S8, then we just have to believe that the back half of the season has a good arc for Chloe that makes sense of this all.

Right?

I am not as emotionally invested in Chloe as I am in Clark & Lois, so I'm willing to wait this one out and see if PS3 are as awesome that folks think they are. This episode? Didn't blow me away... very much reminded me of AlMiles episodes (except for the awesome Jorel/Clark/FoS scenes).

Let's see where this goes.

[geminis]

I have to say despite the negative/positive aspects of Clark having Chloe's memories of his secret mindwiped, there is zero, I repeat zero doubt that he has been making huge leaps and bounds of progress towards becoming Superman this season. Clark has always had to make the hard choices; usually we find that he has made the right one. I have no doubt that this was one of them.

Thank you producers, for what I expect will be 10 fantastic episodes of 2008. Looking forward to what you have in store for 2009.

[Fat Elvis 007]

Chloe was getting annoying. This episode was fantastic! It created a bond between Clark and Jor-el unlike before.

So, let me get this straight.

Clark bonding with a trustworthy, loyal, heroic girl = bad.

Clark bonding with an evil, homicidal, Geneva Convention-violating robot = good.

How does this make any sense?

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----


No Clark did NOT literally violate her mind. Chloe lost all memories. Clark chose to tell Jor not to reinstate the ones with him in it. Not a huge difference but a sutle one. Its the difference with Batman when he says, "Im not going to kill you, but i dont have to save you."

Has Batman ever said that to his best friend?


They chose the Superman mythos over Alison Mack. Simple as that! A hard choice to make as she is a fantastic actress but it was needed.

The issue has nothing to do with Allison Mack. She could have been written out in a number of ways. I would have been OK if she lost her memories of Clark's secret in another way. Having Clark be the one to choose not to give her memories of the last four years of her life was NOT needed in any way, shape, or form, to line up with the mythos. If anything, this tarnishes the Superman mythos as it makes Superman into a fascist dictator who is willing to strip the rights of his friends away in order to protect them.

I'm starting to think that Clark could kill Chloe in her sleep and people would be saying, "Yay! Canon!" :rolleyes:

[Timester]

If they're good writers then they'll figure something out. (As people kept telling us that they were when we decided that it was a bad idea to make Lois go *poof* for 4 episodes.)

Now you understand what I was saying on the Requiem thread. :p

[ClarksGal]

I'm starting to think that Clark could kill Chloe in her sleep and people would be saying, "Yay! Canon!" :rolleyes:

Well, only if he were killing her as the only way to finally be with Lois!!!!! Ha ha. Just kidding.

[Fat Elvis 007]

Al/Miles may have crapped on her were they to do this, but this is why PS3 are masters of their craft.

I'm sorry...the people who still haven't told us little things like how Clark got into the Daily Planet, or what his job even is are "masters of their craft?"

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

:rotfl:

Thank you so much. I really needed that laugh.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Well, only if he were killing her as the only way to finally be with Lois!!!!! Ha ha. Just kidding.

:p LOL. Thanks for being a good sport.

[Kalista]

I'm starting to think that Clark could kill Chloe in her sleep and people would be saying, "Yay! Canon!" :rolleyes:

Now you get the picture.

[dimeo782002]

No Clark did NOT literally violate her mind. Chloe lost all memories. Clark chose to tell Jor not to reinstate the ones with him in it. Not a huge difference but a sutle one. Its the difference with Batman when he says, "Im not going to kill you, but i dont have to save you."

PS3 should never right again? These men have trained for this profession for a large portion of their lives and you suddenly dictate that they should be banned? They chose the Superman mythos over Alison Mack. Simple as that! A hard choice to make as she is a fantastic actress but it was needed.


we are all entitled to our opinions so lets not start arguments with people just cause they don't agree with everyone or eachother.
you may feel this was needed but i don't feel it was. this show was meant to be the journey to clark becoming superman . once he is superman the show can end. chloe losing her memory of clarks secret does not automatically make him superman and i understand why he did it. he took the secret from her out of love for his best friend but that does not change the fact that people are gonna be sad about it. so let them be sad. let them say what they feel . no one can chnage anyone;s opinion so why be argumantitive about it ?

[Fat Elvis 007]

I doubt she would. Clark was very honourable in what he did. She might not like it, but she'd understand.

If only more people around here had seen Angel. Connor wasn't pissed, he understood.

Well, I know what you're talking about, but I think the situations were very different.

Connor was one step away from killing a whole mess of people. And even if Angel had stopped him another way, Connor could have still been a danger to others or himself.

The stuff Chloe has gone through because of Clark's secret doesn't compare to what Connor went through because of being Angel's son. Raised in a hell dimension by a psycopath with one mission: to kill Angel. He escapes this dimension only to find that Angel isn't all that bad and it's his foster father that is insane. Then FakeCordy gives him the illusion of having a happy family, and Connor sacrifices everything for this desire, only to find out that this too was a lie, just like the rest of his life.

Angel's choice had a lot more motivation behind it, I think. With Clark, his friends are constantly in danger whether they know his secret or not, so I've never bought this argument that knowing his secret puts them in any more risk then they are usually in. Martha has turned out OK. Chloe will still be in danger next week, so I don't see how he was protecting her. With Connor, Angel was definitely protecting Connor.

Not that that makes his decision the right one. I can't recall if any of his team was angry at him after they found out their memories were altered--I think Wesley was briefly, but I can't remember--but I have heard many fans complain, more about Angel taking away the memories of his crew than of his son.

So I'm not trying to say Angel was right and Clark was wrong. The thing about "Angel" was that it was a darker show with a more complex treatment of morality. Angel is a very different type of hero than Superman. He isn't the inspirational type. He's more of an anti-hero. So of course he is going to make some hard decisions that Superman won't get his hands dirty with. Still, injustices like Angel letting Darla and Drusilla eat the evil lawyers never stood long, and had lasting consequences. The same could be said of Connor's huge life change.

With "Smallville," I don't get the idea that the writers, characters, or even some of the fans are questioning the hero's decisions. It's just, "Clark can do this, so he should do this. It is heroic and iconic." It's very simplistic, and frankly it's kind of scary, because it presents us a hero who must not be questioned, because everything he does is right. While with Angel, we were always required to think critically about whether Angel was doing the right thing or not.

I don't think violating someone's mind is OK in either case. But Connor's circumstances were much different from Chloe's, as are Clark's from Angel's. And unlike with Angel, we are expected to buy this decision without question. That's called dictatorship, not heroism.

[Misstaken]

I don't know if this has been brought up already, but I feel that maybe Chloe was wrong in her decision of wanting to keep the memories. Not that she had the choice, ultimately, but she did say that she was happy she knew Clark's secret.

So Chloe was afraid that Clark would take her to the Fortress because she didn't want to risk losing all the memories she had and cherished.

She was willing to put her own safety at stake only to feel closer to Clark. Because ultimately, that's what it is. Her knowing Clark's secret is just a way for her to feel closer to Clark and to have a friendship with him that is really special. Yeah sure, it's also a way for her to know what threats she may encounter, but those threats wouldn't really be there if she wasn't good friends with Clark.

IMO, her judgment was clouded by her affection for Clark (friendship or love or call it whatever you want). Her survival was unsure and she STILL was scared that Clark would take her to Jor-El and that it would affect her memory. Usually, survival is the most important thing for humans. Not for Chloe. For Chloe, knowing Clark's secret and feeling close to him is.

Although I'm still struggling to see whether Clark did the right and moral thing, he sure helped resetting Chloe's priority in order (survival and safety first, affection and love for friends after).

Because what's the affection and love worth if you're dead?

[ginnyfan]

Great post Misstaken. :)

Hmm... Selfless and good or unhealthily attached (or a blend of the two)? Either way... I don't think the mind wipe was the only way to resolve the issue.

[Fat Elvis 007]

I don't know if this has been brought up already, but I feel that maybe Chloe was wrong in her decision of wanting to keep the memories. Not that she had the choice, ultimately, but she did say that she was happy she knew Clark's secret.

So Chloe was afraid that Clark would take her to the Fortress because she didn't want to risk losing all the memories she had and cherished.

She was willing to put her own safety at stake only to feel closer to Clark. Because ultimately, that's what it is. Her knowing Clark's secret is just a way for her to feel closer to Clark and to have a friendship with him that is really special. Yeah sure, it's also a way for her to know what threats she may encounter, but those threats wouldn't really be there if she wasn't good friends with Clark.

IMO, her judgment was clouded by her affection for Clark (friendship or love or call it whatever you want). Her survival was unsure and she STILL was scared that Clark would take her to Jor-El and that it would affect her memory. Usually, survival is the most important thing for humans. Not for Chloe. For Chloe, knowing Clark's secret and feeling close to him is.

Although I'm still struggling to see whether Clark did the right and moral thing, he sure helped resetting Chloe's priority in order (survival and safety first, affection and love for friends after).

Because what's the affection and love worth if you're dead?

Many people would argue what's life worth without affection and love? So I can see what you're saying, but I don't think her priorities were out of wack at all.

[DontCha]

Fat Elvis

I think its no coincidence that one episode before he was pondering on telling Lois his secret and one episode later he takes it away from chloe

I know alot of people hate it but I think Ps3 are trying to tell the audience something.

[Misstaken]

She didn't lose all affection and love. She still has friends like Davis and Jimmy, that she claims she loves.

Her mind wipe only erased all the ''too much'' in my opinion. It erased a part of the love and affection she had for Clark, not all of it. It erased the part that puts her own safety at stake because she's *blinded* by the beauty she sees in her relationship with Clark.

I seriously doubt that Chloe could ever stop loving Clark if she knows his secret, because that's what makes their relationship so deep and full of sharing. PS3 tried to make us feel like she doesn't love Clark with the whole Q&A but I honestly never bought it. I think she felt true love for Clark, that did put her in a dangerous position because she didn't want to reevaluate things even though she should have.

I think she just went from true love that is ''worth living for'' (an epic love you might say) to the kind of love most people feel everyday for their loved ones, a slightly less earth shattering one, but that is deep nonetheless and that, most importantly, does NOT threaten her safety.

A love and affection that keeps her happy at all times and not going through the whole roller coaster ride of feelings you usually get with that kind of epic love. Clark made the decision he thought would bring her more happiness and safety, that's all.

[Fat Elvis 007]

Fat Elvis

I think its no coincidence that one episode before he was pondering on telling Lois his secret and one episode later he takes it away from chloe

I know alot of people hate it but I think Ps3 are trying to tell the audience something.

If it wasn't a coincidence, then that is just stupid. What on earth could make Clark think Lois is more capable of handling his secret than Chloe? I'm not saying she wouldn't be, but where is the evidence? Show me, writers!

----- Added 5 Minutes later -----


She didn't lose all affection and love. She still has friends like Davis and Jimmy, that she claims she loves.

Her mind wipe only erased all the ''too much'' in my opinion. It erased a part of the love and affection she had for Clark, not all of it. It erased the part that puts her own safety at stake because she's *blinded* by the beauty she sees in her relationship with Clark.

I seriously doubt that Chloe could ever stop loving Clark if she knows his secret, because that's what makes their relationship so deep and full of sharing. PS3 tried to make us feel like she doesn't love Clark with the whole Q&A but I honestly never bought it. I think she felt true love for Clark, that did put her in a dangerous position because she didn't want to reevaluate things even though she should have.

I think she just went from true love that is ''worth living for'' (an epic love you might say) to the kind of love most people feel everyday for their loved ones, a slightly less earth shattering one, but that is deep nonetheless and that, most importantly, does NOT threaten her safety.

A love and affection that keeps her happy at all times and not going through the whole roller coaster ride of feelings you usually get with that kind of epic love. Clark made the decision he thought would bring her more happiness and safety, that's all.

So now that Chloe doesn't know the secret, I am sure she will be completely safe from harm and Clark will never have to save her from anything again.;)

Sorry, I have never bought that argument. Lana would have been attacked by Braniac with or without secret knowledge. Same for Pete being tortured by that FBI agent in Season 3. Not to mention all the hospital visits the cast has accumulated in nearly ever single episode of the series. The argument that knowledge of Clark's secret puts her in danger just doesn't fly.

And again, my main point is that it was not Clark's choice to make. No one should be allowed to take anyone else's memory, no matter what. It is simply wrong.

[OneShotClois]

No Clark did NOT literally violate her mind. Chloe lost all memories. Clark chose to tell Jor not to reinstate the ones with him in it. Not a huge difference but a sutle one. Its the difference with Batman when he says, "Im not going to kill you, but i dont have to save you."

PS3 should never right again? These men have trained for this profession for a large portion of their lives and you suddenly dictate that they should be banned? They chose the Superman mythos over Alison Mack. Simple as that! A hard choice to make as she is a fantastic actress but it was needed.

I completely agree. Well said.

[AndiGirl]

I'm not saying it isn't. I just don't know what they're going to do with her.

I'm wondering what they're going to do for the second half of the season, particularly with her character. With Brainiac gone and Doomsday missing for a span of episodes, it seems, I'm wondering what she'll be doing other than being Mrs. James Olsen.

I agree...thats what I'm worried about. Chloe and Clark were slowly distancing themselves from eachother...and instead of naturally letting that separation take place, they erase pieces of her mind.

I dont know why people cant see that what they've wanted all along was beginning to happen. It wouldnt be a light switch process where chloe says "actually clark...I dont feel like helping you....ever again, so go away!" But she was beginning to see being involved so deeply with clark was dangerous. Up until Brainiac began to take over.

Now that she has no recollection of his secret....where does she fit? Saying "isnt it good that chloe will have her own life" is almost redundant to me. We all know by now thats not how smallville works! :lol:. If you dont fit into the plot anymore you're history. I just dont want them to leave clarks life entirely or die. Which I can honestly see either of those scenarios happening at this point.

So lets not all play dumb here, I appreciate those trying to put a positive spin on this for the Chloe fans. But unless PS3 does some serious back pedaling and restores her memories...Chloe will no longer have a place in smallville when the brainiac plot is over. I for one am not falling for it. :\

BTW....none of that was pointed at you Jade!! Just the agreeing part ;)

[clarkbunny]

I fail to see how Chloe no longer knowing Clark's secret will allow him to become Superman. I mean it's not like she is the only person who knows his secret - there's Lana, Pete & Oliver then the rest of the J-League although they don't know the origins of his superskillz.

I think it's good for him to have someone he can be totally free with as a sounding board. Now Clark has no-one - Lana's gone, Pete's gone, Kara's gone, his mum's busy in politics, Chloe isn't in on the secret and Ollie isn't really interested in Clark's Kryptonian issues.

Maybe in the short term this will help him to become more self reliant but he was heading that way anyway.

Personally I don't think this mind wipe will last long. I think Clark will choose to tell Chloe the secret again and it will bring them even closer together 'cos this time Clark chose to trust her rather than Chloe finding out herself.

[Fallen One]

The worst mistake the show made was killing off Jonathan Kent in season 5. The second worst mistake they made was NOT killing off/writing out Lana Lang/Clana in season 5. The third biggest mistake they made was making Clark dependent on Chloe since she learned his secret.

I've wanted the "partnership" aspect of Chlark dead for years and I'm proud to say it. Dead, D-E-D DEAD. And I finally got my wish. And I'm loving every bit of it.

Whats most important to me is where the writers take Clark from this point out. Where they go with Chloe from here on out is a distant.. whatever to me. Personally how they handle Doomday's arc, Lois' arc, and Jimmy's progression in the second half of the season is of much higher importance to me. Tess and Chloe's second half arcs are at the bottom.

Do I feel that this is the end to her as an important figure on the show? Hmm maybe. But this will be the test of her character. If she is as awesome as folks say she is, then she should be able to stand on her own without needing the knowledge of the secret just fine. And she should continue to be worthy of the 22 episodes she is booked to appear in.

If she proves to be not much of anything without knowing Clark's secret, then its time to pull the plug and kill her off at the end of the season.

But seeing that the writers had to possess her with Brainiac just to keep her being the "information center" for this more mature intelligent Clark- lets just say I have my doubts that she'll remain important after the Brainiac arc ends.

The proof is in the pudding.

[OutlawAdamKnight]

(I Originally put this in a separate thread, but then saw this one. FALLEN ONE, is dead on. Here is My Gushing!)

have gone out of their way to FINALLY PayOff 7 seasons of Smallville in a Satisfying and (dare I say it) Epic way.

I may not LIKE every decision being made, but at least I can see that theese decisions are thought out, not rushed, researched and tied into previous plot points, storylines and so forth.

I literally cheered when I saw the "Flashback scenes" as Chloe went to her "happy place" with Clark memories, and then was terrified as she realized she was losing them. The Brainiac connecting Chloe to "Doom" is so mint, it actually pays off what I thought was a sketchy idea of having Doomsday on the show.

Look, lets face facts. PS3 was handed a lousy job when AlMiles said "Cheerio, we messed everything up and created a stinker out of what started as pure gold, but now we have no desire to make things whole again!!" in that lousy Limey accent. But they buckled down, remembered what this show was about and are giving everything they can to make this the Show SMALLVILLE FANS have been DYING For it to become again.

Clark in the Fortress talking to Jor-El with Confidence. Gold.

Choosing to sacrifice his confidant for her own benefit, even knowing he'll be alone again. Gold and TRUE TO CHARACTER.

Paying off Chloe's feelings for Clark in flashbacks and then ripping them away, leaving only a fond memory (and now able to really move on, without the knowledge that her fiancee can't measure up to a Super man). Gold. Heartwrenching, but that's WHY it's gold.

I could go on for days.

Thank you.

AK

[tibbit78]

I really liked Chloe knowing Clark's secret. I thought that was the best part of Smallville. It made such an interesting story, at least in my opinion. I'm going to miss Chloe being Clark's Best Friend forever, being his confidante, and true-blue secret keeper. She was his most trusted friend (even if people disagree with me). And I'm glad Lana Lang was never killed off. I hope that Chloe Sullivan doesn't get killed off.

[TECHWON]

i was happy for this move by the producers but still dunno if it was worth it because now that leaves lana with the knowledge of his secret so how they gonna tie up that loose end

[Storm45]

But this will be the test of her character. If she is as awesome as folks say she is, then she should be able to stand on her own without needing the knowledge of the secret just fine. And she should continue to be worthy of the 22 episodes she is booked to appear in.

If she proves to be not much of anything without knowing Clark's secret, then its time to pull the plug and kill her off at the end of the season.


She already proved she was able to stand on her own without Clark's secret. Season 3 anyone? Its not Chloe's character who is in question.

Its PS3's writing ability that should be put to the test.

It might be impressive right now that they erased Chloe's memory of Clark's secret. But I'm waiting for the follow through.

[Misstaken]

So now that Chloe doesn't know the secret, I am sure she will be completely safe from harm and Clark will never have to save her from anything again.;)

Sorry, I have never bought that argument. Lana would have been attacked by Braniac with or without secret knowledge. Same for Pete being tortured by that FBI agent in Season 3. Not to mention all the hospital visits the cast has accumulated in nearly ever single episode of the series. The argument that knowledge of Clark's secret puts her in danger just doesn't fly.

And again, my main point is that it was not Clark's choice to make. No one should be allowed to take anyone else's memory, no matter what. It is simply wrong.

Of course she'll still be in danger. But there's a difference between being in danger because it just happens or because you know someone who's valuable (like Clark) to dangerous people and being in danger because you willingly put yourself in the danger zone.

Clark was just trying to put the consciousness out of Chloe's mind so that she wouldn't be aware of all the danger that she might encounter in her life. She wouldn't be freaked out by Clark's weird behavior. By not knowing what alien's threats might be out there, she is, in a way, safer. I'm not saying she's gained immunity with all of this don't get me wrong.

That being said, I kinda have to agree with you. It's that old dilemma. Kant or Mill? Being ethically moral or doing something for the greater good?

Honestly, I can't decide, but it sure brings up great TV moments...

[j-kent]

YES! definitely well-said to the thread starter...ppl need to see the big picture here! Chloe was Clark's training wheels..but the journey of Superman/CK is always alone!!!

[kaam]

Well said, Cedric. :)

[4Clana]

YES! definitely well-said to the thread starter...ppl need to see the big picture here! Chloe was Clark's training wheels..but the journey of Superman/CK is always alone!!!
IA, this is a story about Clark Kent not Chloe.

[Henryr]

He needs his suit!!!!

[RedKRules]

I don´t think erasing Chloe´s memories, will make Clark any more supermanierrrr..... it was just another copy cat moment, just like this whole season..... Clark is really far from being Superman in my opinion!!

[abbaspice1]

I don´t think erasing Chloe´s memories, will make Clark any more supermanierrrr..... it was just another copy cat moment, just like this whole season..... Clark is really far from being Superman in my opinion!!

If all this is just a 'copycat moment' why are people so interested? If this was just another 'copycat moment, just like this whole season' why are ratings going up? Why is it being called bold, exciting, etc?

You may not like what is going on, but to say it is just another copycat moment is wrong. You may not like this season, but it is not another COPYCAT season. People are interested, excited, angry, etc.

[RedKRules]

It was copy moment yes, they copied it from Superman 2 and LnC .....

[Bizarrolover]

Chloe was ready to give up her memories in S7 to cure her meteor infection, ALL OF THEM, so, maybe, if asked, she would have consented to this partial mindwipe if it was for a greater good.

I, personally, was pretty tired of Chloe being Clark's personal search engine. It made him lazy and co-dependent all thorugh S7 and she put her lif on hold because of him. They are both great characters and they deserve a better evolution. It's finally happening.

[Fat Elvis 007]

Whats most important to me is where the writers take Clark from this point out. Where they go with Chloe from here on out is a distant.. whatever to me.

I agree with this. Which is why I am so sickened after "Abyss." I am much more concerned with how Clark made this immoral decision than in what it actually does to Chloe. I expected her to lose her memory in this episode and I made peace with that. But there was no need to screw up Clark in the process.

----- Added 1 Minutes later -----


Of course she'll still be in danger. But there's a difference between being in danger because it just happens or because you know someone who's valuable (like Clark) to dangerous people and being in danger because you willingly put yourself in the danger zone.

Clark was just trying to put the consciousness out of Chloe's mind so that she wouldn't be aware of all the danger that she might encounter in her life. She wouldn't be freaked out by Clark's weird behavior. By not knowing what alien's threats might be out there, she is, in a way, safer. I'm not saying she's gained immunity with all of this don't get me wrong.

That being said, I kinda have to agree with you. It's that old dilemma. Kant or Mill? Being ethically moral or doing something for the greater good?

Honestly, I can't decide, but it sure brings up great TV moments...

I agree with that last part. Now if only "Smallville" would explore this AS an ethical dilemma. I'm not holding my breath, but we'll see.

[Misstaken]

I agree with that last part. Now if only "Smallville" would explore this AS an ethical dilemma. I'm not holding my breath, but we'll see.

It will be hard for them to explore a dilemma like this. Most TV shows don't even bring it up.

I guess it's only a matter of opinion. Some people might feel the end justifies the means. That the greater good erases all wrongful action, even if they are unethical.

I just think Superman isn't that kind of person. Sure he's all for the greater good of humanity, but normally he wouldn't - or shouldn't because he's righteous - do something that's just so immoral.

I'm actually trying to argue both sides of this problem. Because I think doing the right thing is more important than doing something just to resolve conflicts, but also because I love Smallville and I'm just trying to see how such a decision can be salvaged. I guess we'll have to wait and see how it pans out.

[Fat Elvis 007]

I guess it's only a matter of opinion. Some people might feel the end justifies the means. That the greater good erases all wrongful action, even if they are unethical.

I just think Superman isn't that kind of person. Sure he's all for the greater good of humanity, but normally he wouldn't - or shouldn't because he's righteous - do something that's just so immoral.

Right. "The ends justify the means" is a Luthor philosophy.



I'm actually trying to argue both sides of this problem.

And you're doing a good job too. :)

[Hopefulsuicide]

Superman, as the hero i understand and love, would never abuse his power in order to force anything upon a human. he would never rape someone of their memories without their permission. He would not be arrogant enough to believe that his decision, his worries, his thoughts on the matter are the only one's of consequence.

This is THE MOST UN-SUPERMANLIKE MOMENT OF ANY INTERPRETATION I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!!!!

(worse than the Lois forgetting kiss, although they do make me similarly angry)

[harryandginnyfanatic]

I like that Clark will probably start doing more things on his own without help.

[4Clana]

Anyone else also think part of the reason for Clark not letting Chloe in on the secret is, Clark doesn't trust Chloe anymore? Just something he said in Prey about how he's afraid of who she puts her trust in. And this is a direct result of that.

[Hopefulsuicide]

well i certainly hope she never trusts him again...

[ginnyfan]

She didn't lose all affection and love. She still has friends like Davis and Jimmy, that she claims she loves.

Her mind wipe only erased all the ''too much'' in my opinion. It erased a part of the love and affection she had for Clark, not all of it. It erased the part that puts her own safety at stake because she's *blinded* by the beauty she sees in her relationship with Clark.

I seriously doubt that Chloe could ever stop loving Clark if she knows his secret, because that's what makes their relationship so deep and full of sharing. PS3 tried to make us feel like she doesn't love Clark with the whole Q&A but I honestly never bought it. I think she felt true love for Clark, that did put her in a dangerous position because she didn't want to reevaluate things even though she should have.

I think she just went from true love that is ''worth living for'' (an epic love you might say) to the kind of love most people feel everyday for their loved ones, a slightly less earth shattering one, but that is deep nonetheless and that, most importantly, does NOT threaten her safety.

A love and affection that keeps her happy at all times and not going through the whole roller coaster ride of feelings you usually get with that kind of epic love. Clark made the decision he thought would bring her more happiness and safety, that's all.

And she still has Clark. She still loves Clark as a friend. We don't know to what extent she doesn't remember. Her love is just not at the level that she will throw over everything in her life for Clark. I still don't know how healthy that is... even if the results are good. I don't even know that I'd call it a romantic love as much as an obsessive love.

Even as I say that... I think Chloe was... getting better. She hasn't been as blinded by Clark lately. She wasn't side kicking for Clark. She was starting to fully commit to Jimmy. She was branching out with Isis and the Justice League. Clark should have done the hard work of having a yelling match with Chloe about boundaries and his secret. He should have just dealt with it if she couldn't be talked down. *shrug* She may have been understanding.

After ridding Chloe of Brainiac she was out of danger. That satisfied Oliver's concerns. *shakes head* I don't think not restoring her memory of his secret was necessary.


So now that Chloe doesn't know the secret, I am sure she will be completely safe from harm and Clark will never have to save her from anything again.;)

Sorry, I have never bought that argument. Lana would have been attacked by Braniac with or without secret knowledge. Same for Pete being tortured by that FBI agent in Season 3. Not to mention all the hospital visits the cast has accumulated in nearly ever single episode of the series. The argument that knowledge of Clark's secret puts her in danger just doesn't fly.

And again, my main point is that it was not Clark's choice to make. No one should be allowed to take anyone else's memory, no matter what. It is simply wrong.

I agree. It's "totally retarded." To use Lois' un-PC phrase. Even though technically Clark didn't TAKE Chloe's memory... he should have restored all of her memories. It's gonna bite Clark in the butt.


I agree...thats what I'm worried about. Chloe and Clark were slowly distancing themselves from eachother...and instead of naturally letting that separation take place, they erase pieces of her mind.

I agree! This is what I've been trying to express and you've said it so well. I liked the slow progression. And it would have had so much more value being Chloe's choice.


Of course she'll still be in danger. But there's a difference between being in danger because it just happens or because you know someone who's valuable (like Clark) to dangerous people and being in danger because you willingly put yourself in the danger zone.

True.


That being said, I kinda have to agree with you. It's that old dilemma. Kant or Mill? Being ethically moral or doing something for the greater good?

Great points Misstaken. I'm loving your posts. The ends justifies the means pretty much defines Chloe's hacking. And Chloe collecting people's lives for her Wall of Weird. Clark and Lois break the law... breaking in, stealing... to expose truth and save lives... the Justice League are vigilantes. The fact that Clark was willing to risk unleashing Brainiac on the fortress and the world to save Chloe says that this is a huge scale dilemma for him. Chloe's quality of life is VERY important to Clark. Maybe too important. He thinks he's acting for the greater good. Oh great post.

I can't wait to see how things pan out.

[Ghosthand]

Yeah its about time. He had been leaning on her too much.

BUt CUT THE CRAP DOOMSDAY ALREADY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Its just retarded. Its too soon. he has no real B0lls yet. There is no justice leage he has no uniform. How about the many heros that are supposed to fall trying to stop doomsday.

[Hopefulsuicide]

just another attempt from the crap writers to do something as easily as possible

yes, he leant on chloe too much... but was that the only way they could make him stop? couldnt they have just had him stop because of his own realisation that he can do it himself

[cousteau]

just another attempt from the crap writers to do something as easily as possible

yes, he leant on chloe too much... but was that the only way they could make him stop? couldnt they have just had him stop because of his own realisation that he can do it himself

Wait - so you claim you love the superman storyline, but you're all gung ho about a character that most comic book readers can't even stand? are you one of those superman fans that pick and choose the bits you like for the sake of romance?

In short, give the new staff a break. I understand why and where they're going with doomsday, and I like what they've done with Kal El, certainly more than I have in the past seven seasons.

[wolverine316]

She already proved she was able to stand on her own without Clark's secret. Season 3 anyone? Its not Chloe's character who is in question.




Ummm. Chloe not knowing Clark's secret was quite pathetic back then when she acted like a spiteful girlfriend,betrayed Clark and spied on him for the Luthors. It was only when she learned who Clark was when she came into her own.

[Hopefulsuicide]

Wait - so you claim you love the superman storyline, but you're all gung ho about a character that most comic book readers can't even stand? are you one of those superman fans that pick and choose the bits you like for the sake of romance?

In short, give the new staff a break. I understand why and where they're going with doomsday, and I like what they've done with Kal El, certainly more than I have in the past seven seasons.

who can't most comic book readers understand? doomsday? cause for one, my post was not in reference to doomsday, it was in reference to chloe's memories being taken away

secondly, where are you getting the information that MOST comic book readers hate doomsday? in fact a lot of comic book readers think he is one of the greatest villains of all time, me included

if you referring to chloe as the one that most comic book readers can't stand, i yet again say where's your proof? i don't make any complaints based on my own romantic preference. i'm not all that interested in romance on Smallville as the acting is never good enough for me to enjoy any romantic interaction... it all comes off dry. i like characters for who they are, and Chloe is the best character on Smallville.

personally i think the fact you are calling him Kal-el says everything. this season they are shunning his human side and turning him towards his 'destiny' to save people, but he is doing it like a robotic alien, not like the hero i know and love. they have created someone else, a weird new hero...

[sailordom]

who can't most comic book readers understand? doomsday? cause for one, my post was not in reference to doomsday, it was in reference to chloe's memories being taken away

secondly, where are you getting the information that MOST comic book readers hate doomsday? in fact a lot of comic book readers think he is one of the greatest villains of all time, me included

if you referring to chloe as the one that most comic book readers can't stand, i yet again say where's your proof? i don't make any complaints based on my own romantic preference. i'm not all that interested in romance on Smallville as the acting is never good enough for me to enjoy any romantic interaction... it all comes off dry. i like characters for who they are, and Chloe is the best character on Smallville.

personally i think the fact you are calling him Kal-el says everything. this season they are shunning his human side and turning him towards his 'destiny' to save people, but he is doing it like a robotic alien, not like the hero i know and love. they have created someone else, a weird new hero...

Hear, hear!

I mean, the reason why Superman books never make my pull list is because I find the big boy scout, well, :o a little boring. (Although I adored Conner and read his book, and I'm currently tradewaiting Johns and Robinson's stuff, because, well, it's Geoff Johns and James Robinson, and some of my faves have been from them.)

Maybe that's my problem? Is Superman really an "ends justify the means" kinda guy in his own books while being the standard to which all the other superpowered heroes in the DCU aspire to in the other books?

As another comic book fan, I love Chloe, too. I was never, ever a Chlark shipper, but I've always enjoyed Chloe, and I think she's a major part of the show's success.

[cousteau]

who can't most comic book readers understand? doomsday? cause for one, my post was not in reference to doomsday, it was in reference to chloe's memories being taken away

No, most comic book readers can't stand chloe.



secondly, where are you getting the information that MOST comic book readers hate doomsday? in fact a lot of comic book readers think he is one of the greatest villains of all time, me included

Again, this is down to you misreading what I stated



if you referring to chloe as the one that most comic book readers can't stand, i yet again say where's your proof? i don't make any complaints based on my own romantic preference. i'm not all that interested in romance on Smallville as the acting is never good enough for me to enjoy any romantic interaction... it all comes off dry. i like characters for who they are, and Chloe is the best character on Smallville.

Are you serious? Read this forum! And of course you are, you're the one who's gone ahead and stated that the writing is an affront to feminism.



personally i think the fact you are calling him Kal-el says everything. this season they are shunning his human side and turning him towards his 'destiny' to save people, but he is doing it like a robotic alien, not like the hero i know and love. they have created someone else, a weird new hero...

Let's face it. what's in smallville is neither clark nor kal el - or rather, hasn't been up until recently.

[RedKRules]

Superman, as the hero i understand and love, would never abuse his power in order to force anything upon a human. he would never rape someone of their memories without their permission. He would not be arrogant enough to believe that his decision, his worries, his thoughts on the matter are the only one's of consequence.

This is THE MOST UN-SUPERMANLIKE MOMENT OF ANY INTERPRETATION I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!!!!

(worse than the Lois forgetting kiss, although they do make me similarly angry)

Thank you very much, just well said !! what he did was beyond abuse ... it was cruel and meanless, because we all know what happens next, soooo what is your next SMART move BDA?? ...

[Backward Galaxy]

The comparisons to a mind-rape are just plain silly. When he saves the day using his powers and the Freak of the Week accidentally gets electrocuted to death, that's fine, but protecting his best friend based on at least six different instances in which knowing Clark's secret directly put someone in harm's way (Pete, Lana, Lionel, Lex, Chloe, Jonathan) is somehow the worst form of abuse ever? What a joke. This is not Identity Crisis, where the heroes not only wiped Dr. Light's memories, but also changed personality traits to make Light less dangerous. It's also not when they mind-wiped Batman to cover up what they did.

Furthermore, there is comic book precedence of heroes wiping the minds of villains to protect their identities.

Jeepers, now I've heard everything.

[Lazy Boy]

1. Fist pump.
2. Point to God.
3. Thump chest.

Rinse and repeat.

At last, finally FINALLY, a great injustice has just been undone. The Kents taught and cautioned Clark to always keep his secret, only telling those he chose. Four seasons ago Alicia took Chloe and forced her into Clark's world, without his permission. It was an act of betrayal, and it changed the life of Chloe. But it was a secret that Clark never meant to share with Chloe, but had no choice in the matter.

Tonight, the choice that was inititally taken from him was restored. And he chose.

Ever since Arrival we've watched Chloe get more involved with Clark in his journey. She became obsessed with it, and the truths she sought as a high school newspaper editor became uninteresting when she learned the secret of all secrets. She lost her passion for exposing the strange. She wanted to share in Clark's destiny. A destiny not meant for her.

And Clark.. my dear Clark. He became lazy now that he had a crutch to fall back on. He started to rely on Chloe's advice for things she had little to no knowledge of. Her hacking skills became a constant tool of his. He became dependent. He relied on her too. damn. much. He lost what made him special, but ever since Odyssey he's been getting it all back.

Tonight, he took a giant leap. Sacrificing for the good of his friend. Deciding to carry the burden alone, as only he can.

At last, at last. Superman is here! And its all thanks to PS3.

We who were spoiled knew it was coming, though some of us denied the obvious when the spoiler came out. This was the season to move away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, and move into the Superman lore we all know and love.

A Superman that doesn't need Chloe Sullivan to fullfill his destiny.

So thank you, PS3. For respecting Superman, for putting Clark back on his path, for moving away from the nonsense of Al/Miles, for doing the previously unthinkable.

It takes courage, and you have it in spades.

Bring on the rest of season 8.

I can't understand why people though that Chloe was an obstacle in Superman's development??
If you agreed since Odyssey that Clark has been getting it all back then by saying that you would agree that Chloe's knowledge has not been an hindrance otherwise he would not have progress at all.

I alway saw Chloe as a friend who helped out Clark. Sure he may have been too reliant upon her to help sometimes but that was his choice. All he had to do was stop going to her - its so simple. Don't go to her house, don't go to her office and don't call her. Put your thinking cap on, Clark but no he can't do it cause he's the BDA.

You have to remember that Clark for the most of Smallville has been fighting destiny so he can have a normal life with Lana. Nothing to do with Chloe (or Lana for that matter) - his choice.

Finally people, Smallville is the build up to the Superman mythos. If you want Lois, Jimmy, Lex and Clark Kent in tights, then watch "Lois and Clark: New Adventures of Superman". Smallville will remain Smallville and unless Tom Welling choose to done tights, it will never become LnC. If he does, well that is a different story. So don't waste your time questioning the needs of non-mythos characters in Smallville. It's irrelevant.

The point is Chloe is not an obstacle, Clark was an obstacle to himself. But hey that is life. We go through realising that we need to change things about ourselves in order to progress. Sometimes we don't see it and need other people to point it out and that what Chloe has been doing for Clark along with other people like Jonathan and Martha. Since they left, she had to take on more responsibility for looking after this BDA until the beginning of season 8 when he decide to grow some cojones.

So Cedric, with all due respect my dear sir, I disagree with your post.

1. Bows
2. Exit stage
3. Comes back to encore

[Mischael12]

Originally Posted by Hopefulsuicide View Post
Superman, as the hero i understand and love, would never abuse his power in order to force anything upon a human. he would never rape someone of their memories without their permission. He would not be arrogant enough to believe that his decision, his worries, his thoughts on the matter are the only one's of consequence.

This is THE MOST UN-SUPERMANLIKE MOMENT OF ANY INTERPRETATION I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!!!!

(worse than the Lois forgetting kiss, although they do make me similarly angry)

Superman isn't perfect contrary to popular belief. And there have been times when he has overstepped the bounds between god and man.

----- Added 13 Minutes later -----

and while I'm at it...Can the Fortress get a break. Just once...Just once could it not be destroyed, taken over. Poor Jor-el....

[Kalista]

I can't understand why people though that Chloe was an obstacle in Superman's development??
If you agreed since Odyssey that Clark has been getting it all back then by saying that you would agree that Chloe's knowledge has not been an hindrance otherwise he would not have progress at all.

I alway saw Chloe as a friend who helped out Clark. Sure he may have been too reliant upon her to help sometimes but that was his choice. All he had to do was stop going to her - its so simple. Don't go to her house, don't go to her office and don't call her. Put your thinking cap on, Clark but no he can't do it cause he's the BDA.

You have to remember that Clark for the most of Smallville has been fighting destiny so he can have a normal life with Lana. Nothing to do with Chloe (or Lana for that matter) - his choice.

Finally people, Smallville is the build up to the Superman mythos. If you want Lois, Jimmy, Lex and Clark Kent in tights, then watch "Lois and Clark: New Adventures of Superman". Smallville will remain Smallville and unless Tom Welling choose to done tights, it will never become LnC. If he does, well that is a different story. So don't waste your time questioning the needs of non-mythos characters in Smallville. It's irrelevant.

The point is Chloe is not an obstacle, Clark was an obstacle to himself. But hey that is life. We go through realising that we need to change things about ourselves in order to progress. Sometimes we don't see it and need other people to point it out and that what Chloe has been doing for Clark along with other people like Jonathan and Martha. Since they left, she had to take on more responsibility for looking after this BDA until the beginning of season 8 when he decide to grow some cojones.

So Cedric, with all due respect my dear sir, I disagree with your post.

1. Bows
2. Exit stage
3. Comes back to encore


That is a wonderful post.

[Fat Elvis 007]

No, most comic book readers can't stand chloe.

Count me as a comic reader who likes Chloe. (I used to love her, but she has lost her spine.)




Are you serious? Read this forum! And of course you are, you're the one who's gone ahead and stated that the writing is an affront to feminism.


What on earth does that have to do with Chloe?

Although it's true, "Abyss" was dismal from a feminist standpoint. Little Lady Chloe just can't handle the burden of saving the world, so the Big Strong Man has to swoop in and rescue her in the worst way possible, by invading her mind without her consent and taking away her choices completely.

----- Added 4 Minutes later -----


The comparisons to a mind-rape are just plain silly.

He chose, without her consent, to keep her very own memories from her. This is the deepest, most personal sort of invasion, and therefore the comparisons to rape are apt.


When he saves the day using his powers and the Freak of the Week accidentally gets electrocuted to death, that's fine, but protecting his best friend based on at least six different instances in which knowing Clark's secret directly put someone in harm's way (Pete, Lana, Lionel, Lex, Chloe, Jonathan) is somehow the worst form of abuse ever?

I don't remember him ever intentionally killing an FOTW, and how is that comparable to what he does to his friends?



What a joke. This is not Identity Crisis, where the heroes not only wiped Dr. Light's memories, but also changed personality traits to make Light less dangerous. It's also not when they mind-wiped Batman to cover up what they did.


You're right, this isn't "Identity Crisis," because that was a book that explored how mind-raping someone was a morally corrupt action that has far-reaching consequences, to the point where it rocked the entire DCU. Whereas with "Smallville," Clark is apparently always right. :rolleyes
:

Furthermore, there is comic book precedence of heroes wiping the minds of villains to protect their identities.


Chloe isn't a villain, and again, even mind-raping villains was shown to be a morally questionable thing if not an absolute wrong.

----- Added 8 Minutes later -----




I alway saw Chloe as a friend who helped out Clark. Sure he may have been too reliant upon her to help sometimes but that was his choice. All he had to do was stop going to her - its so simple. Don't go to her house, don't go to her office and don't call her. Put your thinking cap on, Clark but no he can't do it cause he's the BDA.

Precisely! If Clark was worried about Chloe getting too involved in his life, than the brave, heroic thing to do would be to have a conversation with her and tell her all this, and if he really needs to, he can choose to cut her out of his life. But instead, he chooses the coward's way out--violating her brain in a way that she isn't even capable of voicing her opinion on the matter. It's sick and extremely chauvinistic.

[Misstaken]

I can't understand why people though that Chloe was an obstacle in Superman's development??
If you agreed since Odyssey that Clark has been getting it all back then by saying that you would agree that Chloe's knowledge has not been an hindrance otherwise he would not have progress at all.

I alway saw Chloe as a friend who helped out Clark. Sure he may have been too reliant upon her to help sometimes but that was his choice. All he had to do was stop going to her - its so simple. Don't go to her house, don't go to her office and don't call her. Put your thinking cap on, Clark but no he can't do it cause he's the BDA.

You have to remember that Clark for the most of Smallville has been fighting destiny so he can have a normal life with Lana. Nothing to do with Chloe (or Lana for that matter) - his choice.

The point is Chloe is not an obstacle, Clark was an obstacle to himself. But hey that is life. We go through realising that we need to change things about ourselves in order to progress. Sometimes we don't see it and need other people to point it out and that what Chloe has been doing for Clark along with other people like Jonathan and Martha. Since they left, she had to take on more responsibility for looking after this BDA until the beginning of season 8 when he decide to grow some cojones.


I have to disagree with what you've said. Chloe has been an obstacle to Clark becoming Superman. She hasn't been an obstacle directly (like Lana and Clark's desire to have a normal life with her for example) but she has been an obstacle to Clark thinking and doing research on his own.

I agree that it is ultimately Clark's fault if he relied too much on Chloe and if he always went to see her for help. But Chloe didn't help either, by having super intelligence (even before the Brainiac plot), great googling and hacking skills.

It's like when you're doing a math homework. If you have a calculator, you sure are going to use it, but if you don't, you'll try and calculate everything on paper or in your head. (Not comparing Chloe to a calculator, just trying to point something out so please, do not even bother saying that I'm degrading Chloe with this example.)

Clark had an easy solution that didn't take that much time: Chloe. Without that solution, he'll have to take the time to do some thinking on his own, which will eventually remove his BDA status.

He was a BDA mainly for two reasons: 1) Because he wasn't pro-active like he should've been (mostly because he wanted to have a normal life with Lana)
2) Because he was depending on someone that was more intelligent than him. The brain is a muscle too and Clark didn't use his much in the past seasons.
The first reason went away with the beginning of season 8 and with Abyss, the second reason is also gone too. Now Clark can become Superman, instead of the BDA we've known for the past few seasons.

So yeah Clark was an obstacle to himself, but Chloe was one too and so was Lana. Sometimes, we have more than one obstacle that prevents us from going forward in life. But now Lana is gone, Clark has grown a lot and Chloe won't be there to help him all the time so he'll have to become Superman. Not because he's ultimately ready (although he seems to be) but because he'll have to - for lack of having someone else to rely on, because the JL and MM both have other things to do.

[Timester]

Manchester Black.

All I have to say.